The Leadership Habit

Crestcom International

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Jan 20, 2023 • 25min

Minisode: Get Better at Small Talk to Connect in a Hybrid World with Jenn DeWall

Get Better at Small Talk to Connect in a Hybrid World Hi everyone. It’s Jenn DeWall, and we are wrapping up 2022 by talking about the fine art of small talk. We are doing a minisode today. This will be our new podcast episode of 2022, and we’ll bring you all new content in 2023. I will be talking about small talk, something I imagine many of you will be doing ALOT over the next few weeks. But before we get started, I want to remind you that Crestcom offers a complimentary two-hour leadership skills workshop. If you or your team are thinking about how you want to approach 2023 to ensure that you are performing at your best and that you’re collaborating to the best of your abilities, head on over to Crestcom.com. We would love to know more about your organization and how we can help develop your leaders. And also, if you don’t know, I just want to remind you that Crestcom also does free monthly webinars. They are complimentary and open to the public, all designed to give you the necessary skills that you can use immediately to be successful. Our next webinar is coming up on Thursday, January 26th, and we’ll discuss starting the new year with a growth mindset. So I hope you’re able to attend! Why is Small Talk Necessary? But now let’s get into the show. We’re talking about the art of small talk and how to connect in a hybrid world. And many of us might struggle with small talk. We might struggle because we feel like it’s so surface-level. Oh my gosh, I don’t know why I have to do this. There are a lot of grievances that people have around small talk. They might feel like it’s just a waste of time. They might feel like people don’t really have a meaningful connection, which is understandable. We need to be strategic about small talk if we actually want to have an impact with it. So it’s natural to have those feelings. But for the podcast, we’re gonna talk about some of the benefits of small talk and how to navigate small talk. But before we get into it, let’s talk about what small talk is. And this is from “The Problem of Meaning in Primitive Languages” by Bronislaw Malinowski. And this was written in 1923, studying the benefits of small talk. And here, it was defined as: Small talk— A great deal of talk does not serve any purpose of communicating ideas but instead serves to establish bonds, a personal union. So for those that might be thinking, Ugh, small talk is so frustrating. It’s a waste of time! I want to reframe that for you, to think about how you can use small talk to deepen connections and to build relationships because that’s really its purpose. But that also requires us to approach small talk in a different way. Small Talk is the Foundation of Trust And here’s another consideration, and this is from the Career Contessa. Think of small talk like bricks. One or two bricks don’t make much, but if you gather 10 bricks or 20 bricks and you start to establish a foundation, that’s when small talk serves as the foundation of building trust. So I know that initially, it might seem again that, oh, this is such a waste of time, but it’s something that we want to think of the long-term gain for maybe that short-term pain. And understanding that small talk is the starting point for a deeper connection. So I’m going to share with you some tips because as I was researching this, this is actually content that we used for a webinar that we offered in November on this. So again, I can’t recommend it enough— come to our webinars. We would love to have you. They’re open to the public. But in my research looking at small talk and the art of small talk, one of the books that I picked up and read was The Fine Art of Small Talk. And this was written by Debra Fine. She is a speaker, and she works with individuals around the world on how to improve their art of small talk. And here within that book, and I would definitely recommend getting it, the book again is The Fine Art of Small Talk by Debra Fine, but she provides a worksheet, and I’m going to review or read a few different questions for you to consider and reflect on because we want to understand how often are you in situations that require small talk and what is typically your response. Some Questions to Ask Yourself So here are some questions for your consideration. And the full winning at small talk worksheet is available in her book. So one of the questions that you can consider is, “I have joined or participated in at least one club or group activity to meet new people this year.” Is that true for you? Do you find yourself maybe avoiding some of those things? Another statement, “in the past year, I’ve used my contacts to help at least two people get a job, date, connect with new clients or customers, or provide information for networking purposes.” Have you done that? Made a connection? Small talk is a way that we can build bridges to broaden and expand our network. Here are another few, but I would recommend getting her book and walking through this so you can reflect maybe where your areas of opportunity are or what your starting points are. I’ll give you one final reflection piece to ask yourself. When someone asks me what’s new, instead of saying, “Not much,” I often talk about something exciting in my life. Have an Intentional Strategy to Get Better at Small Talk Are you one of the people that doesn’t necessarily talk or give much of a response, which can sometimes be the obstacle or barrier that we have to overcome with small talk? So leading into it, what are some of the small talk mistakes that people might make? And these are honest mistakes, but we want to think about small talk as an intentional strategy. And one of the mistakes that people make is when we ask the individual with whom we’re in conversation yes or no questions. When we ask the yes or no, do you like this? Have you been there before? Have you been here before? It doesn’t necessarily give you an opportunity to hear more, especially if that person doesn’t feel comfortable sharing more. And so asking them open-ended questions such as, what do you like about coming to the events? What do you like about working here? That can be a better way to get more information from someone and to actually build on a foundation of that conversation. So one mistake to avoid is asking closed-ended questions because that will only elicit a one-word yes or no response. Other small talk mistakes that people make is there’s no self-disclosure or talking or on the flip side. So you’re either saying too little, or you’re saying too much. Now the tip here with small talk is we want it to be this gradual self-disclosure where I might respond and answer a question, but then you are going to respond and answer a question. Or if you are the individual that’s running and managing that conversation, you’ll ask the question, but then you’ll also answer it in turn. When you have no self-disclosure, you’re not building trust, and that other person isn’t getting to know more about you. On the flip side, if you’re only talking about yourself, someone might be thinking, holy cow, what’s my exit strategy? How do I get outta here? They don’t even care about me. And another small talk mistake that people make is being critical instead of curious. Let’s say that someone talks about their favorite restaurant or talks about a challenge that they have in the industry. You might be listening to learn, or you might be listening to judge based on your past experience. And if we’re critical, especially in this foundational opening conversation, it can be a turnoff for people, which might make them reluctant to want to talk and engage with you. Avoid “Pitch-Slapping” in a Conversation Another small talk mistake is interrupting people. This is a common mistake for extroverts. We have to slow down and allow people to finish their thoughts instead of assuming what they’re going to say. Another is “pitch-slapping,” also known as “getting networked on” by someone. You go into that networking event, and you find that one person that’s only there to talk to you because they want to sell you. If you are that person, be mindful that you’re not building trust, you’re actually eroding it because they’d see you as someone that doesn’t necessarily care about them. You just care about yourself and your objectives. So be sure to ask some of those questions that you might think are actually fufu so you can deepen the level of trust, and then you could pursue and go into talking about what it is you do or potentially asking for a sale. And going into other small talk mistakes, avoid talking about controversial topics, those can be something that can instantly shut a conversation down. Be Willing to Take the Lead to Get Better at Small Talk Or how about not having anything to say or waiting for someone else to take the lead? Sometimes we don’t wanna be the one that is being vulnerable or owns the conversation, but when we think about what’s in a conversation, you know, typically what we’re doing in a conversation is we’re either exchanging information with someone, we might be exchanging power to try to influence someone to our point of view, or it might be transformational. We’re exchanging it. We’re exchanging energy. We’re just getting to know one another. But know that on the basic. And if you took our webinar, what you would see as a graphic of understanding that with all the conversational levels that I just talked about, that every level as we engage more and more or we add more bricks, going back to that career Contessa quote, we’re building trust. But initially, when we’re starting that conversation, it’s low trust for both people. So we might be a little skeptical of what you have to say. We might resist what you’re trying to say. But as we’ve exchanged and done that gradual self-disclosure and gotten to know more about each other, then we’re building a conditional trust. And again, over time, as we’re listening and learning and going more, that’s when we can get to that high level of trust. So the starting point to be effective at small talk and is from Debra Fine’s book, the Fine Art of Small Talk, and I love this tip. There are two things that you can do to improve small talk. The first is to give yourself permission to take the risk of starting the conversation. Now that conversation or risk might be with a new employee in your organization. It might be with a new person that you’ve never met in a social setting. It might be at a networking event, but either way, give yourself permission to just take the risk and start the conversation. Too often, many of us avoid it because we might be uncomfortable. We tell ourselves we don’t have anything to say. Reframing How You View Small Talk And instead of doing that, look for the reframe of saying, I’m just going to start this conversation and see what happens. And the second thing that you can do to improve small talk then assumes the burden of the conversation. Meaning if you notice lulls if you notice that someone maybe isn’t engaging, empower yourself to be more direct in your questions. How are you? What would you like to do? So on and so forth. So the two things to improve small talk is to start by giving yourself permission to take the risk to start the conversation. And then, second, give yourself the power to assume the burden of the conversation. This means that you also want to have a preparation list in some capacity of what types of questions you might ask. And know that those questions are likely going to be different in a networking event versus at work versus outside work at a social event. But opportunities to practice that if you’re just looking to maybe improve it in a low stakes way, you could go and practice having basic conversations at the grocery store, maybe with the individual that’s checking you out or assisting you in finding a product. You could do the same at the mall or when you’re running errands, but look for opportunities to practice. That way, you’ll feel more confident and comfortable when you actually have a higher stakes conversation where you want to get to know that person and deepen the relationship and potentially partner, work with, or befriend them— whatever the outcome or objective is. The Forgotten Name Problem… Here’s a quick public service announcement, and I think this is great. This is again from Debra Fine’s book, um, the Fine Art of Small Talk. One of the things that she talks about is an obstacle that many of us have. If we find ourselves in a small talk situation, we might also notice that they’ve introduced themselves to us, but we’ve forgotten their name. And instead of listening to them going through your head and not actually listening because all you’re trying to do is recall their name, give yourself permission to just ask the name. What she would say is don’t wait for divine intervention or for someone to come up and be like, Hey Susie, hi Tachi, hi, whatever. We just have to ask, when you just take that power again, assume the burden, give yourself the power to take that risk and ask for the name again. That’s better than not listening to what they’re saying because you’re trying to recall it. So that is one public service announcement. It’s totally okay. A lot of people forget names, especially at events where we’re meeting so many people. So give yourself permission to just ask in case you’ve missed it. Dear Extroverts, Take a Breath and Listen More And finally, I wanna give some tips if you are an introvert versus an extrovert because we need to approach it maybe in a different way. So my message for the extra extroverts would be to make sure that you’re taking a breath while you’re listening. Extroverts can sometimes come on a little too strong, which can be offsetting or off-putting for introverts or people that are maybe new or less familiar with small talk. And so make sure to breathe. You don’t wanna feel like you’re pushing all the information at them. Give yourself permission to ask questions, to slow it down. When you can ask those open-ended questions, you’re actually giving yourself permission to take a break and focus on that individual. Another message for extroverts is to avoid oversharing. Know that if we’re just starting out in small talk, we are developing trust. Trust is not necessarily established, but sometimes a mistake that extroverts can make is by sharing too much when the trust isn’t established. And finally, make sure that you don’t assume what another person is going to say. This can lead extroverts into interrupting or maybe minimalizing what someone says, making them feel that you weren’t listening to them and you didn’t really care what you had to say. Or sometimes they might get the perception that you’re a one-upper or you’re just trying to show how great you are. And finally, the last message for extroverts is to stick with the conversation. Extroverts likely have a very easy time going from one topic to the next, but for people that may not, again, have that same experience or desire, it’s best to stick with that conversation and deepen it and just ask a deeper level of questions as you progress. Introverts Can Get Better at Small Talk Too And now, let’s go into introverts. So what you can do to feel more confident with small talk and feel like you are actually getting the benefit from it is to start by preparing conversational questions. What are potential go-to questions that you could have in a social setting, in a professional work setting, at a networking event, or at a family event? Create a list for each of those and start to think of potential questions that you might ask, but make sure that you’re also checking your mindset and your attitude. If you feel that small talk is a waste of time and it’s pointless, the individual whom you’re engaging in a conversation with will likely perceive that to be true. And so they’ll be less open to actually talking and deepening a relationship with you. So make sure that you’re reframing your opportunities for small talk as, Hey, this is a great chance to get to know more about them. We can see how we can partner together. Hey, this is a great chance to just, you know, see it. We have more in common than I ever realized. Choose the right mindset before going into the event. Otherwise, the individuals that you’re in conversation with