Divergent Conversations

Dive into the emotional journey of rediscovering oneself after an Autism or ADHD diagnosis. The hosts share powerful 'aha' moments that shift perspectives on past relationships and missed cues. Expect candid discussions on dating misfires and the complexities of friendship, alongside heartfelt apologies. They explore childhood memories and sensory experiences that shaped their lives, unpacking how understanding these elements can foster personal growth. Join the conversation about repairing relationships and embracing self-compassion in this enlightening exploration.

In this engaging discussion, neuropsychologist Dr. Donna Henderson, co-author of 'Is This Autism?' dives into the complexities of autism diagnoses. She challenges the notion of an 'epidemic,' highlighting how improved awareness and diagnostic practices contribute to rising numbers. Dr. Henderson emphasizes the power of language in shaping perceptions and the stigma faced by autistic individuals. The conversation reveals the importance of accurate representation and the evolving understanding of neurodiversity, making a compelling case for compassion and acceptance.

The discussion dives into the emotional journey of discovering one’s neurodivergent identity, highlighting both the relief and uncertainty that comes with it. Insights on formal diagnosis versus self-identification reveal the importance of inclusive language and community support. The speakers share personal anecdotes about navigating neurodivergent traits and the challenges of accessing assessments. Barriers like stigma and systemic hurdles are examined, alongside practical advice for accommodations and the implications of disclosure in various settings.

Dr. Mel Houser, an Autistic family physician and founder of All Brains Belong VT, dives into the complexities of Autistic burnout. The discussion highlights how mitochondrial dysfunction and post-exertional malaise (PEM) manifest at a cellular level, impacting energy regulation. Dr. Houser emphasizes the importance of pacing, sensory adjustments, and understanding underlying health issues that often go undiagnosed. Listeners gain practical strategies for managing chronic fatigue and insights into the vital interplay between mental health and physical well-being.

The hosts dive into the complexities of self-advocacy and boundary-setting for neurodivergent individuals. They explore practical strategies for seeking accommodations and the emotional struggles tied to asserting personal needs. With insights on partial self-disclosure and navigating workplace dynamics, the discussion highlights the importance of community support. Listeners gain valuable resources for managing burnout and fostering personal well-being, all while reflecting on the transformative power of friendship amidst challenging experiences.

