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IMA Website: https://www.imanet.org/About the CMA Certification: https://www.imanet.org/cma-certificationFor nearly 50 years, the CMA® (Certified Management Accountant) certification has been the global benchmark for management accountants and financial professionals. Why? Because CMAs can explain the "why" behind numbers, not just the "what." And that can give you greater credibility, higher earning potential, and ultimately a seat at the leadership table.FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPTAdam (00:05):Welcome back for a special bonus episode of IMA's Count Me In podcast. As you know, this series is dedicated to bring you the latest perspectives and learnings on all things affecting the accounting and finance world, as told by the experts working in the field and thought leaders shaping the profession. Well, IMA is pleased to announce that it has continued to shape the profession through its CMA certification and has just officially certified it's 100,000th. To celebrate this milestone IMA has planned a month long celebration to promote the impact the CMA has had on the accounting and finance profession. To kick off the celebration, IMA's brand content and storytelling manager, Margaret Michaels, spoke with IMA's senior vice-president of certifications, exams, and constant integration, Dennis Whitney, about the state of management accounting profession and the trends impacting its future. Keep listening to hear this insightful and celebratory discussion about IMA's CMA program.Margaret (01:08):Great. Well thank you Dennis for joining the Count Me In podcast. The first question is about the certified management accountant or CMA program that was launched in 1972 by IMA. Can you tell me a little bit about what the impetus for creating a certification program like this was?Dennis (01:30):Yeah sure Margaret, thank you for having me today. I'm very happy to talk about the CMA program. Yeah, it's interesting, back in the 1960s, IMA started seriously thinking about a certification program. The impetus behind that was that rightly so they believe that management accounting was a distinct profession from public accounting and that the competencies needed inside organizations were different from public accounting. There was quite a bit of overlap. You know, financial accounting is necessary both for public accountants and accountants working inside the company, but there are distinct competencies, cost management, financial planning, and analysis that are very important for accountants working inside organization. So they identified that need and they started the planning process to develop the CMA program. And it took several years of planning, but they had their first Board of Regents meeting in the beginning of 1972 and rolled out the first exam in December of 1972.Margaret (02:44):Wow. So the CMA has a long history and how does IMA ensure that the program is relevant to the profession right now and evolves alongside it?Dennis (02:56):Yeah, the CMA program has evolved quite a bit over these, almost 50 years now. You know, when we first developed the CMA in 1972, there was more of a focus on cost accounting, but today the focus is more on a planning, analysis, decision support, and also technology and data analytics. So the way we keep up with the profession is, you know, we're constantly scanning the environment, reading research papers, talking to CFOs, corporate controllers. But what we also do is every six years or so, five to six, seven years, we do what's called a job analysis survey. So with that, we identify the tasks that management accountants do every day and what they need to know to do their job efficiently and effectively. And so from that research, we're able to develop the content specification outlines and the new exam and keep up to date with the profession.Margaret (04:02):And how does continuing education fit into the CMA program?Dennis (04:07):Yeah, well, you know, it's interesting that you use the word program because the CMA is a program. It's not just the exam. When you finish the exam, you're required to do 30 hours of continuing education every year, including two hours of ethics and the reason for that is management accountants need to stay on top of the latest trends in the profession. They need to develop new skills, new techniques. You know, if you got your CMA 20 years ago, you know, most of that knowledge is still relevant, but there are new skills and in order to maintain your relevance on your job and add value to your company and also help you develop your career, it's very important that you keep your skills current. So that's why we have the continuing education as part of the program.Margaret (04:58):That makes sense. And I'm sure that continuing education aspect appeals to a lot of professionals who are looking to stay current right now. In looking at the growth of the CMA program, it seems as if the CMA has been growing most significantly in the last five years with 50,000 CMAs added from 2016 to the present. And for perspective, it took 50 years or from 1972 to 2016 to reach the first 50,000 CMAs. So what trends do you think are contributing to the CMA's astronomical growth in the last five years?Dennis (05:39):Well there are a couple of factors that go into that. First of all, for most of our history, we were pretty much a US, primarily a US certification. I mean, we are still a US certification, but our candidate growth has expanded beyond the US. So about 10 years or so ago, we started seriously looking to develop markets overseas. So we've seen tremendous growth overseas. Now we're still, we're growing actually quite well in the US, but we're actually growing very, very well overseas, especially China. We've seen tremendous growth in China. But we've also seen growth in Europe, middle east, very strong growth in the middle east over last 10 years. And India, India is a market now that's really growing quite a bit. And also Southeast Asia, for example, in the Philippines and Vietnam. So it's a global growth and that's attributed, contributed a lot to the growth of the program. The other thing is that we've, we really work hard to communicate the value of the CMA. And for example, we have every year now for the last, I'm not exactly sure how many years, five years or so, we've been doing a commercial and an ad campaign where we make sure that we tell the public, not just our CMA's and our candidates, but tell corporations through business development and tell the public through marketing, how relevant the CMA is. So that increasing exposure has more people who know about the CMA and more people who realize the importance of the CMA, particularly hiring managers. So we're seeing, for example, more ads saying CMA preferred and I think those are the reasons primarily for the growth. Well, one other thing actually is a bigger exposure on the university campuses. So more students are interested in the program as well.Margaret (07:54):That makes a lot of sense and clearly now more than ever, hiring managers and organizations are faced with challenges revolving around rebuilding post COVID and the talent war that we hear about where there's fierce competition for CMAs in particular. So as organizations look to build a more enhanced digital capabilities and transform their finance and accounting departments, how does the CMA specifically prepare them for those types of challenges?Dennis (08:35):Well the CMA has a very unique set of skills. So, y...