will likely notice that you’re not that into the conversation. And just remember that curiosity is key as you think about those questions. Deepening it. Hey, what do you like to do for fun? And if they say, oh, I love playing volleyball, or I love playing football, you might say, oh, what do you like about those sports? Have you ever played those sports? So deepen the conversation by being curious. And here’s a quick PSA. Be a little bit cautious when you use the conversational question, what do you do for work? You might run into a situation where someone might be unemployed or recently laid off or fired, and so you’re going to bring them into the pain of that situation. So that’s one reason you might want to avoid that question. The second reason is you might want to avoid feelings of inferiority that can be created when you ask someone what they do. For example, if I am maybe a high-performing and successful business person and I’m talking to someone that maybe doesn’t have confidence in their career and what they do or feels a little less-than when I ask them what they do, then they might start to get into their head and feel like I’m not good enough to have this conversation. These people are way smarter than me. They are all of these things. So instead of asking the question, what do you do? You might say, what industry do you work in? What intrigues you about that industry? Small Talk Only Works if You Also Listen And now tips for the listener because that’s often the piece that we forget. We think about that initial approach of taking the risk and the conversation, assuming the burden of the conversation and what we can do to get our information to that other person in the conversation. But what do you do when you are the listener? Well, be present. Make sure that you’re maintaining good eye contact, smile, and of course, be mindful of any cultural norms that exist in where you live. If you are in France, if you are in the UK, if you are in Morocco, these might have different cultural norms of what’s appropriate, but the non-verbal cues that you use are essential to the individual that is speaking because that lets them know that you’re in tune and connected with their message. And Another tip for the listener, ask them a question. Always come up with a great follow-up question about the information that they shared. And you can also validate their responses. You can say, oh, what I heard you say is that you really enjoy volleyball and you love playing it with a team. Great, me too. And so just reiterating or what we would call mirroring, repeating back what someone had said to them to say, am I getting this right? For Better Small Talk, Mind Your Body Language And also, keep an open posture! Knowing that almost 60% of our communication is non-verbal, it’s very important to pay attention to the posture and those non-verbal cues that you’re using because sometimes it might show to someone that, again, you don’t care what they have to say. An example might be, and many of you likely have experienced this, think about if you’ve ever had a time when you were in a conversation with someone, and then they picked up their phone, or they looked at their watch to see what time it is. If I’m speaking and you do those things, I am going to assume that you don’t care what I have to say. Now, whether or not that’s true, that’s the information that I am getting from your nonverbal cues. So be very mindful of the information that you’re saying without words. Now, small talk tips, right? Have a Go-To Conversation List Think about your own conversation list. And this is more for building your own conversational list. I want you to just think about what are the topics that you feel comfortable with or you actually want to talk about. Maybe you have a particular hobby like making music or sewing or playing sports, whatever that might be. What are the topics that you feel comfortable with and actually want to talk about? Write down those topics. So then there are things that you can ask, and you can begin by just writing down a list of your interest. It might be sports books or podcasts, hobbies, TV shows or movies, whatever that might be. But if you can build a conversational list of the topics or general interests that you have, then you can use that to say, Hey, I’ve been listening to this podcast, the Leadership Habit, lately. What do you listen to for your own personal development? Are there any personal development topics that you think I should listen to? That’s how that might go. Remember to Practice Good F.O.R.M. Now, in Debra Fine’s book, the Fine Art Small Talk, she also gives an acronym of how to think about structuring or building that conversational list. And what she talks about is, are questions that you can ask typically follow the acronym of Form F O R M. The F in Form is about family. Hey, tell me about your family. Who’s your favorite member? Who’s, you know, how many children do you have? Are you married? Are you single? Now again, I would offer a pause to this, and that’s only from my own personal experience. I think it’s a great conversation. But no, there might be someone, just as I had an experience with an Uber driver where he shared with us that he actually doesn’t have any living family members left. And so know that you might run into something like that. And that’s totally normal. That is the life of of some people, and we want to be mindful and sensitive to that. So if you do get a response like that, you can also say, I am so sorry to hear that. Um, you know, I, I like to ask this question because it’s typically what lights people up, but I can understand where maybe this isn’t the question that you would want to answer. It’s totally okay to switch directions. The O in FORM stands for occupation. What industry are you in? How long have you worked in it? What industries have you ever worked in? You could even ask questions such as, what was the best job that you ever had? What was the worst job that you ever had? I can tell you my worst job was as a newspaper delivery girl, and I had a bike. And when I was delivering Sunday papers, that was extremely heavy and I would often tip over. The R in FORM is for Recreation. What do you like to do outside of work? What do you like to do for fun? And then of course, miscellaneous, maybe something that supports the fam family, occupation, and recreation, or maybe something completely different. That goes back to one of the conversational topics that you previously identified. The M is for miscellaneous topics, which could be books, movies, trivia, what ever you like. So just remember that, you know, when we’re thinking about small talk, whether you’re doing this at the holiday table or at a networking event, every single person is nervous to some extent. And why is that? Because we don’t wanna be judged. We want to be liked, and we want to be safe. And when we go into these small talk conversations, we can feel that this is really vulnerable. What if they think that what I say is stupid, or they don’t like me or they don’t like my vibe, whatever that might be? Know that all of us have a little bit of head trash that’s making small talk seem a little bit scarier over than what it actually is, so know that it’s nervous. Keep Building Your Small Talk Muscles But in closing, I want you to keep in mind how you can build that conversational muscle. So I want you to create and build your conversational checklist. Create three to five questions that might be your go-to, questions that you ask. And you can always, for advice, start a conversation with a statement or an observation. If you’re meeting at a networking event, for example, oh, I love these events. What’s your favorite event that you’ve ever attended? Or you could talk about the weather, but typically people don’t necessarily want to talk about the weather right now. So you could say the weather is perfect outside, but what’s your favorite season? Now, there’s one thing that I would actually add to this, and it kind of goes back to the what do you do for a living? Talking about the basic topics such as, oh, what’s the weather like by you aren’t necessarily responses that elicit you to or that prompt you to provide a high level of information. Yeah, it’s sunny. Cool. We’re not really deepening the connection there. And so that’s where a question such as, the weather is perfect outside right now, but what’s your favorite season is actually going to allow for a deeper conversation. So be mindful of typical questions that you likely hate answering because you feel like you do it all the time. Those might be what do you do for a living? Where do you work? What’s the weather like? Avoid some of those because many of us are asked those repeatedly and we have very scripted responses, which causes us to kind of go into autopilot in the conversation and not be as engaged. And finally, tips for work and business events. Of course, know your audience of what’s appropriate to talk about and inappropriate to talk about. Maintain great eye contact, and smile. And when you’re going to that event for the first time and thinking about where do you start? Find the person that seems approachable. Look for body language. Are they open? Do they seem engaging? And make sure that you give your name and also ask theirs. Sometimes we just walk up and start a conversation without introducing ourselves. Questions to Start a Conversation Anytime, Anywhere And questions that you can ask at business and work events. How did you get started in your career? And know that these are partially from Debra Fine’s book The Fine Art of Small Talk. How did you get started in your career? What trends have you noticed in your field? What projects are you working on right now? What does a typical workday look like for you? What professional organizations or associations are you a member of? What books or podcasts have you read or listened to lately? If you’re going to a social event, you might ask, what’s the highlight of your week so far? What’s your favorite movie? Why? What is something you own that you wish you had never purchased? Now, this is a question that I have asked multiple times, and it typically elicits a fun and playful response. It allows for us to be a little bit self-deprecating, which can actually build trust between the person we’re speaking with and us. So if I was to answer that question, I might say, as much as I hate saying this because I wish I used it more, it’s my road bike. It has been in my garage, hung up for about two years, and it is a constant reminder that I actually bought that, bought all of the coinciding and extra bike apparel to go with it, the shorts, the jersey, and I never used it. I should have just bought that or bought something else, and saved that money. But typically, many of you have examples of something that you own that you thought you had to have, and now you’re like, why did I buy that? And I got this, this question from a different individual. And his example was a fancy watch that he bought that he thought he really needed, but now it’s just a reminder that he wasted a bunch of money on something that he doesn’t need. So it’s a fun, playful question. Another thing, what’s your favorite thing about where you live? Why? Cats or dogs? How do you know blank? And general icebreakers. You could think, what’s one thing that you want to own and why? These might be questions that you can ask in a group setting to your team. Tell me about one of your favorite relatives. What do you think is the perfect age? Why? What’s your favorite holiday? What was the first car that you drove? Who were your idols as kids? One of my favorite questions is, what is your favorite karaoke song? And another quick question that I like to ask is, what was one activity that you really enjoyed doing in high school? This allows us to get into our more childlike experience and it can allow us to learn more and just get a little bit deeper into the conversation without asking them to maybe explain their whole life story. When I asked this one of my favorite questions or one of my favorite responses that I totally was surprised by, because this individual was very tough and direct and he was a lovely person to work with. But when I asked him, what was your favorite activity in high school? He said, oh, I was part of the prom decorating committee. I was so surprised by his response and it just brought about a laugh by all of us because none of us that had known him and worked professionally with him would’ve ever guessed that that actually would’ve been an interest. So that’s my personal one that I love to ask. How to End a Conversation Now in closing, I just want you to think about how you can start a conversation. Where are these opportunities that you can practice? And maybe a goal for yourself is to choose three new people a week to just strike up a conversation. Remember, it doesn’t have to be long. It could be a conversation with someone as you’re checking out your groceries. And in closing, of course, we know just as things have to end, sometimes the conversation needs to end. So here are some conversation exit lines to end your conversations on a positive note. One, you might discuss feature plans. Hey, this was so great. Maybe we can get together again to talk more about this. Make a plan to connect later and create a time constraint. If you find that you add that you either need to go because of a natural time constraint, or you feel like maybe that individual brought up inappropriate subjects and you just want to make sure that you’re getting out of there, you can put a time constraint on it. For example, I have to go, I have to go in a few minutes, but I would love to hear one more story or one more thing before I go. When we’re signaling to them that we’re unlimited time, then it makes it easier for us to say, okay, well I have to go. And then you can take your time away. And how do you know when to end a conversation? Well, it’s when you’re bored or they look bored or when you run out of things to say. That’s why it’s important to have that conversational list when you need a break. This is especially true for introverts, knowing that these conversations can typically drain your energy. Give yourself permission to take breaks, or if they brought up controversial or inappropriate topics, do not keep yourself hostage in a situation where it’s uncomfortable. Give yourself permission to say, hi, I actually have to step outside and you know, take this call or send this note. And an another appropriate time to end a conversation is when they’re rude or judgmental. You do not need to engage in a conversation where someone is offensive, so please give yourself the power to be able to exit those strategies so you don’t have to tolerate what might be very inappropriate, rude, or controversial conversations. So thank you so much for joining our many. So this month I hope you got many tips that can help you in the coming month as maybe many of you are out to go to more holiday events or family events or work events. And just know that the art of conversation is the art of hearing as well as being heard. And you can make friends, more friends in two months by becoming interested in other people than you can in two years by trying to get other people interested in you. So if you want to have a genuine conversation and actually deepen the connection, practice that curiosity. Be genuinely interested in someone else. Have a Great December— We’ll See You in 2023! Thank you so much for joining this week’s Minisode. We would love to see you next year. Feel free to check out our webinar. It’s January 26th, and we are gonna be talking about how to start the new year with a growth mindset. We have complimentary one-hour webinars offered every single month with the exception of December, and we would love to see you there. And, of course, if you need help with your leadership development needs, head on over to crestcom.com. We offer a complimentary leadership skills workshop where we will come into your organization, either in person or virtually, and help you and your team develop a strategy to collaborate better, to communicate better, and just to overall create a place where everyone wants to work. I hope you have a great rest of your year. I’ll see you in 2023. Bye, everyone! The post Minisode: Get Better at Small Talk to Connect in a Hybrid World with Jenn DeWall appeared first on Crestcom International.