ADHD and Autistic burnout can feel like an endless cycle of overwhelm, exhaustion, and frustration—especially for those who live at the intersection of both identities. Many AuDHD individuals struggle to distinguish between ADHD burnout and autistic burnout, but understanding their overlap and unique challenges is crucial to finding compassionate, practical ways to support our mental health.In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the unique qualities of AuDHD burnout. They reflect on their own lived experiences, explore the differences and intersections between ADHD and Autistic burnout, discuss why traditional accommodations often fall short, and share insight on how burnout can lead to shame, depression, and executive function collapse. Through vulnerable storytelling, tangible metaphors, and thoughtful humor, they invite listeners to rethink both self-care and community support in navigating burnout.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Gain clarity on the nuances between ADHD burnout, Autistic burnout, and their combined impact for AuDHD burnout—plus learn why academic literature often overlooks the lived reality of those with dual neurotypes.Hear relatable and honest discussions about executive dysfunction, shame spirals, depression risk, and the paradox of needing energy to recover from exhaustion, especially within the context of daily life and work.Take away practical frameworks and metaphors (including animal critter analogies and the “burnout city”) that offer new language for self-understanding, along with concrete ideas for future-proofing your life against burnout as an AuDHD individual.If you’re navigating the relentless push-pull of ADHD and Autistic traits, or supporting someone who is, this conversation will help you feel seen and provide tools for building more resilient self-care. Listen now for validation, empathy, and practical insight on surviving—and even softening—the cycle of AuDHD burnout.ResourcesNeurodivergent Insights Autistic Masking Workbook: neurodivergentinsights.com/autistic-maskingNeurodivergent Insights Resource on Autistic Burnout: neurodivergentinsights.com/burnout-resourcesThe Autistic Burnout Workbook by Dr. Megan Anna Neff: simonandschuster.com/books/The-Autistic-Burnout-Workbook/Megan-Anna-Neff/9781507223062Check out Neurodivergent Insights’ Library of Boundary Scripts (free resource)Divergent Conversations Podcast Episodes:Episode 2: Autistic Burnout (divergentpod.com/2)Episode 47: Autistic Burnout (Part 2): A Deep Dive Into The Diversity of Burnout (divergentpod.com/47)————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube💬 Join Divergent Conversations Underground————————————————————————————————Thanks to Our Sponsor: Landmark College & Jane✨ Landmark College:Landmark College is the world's first accredited college designed exclusively for students who learn differently. Landmark, located in Putney, Vermont, offers courses in person and online, awarding associate and bachelor's degrees, and offering pre-college, gap year, and professional development programs  for educators who work with neurodivergent students. With a student-to-faculty ratio of just 7 to 1, and the renowned Landmark College Institute for Research and Training, Landmark offers personalized and research-informed support for neurodivergent students that is not available at traditional colleges. Enrollment is still open for Fall 2025. Learn more about this opportunity at landmark.edu.✨ Jane:Jane is a clinic management software and EMR designed to be an extra set of helping hands in your health and wellness business. Available online and on any device, Jane has branded online booking, scheduling, insurance billing, customizable documentation templates and online forms, integrated payments, telehealth, and more — wrapped up in one beautiful package that even your patients/clients will love. Backed by our unlimited human support available by phone, email, and chat (even on Saturdays!), Jane is here to help you get back to the work you love. Get 2 months off new Jane subscriptions when you use code DCPOD at signup. Visit: janesoftware.partnerlinks.io/divergentconversations✨ Neurodivergent Insights Autistic Burnout ResourcesIf you’d like to supplement your learning on burnout, you can check out Neurodivergent Insights' resources on burnout. We have articles, an Autistic Burnout course, workbooks, and print books! Visit: neurodivergentinsights.com/burnout-resources————————————————————————————————💬 Join Divergent Conversations UndergroundDivergent Conversations Underground is a space for messy conversations, real connection, and unfinished thoughts in a neurodivergent-affirming community. If you’d like to go deeper with us into more nuanced, searching conversations, join here: divergentconversations.substack.com————————————————————————————————Mentioned in this episode:JaneJane is a clinic management software and EMR designed to be an extra set of helping hands in your health and wellness business. Available online and on any device, Jane has branded online booking, scheduling, insurance billing, customizable documentation templates and online forms, integrated payments, telehealth, and more — wrapped up in one beautiful package that even your patients/clients will love. Backed by our unlimited human support available by phone, email, and chat (even on Saturdays!), Jane is here to help you get back to the work you love. Get 2 months off new Jane subscriptions when you use code DCPOD at signup. Visit: https://janesoftware.partnerlinks.io/divergentconversationsNeurodivergent Insights' Autistic Burnout ResourcesIf you’d like to supplement your learning on burnout, you can check out Neurodivergent Insights' resources on burnout. We have articles, an Autistic Burnout course, workbooks, and print books! Visit: https://neurodivergentinsights.com/burnout-resourcesLandmark CollegeLandmark College is the world's first accredited college designed exclusively for students who learn differently. Landmark, located in Putney, Vermont, offers courses in person and online, awarding associate and bachelor's degrees, and offering pre-college, gap year, and professional development programs  for educators who work with neurodivergent students. With a student-to-faculty ratio of just 7 to 1, and the renowned Landmark College Institute for Research and Training, Landmark offers personalized and research-informed support for neurodivergent students that is not available at traditional colleges. Enrollment is still open for Fall 2025. Learn more about this opportunity at landmark.edu.Learn More About Landmark College