Contact Demetrios Frangiskatos: https://www.linkedin.com/in/demetrios-frangiskatos-00290a7/Demetrios at BDO: https://www.bdo.com/our-people/demetrios-frangiskatosFULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPTMitch (00:06):Welcome back to Count Me In, IMA's podcast about all things affecting the accounting and finance world. I'm your host Mitch Roshong and this is episode 137 of our series. Today's conversation is between my co-host Adam and the co-leader of BDOs SPAC assurance practice, Demetrios Frangiskatos. The SPAC, Special Purpose Acquisition Company market has long-term implications that cannot be overlooked. Demetrios joins us to explain factors currently driving the market as well as other considerations and risks. To learn more, keep listening as we head over to their conversation now. Adam (00:48):Demetrios, thanks so much for coming on the podcast today. To start off our conversation, where's the SPAC market now and what factors have been driving its activity and is it still a viable option to going public today? Demetrios (01:02):Thanks for having me, Adam and looking forward to our discussion. Yeah. You know, the SPAC market has been on a roller coaster ride over the last probably 18 months and all of it is sort of been going up just at different speeds and different levels. The market right now is probably a little slower than it has been, you know, earlier on in the year with regards to initial public offerings and raising capital through the pipe market, but there's been no indication from, you know, whether, the bankers,, attorneys sponsors, what we're seeing in the marketplace that it is still a viable option. We're still seeing activity. We're still seeing SPACs raising money. We're still seeing spot sponsors, which include asset managers and strategics and high net worth individuals who have had a lot of success in doing M&A, looking to raise capital. So I don't see it slowing down. I think we were sort of in an unprecedented market at the beginning of the year and that incline had started from the year before, and that might've been a pace that was difficult to continue following. But it still seems like it's going strong and you're still also seeing even the traditional IPO market go strong. So they both seem to be viable, options that are continuing in the marketplace, as well right now. Adam (02:51):So back in April of this year, the SEC issued a new guidance regarding, related to warrants that seemed to shake up the market. Can you talk about what happened there and what implications were for sponsors and target companies alike? Demetrios (03:08):Yeah, of course. Yeah, that was, that was a bit of a splash in the market with respect to the accounting behind warrants was dealt with in a certain way for a long period time and with the SEC statement it changed the direction of that accounting from what was fairly easy to account for the warrants as equity instruments, to if the warrant instruments had certain clauses they would have to be reclassified as liabilities. And what did that do, that caused, you know, there was at least 400 SPACs out in the market that raised capital, that had to reevaluate it. That was de-SPACs that occurred in the marketplace, where the warrants carried over from the original offering into the new operating company that became public that had, restatements. So it caused quite a bit of noise. And, you know, the timing was interesting because the statement came out in April and then in March, I shouldn't say then, but prior to that in March, we had started seeing a little bit of a slowdown in the market. I think the pipe market was reaching a bit of a capacity point in how much private investment was going to go into these SPACs and the combination of those two really, really put a pause in the marketplace. And it took, it took about, you know, maybe a couple of months for the market to start getting back up and going and enough time for the companies to evaluate what the rules mean with their current equity instruments, you know, attorneys to evaluate the structure, including the bankers. And initially there was a lot of hesitation and what to do, whether to file new SPACs with, you know, the legacy terms and my ability accounting, try to restructure these agreements so that they have equity accounting, and that started shaking itself out and initially we saw mostly filings of you know, saw the restatements on the old, on the existing companies. We started seeing filings of SPACs with, warrant instruments with liability accounting, and now we're starting to see a shift where the sponsors and the bank community and the attorneys are working on instruments that will, get these warrant instruments to equity accounting and you know, we're working through several within our firm as well, so you're starting to see the market evolve and address some of the concerns that the SEC presented in their statement. Adam (06:06):Can you maybe touch on the regulatory focus that continues to increase, such as the current chair's Gensler's the statements that he's made? Demetrios (06:14):Yeah, no, of course. I think, you know, you're going through changes in the administration right now, because of the presidential change so that's, we'll probably gonna see some shifts in regulatory focus and, you know, the appointments that are being made and coupled with, you know, Gensler's comments, maybe a month, month and a half ago, he was talking generally about the capital markets and there's been an uptick both in traditional IPO's, and that there's an expectation that will continue. But did talk about SPACs, and their sort of their resurgence from, you know, these were vehicles that existed several years ago, or much longer than several years ago, but they just weren't, they weren't being used as often and obviously now the activity is tremendous. And he was, you know, he was focusing on our investors protected appropriately with these SPACs specifically. I think his focus was on retail investors and them getting the appropriate information, that they need both on the initial IPO stage and in the de-SPAC when the target is the operating companies identify and the DSPAC occurs and I think he was cuing that there should be some focus on this and make sure with the volume that's going on that the disclosures and the information flow that's getting to investors is at the right level. And, the second point he raised, which I think has always been something that's been a focus is, just generally speaking the efficiency of the vehicle and whether, you know, is how it compares to traditional IPO. Obviously, the SPAC sponsor is the ones that are raising the capital and are the ones that are looking for the operating company. There's a certain level of dilution and costs that they bring to the table. The SPACs that we're you know, in the current market, maybe several years ago, they didn't have pipes, but now they have pipes which are private investments in public equity. So there's significant capital being raised through that and that they're getting discounted pricing. So the combination of all that is a concern that gets brought up, are the retail investors aware and, are they properly, being, you know, evaluating their decisions with the information for what's going in? So it's clear that there's going to be some heightened focus on SPACs, disclosure, the right level of information for investors, and then ultimately I thi...

Continue the conversation with David!https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidshar/FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPTMitch (00:05):Welcome back to Count Me In, IMA's podcast about all things affecting the accounting and finance world. I'm your host Mitch Roshong and this is episode 136 of our series. Many would describe the global business environment over the last year and a half as rather turbulent. From accelerated growth due to technology, followed by the effects of COVID-19, burnout has become a very common theme in the workplace. David Shar, business psychology expert, and founder of Illuminate PMC joins us to talk about what businesses and people can do to avoid burnout and find real meaning in their work. Keep listening as we head over to the conversation now.Adam (00:49):So David, thanks so much for coming on. Burnout is a word that I've been hearing a lot lately, especially with people coming on the other side of the pandemic and coming out of their homes a little bit more, but so many people have been stuck in front of computer screens in their homes for so long. Can you just kind of talk about what is burnout?David (01:07):Yeah. First of all, thank you so much for having me Adam. So burnout is definitely becoming a little bit more of a popular topic. Fortunate for me, unfortunate for everyone, I guess. And it is, becoming more and more universal, especially with what everyone has gone through and were not done, like you said, as we are now leaving our homes and going back to work and, many of us will be teleworking and be on fully virtual teams, but whatever that means going on to that, and I know it's a horrible term because it's used so much, but to that new normal, we're not out of the weeds yet. This is when, we're all going to have to start to really cope with what we've gone through and burnout by definition is typically defined as having three pieces to it. The first one is this emotional exhaustion and emotional exhaustion is often misunderstood. It's not physical exhaustion, it's not mental exhaustion, but it does lead to those things and even lead to physical ailment, but it starts as emotional exhaustion. The second piece is a general cynicism of work and, that's where we start really putting up barriers between ourselves and our coworkers and our clients and if we have employees between ourselves and our employees, we have this general sense of cynicism and we separate ourselves from our work as much as possible, mentally. And then the final piece of, burnout would be a reduced sense of personal accomplishment. And what that is, is that we feel