Dec 2, 2022 • 45min

Avoiding the Financial Mistakes You Don’t Even Know You’re Making with Eunicia Peret

Avoiding Financial Mistakes with Wealth Strategist Eunicia Peret On this week’s episode of The Leadership Habit Podcast, I sat down to talk about that topic that some of us avoid– finances. I sat down with Eunicia Peret to talk about how to avoid the financial mistakes that you don’t know that you’re making. And before you turn this off because you think, I don’t wanna talk about money, trust me, it was actually kind of uncomfortable at points when I had to actually take an honest look at myself and think, yeah, I am making some of these mistakes. But before we go into the show, let me tell you a little bit more about Eunicia. Eunicia is an accomplished wealth strategist and business owner with over 15 years of experience in the financial services industry. Eunicia honed her expertise by delivering significant financial improvements to the bottom line, Fortune 500 companies and renowned global brands across multiple industries. Her passion is to help multi-six and seven-figure individuals optimize their wealth-creation efforts by empowering them to leverage wealth and creating strategies that go beyond 401ks, IRAs, and other typical savings accounts in order to minimize taxes, maximize growth, and increase income in retirement. I hope you enjoy this important conversation on how to avoid financial mistakes that you don’t know you’re making. Full Transcript Below Jenn DeWall: Hi everyone, it’s Jenn DeWall, and joining me today is Eunicia Peret. She’s a wealth strategist. Eunicia, I’m so excited to talk to you. Our topic today, how to avoid the financial mistakes that you don’t know you’re making! Such an important topic, knowing that many of us, hey, we might be afraid to manage our money, or we just don’t know how to manage our money. And so we may not obviously, be aware of these mistakes and what could be setting us up for maybe more of a struggle in the long run just by making an adjustments for what we can do today to manage our money better so we can set ourselves up for success. Because heck, you might be asking, what do money and leadership have in common? Well, money, Hey, we need that for our lifestyle. It impacts our stress, it impacts our quality of life. It impacts our worries. It impacts how we show up and solve problems at work. You might notice if you’re maybe more, I would say, loose with your money, that maybe you aren’t paying attention to some things in the same way as a leader, you might be a little bit more casual, and this is just another opportunity to add structure to something that you might already be doing. Or to add a new routine that will help set you up for long term success. So, Eunicia, thank you so much for joining us today. Eunicia Peret: Jenn, it’s such a pleasure to be here with you and, and all of our listeners. Jenn DeWall: Oh my gosh. All right, so I always have to ask it. I love a good origin story. Eunicia, tell me about yourself. How did you come to be a wealth strategist? What did your journey look like? Discovering Financial Blind Spots Eunicia Peret: Actually, it’s a very good question, especially for, for the folks that are listening to us. Whether you’re a rising leader or you are already an executive and, and you full rights. I, I used to be there. And one of the biggest things for me when we, my husband and I kind of took a step back and started looking at truly what our financial situation looked like, what we realized was that we were making too much money. We had been making too much money living the life, but frankly, when we were looking at our financial future, it wasn’t where we wanted it to be. And when we peel the covers back, what we realized was that the financial services as an industry is not necessarily suited for rising leaders, even for those that have already got into the multi six and seven figure income streams. And the reason for that is oftentimes we don’t have the assets under management to bring to the table so that we get first dibs and we really get the red carpet treatment as we would all like. And so for, for me, it really was, I became a wealth strategist for two reasons. Number one, reason number one is I was a financial advisor, a strategy consultant for many, many years. I played in that industry. And my area of expertise was always in the finance function. So looking at what CFOs were doing and how CFOs were working in terms of growing the business, doing more with less, I start asking some of the same questions when again, it came to our personal situation. So reason number two, when I started looking under the covers and realizing all of the blind spots and all of the loopholes that frankly we did not know existed, it was a big aha. And the deciding factor was, we need to do better. And other people need to avoid some of the mistakes that, frankly, I wish I could have avoided earlier on in life. Jenn DeWall: Yeah, it’s, I feel like money is just that topic, right? Everyone avoids it. I don’t wanna talk about it. I don’t wanna think about it. It’s just going to be there for me. And I know I at 40 this year, right, of thinking, where do we wanna be? We probably actually need to have a better grasp on where we would want to land 10, 20, 30 years instead of saying, we make really, you know, we make good money now, so it’s fine because we’re not, we’re probably, I’m definitely gonna be someone that’s falling into some of these mistakes that we’re gonna go into. And it’s easy, again, finances, I feel like money can sometimes feel hard, like, or it can be, yeah, it can feel hard. And it could also be, I mean, I get it restrictive feeling like, do I have enough funds? Like I lived much of my life working two jobs, paying off student loans and feeling like I don’t even have money to actually be able to contribute to a long term savings plan. And so I wanna empathize for anyone that’s like that too, because hey, we’re all there. This is going to be something that’s going to help you. It’s information to be able to think and consider things differently. Right. You, let’s go into it. What are some of the mistakes that you see people making? I mean, I know like the joke that I kind of made before this, because we’re recording this in November, we’re going into a holiday season of spending, and I can only imagine how many purchases are made right now that people maybe don’t need. So they might be throwing their money out the door, but what are some of the mistakes that you notice that people make? Having a Scarcity Mindset is a Common Financial Mistake Eunicia Peret: Well, one of the big mistakes, actually, it’s funny because you mentioned it yourself earlier. It’s, it’s this idea of I, you know, I have, I have debt, I have student loans, I have all of these things, all of these, these people, these companies, these, these other individuals that we need to take care of, mortgage whatever it is that your, your financial commitments are. And oftentimes individuals keep putting it off. So one of the big mistakes is, is just acting from, from a scarcity mindset to say, I don’t have enough to pay myself. And one of the guiding things that I have for individuals is you gotta start small. Because when you start and when you see it accumulating our patterns shift, your mindset shifts the way that you purchase, the way that you think about your spending shifts. And so we must stop acting with that from, from that standpoint of, of we don’t make enough. We don’t know enough, we don’t wanna see it. That’s another big, big thing that I see with individuals. It’s money. It’s so taboo. Oftentimes, you know, we, we grow in families and we come up through the ranks and nobody really talks about it. It’s, it’s been so taboo for so long that we just prefer not to think about it. And I feel it’s more of a risky proposition for those that are already making really good money. If you’re already in the six, multi six figure income arena, oftentimes you see a lot of money coming through, but you also see a lot of money going out, and you have this misconception, there’s this misalignment that we make really good money now. We’re always gonna make good money. And one of the things that, that I see with people is this, this fear of, especially when, when folks work for a company, work for somebody else’s, this fear of what happens if I lose my job? Well, here’s the, the idea, when our finances are in order and we know we’ve done things right for ourselves earlier on, we don’t have those fears because now we know that even if something was to happen, even if that job gets to be lost or we get fired or let go, or economy hits, or another COVID comes around or whatever happens, we have the financial standing to be fine on our own and to look for better opportunities. But without doing things right on the forefront, and without putting aside those limiting beliefs, oftentimes individuals end up living a vicious cycle that is, is frankly too much to bear for most. It’s OK to Start Small – Just Get Started Jenn DeWall: I heard you say within that, like starting small, I mean, what house fall is too small because I think one of the barriers for me with that scarcity, yeah, it’s like, I don’t have enough, but then if I feel like I’m putting, you know, $5 away, I may not feel like, well, that’s not anything. So what do you, when you say small, how would you approach small to get us to like kinda embrace that? Eunicia Peret: No, that, that’s a great question. And, and I love the fact that you mentioned $5, right? If we were to sit and just think about our spend, our daily spend and, and we were to, to assess where is it how much money we spend on a daily basis, how much money comes in, how much money we spend on a daily basis. Oftentimes I ask clients, well, you know, what, what would you like to set up for yourself, say on a monthly basis? Well, I’d like to set up a thousand dollars, but a thousand dollars. I’m just using really rough numbers, right? This, this may be for the individual that’s, that’s really saying, I really like, I really don’t have enough. So play with the numbers in your, in your mind, but let’s say a thousand dollars and they’ll say that’s too much. Like, I wanna do that, but it’s too much. Okay, well let’s throttle it back. What, what do you think you could potentially do per day? Can you pay yourself $10 a day? Is that too much? What about $5 a day? Start somewhere. If, if $5 a day seems like it’s a stretch, think about it. Do you go to Starbucks? Are you buying two or three coffees every single day? Are you doing anything extra? Are you stopping at the gas station and buying that pop soda? That’s $2, $3. Is that something that maybe you could be buying at at Whole Foods? Not Whole Foods, sorry, at at Costco or at Sam’s and have in bulk at home. And if you like it, that’s awesome, but find different alternatives to spend that money so that you can free up whatever it is that’s $5, $7, $10, a hundred dollars a day. It really is relevant to the individual. And that’s one of the reasons why we shouldn’t, nobody should put themselves in a, in a corner to say, I don’t make enough. I don’t have enough. Because wealth is relative and how much you can save is going to also be relative to where you’re at. But without starting and without setting that money aside, you never know how much further you can push it because you’ve never started. Financial Mistakes and Holiday Spending Jenn DeWall: Oh my gosh, you said so much that I feel like, again, these are mistakes that I make. I can tell you that I know. Because lately I’m like, we have to be, I want us to be a little bit more confident and focused on a strategic financial future. And, but then it’s the holiday season, Eunicia. I mean, I of course need my Starbucks or I need a pumpkin spice latte. Of course I need to go and buy all of the holiday decor to make my house feel like a warm hallmark movie. I mean, this is honestly how I rationalize and spend. If you come to my house, it looks like Christmas exploded. I can’t help it. I love getting into it, but if I really think about it, and I do, because my husband and I just had this conversation and he’s like, I swear you get a dopamine hit every time there’s an Amazon package delivered. And it’s, when we have that conversation, I’m like, I don’t need any of this. I genuinely don’t need it. It makes me happy because I love the aesthetic of the holiday. But in terms of money, yeah, it’s a big waste. And I have to probably face the music a little bit more and challenge myself to say, Jenn, but you don’t really need this next ornament or a third tree. I don’t need a third tree, Eunicia. I just love Christmas. I know it’s there, but really it just does not make economic sense. But maybe some of our listeners can relate to some of those impulsive spending habits that we have or the little moments of joy. And also being curious about what are we also trying to cover up when we do that, right? Because there is a little bit of like, when we spend that is tied to our mental state of how we wanna feel or thinking that we buy that thing, it’s gonna take away our pains. And I do that a lot. I don’t know, maybe that was too much. What are additional mistakes that you see people making or where they get it, where they might get, you know, their financial approach wrong? Eunicia Peret: Well, I think if we sit and, and kind of think about, there are so many, but it, because we’re around the holidays and a lot of people out there are probably feeling the same way that you do, right? Whether it’s Christmas or it’s Easter or it’s some other holiday that people celebrate, there is this impulse to just, and and frankly the stores don’t make it any easier. Amazon doesn’t make it any easier to just say no, right? But what I, what I tell folks is, is sit down and think about what truly makes you joyful. Is it that extra pillow? Is it that extra Christmas tree? Is it that extra decoration? Maybe you can put yourself on a schedule where you don’t buy major decorations, but every two to three years, maybe you can soften things up by just changing up the type of music that you play in the house. Maybe you can play music consistently. By the way, that’s actually something that I’m trying myself. And the reason I do that is because instead of the music playing just in the office, when I work for my home office, I like hearing the music in the whole house because then whatever I go, there’s just that ambiance. Or same thing with the office, right? If you’re, if you’re at an actual office, it’s about changing the culture. It’s about starting to look at what are the things that make us truly happy internally? And what we find is that spending more on things isn’t getting us there. What people see though on the other side when they start truly building wealth is that as they see their wealth accumulating, their spending habits change. I’ll give you myself as an example. I am, I can be very dangerous when I go shopping, and I know that. So for that reason, I have learned to govern the way that I spend it, the way that I look at things. And I’ve gotten to the point where every time I see something, there’s this question and rationale that goes through my mind of do I really need it? And if, if I’m looking at an extra $150, it’s really, it’s just $150, but then $150 plus another $150 plus whatever else you throw at it, talking about wealth. And when I say wealth for those, those individuals that will say, well, but I really don’t strive to be uber wealthy or wealthy, wealth is relative. Once again, it’s, it’s building that financial independence. I know that $150 will go so much longer, so much further. If I don’t really need to spend it today, it’s gonna go much further for me in the long run. And especially with inflation going through the roof and everything else that we’re battling with, we just really need to think about how do we want to live our future? Because it’s not just about today. If we can focus on the future, we’re gonna get not just the future benefits, but we’re gonna get more of that peace in our heart that, hey, we’re in a really good place. Even if something does happen, we’ve got that peace, that extra blanket or that extra pillow or Christmas or whatever it is that we get is not gonna, we’re not gonna be able to chew on that and it’s not gonna be able to feed us if worse comes to worse. Jenn DeWall: Yeah, it definitely won’t be able to feed me. Absolutely not. It will take up storage space at my house and this is our first house. Right. So I, I think I get, I overdo it for that, but I love what you said, but I’m curious, how do you– because maybe I do need the fear, right? I need the, like understanding what it could look like, the cost of not, right, the cost of inaction. When you see people nearing maybe the end of their working time and thinking about their wealth or their financial future, what does, what’s maybe a good example that you’ve seen of someone feeling being able to maintain their lifestyle? And what’s an example of someone that maybe their whole, like everything kind of had to shift because they just didn’t, you know, focus on it then. And so now that they’re out of work, they actually have a more restricted budget. Do you have examples of kind of both sides of those spectrum? I think that’d be helpful to place that. Understanding Retirement Savings to Avoid Financial Mistakes Eunicia Peret: Absolutely. So one, one really good example is individuals kind of working and going through their careers. And if, if you are the type of individual and you’re listening and you’re already contributing to your 401k, congratulations, you’re probably doing more than a lot of people are. But here’s what happens. Even for individuals that set money aside in the traditional retirement types of accounts, what they don’t realize is that when they get to retirement, their tax situation is actually going to potentially harm them. So oftentimes people go through their careers and they go through life and building their businesses with this idea that when I retire my tax bracket, I’m gonna be in a lower tax bracket. But what they forget to think about is they’re not gonna have the children at home. They’re not gonna have all the deductions that they’ve had building their career, you know, pay mortgage on their house, building their business, et cetera, et cetera. And so even a small incremental shift in taxes is going to ultimately put a huge strain on how they live their retirement lifestyle, right? Or, or if people don’t like to think of it as retirement when we stop working for money. And so one of the big, big issues that we see is that people don’t plant accordingly. Again, just setting money aside in some account is not enough. If that account is not built with a true purpose in mind, starting early. Really being able to think of what do we want to, what do we want to be in the future? And how do we work things backwards? Simple quote-unquote, financial planning is not enough because most financial planning is just focused on put money here or put money there and hope that it’s gonna be fine. But even in those situations, the numbers and the percentages are going lower and lower every single year it seems. So for example, for individuals in years past when they retired, it was okay to say, Hey, we’ll be drawing out, you know, five to 6% out of our retirement income. Then that number went down to 4%. Well, now a lot of financial planners will say, oh, no, no, no, no, we cannot draw 4%. We really need to be down in the two to 3% range. So now you are taking even less money out of what you’ve accumulated. That’s even gonna be even more impacted by taxes in the future. And it’s a recipe for disaster. But in order to flip that around, we need to really start focusing and looking at what do we want the end to look like or the future to look like? And if we work it backwards, then we’re able to make changes and implement tactics and solutions today that are going to enable us to have that financial independence and financial lifestyle in the future that we so desire. Jenn DeWall: Oh my gosh, I, there’s so many things that come to mind for me. I might have a more of a unique perspective from just from where I sit because it actually was hard for me to think about long term wealth because when I was in my twenties, my dad had a stroke that put him into a nursing home. But it was during the 2008 recession. So he was laid off and he didn’t have insurance. And so ultimately that pushed him into what the United States has Medicaid and Medicaid, that then to make him eligible for Medicaid, we had to sell his house. We had to cash out all his pension, his annuity, and the only income that he has is the a hundred dollars a month that he gets and everything else goes back in, right? So even though he planned for it, once you hit Medicaid, and I say this because people don’t plan for like, also the other pieces of life, like it will happen. Jenn DeWall: I don’t wanna say it’s going to, but like you don’t know, my dad was 54 when he had a stroke that altered his life. And on the flip side, my mom was also 50 and she went through a mental health crisis, or she was 54 as well, and with schizophrenia and lost everything just by nature of the disease. And so she lost everything that she had worked for, she had spent down and she had paid that. Like, and not to say that that example is likely for anyone, but just to understand that there are things that are gonna happen that you’re gonna bank on that aren’t necessarily going to come to fruition in that way. Like, you have to be able to understand that life is gonna take you down different paths and you have to set yourself up for success. And I’m not sure if that was too, I guess too much to say, but really when I got, I think when I was younger, I first had the notion of like, well, what the heck am I saving for if, like, if my life is gonna turn out like this, why try now? Jenn DeWall: That was honestly my first kind of way to look at finances was just because I saw that it didn’t really matter. But, you know, the, on the flip side of it, I want to be able to do the things that I do right now today. I know that life is gonna throw me some curve balls and some wrenches I need to get ahead of it. That’s probably the long, the long winded way of saying that to anticipate for that stuff and not just to assume that it’s gonna be easy. Every, there’s nothing that’s gonna go wrong, no light will have ebbs and flows, and we have to make sure that we’re setting ourself up for success. Preparing for the Unexpected Eunicia Peret: 100%. And you know, your, your parents’ cases is definitely unfortunate, but it’s not unique. It happens. I mean, as we age, I’ll never forget, my mom used to tell me that she was having a hard time driving at night, right? And I used to think, I mean, I didn’t discount and I did not say that she was not telling the truth, but I just couldn’t see it until not long ago. I was driving at night and I thought to myself, wait, it just feels like it’s much harder to drive. I’m just having a harder time perceiving the lights and everything else. And I’m, I’m not my mom’s age. And I call her, I said, I think I understand. And she, she just kind of giggled. And she said, you still don’t understand. I mean, sure, you may have noticed something, but the reality is that as we aged, there are things that we really can’t anticipate. And, and you mentioned something that’s beautiful that sadly we don’t really look in retrospect, it’s, it’s the idea of learning from those that have gone before us, right? We may not experience the same exact things that they experience, but we’re gonna experience similar things. And even in your parents’ case, right? How beautiful would it have been if instead of having to liquidate everything your family could have actually enjoyed the fruits of everything that they have saved for versus having to go through a fire sale just to appease what it is that our government is saying in order to be able to qualify for that, for that support. It’s really sad. Unfortunately, things have to be done well in advance. We can’t do it when we’re already there and things would’ve needed to already shift, Jenn DeWall: My gosh, transfer those assets, get past the look back period. You can Google that. That’s not my financial period. That would be my financial advice of what I’ve learned of like transferring assets, getting your power of attorney lined up, you know, setting up who’s gonna handle that and where they’re gonna go. But that’s not the focus of today. We are gonna talk about how we can take a different approach. And I know that you have the three pillars of financial planning. It’s the methodology, it’s how we can look at this to apply a different approach to hopefully maximize what our long term savings looks like. So let’s dive into it. Eunicia, let’s go the three pillars of financial planning. What are