Burnout can hit hard for late-diagnosed autistic and ADHD adults, especially when the energy cost of masking becomes too much to bear. Dropping the mask and stepping into authenticity brings both relief and upheaval, raising new challenges that aren’t always easy to navigate alone.In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the intricate relationship between masking, unmasking, and Autistic burnout. They use vivid metaphors and real-life examples to depict how masking acts as a bridge to burnout city, discuss the destabilizing yet liberating process of unmasking, and share personal stories of re-discovering their bodies, needs, and boundaries after years of suppressing them. They also offer practical suggestions for finding moments of authentic self-expression, especially when safety and acceptance aren't always possible.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Gain a clear, relatable understanding of how masking—often invisible to even ourselves—contributes to burnout and why unmasking can feel disorienting but ultimately healing.Hear honest stories from Patrick and Megan Anna about the messy realities and sometimes victories of post-discovery life, including changes in relationships, energy management, and self-acceptance.Learn small, actionable strategies for unmasking safely, rebuilding trust in your body, and advocating for your needs, even if it’s just a few minutes each day.If you’ve been struggling with burnout or questioning why life feels harder after discovering you’re Autistic or ADHD, this episode offers validation, insight, and gentle guidance through the journey.ResourcesNeurodivergent Insights Autistic Masking Workbook: neurodivergentinsights.com/autistic-maskingNeurodivergent Insights Resource on Autistic Burnout: neurodivergentinsights.com/burnout-resourcesThe Autistic Burnout Workbook by Dr. Megan Anna Neff: simonandschuster.com/books/The-Autistic-Burnout-Workbook/Megan-Anna-Neff/9781507223062Check out Neurodivergent Insights’ Library of Boundary Scripts (free resource)Divergent Conversations Podcast Episodes:Episode 2: Autistic Burnout (divergentpod.com/2)Episode 47: Autistic Burnout (Part 2): A Deep Dive Into The Diversity of Burnout (divergentpod.com/47)————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube💬 Join Divergent Conversations Underground————————————————————————————————Thanks to Our Sponsor: Landmark College & Jane✨ Landmark College:Landmark College is the world's first accredited college designed exclusively for students who learn differently. Landmark, located in Putney, Vermont, offers courses in person and online, awarding associate and bachelor's degrees, and offering pre-college, gap year, and professional development programs  for educators who work with neurodivergent students. With a student-to-faculty ratio of just 7 to 1, and the renowned Landmark College Institute for Research and Training, Landmark offers personalized and research-informed support for neurodivergent students that is not available at traditional colleges. Enrollment is still open for Fall 2025. Learn more about this opportunity at landmark.edu.✨ Jane:Jane is a clinic management software and EMR designed to be an extra set of helping hands in your health and wellness business. Available online and on any device, Jane has branded online booking, scheduling, insurance billing, customizable documentation templates and online forms, integrated payments, telehealth, and more — wrapped up in one beautiful package that even your patients/clients will love. Backed by our unlimited human support available by phone, email, and chat (even on Saturdays!), Jane is here to help you get back to the work you love. Get 2 months off new Jane subscriptions when you use code DCPOD at signup. Visit: janesoftware.partnerlinks.io/divergentconversations✨ Neurodivergent Insights Autistic Burnout ResourcesIf you’d like to supplement your learning on burnout, you can check out Neurodivergent Insights' resources on burnout. We have articles, an Autistic Burnout course, workbooks, and print books! Visit: neurodivergentinsights.com/burnout-resources————————————————————————————————💬 Join Divergent Conversations UndergroundDivergent Conversations Underground is a space for messy conversations, real connection, and unfinished thoughts in a neurodivergent-affirming community. If you’d like to go deeper with us into more nuanced, searching conversations, join here: divergentconversations.substack.com————————————————————————————————Mentioned in this episode:Landmark CollegeLandmark College is the world's first accredited college designed exclusively for students who learn differently. Landmark, located in Putney, Vermont, offers courses in person and online, awarding associate and bachelor's degrees, and offering pre-college, gap year, and professional development programs  for educators who work with neurodivergent students. With a student-to-faculty ratio of just 7 to 1, and the renowned Landmark College Institute for Research and Training, Landmark offers personalized and research-informed support for neurodivergent students that is not available at traditional colleges. Enrollment is still open for Fall 2025. Learn more about this opportunity at landmark.edu.Learn More About Landmark CollegeJaneJane is a clinic management software and EMR designed to be an extra set of helping hands in your health and wellness business. Available online and on any device, Jane has branded online booking, scheduling, insurance billing, customizable documentation templates and online forms, integrated payments, telehealth, and more — wrapped up in one beautiful package that even your patients/clients will love. Backed by our unlimited human support available by phone, email, and chat (even on Saturdays!), Jane is here to help you get back to the work you love. Get 2 months off new Jane subscriptions when you use code DCPOD at signup. Visit: https://janesoftware.partnerlinks.io/divergentconversationsNeurodivergent Insights' Autistic Burnout ResourcesIf you’d like to supplement your learning on burnout, you can check out Neurodivergent Insights' resources on burnout. We have articles, an Autistic Burnout course, workbooks, and print books! Visit: https://neurodivergentinsights.com/burnout-resources