like we're turning our wheels twice as fast and getting half as much done, or we feel like we're putting in the effort, but not getting the reward and maybe that means the compensation, dollars and cents compensation, or maybe it just means the recognition or the positive feelings or whatever it is we're putting X in and we expect to get Y out and there's an imbalance there, which is either real or just perceived, but either way it will take you to the brink of burnout.Adam (03:48):So as you described all of those three things, I know that I've been there, I'm sure you've been there, I'm sure many of our listeners have been there. What can business leaders do to prevent that burnout?David (04:01):Yeah. Another great question. So, right. We've all sort of been there, especially over the past year and a half. You know, who hasn't felt extremely cynical, who hasn't felt emotionally exhausted as they're trying to learn to do their job, in a new reality and, you know, within accounting, a lot of your work could be done virtually and a lot of you may have been already working primarily virtually, but even those individuals didn't necessarily have their children at home trying to homeschool their kids, you know, at the same time, that's incredibly difficult. There are, there were incredible barriers that we made work harder. And, so there's a lot that can be done from a leadership perspective, as well as the individual's perspective. But the biggest thing that I would say from the very beginning is we need to reconnect with what it is that we do, right? Like, we need to reconnect with our proverbial why, like what is our firm all about, what is our business all about? We need to be able to reconnect with that because that's what we've gotten away from. We get so lost in the weeds and so overwhelmed and distracted that we lose sight of maybe it's the client interactions, maybe it's the mission of the organization, maybe it's a difference that we're making and suddenly instead of all of those things, it's just spreadsheets on the computer and it becomes very easy to lose sight of those other things and so we need to take away the noise and create the sense of why again, and we need to be able to do it in a way that, brings people, brings people back mentally and also gives them a sense of control in their lives again. Work during the pandemic, could have been part of the problem, or it could have been an escape from the problem, depending on how much control employees felt when they went to work or virtually signed into work. If they felt in control of their work, then when their entire lives felt out of control work was the haven where they were still in control. But if that wasn't the case, then work was just part of the problem.Adam (06:37):So let's dig into that, finding your why a little bit more, you know, sometimes people have very mundane jobs, when you're first starting out in accounting, you know, sometimes you just, you know, kind of crunching numbers. How are people supposed to find meaning in that work and connect with that why, if they're so far down?David (06:55):Yeah, it's really interesting. So my first job, my first real job was, I was a kennel worker. I wanted to be a veterinarian and, turned out that, to be a bio major pre-veterinary you needed chemistry and physics. So I'm like, nope. And ironically, I switched to the business college and the very first class I took, I'm like yes, I'm getting away from all the math and the very first class I took was accounting I. So you gotta be kidding me, but suddenly when you took moles off the end of a number and you put a dollar sign in front of it made a lot more sense to me. But yeah, so my very first job was working in these kennels and I was pre-veterinary, I wanted to be a vet and I remember one day as a young man, I was literally pooper scooping, like picking up poop from the floor of a kennel. And I was doing this, I was working on alongside a coworker and I remember looking over and seeing her face and realizing that the two of us were doing completely different jobs, the same exact tasks, but completely different things. She was picking up poop. I was, I was creating a cleaner and safer environment for these sick animals. You know, I was caring for animals while she was cleaning up poop, you know, and it was just in the mindset. It was in how we saw our jobs and when you're in accounting or any profession, you have a choice in how you see the actual why of what you do, how much you connect with that. And we typically find careers where we have some sort of role model that we look to somebody that we see that we're like, yeah that's what I want from my career. And there's usually not that much of a separation between our career and life outside of our career. We look for significance in our lives, we look for significance in our career, and that might mean something different to each of us. Maybe want to make a difference with the organizational mission. Maybe you want to be able to, you know, afford to travel around the world and work from wherever, whatever it is, you're lookin...

Contact James Burton: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jcburton/Personal Capital: https://www.personalcapital.com/Advisory services are offered for a fee by Personal Capital Advisors Corporation (“PCAC”), a registered investment adviser with the Securities and Exchange Commission. Registration does not imply a certain level of skill or training. Investing involves risk. Past performance is not indicative of future returns. You may lose money. PCAC is a wholly owned subsidiary of Personal Capital Corporation (“PCC”), an Empower company. PCC is a wholly owned subsidiary of Empower Holdings, LLC. © 2021 Personal Capital Corporation.Personal Capital SRI portfolios are powered by Sustainalytics.FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPTAdam (00:00):Welcome back to Count Me In. IMA's podcast about all things affecting the accounting and finance world. This is your host Adam Larson, and I'm here to bring you episode 135 of our series with featured guest, James Burton. In the wealth management space, a few can claim to have accomplished more than James, a 20 year veteran of the industry, he has held executive, management, and C-level positions at some of the most respected financial institutions in the world. He now serves as Chief Growth Officer at fintech trailblazer, Personal Finance, and joins Count Me In to talk about how to turn a crisis into opportunity. Keep listening as we head over to the conversation now. Mitch (00:50):So James, obviously the global pandemic of 2020 caused a crisis for many businesses. A lot of our listeners felt this impact. For you personally, I'd like to start off our conversation by just having you explain, how did you help clients and organizations navigate through these difficult times, particularly in the beginning? James (01:09):Yeah thanks, Mitchell. You know, something like a pandemic and the initial market slump that it caused, that really, that really makes you reconsider everything, right? All your assumptions about your business model, your strategy, your growth opportunities, trying to see into the future. And naturally many of our clients went through very similar reflections about their goals and their financial situations, and they had a lot of questions about the future too. And the demand for advice, financial advice and expert support definitely increased. And in this case, it turned out that our company, Personal Capital, we were highly prepared for the crisis because we already had a hybrid digital and human model advisory model is technology enabled to operate remotely. So in a very general sense, we just stuck to our knitting. That's a British term, I think, meaning, we stayed on strategy and we continued interacting with our clients and supporting them through their financial concerns during the pandemic, particularly in those early, very stressful months. But we also made a very crucial pivot to getting everyone to remote working, from home literally overnight. And we could do that because of how the company was designed and built. So, you know, the result was that despite the initial market slump that we went through, we actually saw strong growth last year. People want advice. They want to holistic advice and they mostly don't want to travel to a brick and mortar building or office with wood panels, you know, nice little offices. They certainly didn't want to travel during a pandemic, right. And now, you know, a year later they know that in fact they don't need to go any further than their kitchen or the home office, to work with us. So we were able to help them, right away and we were able to help them remotely, which was great. Mitch (03:14):And now, you know, kind of building on this conversation a little bit, in leading up to our recording today, I was told that you follow a quote from Winston Churchill. It's a bit of a mantra and if I can just read the quote, "never let a good crisis go to waste". So, to help explain for our listeners here, why, what does that mean to you? How, do you go about using that as a mantra? James (03:37):Yeah, so Winston Churchill, he certainly produced a lot of great motivational quotes and I do particularly like that one, "never let a good crisis go to waste". I find myself using it a lot actually. And, you know, a good crisis, is very often a great opportunity. And that's because it's when you're forced to reconsider everything, you know, all your assumptions, your business model, your strategy, your opportunities, even your very survival sometimes. A really good crisis puts all of that in the picture. And as a result, it's often when meaningful change is initiated and it's when we move forward from the past, you know, to the future way of thinking. And in the case of our company, as I mentioned, we found that as it happened, we designed and prepared very well for the lockdown and we could commit to this virtual first approach. And as a result, we've proved beyond doubt that virtual financial advice works very