they? Three Pillars of Financial Planning to Avoid Financial Mistakes Eunicia Peret: So before I go into the three pillars of financial planning, let me just preface it by saying that when we started looking at what are the different blind spots, what are the different pitfalls that frankly I was missing out on that I didn’t see. But so many others, executives and, and leaders, rising leaders unfortunately, are facing day in and day out. What became very a big eye opener was that it, they were kind of in my mind, and based on everything that we’ve seen, they’re focused on kinda three different areas. And those three different area, consequently are those three pillars that we’re talking about. The first one is taxes. One of the things that I had no idea I really, truly could have had so much more of an impact on was minimizing my tax exposure legally and, and doing things basically in accordance to the tax law. But unfortunately, so many other people are trapped in that same exact situation. And especially for those that are w2, the whole idea for many of them is I cannot legally reduce my tax exposure. The reality is that you can’t, is it easy? No, it requires work, but it can be done. So one of the things that we do, one of the, the first pillar is focusing on how do we minimize our tax exposure because of the businesses that we have or because of the, the jobs that we have and, and our passions today so that we can enjoy the fruits of those, of those savings down the road. And oftentimes what we see is that people leave as much as 30 to 50% more, they pay more in taxes than they truly should. Jenn DeWall: Wait. How, how does that happen though? Cause I mean, does it, if you’re a w2, is it that you’re not claiming your exemptions? Like how, how are we paying more in taxes? Eunicia Peret: Well, as a2, technically you cannot claim those exemptions, right? So you have to technically change your tax status. And that changing of tax status comes not only with, with some work, it requires support, but at the same time, it’s a, it’s a total mindset shift, right? I, I can’t tell you how many times I speak with, with high paid individuals, whether it be doctors, whether it be pilots and their whole, this whole idea of I don’t qualify for Roth. I mean, it’s something as simple as Roth account or Roth 401k. I don’t qualify for Roth because I make too much money. Hello? Who in the world gave them that idea? Whether they heard it internally in their company or they spoke to somebody that gave them that idea, the reality is that they’re leaving money. This is future taxes on the table without knowing that they could be doing something about it. Now, there’s also this idea of minimizing taxes in the present here, but a lot of, especially they’re W2 s a lot of W2 employees don’t understand that there are ways and what are the ways in which they can do that? So we focus on taxes for, for, for today, right? And that’s where our team of experts are exceptionally well suited to work with individuals that historically did not know that they had options. The second pillar, as we move, Ask More Questions to Avoid Financial Mistakes Jenn DeWall: Wait, can I ask the basic question? Sure. What’s a Roth IRA? I’m gonna do it. I don’t know. I mean, I’ve heard of it, I know the term, like I’m not fluent in it, but it sounds like there’s a tax shield, but it also sounds like there could be an income. What, what is a Roth IRA? Eunicia Peret: So a Roth IRA or a Roth 401k, if, for those that are contributing to their 401k, is a savings plan where you pay taxes on the income today and that money as it grows, and that Roth account will not be taxable down the road. That Roth account will also position individuals, the Roth money, at least based on the current legislation. It’s not going to go against your social security income and other types of income that you have, which are going to put you, A lot of people also don’t know that social security can be taxed up to 85%, 80 up to 85% of your social security benefits can actually be taxed. So now we’re talking about double taxation. Congratulations. If you’re making a lot of money today, there’s a likelihood that you’re going to be paying even more in taxes than you anticipated because you are gonna be making better money in the future. And so those are a lot of the different things that people don’t know. But I hope that that answers your question regarding that Jenn DeWall: No, thank you. I’m, I don’t, I will ask all the questions that people may or may not know, or maybe everyone can get a good laugh by saying, oh my gosh, I can’t believe she doesn’t know what that is. I, I mean, I’ve heard of Roth IRA, I just don’t, I’m being honest, I’m probably one of the your targets right now of people that aren’t doing these things. And I’m just trying to be transparent to say to our listener, don’t go into the shame and bury your head in a hole. We’ve got to, you know, face it head on and take responsibility. So I’m just trying to be a little vulnerable in that approach. All right, Eunicia Peret: So the first, here’s what, before we go into the second, the second pillar, here’s what I wanna tell you specifically on that. Roth versus traditional, there are a lot of books out there. Because obviously we, we stay on top of what’s happening in our industry. There are a lot of books out there that will tell people, Hey, it’s set more money aside in a traditional account because you don’t pay taxes on that money today. You’ll pay taxes in the future. But what a lot of individuals don’t understand is that a lot of those books are written for the people that are never gonna rise above a certain level. So if you are that individual that says, I really, I want to live the same lifestyle in retirement as perhaps you do now because you make really good money, then you’re gonna, what, what those same authors and those same books will tell you is, oh, by the way, down the road you can do a back Roth conversion. Well, why in the world would I choose to do a back Roth conversion down the road and pay more in taxes because I’m going to be making more money? Versus thinking strategically today to figure out what should that portion of traditional versus Roth accounts look like for me? Because it’s not to say that you have to do one or the other, you can do a mix, but a lot of individuals don’t know that those options exist or how to think through them. And because of that, it’s gonna end up costing them potentially hundreds of thousands of dollars down the road and just taxes a little. Jenn DeWall: Wow. That’s, I mean, I love that. I hope that that was a great tip for everyone and just thinking of considering and how you start to evaluate these. A Message from Crestcom Crestcom is a global organization dedicated to developing effective leaders. Companies all over the world have seen their managers transformed into leaders through our award-winning and accredited leadership development programs. Our signature BPM program provides interactive management training with a results-oriented curriculum and prime networking opportunities. If you’re interested in learning more about our flagship program and developing your managers into leaders, please visit our website to find a leadership trainer near you. Or maybe you yourself have always wanted to train and develop others. Crestcom is a global franchise with ownership opportunities available throughout the world. If you have ever thought about being your own boss, owning your own business and leveraging your leadership experience to impact businesses and leaders in your community, Crestcom may be the right fit for you. We’re looking for professional executives who are looking for a change and want to make a difference in people’s lives. Learn more about our franchise opportunity on the Own A Franchise page of our website at Crestcom.com. Common Investment Mistakes Jenn DeWall: All right, let’s, let’s dive into the second pillar now. Eunicia Peret: So the second pillar is, it’s really a continuance of the first pillar, but focuses more on how do we grow our wealth, right? Where, where does money get ultimately invested? And a lot of individuals have this anxiety about the market. Sure, the younger generation, not so much. But as we get into those forties days into those fifties, people start asking the question of, can I truly afford a downturn? Can I afford a 30% of 50% or even higher downturn in the market? And the answer for many people is no, they not only can’t afford it, they can’t stomach it, they cannot go through it emotionally, it’s too draining. But then the question becomes, what else can we do? Because historically they don’t know that they have options. And so one of the things that I’m a huge believer in is this notion of people need to understand what their options are when it comes to investing. And investing can be in, in the, in traditional financial vehicles, non-traditional financial vehicles, which are truly not exposed to the market. But then there’s this whole other aspect of investments, different types of investments that have nothing to do with the financial services industry. And that’s a lot of the same things. Those are the same strategies that no one is really talking about. Why are they not talking about, because frankly, the investors that are out there, they want to know that they have people that they know, like, and trust coming in. And so if it’s just somebody off the street saying, Hey, I’d like to be part of this fund, or this, this investment, or whatever it is that the opportunity is, the likelihood that they’re gonna be able to get in is nil. But the biggest challenge is people don’t even know that they have access to these opportunities. And so when we looked at the blind spots, one of the big things that I said is, boy, I wish I would’ve had access to know how the angels angel investors work. It doesn’t take millions of dollars to become an angel investor. The risks can be much higher, but guess what? The rewards are also likely much higher as well. And if you know what you’re looking at, then it gives you, again, the sense of this new renewed sense of I’ve accomplished and I’m doing really well for myself because I’m truly diversified. And when I say diversified, I’m not talking about that pie chart that you see in your 401k statement or your investment statement. Okay? So that’s, that’s a big thing, is really that second pillar is focused on giving individuals the empowerment to understand what are the different options and figuring out what are the options that actually resonate with who they are with how they see money so that they can ultimately not only build wealth, but sleep better at night. Jenn DeWall: Yeah, I mean there, I think their ignorance is bliss, right? Like I honestly can tell you that statement. Oh gosh, I’m really just, I guess I’m really, maybe this is my financial confession during this podcast today, because I have not looked at my 401k statement from my old job that I was, that for 10 years. I’ve not looked at it in like years. Cause I don’t wanna see how much it’s dropped over the last few years. I’m just ignorance is bliss, right? I’m that person where I’m like, I don’t wanna know. But on the flip side, I also think it was really oblivious to some of the alternatives to the market, that it’s not just out there. And maybe I’m not saying you’re saying this, but even I worked for a brief period with a company that, a private equity firm. And so taking your 401k and rolling that into real estate a rolling that into a business, understanding that there are many different ways to actually invest your money than what you might traditionally think. Jenn DeWall: And so I appreciate you saying that because I honestly had no idea. I mean, I knew that like private equity existed, I just thought that was for some super wealthy people that were out there doing stuff, like I had no idea that actually a typical person could actually do it depending on, you know, the type of investment you’re going to make. And so when I realized that, I was like, oh my gosh. So if you can tell I’m not, I’m multimillionaire, I’m a normal person just like you or just like the people listening and yeah, I think it’s just, it helps to realize that there were other options. And you can take a 401k and you can, you know, roll it in and invest it, and you can do different things with it. But the thing is, you have to start having these conversations. You’ve got to start to think about it differently, The Economy and Learning from Past Financial Mistakes Eunicia Peret: 100%. And it’s not just the conversation, it’s also who do you trust? Because yeah, we’re right, wrong or indifferent, we’re, we’re not nobody. I’ve not heard one person that, that have said that 2023 is gonna be easier on a financial spectrum than 2022 has been. On the contrary, everybody’s thinking that 20 we have to brace for 2023. So then what do we do? Considering that a lot of the alternative investments, you know, people have really made a lot of money when the economy was really good. But the question is, who’s been out there? Who was out there in 2008, 2009 that rode the waves? They did not end up losing everything. Because when you are thinking about setting, putting your money somewhere, you don’t wanna put it with individuals that completely lost everything in 2008, 2009, unless you want to repeat the same process. So one of the big things is who do we trust and how do we go about that to make sure that, as you said, that money aside in those alternative types of investments, that again, it’s, it’s with people that you know, like, and trust if they come through trusted referral sources, et cetera, et cetera. And they have the trajectory to prove for, for the actions that they’ve taken in the past. Jenn DeWall: Okay, so I wanna add like a follow up question to that, because I think that it is true when you have, I know you know this, I know you know this, so it’s not gonna be offensive, but like financial planners, like all of a sudden you’re like, oh my gosh, they’re gonna sell it to me. I don’t know what to do. They’re go like, and sometimes it can feel like, and I don’t know cause then you’re talking about a topic that I’m already uncomfortable talking about because I’m not sure I wanna talk about my financial period, so or my financial fur future. So how do you kind of assess that? Because I think initially there is, unless you’re proactively like, Hey, I wanna do this, I’m more inclined to distrust someone because it’s my money than I am to trust. So how, what are things I’m not alone, right? This is how other people are, or I’m <laugh> Eunicia Peret: You are not alone. As a matter of fact, remember at the very beginning, I, I, I learned to distrust the financial services industry for that reason. Everybody unfortunately has something to sell, and the incentive in the industry is not for there to be collaboration across the financial team. Think about your cpa, think about your attorney, think about your financial planner. One of the biggest things for me, which, which really led me to this distrust was actually after I started working with individuals where I was a fly on the wall. And I cannot tell you how many financial advisory kind of interviews I, I just wanted to observe. Again, that was my, my strong suit as a financial a strategy consultant and, and financial in the financial world to say, you know, I just wanna observe, and I cannot tell you how many situations there were where clients would come in with a real estate portfolio and the conversation would go something along the lines of real estate is wonderful. Here’s all the reasons why you should stay away from hardcore assets. Oh, by the way, you can still reinvest in real estate if it’s through a REIT or through some sort of a fund. Because that’s how the financial planner was getting incentivized, is to have the clients there at their disposal versus in the hard assets. Well, when I realized that, hey, by the way, my husband’s in real estate, we’ve been in real estate for a really long time, and I happen to be very passionate about real estate. Not to say that everything has to be in real estate, not at all. But it’s, it’s a it’s an area that I know that I trust that we’ve made money in, et cetera, et cetera. And so one of the different approaches that we take with our clients is I don’t ever want a client to be in a situation where they feel like their questions are stupid, especially when they talk to financial planners or financial advisors or anybody in the financial services industry. Eunicia Peret: And so after clients end up working with us, they know that there’s no question and there’s no statement that is gonna get thrown their way, that’s going to make ’em feel tiny as a human being. Why? Because they’re empowered with the knowledge. They don’t have to know how to do it themselves, but they’re empowered with the knowledge to know that, as one of my coaches would say, they no longer will be bamboozled because they know better. They know that they have options. And so when somebody comes and says, well, this is best for you, because… Immediately the answer can be, well, I don’t think it fits me. Here are the reasons why. Whereas historically, people don’t know how to come back with that answer because they don’t understand the different options. Financial Planning by Working Backwards Jenn DeWall: Yeah, I love that. Giving people permission to not know, being supportive and trying to build that collaboration that is absent of that feeling like, I don’t know, you’re just trying to get something from me and I don’t even know if I like you. I, I really appreciate your approach because I, I feel like that’s, if people responded like that, like I would build trust a lot faster and feeling like, yeah, I actually wanna do this and thank you so much that I feel like I actually understand what we’re doing or what these fees look like or what the consequences are, that nothing is going to come outta the blue. That’s going to surprise me. Like I really appreciate that approach. All right. I know that we have, I love, I love this conversation, but I know we still have to get to our final pillar. What is the final pillar? Eunicia Peret: So the final pillar is what I would call the, the strategy, right? Whether it’s we’re we’re working on W2 job and we are looking at retirement, or we may be our business owners, or we want to build a business and we want at some point in time think about how do we, how do we pass that business on? Or how do we, how do we get to enjoy the fruits of our labor when it comes to the financial side of things, right? When it comes to being able to extract the money that we’ve set aside or the wealth that we’ve built. And so when we focus there as I mentioned earlier, we really start looking at both forwards but also backwards. We have to look backwards in order to understand where we’re at. And this is where I have a, a great example a client that came to us, and it’s funny because I just met with husband and wife two weeks ago and when the very first time they came to us one of the things that she said is, I, we talked about what, what do you think you you’re gonna wanna be when you retire? And she said, well, based on everything that we’ve been told, again, by however many other people they’ve spoken with, we would be happy if we’re looking at somewhere around $5,000 per month. And I thought, okay, that’s, that’s not a bad number, right? Especially for people in retirement based on their lifestyle, et cetera. Well, here’s the deal. When we work things backwards and we made just a couple of small shifts in, in terms of their financial portfolio, not all of it, but some of the things shifted at the very onset on a very minimal basis, they were looking at a projected $8,000 in income. And that was very conservative. Wow. Can we honestly say that their life has ar automatically changed that their mindset is now in a totally different place. Because instead of thinking if I can get $5,000 now they know that at a minimum we’re gonna have almost a guaranteed $8,000 coming in. Jenn DeWall: Yeah, Eunicia Peret: Well here’s the beautiful thing. This was a few years ago when we met just a couple of weeks ago and we looked at, of course they’ve gotten better jobs and they’ve gotten better salaries and they’re setting more money aside and their, you know, their, their financial platform continues to evolve. Now, eight thousand dollars is gonna be there, but it’s gonna be a whole lot more than that. And so as we, I’m sure everybody that’s listening can think to, well, if I could, and the idea is you can, but you have to have the right strategies in place. And without working things backwards, there is no way that that’s gonna happen. Unfortunately, to work things backwards goes against the grain of what the industry as a whole does. And when we realized that that was one of the big blind spots for people, we just said, you know what? We have to focus on it. We have to work things backwards as hard as it is. Because then we know we’re gonna, we’re either on the path to achieve the results or we’re veering off path and we need to come back to course. And it’s just a beautiful thing because that gives us that sense of we’re gonna be okay. And that sense of, of confidence in what the future is gonna hold is so powerful regardless of what happens in life with our careers, et cetera, they will bounce back. But if we don’t do things correctly on the financial side, we’re gonna constantly play catch up. And catch up is not a pretty thing to do. How to Connect with Eunicia to Learn More Jenn DeWall: Oh my gosh, catch up just sounds, we have less time and we’re not as energetic as we used to be. So catch is gonna be hard at that point in time. Work it backwards, be open to a new approach. Check your scarcity mindset. Talk about those three pillars of reducing and minimizing your taxes and optimizing your financial portfolio. And of course just retirement planning. You’ve shared a lot today. I have really enjoyed our conversation. I think probably because it felt like confession for me, I really had to own some of the mistakes that I’m making. But how can people get in touch with you? Eunicia Peret: The easiest way is to check us out on our website, empowerfinancialplanner.com. We’re also on social media. You can find us under Eunicia Peret we’re quite active, especially on LinkedIn for our listeners, I’m sure you guys are all on there. Reach out to us, message us and it would be our pleasure to help you out. And we also have a, a giveaway for you guys. The five biggest pitfalls that we see in individuals. They’re a very easy read. I encourage every one of our listeners to go in there, check ’em out, and after you have a chance to read them, it’ll also give you an opportunity to schedule a call with one of our team members. It would be our pleasure to just answer some questions that you guys may have and you can find that at empoweredfinancialplanner.com/pitfalls. And it’ll also be, I think in the meeting notes. Jenn DeWall: Yep. It’ll be in the show notes. Thank you so much, Eunicia, for just sharing, stopping to give us your expertise, your time even to probably entertain the random questions that I asked. I just really appreciate your approach to financial planning and really thinking about how can we maximize our future so we can live those best years in the best way possible. Thank you so much for coming on the show. Eunicia Peret: It was my pleasure, Jenn. Thanks for having me. Jenn DeWall: Thank you so much for listening to today’s podcast. I know that there were so many insights that I gained. I know that I obviously have a big opportunity to maybe be a little bit more assertive in how I manage my finances and even if it is just starting small, just like Eunicia opened with starting small. Now, if you want to get in touch with Eunicia, you shared a resource, the Five Pitfalls to Avoid in Retirement. So if you wanna connect with it, it’s going to be in our show notes. You can find that resource link at empoweredfinancialplanner.com backslash pitfalls. And of course, if you enjoy today’s podcast episode or maybe you know someone else that could benefit from hearing this message, share it with them, leave us a review. We would love your feedback. And in closing, if we could do, do anything for you or the leaders to help you develop, let us know. In January, we’ll be doing a free webinar open to the public, all about growth mindset. And of course we offer a complimentary two hour leadership skills workshop that we will be willing to come in virtually or in person to any of your organizations because we are so committed to developing and making the world a better place by developing better leaders. Thank you so much for listening. Until next time. The post Avoiding the Financial Mistakes You Don’t Even Know You’re Making with Eunicia Peret appeared first on Crestcom International.