Autistic burnout can feel like you’re running on empty: emotionally, physically, or both. Managing energy, burnout, and self-acceptance in a neurotypical world can be exhausting, especially for neurodivergent people navigating chronic fatigue, sensory overload, and internalized expectations.In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the lived experience of burnout, depleted energy, and the ongoing struggle to honor personal limits. Through honest dialogue, they dig deep into pacing systems like spoon theory, the boom-and-bust recovery cycle, and the strategies (and grief) involved in energy management for neurodivergent folks. They also share laughter, relatable moments, and useful frameworks for understanding and advocating for your energy needs.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Gain a practical understanding of energy pacing systems: including spoon theory and chronic illness frameworks, and hear how these concepts can help you manage your day-to-day life.Learn why naming and honoring your energy limits is inseparable from self-compassion, grief work, and dismantling internalized ableism, with candid stories straight from Patrick and Megan Anna’s lived experiences.Discover actionable strategies for mapping your energy rhythms, advocating for your needs, and building routines that recognize both what drains and what restores you—so you can move toward a more sustainable life.If you’ve ever struggled with burnout, chronic fatigue, or simply wished for more permission to rest, remember that honoring your energy needs is not weakness—it’s a vital act of self-respect.ResourcesSpoon Theory for Neurodivergent Adults: neurodivergentinsights.com/spoon-theoryNeurodivergent Insights Resource on Autistic Burnout: neurodivergentinsights.com/burnout-resourcesThe Autistic Burnout Workbook by Dr. Megan Anna Neff: simonandschuster.com/books/The-Autistic-Burnout-Workbook/Megan-Anna-Neff/9781507223062Check out Neurodivergent Insights’ Library of Boundary Scripts (free resource): neurodivergentinsights.notion.site/Boundary-Statements-17da17a4bb8b80c9a45dc8ff9c651725Relaxation Scripts: students.dartmouth.edu/wellness-center/wellness-mindfulness/mindfulness-meditation/guided-recordings Muscle Relaxation: students.dartmouth.edu/wellness-center/wellness-mindfulness/mindfulness-meditation/guided-recordings/progressive-muscle-relaxationSensory Checklists:Sensory Preferences: neurodivergentinsights.com/sensory-preferences-the-complete-checklistSensory Soothers: neurodivergentinsights.com/sensory-calming-techniquesSensory Triggers: neurodivergentinsights.com/understanding-and-managing-sensory-overloadDivergent Conversations Podcast Episodes:Episode 2: Autistic Burnout (divergentpod.com/2)Episode 47: Autistic Burnout (Part 2): A Deep Dive Into The Diversity of Burnout (divergentpod.com/47)————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube💬 Join Divergent Conversations Underground————————————————————————————————Thanks to Our Sponsor: Landmark College✨ Landmark College:Landmark College is the world's first accredited college designed exclusively for students who learn differently. Landmark, located in Putney, Vermont, offers courses in person and online, awarding associate and bachelor's degrees, and offering pre-college, gap year, and professional development programs  for educators who work with neurodivergent students. With a student-to-faculty ratio of just 7 to 1, and the renowned Landmark College Institute for Research and Training, Landmark offers personalized and research-informed support for neurodivergent students that is not available at traditional colleges. Enrollment is still open for Fall 2025. Learn more about this opportunity at landmark.edu.✨ Neurodivergent Insights Autistic Burnout ResourcesIf you’d like to supplement your learning on burnout, you can check out Neurodivergent Insights' resources on burnout. We have articles, an Autistic Burnout course, workbooks, and print books! Visit: neurodivergentinsights.com/burnout-resources————————————————————————————————💬 Join Divergent Conversations UndergroundDivergent Conversations Underground is a space for messy conversations, real connection, and unfinished thoughts in a neurodivergent-affirming community. If you’d like to go deeper with us into more nuanced, searching conversations, join here: divergentconversations.substack.com————————————————————————————————Mentioned in this episode:Neurodivergent Insights' Autistic Burnout ResourcesIf you’d like to supplement your learning on burnout, you can check out Neurodivergent Insights' resources on burnout. We have articles, an Autistic Burnout course, workbooks, and print books! Visit: https://neurodivergentinsights.com/burnout-resourcesLandmark CollegeLandmark College is the world's first accredited college designed exclusively for students who learn differently. Landmark, located in Putney, Vermont, offers courses in person and online, awarding associate and bachelor's degrees, and offering pre-college, gap year, and professional development programs  for educators who work with neurodivergent students. With a student-to-faculty ratio of just 7 to 1, and the renowned Landmark College Institute for Research and Training, Landmark offers personalized and research-informed support for neurodivergent students that is not available at traditional colleges. Enrollment is still open for Fall 2025. Learn more about this opportunity at landmark.edu.Learn More About Landmark College

Burnout is a persistent challenge for autistic individuals, deeply tied to their nervous system responses. The hosts explore the science behind stress regulation, heart rate variability, and the impact of trauma. They emphasize the importance of self-compassion and co-regulation in navigating daily challenges. Practical tools for mapping nervous system responses are discussed, along with personal stories of overcoming mental health struggles. The conversation highlights how recognizing triggers can lead to greater resilience and well-being.