well. If you have the right technology and business model and it's here to stay. So a great crisis here, which it really was, and in many ways still is, you know, helped us prove that and move into a future where, you know, advice can look very different for Americans. Mitch (04:55):And now we are, you know, roughly 16, 17 months through this, you know, it's been a year and a half and, you mentioned going into the future a little bit more, not every bad thing that happens is a crisis necessarily for business, right? We don't always face something like the COVID-19 pandemic. How can this mantra, this quote still apply on a daily basis, you know, once we kind of returned to normal or the new normal, however you want to refer to it. Can you give us some examples and some response options for the daily ups and downs of business and responding this way? James (05:31):Sure, sure Mitchell, and look, you know, certainly these have been some strange and scary times in the past year. But you know, it's exciting to look into the future and see things improving. I'm definitely happy to share some examples, but, you know, as I've thought about this, as you point out, you know, real crises and real opportunities, they're not exactly daily events, you know, thank goodness. They tend to come along just when you think everything's going great in your business, like maybe early 2020 for example. So every few years you may get a really good crisis, you know, something really challenging or bad happens in the environment or, you know, in your business. I've got some examples of how to put, you know, a good crisis to work, but I have to mention that they're not really day to day examples, they're how to really harness the big situations. So if you'll indulge me, I'll happily proceed, but, you know, I generally wouldn't use an expression like, "never let a good crisis go to waste", in the day-to-day environments, right. That's just doing our jobs. So I'm happy to proceed with, you know, let's just say longer term, bigger picture examples. I'll go for it. Mitch (06:48):Absolutely. Yes, please do. James (06:50):That's great. So, first of all, I could go back in the time machine, maybe about 20 years. And, at the time I was working for a well-known stock broker based here in San Francisco, and the company had experienced huge growth in the late 1990s. And then along came the crisis, the tech bubble burst in 2000. For anybody who was active in the markets at that time...

Contact Karri Callahan: https://www.linkedin.com/in/karri-callahan-5219676a/FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPTMitch (00:00):Hey everyone. Welcome back to Count Me In, IMA's podcast about all things affecting the accounting and finance world. I'm your host Mitch Roshong and this is episode 134 of our series. In today's conversation, you will hear from Karri Callahan, CFO of global real estate company, Remax. Karri spoke with my co-host Adam about the role of the CFO and shared some tips for finance leaders. From strategy and technology to diversity, equity and inclusion, Karri has great perspective on many topics business leaders should be aware of. So to hear more, keep listening as we head over to their conversation now. Adam (00:47):So Karri, thanks so much for joining us and as you know, the role of the CFO is become very multifaceted and how can aspiring finance leaders better prepare themselves for providing a strategy and insight? Karri (01:00):Great, thanks so much for having me Adam, I appreciate it. And I think there's a couple of things to consider. First and foremost, I think it's important that you always keep learning, making sure that you continue to build your network, connect with peers and think about joining the right organization for you so that you can hear from different speakers and industry leaders on a regular basis, I think is really helpful. Some organizations that you can consider and that I've found helpful include Financial Executives International or FEI, and also the Association of International Certified Professional Accountants, so the AICPA. Since I've been the CFO of a publicly traded company for the last five years or so, I've also found, NIRI or the National Investor Relations Institute, a great resource, they offer some fantastic certification courses and trainings and have just a tremendous library of events and programs that they offer. So I think that's also another resource for you. And then of course, last but not least, IMA definitely I know you all have a lot of resources to help professionals. I think the last thing I would say is just read things that are of interest to you, so that you can stay current either on recent economic trends, trends that might be impacting your business or your industry, or just business leadership in general. But I think some of the best advice I've gotten is that it's important and critical to really be intentional about how you spend your time. Your time is truly invaluable and making sure that you get the most out of every minute is critical, but if you keep really absorbing information, learning from others, the better prepared you're going to be as life and your profession throw you curve balls. Adam (02:53):Yeah, definitely. So, you know, speaking of time, we know that time, technology takes a lot of our time and technology has changed how finance and accounting operate with how, many routine tasks or many, many routine tasks are now automated, freeing up professionals to focus on higher level tasks. How well acquainted should today's accounting and finance professionals be with technology like intelligent automation or RPA? Karri (03:21):Yeah. So it's a great question. Remax LLC, president Nick Bailey, who I work closely with, he oftentimes tells our agents that if you know that technology won't put real estate agents out of business, but agents who don't embrace technology will put themselves out of business. And I think that advice is applicable to so many other professions, including mine and accounting and finance. And so I think as you think about technology and as all professionals really think about technology, it's important that we're always learning and evaluating and studying new trends from a technology perspective, that makes sense for your company and the finance and accounting operations within your organization. Our teams are constantly evaluating how to incorporate new technologies and software into our routine accounting and finance processes and the reason why that's so critical is because it frees up our team's time to really help analyze trends within the business, evaluate business opportunities and really work strategically with other leaders within our organization so that we're contributing to strategic growth initiatives. And so technology is a key point to that, you know, as part of that transformation within our business, our company now has more in-house technology expertise and firepower than we ever have. We have now about 50% of our workforce that's directly involved in technology and we've recently announced an organizational change to really create one technology team comprised of all of those professionals so that we can really maximize collaboration, focus on our customer and end user experience and operate with purpose, passion, and excellence from a technology perspective. And I think what that does over time is, you know, we expect it really will benefit the entire corporate team, including everyone from an accounting and finance perspective, as well as other services function by really enhancing the delivery and supportive technology and data to all areas of the business so that we can continue to drive the business forward. Adam (05:28):Definitely. It sounds like Remax is doing some wonderful things to, be a leader in the industry. So what do you do to stay ahead on the technology curve? Karri (05:39):Yeah, great question. So I think, you know, fortunately the piece of change in the real estate industry, it's incredibly exciting and incredibly dynamic and because of that, our leadership team has really a front row seat to the latest technologies as we implement our MNA strategies as well as just continue to focus on our organic growth as well. For example, you know, despite a global pandemic in September of last year, we announced the acquisitions of Gadberry Group and Weenlow. Gaderry Group specializes in building best in class products that help clients solve geospatial challenges through accurate and precise location data. Weenlow is a Florida based startup that is reshaping the mortgage loan processing, process within the mortgage brokerage channel and they have developed the first service cloud for mortgage brokers effectively combining third-party loan processing with an all-in-one digital platform. And so those are just two really exciting opportunities that we have been able to execute upon as we really look to stay ahead of that technology curve. You know, we're always assessing the latest technologies and innovative companies with in, in the space and in our business pursuits because we are the worldwide leader and we want to make sure that Remax, stays in that position from a real estate technology perspective is clear. That mission is hugely beneficial to my knowledge of what's currently out there and what the space is, is truly lacking. It sounds simple, but another way to stay ahead of the curve is really by surrounding myself with a healthy mix of like-minded individuals and people who really stretched me beyond my own constraints. We have a fantastic network of about 140,000 real estate agents, more than 600 headquarter employees, and we operate in over 110 countries and territories globally and I'm so fortunate to be able to work with and network alongside people who have very similar core values and yet challenge each other to continuously improve and innovate. And I think that collaboration really transcends across our headquarters organization because I think staying connected with leaders on the technology side is really important. I have a standing weekl...