Nov 18, 2022 • 41min

Creating a Work Culture that Accelerates Performance with Jessica Kriegel

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Unexpected Leadership Lessons from ‘80s Pop Culture with Chris Clews

Nov 4, 2022 • 43min

How to Reprogram Your Brain with Neuro-Hacker, Iris Polit

Neuro-Hacker Iris Polit Explains How to Reprogram Your Brain Hi everyone, it’s Jenn DeWall, and on this week’s episode of The Leadership Habit Podcast, I sat down with Iris Polit to talk about how to reprogram your brain. Iris Polit is an award-winning author, speaker, and career and personal branding strategist. She is an advocate of brain hacking to enable human flourishing and believes that our work life plays a big role in our sense of fulfillment. Her mission is to help professionals and entrepreneurs get unstuck, take ownership of their success, and to live to their fullest potential. Iris leverages her training as an applied positive psychology practitioner and over two decades of experience in corporate and non-profit environments to empower professionals and entrepreneurs to navigate career transitions effectively. She has been featured on ABC, CBS, NBC, and Fox, and is a co-author of the bestselling books, Mastering the Art of Success and How to Be Crazy Amazing During Difficult Times. And I hope you enjoy this conversation with neuro-hacker Iris Polit as we discuss how to reprogram your brain. Full Transcript Below Jenn DeWall: Hi everyone. I’m so excited to be joined by Iris Polit today. Iris, thank you so much for joining us on the Leadership Podcast. Iris Polit: Thank, Thank you so much for having me! Jenn DeWall: I love the enthusiasm. It’s my over-enthusiasm because we’re talking about a topic that I don’t know if it’s just that, you know, understanding our own, how our brain works is becoming, I feel like something that’s so much more talked about in the last 20 years or so, but I am here for it. Let’s talk about and have a great conversation on how to reprogram your brain. That’s what you are in store for Leadership Habit. So I’m gonna put it back over to you, Iris. Thank you so much for coming on the show, and I always love a great origin story. So if you could just start out by telling us a little bit about yourself or how you came to be, how the heck did you even become interested in understanding how our brain works? I mean, that’s one question in and of itself. But I I turn it over to you now, Iris. Meet Iris Polit, Neuro-Hacker, Author and Career & Personal Branding Strategist Iris Polit: Thanks so much, Jenn, and thanks for inviting me to the podcast. I’m super excited to talk about one of my, my favorite topics, which is neuro hacking. I am flabbergasted that we’re able to operate in our modern world with the caveman brain that, that we’ve been provided. So a little bit of an origin story. I had no interest in anything psychological. I mean, I was a polis sci major for, for goodness sake! I was going to be the first Secretary of State, but Madeline Albright got that job before me. She did great <laugh>. So I went down a different route. I went down the root of marketing and looked at marketing through the lens of what resonates with your target audience. There’s a lot of psychology involved. So I got certified and applied positive psychology and really got into neuro hacking and neuroscience. It is, as you said, relatively new. Because previously, we didn’t have the technology to really see how our brain operates, right? Like in the past, people would like cut-up cadavers– and at that point, the brain is dead, so you can’t really see what’s going on. But modern technology, and especially imaging, has allowed us to see which part of our brains light up when certain things happen, and it really makes it a lot easier to understand the brain a lot better. So I’m super excited to be talking about neuro-hacking. I’m also the founder of Your Success Ace, which is a boutique coaching agency that focuses on career transition and career growth and personal branding and thriving in the workplace. So this is a big, big part of that, and I’m looking forward to chatting with you about it. What Are the Myths We Have About Training Our Brain? Jenn DeWall: Oh my gosh, absolutely. Well, we need that, right? Understanding our brain because either it’s working towards our success or it’s taking us further away, or maybe motivating us to make choices that might be or make choices that are pushing us away from our dream. So let’s dive in. How to reprogram your brain, or I love the phrase that you use neuro-hacking. What do you think are the challenges or the issues that people have or even the myths that people have around retraining your brain? Iris Polit: So I think that that old myth of, oh, we only use 10% of our brain. We’ve all seen like the movies where the people take a pill and can access a hundred percent of the brain and it becomes amazing and ends in disaster. That is not actually true. We use a lot more than 10% of our brain. We also use different hemispheres of our brain at the same time. And it really, it allows us to, to function and move through the world. I mean, our brain, the best way to look at it is like a mega computer. And that’s why I use terms like reprogramming, right? And hacking. And we’re gonna talk about that. We’re gonna talk a little bit about hacking and rewiring and upgrading our brain today. It’s because if you were to take a computer that actually does the same thing that our brain does, you would be flabbergasted because it would have to have about 3,500 terabytes of memory, which is huge. You know, how excited we get over one terabyte of like external storage, like imagine 3,500, right? We Use Much More than 10% of Our Brain— Just Not All at Once Iris Polit: And also it would have to perform 38,000 trillion operations per second. So that’s, that’s the power of our brain, but that is also the downfall of our brain. Because there’s so many things that come at us and in today’s day and age, we live in a very noisy world and our brain works a lot harder as a filter. And that’s another part we’re gonna talk about resilience, why resilience is, is so important because our brain is tired! There’s way too much stuff coming at it right now, you know? So I think the 10% myth is probably one of the biggest ones. The challenges perspective is, so there’s two, there’s a lot of biases that come along with this fabulous brain of ours, right? As I mentioned, we are walking through a modern world with a cave person’s brain. Our brain was designed to protect us. Our brain is always like, Oh my god, where’s danger coming from? Who’s gonna attack me? How do I keep my little human safe? Right? So there’s a lot of biases that are programmed and hardwired into our brain that, that we need to overcome such as, you know, negativity bias, confirmation bias and we’re gonna get into all of that today. Jenn DeWall: I am excited. I mean, negativity bias is one that I think people don’t realize that all of us have and that it impacts, you know, how we feel. And it also shows that so many of our thoughts or how our brain communicates are actually repetitive. I mean, I just think that that’s bananas when we get into that. I’m looking forward to it. <Laugh>, I think most people don’t realize that if you don’t like something that’s happening in your life, so much of it starts with your brain and how, or the information that you’re using to program it. So is it even true from your perspective that you can reprogram your brain? Because I know, that’s one that people sometimes think, or maybe it’s easier to get into that belief that things are happening to you, that you don’t have the control like is it even true that you can reprogram your brain. Yes, You Can Reprogram Your Brain Iris Polit: It is a hundred percent true. There’s an amazing concept called neuroplasticity. And neuroplasticity is basically the way our brain continues to operate through disease, through brain trauma. And so in our brain, we have all these little neurons, right? There are neuro cells and they connect to each other and communicate with each other through synopsis. We’re gonna keep this super, super simple, right? Neuroplasticity basically allows us to rewire the neurons in the way they communicate in case there’s, you know, brain trauma or injury or disease. But it’s also what allows us to quote-unquote change our mind and realize once we have the awareness that we could get rid of negativity loops you that, for example, that you mentioned, those negative thoughts, you know, and, and tweak it to make sure that those pathways go along in, in the ways that really make us more effective, more successful, more positive in the way we move through the world. Jenn DeWall: I mean, I love thinking about the brain as someone that has <laugh>. No, I mean, as someone that has multiple sclerosis, right? I have a neurologist that helps me look at my brain and understand it. I have a dad that suffered a stroke about 10 years ago. And so we’re talking about, you know, the impact in behavior and mobility as a result of that. And then I also have a parent who– my mom, has the diagnosis of a schizophrenic, which also impacts our brain. So I love all things brain because our brain is something that I think people can’t even begin to understand what goes on up here and what that actually looks like. You know, I think it’s so much more sophisticated than what we ever actually give it credit for. Yeah. <Laugh> like, so let’s dive into it. What, like, how do you, So I love that talking about neuroplasticity. And then I think you had also mentioned something, and this was on our pre-call about the growth mindset. Yes. Tell me more. Reprogram Your Brain with a Growth Mindset Iris Polit: <Laugh>. Absolutely. So neuroplasticity is obviously one, right? So that’s, if, if we’re thinking of, of our current like neural mapping, they’re all like six-lane highways, and we are going to decide that we’re gonna hack at the bushes over here and create a new exit off this highway and build a new highway, right? So that’s how we create new neural pathways growth mindset is something that came to the forefront by Dr. Carol Dweck, who I’m a huge fan of. And it talks about the way we approach learning. It’s the way we approach criticism, the way we approach other people’s success. So there’s a growth mindset, and there’s a fixed mindset, and in different areas in our life, we could rotate between the two of them. I mean, yes, there are some people that have a fixed mindset across everything. We all know one of ’em. And there’s also people that have a growth mindset when it comes to everything. But the main differences is how do we approach our capabilities? And I, and I think it really outlines well with neuroplasticity as well, because if we have a growth mindset, we’re able to say, I don’t know this yet. And we’re aware of our ability to learn something new instead of coming into the world with like this fixed set of talents. You know, I was born with this talents and this is all I know, so don’t ask me to learn anything new. Right? And in the same vein, it also has to do with criticism. People with growth mindsets are more open to criticism because they view it as an opportunity to learn. Whereas people with fixed mindsets are like, why is this person criticizing you? What do they know? Blah, blah, blah. You know? And my favorite is when you look at it through the point of view of success, right? When we see other successful people. Are we like, Oh my god, yay them. And what can I learn from them to be successful? Are we like, eh, whatevs? You know? And when we’re not able to celebrate somebody else’s success. So yeah, growing mindset is, is absolutely fantastic. And the more we’re aware of it, the more we realize, how do we show up and just being honest with ourselves. Like, Oh, did this thing trigger me? Why did this trigger me? Is this like, am I having a fixed mindset in this particular occasion? Fixed Mindset Vs. Growth Mindset Jenn DeWall: Well, maybe let’s talk about some examples of what a fixed mindset might look like to, for someone that might not be aware. Am I someone that has the fixed mindset? In your experience with working with coaches, what are some examples of what a fixed mindset sounds like? Iris Polit: It sounds like– that’s a really good question. It sounds like, why is my, you know, boss or if your running a business, your business partner, why are they asking me to do this thing that is out of my comfort zone? Like, don’t they know that I don’t know this stuff? Instead of sitting back and saying, Oh, this is a really interesting opportunity for me to grow in this other area and learn something new. Right? And as I mentioned the example with, with success, I think that’s the one that is most prevalent. If you are in an environment where somebody is celebrating a success in something, are you sort of like sitting back and being like, ah, whatever. Or are you like super excited for them and super excited, the opportunity to be like, Oh, can I like reverse engineer what they just did to like be successful as well, right? Jenn DeWall: I mean, I feel like I’m that person, but then before I get there, I’m typically like, Ah, Jenn, like, why can’t you do anything, right? Why can’t you figure this stuff out? Like, I go down the self-judgment, self-doubt rabbit hole. I can look at someone else’s success and say like, Well, you’re never gonna get there because they have “it,” and you don’t have “it.” And so that’s how I feel like I experience the fixed mindset. It starts with comparison. Then I somehow tell myself I’m not enough. And on the days that I don’t have my confidence, I believe it <laugh>. Iris Polit: I think, and I think that’s the challenge, right? It’s how are we, first of all, who are we comparing ourselves to? Are we comparing ourselves to others or are we comparing ourselves to ourselves? Like, how am I today compared to the way I was yesterday or a month ago or a year ago, right? Because honestly, the only way to truly gauge your momentum is comparing yourself to yourself, right? So that’s, that’s super important. Reprogram Your Brain with the word “Yet.” Iris Polit: The other recommendation I would give you is to use that little word— yet. It is absolutely magic when you are like, Oh, how come I’m not blah, blah, blah. Just add the word yet to it and it will totally reprogram the way you’re looking at the situation. The other thing to keep in mind is that with growth mindset, you want to just stay open, right? So it’s not that the judgment that you brought up is, is such a dangerous, dangerous path to take. There’s actually a great little positive psychology chart called the judge’s path and the learner’s path, which I love. It has this cute little drawing attached to it. And it basically shows a person that walks through life, right? And it’s like, what questions are we asking ourselves? Are we asking judge-y questions like, oh, like how come they did that? Or How come they’re so dumb? The more of those questions you ask, the more you end up in what is called the judge’s pit. And it’s full of tar and you get stuck in it and it’s really difficult to get out. But if you allow yourself again, that that little exit off that highway to basically say, Okay, what question can I ask myself that would be productive, right? Like, what can I learn from this situation? Then you’re taking the learner’s path and through curiosity you’re able to create an upward spiral instead of a downward spiral that takes you into that judge’s pit. Jenn DeWall: Yeah. Oh my gosh. I mean, and I share that because <laugh>, oh, I just experience it as much as like even on the outside people might be like, You’ve got it all figured out. I’m like, really? I do. Who says? Iris Polit: You bet. You’re like all smooth above the water and under the water you’re paddling those little feet like a mad person. Jenn DeWall: And I think there’s so many people that we don’t realize are faking it, right? Like that we just aren’t maybe as comfortable or it’s not appropriate to share it and we suffer in silence. A Message from Crestcom Crestcom is a global organization dedicated to developing effective leaders. Companies all over the world have seen their managers transformed into leaders through our award-winning and accredited leadership development programs. Our signature BPM program provides interactive management training with a results-oriented curriculum and prime networking opportunities. If you’re interested in learning more about our flagship program and developing your managers into leaders, please visit our website to find a leadership trainer near you. Or maybe you yourself have always wanted to train and develop others. Crestcom is a global franchise with ownership opportunities available throughout the world. If you have ever thought about being your own boss, owning your own business and leveraging your leadership experience to impact businesses and leaders in your community, Crestcom may be the right fit for you. We’re looking for professional executives who are looking for a change and want to make a difference in people’s lives. Learn more about our franchise opportunity on the Own A Franchise page of our website at Crestcom.com. Strategies to Reprogram Your Brain Jenn DeWall: You know, if you find that maybe any of these examples related with you and that you are wanting to change to our Leadership Habit audience, this is where Iris is coming in with the strategies. So let’s do it. How do we reprogram the brain? Cultivating Focus Iris Polit: So three strategies and all of them have like little sub-strategies within them. The first one is to hack, right? Because we can’t change something that we’re not aware of. So how are we cultivating our focus? How are we really paying attention to what we’re paying attention to, right? Which I think is really, really important. Our brain is such an amazing filter because if it actually had to process all the different, different stimuli that are coming at us every day, it would explode like literally like combustion. So what are we focusing on? And I think that’s where it’s really important that as you know, as we set our goals, as we plan our days, that we are very careful with what we’re focusing on and, and making sure that what we’re focusing on is truly what is gonna get us to that, that next level in life. Jenn DeWall: Are we thinking about it from the difference between understanding what’s in our conscious mind versus our unconscious mind? Or are we thinking about it from the perspective of or perspective of like what keeps you up at night or what’s draining your confidence? What’s maybe the context if I was trying to build that awareness? How would I start that? Iris Polit: So all of the above, just not at the same time, right? So there are things that are part of our consciousness and if with that, I always say, look at where the pain is. If you have a pain that is repeating time, after time, after time, something that is triggering you time, after time, after time, examine it and ask yourself like, what, why is this painful to me? Why is this triggering me? And try to unpack it. Because it’s that pain that is gonna allow us to dig a little deeper into our subconscious. And there’s a lot of stuff. There’s a lot of hard wiring and programming that is under the surface that we’re not even aware of. I tell my clients all the time that you know, whether it be childhood trauma or something that happened when we were younger because when we’re younger, our brain is like a sponge. Like our prefrontal cortex is not fully developed yet. So our ability to question isn’t there yet. So we absorb everything as truth, right? So if we grew up in a family, for example, where, you know, the parents were like, Oh, money is the root of all evil. You could be a very successful person that is able to build abundance but not hold onto it, right? So I always tell my clients, don’t let your six-year-old self drive the Ferrari, because you’re like a well-oiled machine. You are kicking butt in life. But the more you become aware of what’s going on under the surface, the more you’re able to unpack it and, and it takes time. You know, Jenn DeWall: I love don’t let the six year old drive the Ferrari. Yeah. Because I can still think of messages that, you know, I’m, I’m going to, I have a big milestone birthday this year, 40, and I can still think of messages that were yeah, woo woo. I’m grateful for every day above ground. And just really thinking about even some of the messages that I know aren’t true. Like, I know once I was told that I could never be a lawyer, even that’s all I wanted to do. And then before I wanted to be a lawyer, I wanted to be a newscaster. And someone said, No one would ever take you seriously. And I mean, heck, I even still get feedback too. Like, Jenn, you’re not dynamic, you’re not blank. And it’s easy to take that feedback on and be like, Is that, is that the truth? Just from this one person’s feedback to me, do I have to all of a sudden take that on, own it and believe it to be true and drive that Ferrari? No! Build Awareness of Your Own Programming Iris Polit: Well that’s, that’s where that awareness of our programming is so important, right? And that’s where, you know, you mentioned like negative thoughts, right? It’s those we need to like hack and debug those negativity loops. So when we sit down and we’re like, again, looking at the pain, looking at the trigger, what is that message that keeps on playing in the background? And then we need to ask ourselves, is this really true? Like, where did this come from? Right? Because as I mentioned before, prefrontal cortex doesn’t get developed until our teens, through our early twenties. That’s why we’re such jerks at that age. Because we start questioning everything, you know, question, be curious, be like, where is this coming from? So you’re able to unpack it and then debug, you know, just like you would do with any other good piece of software. Jenn DeWall: <Laugh>. Oh my gosh. And so I know that I cut you off in my question of like where to start. And so the first piece being, you know, understanding, what was the second piece of that? That I think the debug piece. Did we, is that the second one that I cut you off on? Yes. Ok. Iris Polit: So the first one is cultivating focus, and the second piece is awareness of our actual programming. So you’re able to unpack it, right? Jenn DeWall: Oh, great, go ahead! Iris Polit: Oh no, I was gonna say that’s where we get into like the second strategy of rewiring, which is like the active fun part. But if you have another question, I’m happy to answer it. Well, Jenn DeWall: I