Burnout isn’t just about exhaustion—it’s a sensory experience that can leave neurodivergent people feeling stretched to the breaking point. When every sound, smell, or texture feels overwhelming, how do we navigate recovery and build resilience in a world that rarely slows down?In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the connection between sensory processing and autistic burnout. They share candid reflections on their personal burnout cycles, explore how sensory overwhelm shapes emotional and cognitive well-being, and highlight the critical need for understanding individual sensory profiles. This conversation unpacks the realities of living through burnout—including the constant to-do lists, the elusive pursuit of “just right” sensory environments, and the importance of community support—while providing practical strategies for recovery and prevention.Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:Discover how sensory overload and sensory needs play a major role in burnout for Autistic and ADHD people, and pick up strategies for managing sensory overwhelm even when "rest" isn’t an option.Hear honest, relatable insights from Patrick and Megan Anna about identifying sensory triggers, living with constant overwhelm, and unlearning narratives around "not being content"—plus the validating realization that everyone’s sensory profile and needs are truly unique.Get practical tools to help you map your own sensory landscape, communicate your needs, and take actionable steps toward burnout recovery and prevention—grounded in real-life experiences and evidence-based wisdom.If you’re feeling stretched thin by sensory and emotional demands, this episode is designed to help you understand why and start reclaiming what makes you feel safe, soothed, and genuinely well.ResourcesNeurodivergent Insights Resource on Autistic Burnout: neurodivergentinsights.com/burnout-resourcesThe Autistic Burnout Workbook by Dr. Megan Anna Neff: simonandschuster.com/books/The-Autistic-Burnout-Workbook/Megan-Anna-Neff/9781507223062Check out Neurodivergent Insights’ Library of Boundary Scripts (free resource): neurodivergentinsights.notion.site/Boundary-Statements-17da17a4bb8b80c9a45dc8ff9c651725Sensory Checklists:Sensory Preferences: neurodivergentinsights.com/sensory-preferences-the-complete-checklistSensory Soothers: neurodivergentinsights.com/sensory-calming-techniquesSensory Triggers: neurodivergentinsights.com/understanding-and-managing-sensory-overloadDivergent Conversations Podcast Episodes:Episode 2: Autistic Burnout (divergentpod.com/2)Episode 47: Autistic Burnout (Part 2): A Deep Dive Into The Diversity of Burnout (divergentpod.com/47)————————————————————————————————🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast🎙️Spotify🎙️Apple🎙️YouTube Music▶️ YouTube💬 Join Divergent Conversations Underground————————————————————————————————Thanks to Our Sponsor: Landmark College✨ Landmark College:Landmark College is the world's first accredited college designed exclusively for students who learn differently. Landmark, located in Putney, Vermont, offers courses in person and online, awarding associate and bachelor's degrees, and offering pre-college, gap year, and professional development programs  for educators who work with neurodivergent students. With a student-to-faculty ratio of just 7 to 1, and the renowned Landmark College Institute for Research and Training, Landmark offers personalized and research-informed support for neurodivergent students that is not available at traditional colleges. Enrollment is still open for Fall 2025. Learn more about this opportunity at landmark.edu.✨ Neurodivergent Insights Autistic Burnout ResourcesIf you’d like to supplement your learning on burnout, you can check out Neurodivergent Insights' resources on burnout. We have articles, an Autistic Burnout course, workbooks, and print books! Visit: neurodivergentinsights.com/burnout-resources————————————————————————————————💬 Join Divergent Conversations UndergroundDivergent Conversations Underground is a space for messy conversations, real connection, and unfinished thoughts in a neurodivergent-affirming community. If you’d like to go deeper with us into more nuanced, searching conversations, join here: divergentconversations.substack.com————————————————————————————————Mentioned in this episode:Neurodivergent Insights' Autistic Burnout ResourcesIf you’d like to supplement your learning on burnout, you can check out Neurodivergent Insights' resources on burnout. We have articles, an Autistic Burnout course, workbooks, and print books! Visit: https://neurodivergentinsights.com/burnout-resourcesLandmark CollegeLandmark College is the world's first accredited college designed exclusively for students who learn differently. Landmark, located in Putney, Vermont, offers courses in person and online, awarding associate and bachelor's degrees, and offering pre-college, gap year, and professional development programs  for educators who work with neurodivergent students. With a student-to-faculty ratio of just 7 to 1, and the renowned Landmark College Institute for Research and Training, Landmark offers personalized and research-informed support for neurodivergent students that is not available at traditional colleges. Enrollment is still open for Fall 2025. Learn more about this opportunity at landmark.edu.Learn More About Landmark College