Contact Hilla Sferruzza: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hilla-sferruzza-cpa-mba-b3170b8/Meritage Homes: https://www.meritagehomes.com/FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPTAdam (00:05):Hey, everyone. Welcome back to Count Me In. IMA's podcast about all things affecting the accounting and finance world. Adam Larson here with you again, and I'm pleased to introduce today's featured guest speaker Hilla Sferruzza. Hilla is the CFO of Meritage Homes and spoke with my co-host Mitch about the role of today's CFOs. In their conversation, she explains why future ready executives must have a holistic view of the business and possess four lines of sight. Keep listening to hear more about finance, strategy, technology, and more. Mitch (00:42):So in today's episode, we are talking about the role of the CFO becoming more central, more complex. Let's start broadly, and then we'll kind of work our way into some more specifics. So first, what is it about today's business world and the way organizations are run that requires the CFO to have a more holistic view and a better understanding of the business. Hilla (01:05):So, thanks for having me on Mitch. In today's world everything is moving at an accelerated pace. So change digitalization, everything is causing technology to just move really fast. So the risk of taking a wrong turn can be really expensive. So I think the CFOs have to take a step back and kind of look at the entire landscape of a company and really understand all of the interconnectivity of what we're doing as a company, as an organization, and make sure that decisions that are being made really impact the organization appropriately. So whether we're looking at it through the financial lens or risk assessment lens, a technology lens, an investor stakeholder lens, you know, more recently ESG and DI lens. It's really important that we understand the implications of everything that's happening. We're much less siloed than we used to be. I think we were kind of along this path anyway, and then maybe the pandemic and working from home accelerated that where decisions are being made real time very, very quickly. I would say in the public sector, where I am the CFO, it's maybe even more accelerated and CFO is having to answer live, you know, kind of on the go conversations, whether it's from investors or from analysts, you really have to have that broad knowledge of what's happening in the market, as well as all your competitors. So you kind of are a co-leader of all this data and you have to bring it back internally and make sure the guidance that you're providing the rest of the executive team and the initiatives and strategy that you're driving as a CFO really encompass the entire company's organization and operations, not just, you know, what are we looking for on the bottom line? What's the EPS going to be, of this decision, the consequences of this decision. Mitch (03:00):Now, with this deeper understanding, this broader understanding as well that you just mentioned of the business, how are you better able to lead the strategic planning, the risk mitigation processes for the organization? We have a lot of these individual conversations about, you know, the role of the CFO, but what is it about the CFO of the finance team that really allows them to work cross-functionally and ultimately make these important strategic business decisions? Hilla (03:26):So I love to say that the finance team is agnostic, right? Our only goal is the success of the company as a whole. Every other functional area, maybe has a little bit of a different spin. Maybe it's conscious, maybe it's subconscious, but they're all driving to a different objective. Maybe if you're in sales, you're focused on a different metric and if you're in operations or in purchasing or in marketing, everyone's got a little bit of a different spin on what they think is most important to make the company successful. I think finance is agnostic, right? So we can maybe take a step back, see the entire picture, not get lost in the forest or the trees and then give counsel that is best for the organization. So I can share an example. So I work for a home builder. We always have a little bit of a push and pull on timing and on dollars. We break our teams between the folks that do what we call horizontal work, which is land and vertical work, which is the actual construction of the building. There's always a little bit of a tug of war between those two departments. The finance team can take a step back and say, well what's actually most beneficial for the organization is to take this approach. Sometimes it breaks or it's one department, other times it breaks towards another department, but maybe, you know, I keep on saying agnostic, maybe a different word is also arbiter, right? We're kind of the one that maybe can help negotiate between all the different departments and through dollars and cents explain why certain decisions are the best decisions for the organization as a whole, even though there may be not an ideal state from one department versus another. Mitch (05:06):I think that's a great way to put it, the arbiter at the end that you mentioned, it really is, you know, just the understanding that we're talking about here from both sides of the equation and making sure that things balance, you know, when it comes to accounting, making sure that everything makes sense and works out. The way you explained it right there, the push and pull really helps clarify things, so thank you for that story and that analogy. I think, another interesting part of your role as we talk about these different decisions and different teams working together, obviously you have oversight over the finance team as CFO, strategy, operations, all the regular things that the CFO has a responsibility for, but you I understand also have oversight over IT. So what are some of the advantages of having IT under your umbrella when it comes to these cross-functional teams, cross-functional conversations and things like that? Hilla (06:00):So, obviously I'm a CFO. My first love was always numbers, but I will say that my current passion maybe almost bordering on obsession is the IT function. So I kind of inherited the IT function as I think a lot of CFOs do because the underlying system of record, the accounting system is kind of my general umbrella. And IT is a role that I guess it could sit with the CEO, the COO, or the CFO in a regular organization, but they're a little bit of a, you know, they kind of get tossed around. Nobody really wants to own it. It's a little bit intimidating to have a function roll up to you that's maybe not your core level of expertise. So when the IT team became part of my CFO team, I was nervous and excited. It's been a long time since I kind of didn't know something from soup to nuts, but I really dove in and the more I dove into the IT function, the more I realized that IT was going through a metamorphosis, right. They had kind of been the back office, keep the lights on part of the organization. Nobody even knew where they sat and call them if your password didn't work. And then they've really morphed into a key contributor and everything operations. Sure we still help you with your password, right. But the real core of what we do is operational efficiency, operational excellence, and, giving us that edge, that next differentiator. So for me as a CFO, this is the lens into the business. This is the lens into ops, all of the projects, all of the requests, whether it's a wholesale change ...