love, anytime we get into the topic of self-awareness, I’m always intrigued by that because I think that there are many different ways to build it. Yeah. There are also many different people that think they’re self-aware and aren’t. And so I love asking the question, when we start talking about self-awareness from your work with your clients, what are some ways that you help them develop that self-awareness? Use Self-Assessments to Become More Self-Aware Iris Polit: Assessments, assessments, assessments. I am obsessed with assessments. Whether it be a fun one like Gretchen Rubins, like Four Tendencies to more, you know, research-based ones like the VIA Character Strengths, there are so many assessments out there that I, I’d be happy to share with your audience that help you become more aware of your values, of your strengths and, and unpack so much of that. And then you could leverage all of that too in your personal branding too, and in the way you market yourself in the world. So I believe assessments are such a powerful tool because yeah, some of them are more fun, some of them are more serious, but you’ll see such consistency the more of ’em you take. And, and I think where there is consistency, there is truth, right? And that’s what what we need to unpack. Its being honest with ourselves regarding what’s holding us back and also being honest with ourselves regarding what we want and what we need. It’s not that we are inherently dishonest. It’s that sometimes I think we make commitments in life that we’re afraid that if we’re honest about what we actually want and need in order to be successful, that it goes against like those commitments that we already made. You. Jenn DeWall: I preach, Hi, my name is Jenn DeWall, I am a people pleaser. That means that I’m constantly reevaluating myself in the to-do list and saying, Oh, I don’t really wanna do this, but I’ll feel bad or I want to make sure you’re better. I mean, I’m sure people can relate to that or I mean, you know, the perfectionist trap, right? Like, Oh, I just have to make sure I do everything perfect by anyone’s standards even though I have no idea about these arbitrary standards that I’ve set. But somehow, I mean, this is, I know you might think I’m bananas that I try to say this stuff. Iris Polit: I’m sending you all of the assessments after this recording so you can take all of them. We’re gonna unpack this! <Laugh>. Jenn DeWall: All right, let’s let, I mean, hey, and you’re normal because again, we should actually talk for a minute quick if we aren’t gonna get into it with the rewiring. But negativity bias was something that I think I was made aware of in the last like few years. Yeah. It was something that I was totally not even aware of that happened. And so let’s talk about what that bias is. Yes. Iris Polit: So negativity bias, and it’s funny that you should mention it because it is part of strategy too, which is rewiring. Strategies for Reprogramming the Mind to Overcome Negativity Bias Jenn DeWall: Okay, perfect. So then we’re going into the rewiring strategy. Okay! Iris Polit: We, but let’s talk a little bit about negativity bias, right? So again, caveman, modern world, right? So we were meant to walk through this earth with our brains protecting us from dangers, right? Dangers that no longer exist in today’s day and age. So when that negativity bias pops up, like, Oh my God, I’m catastrophizing because there’s a sabretooth tiger coming to get me. You need to sit back and be like, Thank you, brain for trying to protect me, but there’s no sabretooth tiger coming to get me. And I think that’s where rewiring comes in, because you can’t turn off those negative thoughts, but you could shift them. So we’re not talking about mind control here. We’re talking about mind training, right? So when that negative thought pops up or that icky emotion pops up, you can’t like just be like, knock it off, you know, butch up, stop doing this stuff, right? Because it just doesn’t work. So we need to pay attention to how it shows up in our bodies. So for example, like let’s say we have a big presentation or we were talking earlier about like public speaking, right? And we are so nervous, right? And we’re like sweating and we’re like, we can’t do this. The closest emotion to nerves is excitement. Excitement and nervousness shows up exactly the same way in our body. So if tell, if we tell our brain, Oh, I’m super excited about this opportunity, your brain does a little scan and it’s like yes, this, this is, this is showing up as true. It, your body feels like it’s excited right now, so ok, let’s go with that. Right? And that’s where the rewiring comes in. It’s kinda like messing with your head but you use that powerful good instead of evil. Jenn DeWall: I mean, are there people that are in the thought of like, but I’m lying to myself, I am not feeling excited. I am actually terrified of what I’m about to do. Or nervous, extremely nervous. I mean, what would you say to someone that’s like, but that’s lying to myself, Iris Polit: <Laugh>, but is, but are you using it for the greater good, Right? Yeah. Cause again, if it’s something that that shows up in your body and it helps you like get to that next level, then it’s not truly lying to yourself. It’s just helping yourself be your best self in the moment, right? Yeah. And it’s, you’re looking at it as in like, what is the best possible future? That’s like another exercise. So there’s like two ways of going at it, right? When you’re like super catastrophizing, the first thing you need to do is let yourself go down that rabbits hole, right? And you’re like, okay, worst case scenario, like, I don’t do a good job in this presentation and my boss is gonna hate me and I’m gonna get laid off and I’m gonna lose my house and I’m gonna end up living under a bridge, Right? You take it to like the most ridiculous down the rabbit hole that you can, to the point where you start laughing and that triggers a different part of your brain that is like, okay, now you’re being completely silly. So what is an actual outcome that could come here? And then let’s try to shift it above neutral and be like, what is the best positive outcome that could come as well, right? Yeah. So it’s still messing with your brain and you could choose to call it lying to yourself. I choose to call it neuro-hacking, Potato potato, you know? Jenn DeWall: No, and I have to say it because in my work with clients, too, it’s the same thing. Like, what do you mean? Like, I don’t think that <laugh>, right? There’s that initial trepidation of I don’t understand it. Like I think it’s easier for us to probably see that, but that’s typically some of the resistance that you get with people earlier on. That feels like I’m not being honest, but it is the way of working with your brain. Or even going back to the negativity bias. Yes, you’re naturally going to look at all of the worst-case scenarios that could potentially happen around situation X. That is negativity bias doing its exact job. But it is also, I love that you say like, let it run its course into however many ways you need to do it until you can make the shift. Because you always get to choose that. Understanding the Science of Neuro-Hacking Iris Polit: Yes. Absolutely. And I think, look, I, you’re not the first person to ever say that. Oh my God, you’re so woo-woo, and this stuff never works. Trust me, everything that I’m sharing with you here is based in science-backed by research. I’m, I’m not, like, there’s nothing woo woo here. It might sound woo-woo, but if you want the backup research, I’m happy to send you the links to it. So Jenn DeWall: No, I’m, I’m in total agreement with that. And I think it’s because of our, you know, educations and our background of understanding, you know, the impact of this, and it’s still relatively new. And so that’s why I think most people really do think this is woo-woo magic that is just not gonna work. And you know, I always find like, let’s address the elephant in the room, like <laugh>, you know? Yeah. Because there are people that are of that. But it also could be going back to the other example you shared– it’s your fixed mindset coming through Iris Polit: <Laugh>. Yeah, yeah. No, and, and you’re absolutely right. I think, look, especially if you look at the field of positive psychology, it is relatively new. It started in the nineties with Dr. Marty Seligman, who became, you know, the head of the American Psychiatric Association. And he was like, We’re focusing too much on disease and we’re focusing too much about all the stuff that is below neutral. Why don’t we examine, you know, all the ways that people can thrive and go above neutral. And he did many studies, especially with the military on PTSD. But the reality is there’s PTSD, but there’s also post-traumatic growth. And there’s many cases of people that came back from trauma stronger and better and, and thriving. But nobody talks about that because we all have that negativity bias that is like, Yes, PTSD, that’s the label we’re gonna use for everything, right? Yeah. And I’m not saying that there aren’t severe cases of PTSD out there, obviously. Of course there are. But how do we approach treating them, right? Jenn DeWall: Yeah, absolutely. And thank you for even just talking about positive psychology. That’s all this is. It’s not magic. It’s not woo-woo. It’s positive psychology. Positive Psychology and Self-Empowerment Iris Polit: Yeah. And it’s, and the biggest a thing difference between psychology and positive psychology is, again, psychology, in general, is based on a textbook, like dealing with disease, dealing with dysfunction, and it’s very prescriptive. Whereas positive psychology is more descriptive and taking a look at different methodologies that work and trying them out. At the end of the day, we’re the only ones that know what will work on us. You know, you could try different vitamins, you could try different medications, they will impact everyone in a different way. So why not try, you know, neuro-hacking yourself and doing my exercises on yourself to see what works, right? Jenn DeWall: Yeah. I mean, I’m here for it. I find that that’s the best, like lease on life is to know that the times that I feel powerless and the times that I feel discouraged that the one thing I can come back to is how I control my thoughts. How long do I wanna pitch a tent there? And of course, we’re not talking about trauma when it comes to this because there are different mechanisms, but, you know, I just think there’s power in understanding that that’s the one power that people can’t take from us. That’s my thing of like, why I love it so much is like, it’s free. Well, maybe not free. Sometimes we have to invest in that, but it’s free, right? Something that’s within our control. I don’t have to go and buy this product and think I need that. Like, it’s all up here and I can do it. I mean, you might have to do the work for it, but you can do it. I just think it’s so powerful. So where do we continue? Yeah, go. Sorry, go ahead. Upgrading Your Software to Reprogram Your Brain Iris Polit: No, I love what you just said about, you know, we have control over it because again, if we are looking at our brain as this mega computer, why would we allow somebody else to program it? Right? We need to take that power back. And that’s where, you know, the upgrades come in and that’s strategy number three. And that’s, you know, the everyday practices that we take. And it could be different things for different people. For some people it’s, you know, writing and journaling. So you have like, you keeping track of how your thoughts are and what triggers you to be able to be more aware of it. There’s repetition, you know, if you’re like, some people use mantra, some people use you know, different things that they’re able to repeat that help them reprogram their brain. There’s stimulation. So I’m a huge fan of positive visualization. And whether you believe it or not, whether you think it’s woo woo or not, research shows that our brain cannot tell the difference between an actual memory and something that we visualized. And this is something that has been researched a lot, especially through sports psychology. One of my favorite pieces of research, it was a basketball team and they separated them into three groups. One group had to like practice shooting hoops every day, every day, every day. The second group was supposed to just sit in their room and visualize making the perfect shot every time doing those visualization exercises. And then the last group was basically told to do nothing. So obviously the group that did nothing did not improve, right? And the group that practice did improve, but the group that visualized it improved the most because there was no sense of failure. So the ones that were practicing, yes, sometimes they would make the shot and get it in, sometimes they wouldn’t. And that failure would kind of mess with their belief of being able to do it. Whereas the folks that did the exercise of just visualizing it perfect every time, didn’t have that failure impact their performance. Which I think is absolutely a amazing. So, again, remember, our brain doesn’t know the difference between a, an actual memory and something that we visualized, and it’s those neural pathways that, that we’re developing that, that allows us to, to grow. Jenn DeWall: So how can you visualize your success today? Visualize the outcome that you see? See, this is the stuff that’s so exciting. It’s all within our control. The Power of Visualization Iris Polit: It’s not, by the way, it’s not just outcome. So it’s kind of like a double-edged sword, right? Cause there, there’s plenty of, of gurus out there that are like, Oh, well, you know, visualize yourself in the big house with the fancy car. That could be dangerous because your brain is also like, Oh, okay, so I already have the house in the car. I don’t need to do any work. So, visualize the process, the effort that you’re putting into being successful, right? So it, it’s that visualization needs to have a very clear cadence of not just the end goal, but also the process that got you there. And I think it’s really important. And that’s where sort of like collaboration comes in. It’s like, what are we sharing with our loved ones or our partners or our coworkers regarding, I’m working on building this, right? Because you never know what ideas will come to you from other people or what resources will come to you from other people. So the more we collaborate and, and share that visualization, the the more we we could bring it to fruition. And then the last piece is actually act. You can’t just sit and visualize and expect, you know, something to land in your life. You actually have to take the actions that you’re visualizing in the process to get it done. Jenn DeWall: And I know that you had we had talked in the pre-call even about talking about a little bit of how we can improve our own resilience. Yeah. And you know, of course, like life is gonna throw some curve balls at us. Life is gonna challenge maybe that vision that we had or just that belief. And so knowing in our, we have a few minutes left, what are some strategies that we could share with our audience for how to improve their own resilience? Building Resilience By Living Authentically Iris Polit: Sure. So I look at it through the lens of thriving and resiliency at work. So that’s like the approach that I, that I’m going to take here. Like how do we show up in our professional life? Number one, and this is something that all of like the top 10 resiliency lists always miss is authenticity. Like, how authentic are you are? Are you living your values? Are you developing your strengths? Because it is the times where we’re not authentic that it just, it strips away at us and it makes us feel less resilient. So authenticity is a huge part of building that resiliency muscle. Number two this is gonna sound a little hokey, but finding your calling. If you feel like the work that you’re doing is meaningful and it doesn’t have to be meaningful to anybody else. You know, I mean, I don’t know who told you you shouldn’t be a lawyer, but they’re crazy because most parents would love to have a child that’s a lawyer. Iris Polit: But you know, even if like your parents want you to be a lawyer and you decided to become a dj, you know, it doesn’t matter if the work is meaningful to you. That’s like the most important part because that allows you to be in the flow and, and be productive and feel resilient even when, because I mean, look, we could do meaningful work, but it’s still gonna be work, right? So if we’re in the flow when we’re doing something that’s meaningful, it makes us more resilient. Iris Polit: Number three maintaining perspective, right? So we talked a little bit about negativity bias but it’s also how do we learn from setbacks, right? Do we view failure as a learning opportunity or do we view it as the end of the world, right? So that perspective is really, really important because we need to continually focus on solutions. Iris Polit: Our brain, again, it’s like an eager German shepherd. It wants to do whatever we tell it to do, but if we’re like, Oh my God, this is awful, this is hopeless, the brain is like, All right, see, I’m going on vacation, you know, <laugh>. But if you ask yourself curious questions, you know, and, and change that perspective again from the judge’s path to the learner’s path, like how can we deal with the situations? What solutions are available to us? What resources are out there that we could sort of like dig into? Iris Polit: Managing that negative thinking is so important and being able to, to really maintaining our perspective on stuff. Managing stress is so super, super important. And, and it’s not just, you know, say to yourself, Oh, stuff being so stressed out, right? It’s that you make time for life work balance, and yes, I call it life work balance because your life comes before your work. Work is integrated into your life, not the other way around. I don’t know who came up with work life. I’m not judging them, I’m just saying it should be life work balance. Re-Program Your Brain with Healthy Habits Iris Polit: So how are you making time to like renew and refresh in order to maintain your resiliency muscles, right? Because when we have a good night’s sleep, you know, it’s a lot easier to deal with the muck when you wake up in the morning and you’re all like bright eyed and bushy tailed, right? Right. Instead of, Oh my God, I did not get enough sleep. And it’s, it’s even harder to deal with what I’m dealing with right now. There are so many different ways, I’ll give you three more for resiliency. So we talk just working with colleagues, collaboration, feedback, advice. Again, it helps you stay more solution-focused. So the more you can work with your colleagues at work and be like, My God, this situation really stinks. Like what can we do about it? Right? Or, or celebrate. And just, this was amazing. You know, I think we so often forget to celebrate our successes and if you just move on to next, next, next, the next thing that erode away at your resiliency as well, right? So definitely be mindful of the way you’re working with colleagues. Staying healthy. I know this is like on every list, right? I mentioned authenticity wasn’t on any of the list, but staying healthy, you know, self-care is healthcare at the end of the day. Like what are you putting into your body? Are you actually taking time to move? Are you taking time to go outside and have some fresh air? You know, your body needs that to be resilient. Spending time in nature. There is so much research that shows that being in nature and even just looking at the color green is downregulating for your brain and it makes your brain happy. Iris Polit: So I think that’s super important. And then, last but not least, again, going back to that community piece is like building networks. Not just within work but outside of work. Like where, where’s your support system? You know, no person is an island. No person can do everything, right? And I find that, especially when it comes to the point in our life when we’re successful in our career or in our businesses, we’re kind of sandwiched between different things like aging parents, younger children, and we’re taking care of everybody else, except ourselves. And when your cup runs empty, your resilience isn’t, isn’t going to be there. And just being mindful of that. Jenn DeWall: Yeah, I I love that as a closing message. Your self-care is your healthcare. I feel like that’s a really, I don’t know that stuck with me and I’ve never heard someone say it in that way before. So I love that. It’s Iris Polit: Not, it’s on my own. I’m borrowing someone else’s. I just, I know I read it somewhere. Where to Find More from Iris Polit Jenn DeWall: But it’s a great reminder and I think we all need that to put yourself at the top of your to-do list. Iris, how can our audience get in touch with you? Iris Polit: Either through LinkedIn, just look up Iris Polit. I’m the only Iris Polit on LinkedIn. So that’s I R I S P O L I T. Or email me at Iris at YourSuccessAce.com. I’m happy to share these resources as well as assessments and other PDFs on staying resilient. So reach out iris@yoursuccessace.com. Jenn DeWall: Iris, thank you so much for coming on the show. Thank you for a great conversation. I really enjoyed it. I felt like we covered a lot for our short time, but thank you so much for leaving our audience, hopefully feeling inspired and empowered to go out and hack your brain, and reprogram it. Thank you so much for being on the show. Iris Polit: Thank you. Jenn DeWall: Thank you so much for listening to this week’s episode of the Leadership Habit Podcast. I really hope that you enjoyed my conversation with Iris. I love the insights. I love talking about all things brain. And, of course, if you enjoyed this podcast or if you know someone that could benefit, share it with them or leave us a review. And if we can assist you in any of your leadership development needs, head on over to Crestcom.com. There, you can request a complimentary two-hour leadership skills workshop and also register for our monthly complimentary or free webinars that cover a wide variety of different leadership topics. And in closing, if you wanna connect with Iris, you can connect with her on LinkedIn. You can also email her at iris@yoursuccessace.com, or you can head on over to YourSuccessAce.com, and there you can find more information about her services. Thank you so much for listening. Until next time. The post How to Reprogram Your Brain with Neuro-Hacker, Iris Polit appeared first on Crestcom International.

Oct 28, 2022 • 43min

Improve Your Self-Promotion Through Authentic Communication, with Sonja Stetzler

How to Promote Yourself with Authentic Communication, with Sonja Stetzler, Executive Communication Coach Hi everyone, it’s Jenn DeWall, and on this week’s episode of The Leadership Habit Podcast, I sat down with Sonja Stetzler to talk about how you can promote yourself in an authentic way. Sonja Stetzler is the CEO and founder of Effective Connecting, an executive communication coaching and training consultancy that develops clients’ communication skills. She helps executives with everything from public speaking to successfully navigating a difficult conversation. Her goal is to ensure her clients find success in their professional and personal lives through how they communicate. Sonja has several decades’ worth of experience in management, sales, education, and executive coaching, and she often uses applied improvisation techniques to deepen her client’s ability to foster and develop their communication skills. She is a certified conversational intelligence coach a member of the National Speakers Association and, the ICF, and the Applied Improvisation Network. And I hope you enjoy our conversation as Sonja and I talk about how you can promote yourself in an authentic way. Full Transcript Below Jenn DeWall: Hello, hello, Leadership Habit audience! I am so happy to be here with you today, joining me on the Leadership Habit Podcast– as you heard in that bumper, Sonja Stetzler. She and I are going to be talking all about how you can promote yourself in an authentic way. Not that weird way, not that over ego. Let me tell you how great I am, but in a way that, hey, people actually might gravitate towards you. Sonja, thank you so much for taking the time to join us on the show today. It’s really great to get to know you and just, and I’m looking forward to having our conversation. Sonja Stetzler: Thanks, Jenn. It’s so great to be on with you today. I’m excited about our conversation. Meet Sonja Stetzler, CEO of Effective-Connecting Jenn DeWall: Oh my gosh. Well, Sonja, of course, I love a good origin story or even just how did you come to be? Or you could say anything to our audience, but we, your work is meaningful, right? Even helping people promote themselves in an authentic way, and being able to communicate themselves in the way that, you know, they want to feel seen and heard. You do really important work. But go ahead, introduce yourself to the audience. We would love to hear a little bit more about you. Sonja Stetzler: Sure. I am an executive communications coach. I work with mid to senior-level professionals within organizations. Mainly I work with Better Up, and I also have a private practice, and I came to this role in a very, I would call circuitous route. I have a background in healthcare. And I realized that after I graduated, it was a kind of an oops degree where I really didn’t enjoy the work. It was hospital-based, and I chose to go into management because, in that role, I was able to see advancement. I could see progression, a career progression. However, if I knew then what I know now about management, I would’ve done a lot better. You know, it’s all about your people skills. Yeah. Being a leader and a manager. So after about six years of that, I decided that I wanted to get into sales. I equated sales with education, and I love to teach. I remember, you know, five years old, dressing up in my mom’s old dresses, and my best friend next door, we would put all our stuffed animals out, and we would teach them. And so I had this thing in my, you know, in the back of my head. So I spent a decade in sales, and I was a top producer in my organization because I loved what I did. I loved the travel. For me, it was a dream. Somebody was paying me to travel, and I was doing what I enjoyed doing. From there, my company got bought, and I decided it was time for a change.I went into a, a training role, quality assurance, and I also had an opportunity to get my master’s and coaching certificate, executive coaching. And the University asked me to come back. So I taught in the school of communications for a decade. My masters is in organizational communications. And after a decade of that, and it was time to launch. And instead of going back to my healthcare background, what is the underlying skill that you need in order to be successful in any type of environment? It’s communication. Yeah. And so that’s where the effective connecting, my belief is that you can’t be a really effective communicator unless you connect with your audience. Why Should We Learn to Promote Ourselves in an Authentic Way? Jenn DeWall: Yes. And I love that, which segues into, you know, why do we need to, why do we even need to know how to promote ourselves? I mean it at the basic level. Why do we need to know how to do that? Sonja Stetzler: Well, if you want to advance, if you want to be able to communicate to people about what you can do and how you can help them, you have to let them know what you do. And I’m finding that, especially in the role where I am now, where I work with a lot of middle to senior level, especially in that middle manager leader space where they’re looking for advancement. And particularly women, particularly those from other cultures where self-promotion is not appropriate and is frowned upon. There’s difficulty in how you do this. In fact, I had a recent client who watched all of her peers get promoted, and she wondered, you know, I’m working just as hard. Why am I not getting promoted? And when she approached her manager, the response was, Well, I didn’t know that you wanted a promotion! So she was kind of astounded that I had to let you know, or I had to promote myself in order to get this promotion? So we’ve worked on ways, and I work with, especially women because women tend to have a more, more of a challenge in promoting themselves because we seem to, you know, in, I can just recall my father was an immigrant, and from the culture that he came from, self-promotion was not appropriate. And I remember if I didn’t hear it once, I heard it multiple times, Sonja, don’t be bold . So what does that mean? Jenn DeWall: Oh my gosh, I love that. Well, and it’s, you know, why do we need to? Well, because many of us probably aren’t aware of those rules or the advice that was given to us to be successful. I mean, don’t be bold. How did the heck did you navigate that? Because I feel like having that, I mean, I guess that means that you know, you’re not gonna like raise your hand. Like, what does that mean? How did you interpret that? Sonja Stetzler: Well, I interpret it as don’t raise your hand, that you’ll get recognized for the work that you do. And honestly, in corporate America or really anywhere, managers sometimes don’t have the time, especially if they have a large group or a large team, to notice everything that you’re doing. And as women, we’re socialized, we put our heads down, we work really hard, and we think that because we’re working so hard that somebody is going to notice what we’re doing. And honestly, they might notice that something is happening, but they don’t know. Sometimes the work that you’re doing is, is very much in a supportive role, and they can only see the superstar or the outcome. And it’s attributed to a lot of people. But what role did you actually play in enabling that outcome to occur? Why do People Struggle to Promote Themselves Authentically? Jenn DeWall: Yeah. It is just unbelievably important to like be able to see ourselves and that equation, to know that it’s okay because I know that earlier on in my career, I absolutely had that kind of illusion, right? Oh, they’re gonna notice I’m working really hard. They’ll absolutely notice, only to be met with. No, they didn’t notice. And then I feel like the bad thing that I might have done is I went from being like, Well, since you didn’t notice, now I’m gonna be probably a little bit more in your face and being like, Hey, can I get this? Which I think ended up coming off a little bit overzealous. But you know, those messages. I’m curious from maybe how you’ve seen these, you know, whether it’s a cultural norm of what’s okay to ask for, whether it’s messages that we have seen, such as don’t be bold or children, you know, should be seen and not heard. Are there any other themes that you notice within why people have reservations or self-doubt about how they promote themselves? Tips for More Authentic Self-Promotion Sonja Stetzler: Well, it seemed, it seems as it seems lazy that, you know, we don’t wanna come across as braggadocious because that, you know, honestly, if you think about it, I’m turned off by people who are, you know, me, me, me, I, I, I. So the way I work with my clients is can we turn that into a “we” instead? Especially nowadays that we’re, most of us are working in teams. We did this. And I think a subtle shift in language to position yourself as a leader is to say, I led my team to do X, whatever that X is. And I would add to that, not just that you led your team to do X, but you need to add the “so that” so that you can communicate the impact of whatever it was that you led your team to do. How did that impact the organization, or what impact did your leadership hold or have? Jenn DeWall: Yes. I love that I led my team to blank so that we could do this. So many people, and I feel like I noticed this. People forget the “so that” part. They always forget it. I mean, what, why did you forget the impact or the results that we’ve achieved? Why do you think people forget that? The sleazy thing again, is that just the circle then that we’re on or a carousel? Sonja Stetzler: No, because I think we are so focused on leading that we don’t think about the impact. And actually, the impact is the most important thing, especially if you are communicating to senior leadership because they don’t care so much about the actual thing that you did. Honestly, they care more about the impact. Jenn DeWall: Oh my. Yes. And it’s that idea of what’s in it for them. I mean I definitely, I think when it comes down to promoting yourself, it is easy to really let your ego, I guess, and not depending on what you’ve learned, but to feel like you have to let your ego drive the course and I have to prove it to you. I have to prove it to you. Instead of thinking, well, what would they actually want to hear? What do they care about it? So not really tying that in. Do you notice a little bit of people just not being able to align that like they’re thinking too much of themselves, and so they’re not able to actually see, Oh, that’s right, that’s how it connects to this other side of it. And so then they’re missing that opportunity for promotion? Or what do you see? Authentic Communication Starts with Empathy Sonja Stetzler: Yeah, absolutely. Communication really is not so much what you say, it’s what other people hear. And communication really starts with empathy. What is it? How are you in service of others? And how can you address the what’s in it for me, for them? And when you can align what you have to say with the what’s in it for me, for them, then you’re going to make progress. People are going to hear you. Jenn DeWall: I love this. Well, and it’s the way that you can make the bridge work. You’ve got goals, you’ve got dreams, you have objectives or strategies. We have to figure out how to communicate as much as the conversation that we’re talking about is how to promote yourself in an authentic way. This is communication for influence. It’s influencing people to maybe take action or to see that you’re the right fit. Let, so let’s dive into it. I know that you’ve got a few different ways that you would recommend for people how they can think about authentic communication to promote themselves. I should actually ask and level set, what does it even mean to be authentic in your communication? Because I mean, authenticity is over, you know, it’s a used word. What does it even mean? What does authentic communication even look like as a baseline before we dive into it? When You Feel Inauthentic, It’s Difficult to be Confident Sonja Stetzler: Yes. And I really like that question because it speaks to who you are as a person. And yes, it might take moving a little bit out of your comfort zone because this is something that you’re not accustomed to doing. However, you’re still who you are. Your authentic self comes through. And if you’re not the type of person who is, say maybe more extroverted, who loves the people aspect, you can still be who you are, even if it is the more quiet, reserved, thoughtful person and still be expressive and still be who you are. Because when you’re inauthentic, when you’re, when you’re communicating, and it’s not really you, you don’t have the confidence. That doesn’t come through. So a couple of ways that, and we’ve just talked about one earlier, about positioning yourself by saying that I led my team to… Another way to think about this, especially for those who might be a little bit reticent about self-promotion, is to think about what you are proud of. I am most proud of the time I worked with a client for whom I wasn’t quite sure if he was going to be able to deliver this presentation to other senior leaders. However, through his own efforts and some support and work with me, he was able to outshine and get a higher speaker score than a speaker whom we paid $10,000, to address this executive audience. It was amazing. Jenn DeWall: That is a powerful example! I mean, also, holy cow, can I get that paycheck, please? <laugh> Oh, sorry, go ahead. Telling Your Own Story in an Authentic Way Sonja Stetzler: Well, I was gonna say, you know what, that was a, that was my story. It was a moment that I was proud of. It was easy for me to talk about that. Yet I didn’t make myself the hero. The hero really was my, my client who actually did the work. I was support. I gave him the tools that he needed and he was the one that needed to execute. And honestly, a little bit more on that story, the day before when we had our rehearsal, oh, it was horrible. He couldn’t even get through his presentation and I sweated it. I thought, Oh no, I am never gonna be hired again as a speech coach because I’m not sure he’s gonna be able to do this. But my client really realized that, oh, he needed to pull this off. This was a high moment for him, a high moment of visibility. Senior leaders were going to be there, and the next day he just knocked it out of the park. So the meeting planner— immediately after his presentation turned around, and she just gave me this huge hug. I was not expecting it. Jenn DeWall: What did he do? That’s a huge feat. Like, what did he do to kind of switch that around, especially with so many people who can relate to that? We’re talking about communication, and public speaking is incredibly intimidating. It can be incredibly intimidating even for those that do it all the time because heck, who wants to be judged by everyone? But I’m curious, what did he, like, what did you notice, or how did he help himself show up as his best self? Practice Self-Promotion to Make it Feel More Natural Sonja Stetzler: I will tell you. It was rehearsal. It was rehearsal. And for many of my clients, that is the least liked part of the process. Yet that’s the part that has the most impact in how you deliver. Because when you are rehearsing, you’re, you’re working with your memory, you’re working with muscle memory in your mouth and in your tongue. And the words are gonna come out more like you want them to come out. If you’ve invested, and I use the word term, invested the time in rehearsal, he’ll get the greater return on the other side– if you invest time in rehearsing. And so he spent the night prior after that, that failed dress rehearsal, he skipped the speaker’s dinner. He told me, Sonja, I’m gonna order in and I’m going to practice tonight. And I said, Great, I’ll see you tomorrow morning. And he, he really had a change. I’m not quite sure what the tick was. I think just having a failed dress rehearsal really lit the fire that he needed to turn the ship around. Jenn DeWall: Oh my gosh. Well, and I’m sure the amount of panic that that individual had of, Oh God, if this doesn’t go, what’s gonna happen here? But it’s, I love it. You know, there are so many basics with communication that we just don’t even pay attention to, or we just want to say, like, eh, preparation. What does that do? I mean, I love the examples that you shared about how preparation, even in terms of the muscle memory of maybe like your mouth and the word formation, how gets a little bit easier, which allows you to probably say things in a more natural or organic way. And even though preparation isn’t necessarily one of the pieces of how to promote yourself, it sounds like it actually is a piece of what we need to do. Depending on who you’re trying to influence. I don’t know if you have any tips, cuz this is kind of off when I think about preparation, one of the pieces that I do before an event is, you know, I like to create a structure of things and like the main point. But I don’t know if you have any tips that you recommend for people for how you can actually work on your preparation. Do not skip this. Anyone that’s an expert or that you’re listening to and enjoying, probably prepared on the other side of that. They’re not just winging it. That’s what allows them to look like they were winging it. Yes, They’ll Know if You’re Reading Your Notes Sonja Stetzler: Absolutely. What I’ve learned is that the more you practice, the more you rehearse, the more authentic you can be. Because you know your material, you’re not having to read it. And despite what people think, yes, people can see, or even in a virtual environment where people think, Oh, nobody can see that I’m reading. Yes, we can tell you’re reading because you have a cadence in your voice that allows us to know you are reading. So yes, rehearsal and the other benefit of rehearsal, once you know your content so well, the lights could go out, and the technology could blow up. Yet the show must go on, and you can just pick right up. You know where you are. You’re, you can be more improvisational if you’ve spent the time in rehearsal. You won’t sound scripted like you’re reading. And I am in no way suggesting that you memorize word for word, you’re script. Yeah. Because then you are gonna sound scripted. But when you know your material, and it’s coming from a place of knowing versus I’ve got to look at my notes. Then absolutely you’re coming from a place of higher confidence and you’re allowed to be more, you’re allowing yourself to be more authentic as you deliver. Jenn DeWall: Which I feel builds that likeability. They can see who you are, your message seems stronger or clearer or easier to connect with. And I feel like the other piece that I always notice from watching people transitions, like there is nothing more, oh my gosh, when you don’t know the bridges that are happening. Or when they’re maybe reading everything and it doesn’t even feel like a natural transition from one talking point to another. I wanna know how it all flows together. And so that piece for me as a, as a listener, as an audience member, is incredibly important to just feel like I get it. And I say that with not with criticism because I think that’s one of the things that I’ve able to work really hard on, is constantly working on transitions. Because that’s how I look at it. As weaving the fabric of the event, of the presentation, of getting them along on the story. But before I started practicing, I didn’t even realize transitions were a thing. I just did a period and then went to the next slide instead of thinking about how they actually connect. God, I’ve probably done a lot of bad presentations back in the day. Learn to Use Transitions in Your Speaking Sonja Stetzler: Well Jenn, you bring up a really important point about transitions because this is where if someone has a problem with filler words, you know, the a the like, you know, this is where they’ll, they’ll come out when you are bridging from one point to the next. And if you don’t have a transition in place, then you’re gonna hear the filler words. Jenn DeWall: Yeah, my gosh. Okay, I love that. So that’s, transitions can help with filler words. I did not know that. Of even just thinking go from one