Contact James Stark: https://www.linkedin.com/in/james-stark-312a2/FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPTAdam (00:00):Welcome back to Count Me In, IMA's podcast about all things affecting the accounting and finance world. I'm your host, Adam Larson and today I will be previewing a conversation between my co-host Rouba and her special guest, James Stark. In this episode, James shares his insight and views on the challenging global landscape and the must have skills for CFOs. He is active in Egon Zehnder's financial officer's industrial board practices and is well-versed in the financial leaders need to evolve and optimize their careers and their organizations. Keep listening to hear more from James and Rouba now. Rouba (00:42):So I want to ask you a little bit about your career in the finance and accounting industry for so many years, I mean, throughout your career you've facilitated a lot of peer to peer learning within the finance and accounting profession itself, and you're a huge advocate for creating lasting value. Can you tell us a little bit more about what it means to drive that kind of level of value in today's very volatile globalized marketplace? James (01:13):Yeah, of course. So look, I tie this to the rise of the strategic CFO, which is something that's been written about quite a bit over the last decade or so. What that means, I think in practice is that CFO, senior finance leaders are becoming much more forward looking to help drive business decisions and not just kind of the backward looking scorekeeper that they might've been 20, 30 plus years ago. I think elements of that would also include scenario analysis and how you translate corporate strategy down to business unit or functional or even product strategy. So there's much more of a focus on commercial outcomes and driving the business forward. I also think finance leaders are really well equipped to help drive this value, given their position in the organization. Especially if they can broaden their skills beyond just kind of whatever that core part of finances they kind of came in or came up through. So, you know, rotations can help with that as you think about moving around between controllership to FP&A or treasury or investor relations or strategy and corporate development, et cetera. I've had CFOs tell me over the last, maybe five plus years that, you know, technical skills now are really just more like table stakes and what truly differentiates finance talent and helping to drive value creation, is having greater impact via, you know, better strategic thinking, being both deeply analytical, but also pairing that with a willingness to embrace new technologies and then also strong leadership and interpersonal skills can really help motivate and organize and energize the broader organization and I think specifically to that peer to peer learning piece, and I think part of that is also, you know, if you're a lifelong learner, you're going to be kind of more adaptable and you're constantly being incorporating best practices that you learn from others outside your organization, or even outside your industry. Rouba (02:56):Yeah, I'm all for the life learning approach, that's really a big value, at IMA. So when you look at, when your focus in recent years has been a lot on innovation and organic growth, but let's look into this new era, this new normal that we're in, the COVID-19 pandemic pre, during, and post, and as organizations are crumbling, some are succeeding, some have completely remodeled their entire business model and they're struggling to survive. What role does innovation play, I mean, and organic growth play at this time, if at all? James (03:35):Yeah, great question. It's certainly very timely, right. So I've been talking to senior finance leaders for almost two decades now and when I asked them about their top priorities, innovation and organic growth is always at, or near the top. And that's both for the company, but also even within the finance function, right? How can you improve your operations and processes within finance? So I think there's always a role for innovation, but it's important as well of course, ebb and flow, depending on what's happening both within the company, as well as the broader macro conditions. You know, in times of crisis it's well-known that R&D spending is typically one of the first line items that gets cut or at least drastically reduced, right. Cash is king and so, yeah, totally get that, that's going to happen in a downturn. But you know, but once that storm is weathered and you start seeing a return to normalcy, I think then it becomes time to quickly pivot and identify new opportunities for growth again. And I think the earlier you can make the pivot, you know, the better the odds that you can beat your competition at it. I'd also, you know, even use Egon Zehnder as an example in terms of what we did during the pandemic. You know, as the pandemic was ramping up, we didn't lay off anyone globally. You know, it was, we did stop, we did stop hiring, but we didn't lay anyone off and, you know, given our values, we didn't think layoffs were the right thing to do at the time, but also strategically, we didn't think layoffs made sense, and I think, you know, some of our competitors actually did lay off staff and, you know, as a result now that we're seeing this strong rebound in some markets, we feel like we're in a great position. Rouba (05:02):Yeah I don't think many anticipated the pent up demand and how it's going to see them scramble to get their business back to normal. So if we look at automation, machine learning, artificial intelligence, they've already begun taking serious inroads into the professional realm and not just in the finance and accounting sector, but every single industry. So digital transformation is now the conversation at every boardroom, every discussion and it was extremely accelerated by COVID. I mean, whatever was in the works a few months ago just became a priority all of a sudden. So when you think of this post pandemic, new normal per se, what are the skills that the finance and accounting professionals are going to require in order to maneuver with this new normal? James (05:49):Yeah, you know, I think some of these kind of core skills will get amplified given what we've seen over the last 16 months or so, right. And so that's around adaptability, resilience in being able to lead through ambiguity. I think we'll see likely an acceleration of some of these pre COVID trends as we move to the new normal. I think many have already, as you said, many have already been focusing on advanced analytics, bots, robotic process automation to improve performance within the finance function. As we, move to the post pandemic normal, I think those areas are going to remain robust. I'd also expect to see many people turning to artificial intelligence, machine learning, advanced data visualization technologies, and of course, digitalization to do things better, smarter and faster and who knows at some point maybe blockchain may eventually even live up to it's hype. Rouba (06:38):Hopefully. I mean, it's the biggest conversation right now, blockchain and cryptocurrency taking over the world. So we've seen companies around the world undergo major digital transformation efforts in the region. Some of the most notable are, Emirates NBD. I mean, these guys spent 1 billion dirhams, on, their own transformation. You're talking about roughly a quarter of million dollars, and just to enhance their performance, Coca-Cola says that they were able t...