point to the next and I mean, I’m guessing that likely helps you slow down your rate of speech then. Because you’re anchoring, maybe grabbing onto that transition and then turning the corner. So preparation, rehearsal, I love it because we’re all just rehearsing to be able to promote ourselves or at least influence a desirable outcome. A Message from Crestcom Crestcom is a global organization dedicated to developing effective leaders. Companies all over the world have seen their managers transformed into leaders through our award-winning and accredited leadership development programs. Our signature BPM program provides interactive management training with a results-oriented curriculum and prime networking opportunities. If you’re interested in learning more about our flagship program and developing your managers into leaders, please visit our website to find a leadership trainer near you. Or maybe you yourself have always wanted to train and develop others. Crestcom is a global franchise with ownership opportunities available throughout the world. If you have ever thought about being your own boss, owning your own business and leveraging your leadership experience to impact businesses and leaders in your community, Crestcom may be the right fit for you. We’re looking for professional executives who are looking for a change and want to make a difference in people’s lives. Learn more about our franchise opportunity on the Own A Franchise page of our website at Crestcom.com. Get Comfortable Speaking About Your Own Achievements Jenn DeWall: So, so far we’ve talked about promoting ourselves by taking stock of your achievements and that shifting from we to, you know, I led. So that, and then talking about what we’re proud of. I mean, I actually have to ask this because I think that there are so many people that hate that question, , Oh Jenn, tell me what you’re proud of. And I’d be like, I don’t know, did I wake up today? Like, I don’t even know if I did something to be proud of. But what do you notice when people struggle with that? Is it more just because we hate self-promoting, we just don’t like doing it, or we’re just not used to looking and being like, Oh, you actually do, do things that matter, Sonja Stetzler: ? Well, I find that when people are asked, What are you most proud of? It’s much easier for them to talk about achievement. It’s the way that that question is framed that I think most people feel more natural in asking about what they’re most proud of versus, you know, what is your greatest accomplishment. So I think the language can be very empowering to ask, what are you most proud of? And I think, that enables people to think about a time when they shined, and it doesn’t feel braggadocious. A story. You know, a story will evolve when somebody is asked, well, what are you most proud of? And they talk about, they, they tell the story. And I think that’s the key is to draw out the story of their most proud moments. Jenn DeWall: And so, the recommendation in terms of showing up authentically. Obviously, we have to know what we’re proud of or what like what those accomplishments are our skill sets, the value that we bring, being able to talk about it in a positive way, hopefully without that self-judgment. But then also another piece of promoting yourself in an authentic way you talk about is through story. How would you recommend people to use story? Are there any, you know, tips that you have on stories to avoid or when to be sensitive or even appropriate times to use story? But let’s, let’s talk dive in a little bit more about understanding the power of story as it relates to how we can promote ourselves. Using Authentic Communication to Craft Your Personal Story Sonja Stetzler: Stories can be really powerful, Jenn, because it’s a way we connect emotionally with our audience. Now, some audiences, for instance, your executive audience, is going to prefer data over story. When we think of story, we’re thinking the TED talk, right? However, the way we tell the story is through data with that particular audience and what your interpretation of that data means. Now when it comes to self-promoting, if I tell a story for instance, that I did of a former client, that was a way to link because most people have been there. It’s something that we can relate to. It makes you relatable. And the story is relatable because most people have been in a situation where they have under-practiced and, ooh, the results weren’t as good as they had anticipated. So that story bridges the concept, and it relates, it’s, it’s relatable. So how do you tell a story? Probably the best way to start is just in the middle of the story. I find that when you start in the middle of a story, and you’re setting the scene, your audience can paint a picture. They can see the situation in their mind’s eye. Jenn DeWall: Can you gimme an example of what starting in the middle sounds like versus starting at the beginning? Sonja Stetzler: So when I told that story, we were at the dress rehearsal. Did you get the sense— could you see this individual at a dress rehearsal on stage? Jenn DeWall: Yes! Sonja Stetzler: Yes. I didn’t have to give you a lot of exposition about what conference this was or where we were. I started you in the middle, we were at the dress rehearsal, and I had a client that was doing his rehearsal, and it was a major fail. He couldn’t finish his presentation because he forgot everything. And so that immediately puts you right there in the scene Jenn DeWall: Versus starting with: he had been assigned this speech. There was this executive that was assigned this presentation or a speaker that was assigned this presentation, and this is what happened. I love that. And it skips over probably a lot of the filler words or the struggles that we have thinking. I’m not a storyteller. How do I even begin this? Do you start with once upon a time? I don’t get it. And so I feel like that starting with the middle makes it just easier to be like, you don’t have to explain the whole thing, don’t tell them everything because we want to get to that main point, which I think is always the struggle with stories. I don’t know if everyone has a family member or a friend. I have two uncles that are the biggest storytellers, and I love them. I wouldn’t say all of their stories have the same amount to a point. I think that some of them might be a little long-winded, and maybe they could actually improve by starting from the middle instead of the beginning. I like, I laugh at that because it’s, but I think for people that are nervous, we’re addressing how to promote yourself in a meaningful way. Obviously, communication is super intimidating. It can check our confidence, and there are a lot of insecurities that can bubble up. And so I hope that they’re hearing this in terms of stories. Like, If you want to use a story, start from the middle of the story. You don’t have to craft out this huge ornate story, just set the stage. What’s happening right now? What would you see if you were looking around the room? If You Are Shy About Self-Promotion, Ask for Help! Sonja Stetzler: Exactly. Start in the middle. There’s an action. There’s a conflict. So the conflict was, you saw this individual failing at the dress rehearsal, the conflict there, was he going to be able to perform the next day? So that’s what keeps people interested. It’s the conflict. And then you’ve got a resolution at the end. And that aha moment, the aha moment was practice the rehearsal. The investment in rehearsal gets you a return, your greatest return on the other side. That’s, that’s the point I was trying to make with that. So I think this also brings us to another key in self-promoting. And what I have found to be also quite valuable is to have my wingman or wing person. So what do I mean by that? How the support person, because oftentimes it’s easier for us to promote others than to promote ourselves. So, for instance, this particular client that I have had a hard time speaking up in meetings. She was doing great work, but she had a hard time promoting the work that she was doing that was leading to really great success and impact. And she decided to have a conversation with her manager. And her manager said, Well when I’m in these meetings with you, she asked for his support. And he did. In the meetings when there was an opportunity for her, for him to promote her, he would segue, well, he would start the self-promotion, you know, Mary did X and Mary, why don’t you tell the group about what you did and what the impact was. So he kind of greased the skids and helped her to be able to speak about herself. Get a Networking Buddy to Start the Conversation Sonja Stetzler: I find that networking events too. I have a colleague that if we go to a networking event, if we’re gonna be at the same event, she might start the conversation with someone and say, you know, hey I have a colleague who has done X, you know, Sonja meet John, you know John, this is Sonja, you know, Sonja, tell ’em about the project that you worked on with whatever. And that gives me the intro to start talking about whatever it was that I wanted to promote, so to speak. Jenn DeWall: I love that’s, I feel like that’s a great way to even push your employees outta their comfort zone to help them develop and see themselves. Oh hey, actually, Jenn has been working on something like that. Jenn, why don’t you tell me more about that? If you’re a leader right now listening and you want to help someone maybe see their own confidence or give them an opportunity to, you know, promote themselves or just share because you will have to do that. I mean, I’ve worked in organizations where if they’re like, well, I mean, I don’t have face-to-face contact with her, so I don’t know. And so we need the allyship that’s going to help us find those opportunities to then share it in those moments. And I think that’s a really beautiful example of all you have to do, is kick it to someone else. It’s a way to get them to help themself promote, help share their ideas, and heck, you’re developing someone to helping them reach their full potential or meet, you know, if it’s networking, meet that, you know, potential business partner or whatever that might be. It seems more natural that way. I How would you recommend even finding someone, though? Is it that you kind of had this conversation before? Are you saying, Hey, I’m a little nervous about this and maybe just asking for help? Or how do you find that ally? Sonja Stetzler: Well, it can happen both ways. As you mentioned, you can have that conversation, and you know, with a trusted colleague. So, you know, admit, you know, I’m having a little trouble. I’d love to be able to talk about this, but I’m having trouble getting started. Can we work together? And so that’s the actually it was my colleague that that asked me, she goes, We can help promote each other when we’re in these situations and I’m all for that. And so we’ve worked it out where if we were at a networking event together, we will, If I am introduced to someone that, or I’m in a conversation with someone and the topic that we’re talking about reminds me of my colleague, absolutely. You know what? I’ve got a colleague who has done this or might be able to help you. Can I make an introduction? You know, can I, can I help put you together? And I think that’s a beautiful way to, to help support other people. Take an Improv Class to Improve Your Communication Skills Jenn DeWall: Yeah, it feels it’s not as vulnerable, it just feels a little bit, yeah, more manageable, maybe less anxiety-inducing. I really like that idea and again, I just love the way that leaders I think can do this to help, you know, raise their team to help their team have different opportunities or help other people see their team in the way that they only can because of how they work together. Sonja, your experience is really extensive as it relates to communication, and I know that there are other things that we didn’t necessarily talk about, but I’m curious, you know, if someone’s looking to improve their overall communication, what are other tips that you might recommend for them to focus on to improve their communication or communication style? Sonja Stetzler: Well Jenn, I think one of the best things that I ever did was take an improv class. I took a class eight years ago and it was on the encouragement of colleagues that were in the National Speakers Association, of which I am a member. I know you are a member as well. And many of my colleagues had had a little bit of experience with improv. So when the time was right, I decided I would take a class and one of my frustrations in that class– and it was hard. That was a step out of my comfort zone, for sure. But I kept getting called out for not listening. Now, that was so frustrating because I’m a trained coach and what is the first thing that you go through in coach training– its listening skills. And it took me a while to figure this out and part of it was my fear of not coming out with something brilliant, which you don’t have to in improv. I mean, life is funny in itself. You don’t have to be the one to come up with the one liners all the time. The other is going into a conversation or a scene with my own agenda. Because you’ve got your ensemble members who also are coming into the scene with their own agenda. And if you don’t let go of your agenda and you’re trying to push a scene in a particular direction, the scene is gonna fall flat. It’s gonna just fail. Jenn DeWall: Which is a true leadership example, right? Of why we need to listen and let go of our own agendas and actually work for the ensemble instead of pushing it through. Otherwise, we risk failure or things just obviously not going as planned. The Magic of “Yes, And” Sonja Stetzler: Yes. Yeah. So listening skills. And I realized that improv is nothing more than communication skills. The ability to listen and to truly be present because what I’m listening for is a gift, and a gift is a piece of dialogue or a word that helps me move that conversation forward. Or what we, in improv, would consider the scene. The second is nonverbal communication and improv. We don’t use props. We might have a chair that might be the only prop, but everything else is, is tone of voice, facial expressions, maybe what you’re doing with your hands or, or the way your body is positioned. And I have to read that. I have to be able to read that and be able to acknowledge what is going on with that particular ensemble member. We need do that with, with the person we were having a conversation with. And last but not least, and I know everybody has probably heard of the “yes, and” approach. Jenn DeWall: Yes! I love that! But explain the “yes, and” because I don’t know if everyone does. Sonja Stetzler: So yes, and. Yeah. So yes, and doesn’t necessarily mean agreement, it’s an acknowledgement. I’ve heard you, and I’m building on top of what you’re saying. I’m building on the piece of dialogue that you’ve just given me. So probably one of the, this is the personal example, but I think it was very, it was a pivotal moment. Years ago, my oldest child was a senior in high school and he came home one afternoon, it was a Friday afternoon from school and he, it wasn’t even an ask, it was an announcement that he was going to this party and he was going to break his curfew. Now my first response would, would’ve been, heck no. And it was a little bit stronger than that, but it was like, it would’ve been a headbutting moment where I would’ve said something like, No, I’m taking your car keys and whatever, whatever. I had just started taking improv classes and it was a nanosecond decision. However, I said Yes, and let’s talk about the consequences. And as a result of that line, he was able to express to me his need to belong to this social group. And in the meantime, I was also able to express my concerns for him because I knew there was gonna be drinking. My concerns were his safety driving home in the middle of the night, you know, wee hours of the morning. And I had to add my need for beauty sleep because I wasn’t gonna get to sleep unless he was home safe. Jenn DeWall: Yeah. Oh my gosh. I’m sure . Sonja Stetzler: Yes. And so we, we worked out a compromise, but from that day forward, we had been butting heads that whole school year because he was senior in high school. Of course he knew everything. However, at that particular moment in time, we were able to have a dialogue like we never had that whole year and we just started on a new footing with our relationship. And to this day we still have a very open, honest dialogue where we can have a conversation. And that was the pivotal moment where the yes, and I think saved that relationship. Jenn DeWall: That is a really powerful example of just how that can soften communications. It can soften the tensions or the competing values or objectives that each party has. I mean, I love, Yes. And you know, even in that idea generation place of how we ask teams for meetings. Yeah, that’s a great idea. And, and? I mean it’s, I think improv is one of the most underutilized tools of helping to learn authentic communication. I don’t know if you see this, but you’ve been practicing for a while. It’s something that I got into in the last five years, but just even helping you be more, Okay, there’s not a right answer. You can’t go into it scripted, you can’t think about it as well, I’ve got the perfect one. You just kind of have to be like, well, let’s see how this goes. All right, perfect! And so a basic activity, I guess, with your team, take the yes and have them bring up a topic or, you know, brainstorm solutions and have them practice only answering each other with yes and. Not no, but– no one wants to hear it. It’s yes, and. I just love that example of you being able to like, breakthrough probably the awkward times of a, a young adult and a parent trying to compete over setting a curfew. Oh my gosh, Sonja, I’ve enjoyed our conversation today and I appreciate the insights and expertise that you’ve given us. How can our audience get in touch with you? Where to Find More From Sonja Stetzler Sonja Stetzler: Thanks so much for having me on, Jenn. This was a lot of fun. You can reach me two ways. My website is SonjaStetzler.com or connect with me on LinkedIn and you can find me again, SonjaStetzler.com. Jenn DeWall: Oh my gosh, Sonja’s great coach. You can help you with your communication needs. Sonja, thank you so much for being on the show. It was great to have you and thanks for helping our audience learn how to represent and promote themselves in an authentic way. I very much appreciate your time and your expertise. Sonja Stetzler: Thanks a lot, Jenn. Thanks for having me on. Jenn DeWall: Thank you so much for listening to this week’s episode of The Leadership Habit Podcast. Sonja had great insights on what we can do to come across as more confident. Hey, heck, one of those is rehearsing, but another way that we can improve our communication skills is improv! I hope that you found valuable insights into how you can promote yourself in an authentic way and even what you can do to help give other people that opportunity for promotion or set the stage for them. If you wanna connect with Sonja, you can get to know more about her by heading over to SonjaStetzler.com. There you can connect, find additional resources, or if you want to connect on LinkedIn, she invites you to do so as well. Head on over to Sonia Stetzler there. And, of course if you know someone that could benefit from this conversation, share this podcast episode with them or leave us a review on your favorite podcast streaming service. That’s how we ensure that the Leadership Habit Podcast gets heard. And finally, if you want help with your communication needs, whether that’s delegation, or conflict resolution, we’ve got you covered here at Crestcom. Head on over to Crestcom.com, and you can find out more about our services and our 12-month-long leadership development program. Thank you so much for listening. Until next time. The post Improve Your Self-Promotion Through Authentic Communication, with Sonja Stetzler appeared first on Crestcom International.

Oct 21, 2022 • 37min

How to Operationalize Kindness in the Multi-Generational Workforce with Phillip Kane

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