Contact Marco Otti: https://www.linkedin.com/in/marco-otti/Budgeting Revisited: https://sfmagazine.com/post-entry/may-2021-budgeting-revisited/FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPTMitch: (00:00) Welcome back to Count Me In, IMA's podcast about all things affecting the accounting and finance world. I'm your host Mitch Roshong and this is episode 131 of our series. For today's conversation my co-host Adam spoke with Marco Otti about possible solutions in different approaches to budgeting. Marco is a group controller who acts as a finance business partner to support the decision-making of Autoneum, the global market leader in acoustics and thermal management. In their conversation, Marco discusses some of the common issues with traditional budgeting and explains why CFOs need to rethink how they plan and execute their budgets. Keep listening as we head over to their conversation now.Adam: (00:50)So let's start by talking about some of the issues with traditional and better budgeting. Why change?Marco: (00:56)Yes, why is innovation in budgeting needed, right? I mean, as a group controller, I contribute to our company's annual budgeting, monthly forecasting and three-year financial planning process, and I often ask myself, how can we as management accountants do a better job at budgeting, right? Kind of process be simpler or different. I'm sure most listeners have been involved with the budgeting process in one way or another. Maybe ask yourself as well, what do you consider the most significant barrier to improving or changing your budgeting process? There can be many barriers of course, for example, organizational attitudes towards budgeting, time, cost, inflexible IT systems, or the process being controlled by another group/department, or maybe you think there are no barriers at all, then that's great. One thing to remember is that traditional budgeting is still used in the maturity of companies. At the same time, many of these organizations identify agility as their strategy, which is quite surprising because traditional budgeting is too rigid to support agility well. And if you read Kaplan and Norton, they say that the ineffectiveness of many budgets also comes from the fact that almost 60% of organizations don't link budgets to their strategy and only 25% of managers have incentives linked to the company's strategy. Most of us are aware of the limitations of traditional budgeting. So it can be a very time-consuming exercise with limited value, as assumptions are quickly outdated. Also decisions are often made too early and other to senior level. And based on my own experience, having been involved in a budgeting process, the issue with traditional budgeting is really the amount of work compared to the benefit. I mean, having annual and detailed discussions with cost centers can be quite time-consuming and usually the complaints come from us, the finance function, finance organization who manage and execute this process. So depending on how lean and improved your process is, it can be an efficient exercise as well. With better budgeting you can substantially reduce the planning effort, for example, with less meetings, less reporting requirements, more top-down guidance, shorten the process to maybe one or two months every year. However, process improvements are still a continuation of the traditional budgeting approach and does not bring fundamental changes of instruments.Adam: (03:30)So then what are the essential functions of budgets and what are they used for?Marco: (03:34)That's a good question because, the functions and what budgets are used for, are quite relevant and important, like translating your company strategy into targets, which refers again to the strategy execution, Kaplan and Norton are talking about. Budgets are, if you will, the tactical implementation of the strategy, they are about resource allocation, which again, starts with developing and validating the company strategy. Therefore, I would say you cannot just remove the budget with its functions and manage your costs and business because planning is still important to coordinate activities, in your own organization. As an example, let me share some of the different functions the budget has at my company, Autoneum. We use the budget for setting absolute targets for the year and to support the performance management throughout the year, for example, every month. So the budget really serves as a reference point for performance and based on many assumptions, it gives a prediction of the next year and how we plan to control costs. Also it is used for resource allocation and managing continuous improvement initiatives. In any organization, traditional and better budgeting is really a mix and let's say a compromise of some of these and other functions.Adam: (04:57)Okay, then, so in the context of traditional budgeting and VUCA environments, how did your company respond to the crisis last year?Marco: (05:04)Yes, I mentioned agility before, of course, in a VUCA environment, like in 2020 with the COVID-19 pandemic, traditional budgets were not very useful to compare performance against because they were basically irrelevant by the end of the first quarter. So how did we respond? On the top line we planned for different scenarios and updated them weekly. In terms of costs, we used the most recent rolling forecasts, which are updated monthly. And in discussions with the business unit locally agreed on how to best cut costs. In some cases we instructed some top-down adjustments, based on the revenue levels. So for a time really stopped focusing on a budget, right, and shifted the attention to the monthly forecast and came up with intermediate targets based on the circumstances. This is also something to think about when you put yourself in the shoes of the decision makers. What did you or your company do to respond and manage costs during the pandemic? Did you empower your local teams because they know best how to manage costs. Or on the other hand, did you centralize decisions as much as possible because in a crisis there is a need for strong leadership, right? Actually, I mean, this spectrum of self-control versus command and control is relevant when thinking about new budgeting approaches. You can manage costs with detailed annual cost budgets or increase autonomy and flexibility by using absolute or relative KPIs, or even no targets at all. Of course, this then needs strong company values and a clear direction.Adam: (06:45)What are the possible solutions for more business agility and changing to different budgeting approaches like beyond budgeting?Marco: (06:52)Actually this question, was the reason why the president of the IMA Switzerland chapter, Hessel Brouwer and myself, reached out to CFOs and academics in Switzerland to learn from their experiences of moving to more modern and agile budgeting techniques and then also publish an article in strategic finance. One of the main ideas of the beyond budgeting theory is to separate the budget functions as outlined before. The key budget functions, are target setting, forecasting, and resource allocation. So instead of having one compromised number for all these functions, you would in a first step separate targets from forecasts and from resource allocation. With that, you would have three different numbers serving different purposes. A key tool is forecasting or rolling forecast, which supports the ongoing planning and forecasts are used for the purpose of better decision-making and not as a target or application for resources. Forecast should reflect the best estimates with as little details as possible and be again, decoupled from targe...

Contact Keith Terreri: https://www.linkedin.com/in/keith-terreri-595b4bb/NEC Corporation of America: https://www.linkedin.com/company/nec-corporation-of-america https://www.twitter.com/nec FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPTAdam: (00:05)Welcome to episode 130 of Count Me In, IMA's podcast about all things affecting the accounting and finance world. This is your host, Adam Larson and today I'm pleased to introduce our featured guest speaker, Keith Terreri. Keith is the Chief Financial Officer and Senior Vice President of corporate operations, and IT for NEC Corporation of America. In his double role of CFO and CIO, he has developed a wealth of skill and knowledge necessary for effectively overseeing and managing accounting, FP&A, supply chain management, corporate operations and IT. In this episode, Keith describes the convergence of these two pivotal roles and explains the value each team brings to the business regardless of the organizational size. Let's head over the conversation to learn more.Mitch: (00:57)So our listeners are well aware of the changing role of the CFO. It's something we talk about all the time, you know, the need for a strategic foresight decision-making business partnering is something that's very popular. A lot of this is due to the evolution of technology, but you have a unique role. You have a double role of CFO and CIO at NEC. So what does this convergence of the two roles really look like to you on a daily basis?Keith: (01:22)Thanks, Mitchell. That's actually a great question because it's certainly different than when I was just CFO. The convergence of these two roles, it's actually been a very eyeopening experience to say the least. So the convergence has come with some great synergies, and also a significant amount of risk management. From a synergy perspective, obviously our back-office functions of OTC, which is order to cash, PTP, which is procure to pay and record to report, or RTR have been greatly enhanced, right? So finance corporate operations, and IT are all one team now and communicating regularly. The interaction in visibility for both groups has been fantastic as one team and under this scenario, we work on a daily basis to make sure not only our ERP is running smoothly, but also our network and data is secure. For a risk management perspective, obviously cybersecurity has become a major part of all IT team's responsibilities over the last several years and now it's a part of daily operations for companies. However, in this dual role it's been becoming increasingly clear to me that cyber security is everybody's responsibility, not just the IT department. As everybody knows, ransomware attacks are very prevalent right now making cybersecurity the utmost importance on a daily basis. So we constantly monitor our network for security purposes and many companies are moving towards a zero trust approach from a cyber security information perspective and so that is also part of our daily discussion. Customers are also getting much more stringent, you know, on their contract requirements, requiring information security clauses in the contracts with us, so that we have to be very cognizant of that as well. So now we are very involved as we continue to make contracts with our customers. So, I mean, all in all it makes for quite a different daily routine than just finance.Mitch: (03:32)Well, as far as finance goes, you know, I know much of your career prior to this role, prior to taking on CIO also was specifically in the finance function. So talk a little bit about how those experiences and those skills helped you prepare for the responsibilities you just discussed and what you've taken on involving IT.Keith: (03:51)That's another great question, Mitchell, thanks. I mean, primarily, it was really my training in risk management that has helped me the most. Always concerning myself with the downside of either operational or finance issues has been very helpful throughout my career and now with that, the added responsibility for IT, thinking about the downside, or any type of issues from an IT perspective, has really been a good mix for me. Also having had experience in cyber liability insurance probably since it started, or when it was first offered, I've almost kind of grown up with that. So as a CFO, financial risk management is very important and frankly cyber risk has become, definitely become a financial risk to everybody these days based on all of the cyber activity that's out there in the world. I mean don't forget, I mean risk management is not only for services you provide to your customers, but also for your own network and your data. So you've got two things you have to look at from a risk management perspective and we do this frankly, on a regular basis. So when you think about all the, you know, traditional finance experience, most of the times the CFOs are responsible for risk management insurance. I think that the cyber liability insurance, which is changing rapidly as we've seen in the last month or so is very important for both the CFO and the IT guys to understand completely. I particularly, if you have a chief information security officer, that employee needs to be very familiar with how the policy works, if you should ever have a claim.Mitch: (05:34)Now, oftentimes because of the risk management perspective, you were just talking about how that falls on the CFO's shoulders. They're usually responsible for forging a relationship with the CIO because of the cyber security, cyber liability, things like that and the joint relationship is responsible for handing the priorities of finance and IT individually. We spoke a little bit your role prior to this call and, you know, you serve both. So how do you really communicate the needs and further support the relationships of two different teams as one person?Keith: (06:08)So this was definitely something I wanted to focus on when I took over IT three years ago. And I really think, you know, as a CFO and being able to look holistically at the financial statements and also preparing our annual budgets and forecasts, it becomes slightly easier to allocate resources for cybersecurity and for IT initiatives. There's no longer in my mind, right? In the way we have things set up a competition for funds or resources between finance corporate operations and IT. So it really makes for a more collaborative approach on resources so that when we prepare our annual budgets, we go together as a team and we've already kind of vetted out, you know, the priority of funds and funding for resources. The entire team discusses and ranks the needs so that we're all in sync. You know, one of those slogans I adopted early on with the finance team was “we're all IT now”, and that has really helped kind of change the mentality and increase the collaboration between the two groups. I mean, under this type of scenario, there's no longer any finger pointing and everybody accepts accountability. You know, in a traditional scenario where you have the two teams separated, in a traditional scenario, there separation of these two teams can create friction, which is not necessary in today's ultra fast paced business world. The entire leadership team of finance and IT, and corporate operations meets once or twice a week. They think that's an update from my perspective, but really it's for them to interact and update each other so that we're all on the same page and so no one person can say, “I didn't know IT was doing this”, or “I wasn't aware of finance wanted to do that”. And this communication has brought foresight and respect,...

Contact Denise Dettingmeijer: https://www.linkedin.com/in/denisedettingmeijer/FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPTAdam: (00:00) Welcome back to Count Me In, IMA's podcast about all things affecting the accounting and finance world. This is your host, Adam Larson, and I'm here to kick off our conversation for episode 129 of our series. Today you will hear from Denise Dettingmeijer, Chief Financial Officer of Randstad North America. Denise is a dedicated financial leader who is passionate about bringing more women into the field. While she talks with Mitch, she explains what needs to be done and how it can be measured to ensure women are integral part of the future of finance. Let's head over to hear her perspective on the topic now.Mitch: (00:44)Thank you Denise, for joining us. Our conversation today is about bringing more women into the field of finance. I know you said this is something you're passionate about. So to begin, can you please share with our listeners kind of your perspective on the current environment, the gender gap in the industry, and really what interests you about this topic?Denise: (01:02)Yeah, I absolutely can, and thank you for having me here today. You know, starting with the current environment, we can't not speak about the pandemic, so hope everybody's safe and sound. What that has taught us as an industry, as finance professionals that flexibility, the speed, the creativity, just, you know, crisis management was always one of our skill-sets, but nothing at this level before. And putting that into an environment like a pandemic from a past where those skills were always extraordinary for us, I think just exploded, you know, what we can do for the company. When you lay that over onto the gender gap, there is definitely a gender gap as a result of COVID as well in the industry, not just in the industry, in the world with working women. So focusing down on the finance thing, the one word I have is women are definitely underrepresented in the finance worlds. Statistically there's 38% of finance majors are female and 18% of CFOs are female. Those are for fortune 500 companies., it gets lower when you include all companies, 12%. So when you start out at 38, we could argue that's too low and what can we do about the education and having people that look like me and others, you know, getting involved in the finance stream of universities then accountants and other professionals, but regardless, even at the 38%, if we could get to 38%, that would be quite an accomplishment. We're hovering much, much lower than that. So no matter how you do the math, truthfully, we're underrepresented in an industry and in a function that actually suits traditional female traits and so many career pathing for so many people.Mitch: (02:45)Now you are at the forefront of the industry as CFO and through your experience as a finance leader, you talked a little bit about the numbers, but what else have you noticed as far as progress? How have you seen the industry really progress with this topic?Denise: (02:59)Yeah, so, the industry, as I think that beginning entry level has progressed. So you see a lot of women in finance when you do finance in general. So whether it's accounting, accounts receivable, payroll, FP&A, you know, the whole scope of finance, you see more and more women at the entry level. Truthfully, I haven't personally seen it progress in the upper ranks since I've been working, it's still a unique position. There's not a lot of women when you go to CFO events, when you look at panels, it's just an underrepresented group in this area. So while the industry has progressed toward, more soft skills, being able to connect people, it used to be a really kind of a technical function. It's progressed to understanding bigger pictures and teamwork and traits that perhaps are generally more seen as female traits, the female representation and finance hasn't progressed along with that. I think there's things we can do about it, of course. But until now it's really, it's still unique for me to see another female CFO. And every time we join a meeting, we're still counting. We're like, okay, there's 20 of us, there's three, that's more than 10% great. Right. We're still counting and when we can stop counting, I think we've made a difference.Mitch: (04:23)It's very interesting and you know, very, as you just said, minimal change from the target, the goal that you're really looking for. So obviously there's room for improvement. When it comes to, you know, closing this gap, how do you recommend the industry improves? What is, what is still lacking? What needs to be done next?Denise: (04:42)Yeah. So, there's hundreds of things. I think for me, the, the big ones are, it's hard to make this change, right? And I know people talk about unconscious bias and you know, you hire people who look like you or who have the same experiences. We've got to crack that and crack it for so many reasons, not just women, but race and all of the other, you know, gender issues or diversity issues that are happening. We no longer have to, you know, 15 years ago we had to put forth the business case of why diversity matters, how come companies perform better with a diverse leadership team. Those, we don't even talk about that anymore. Everybody understands that agrees with it, it's scientific, it's proven. So I think it starts now with the humans and the fact that we can all learn and admit we have unconscious biases, here at Randstad, we switched that and go, you have to have conscious inclusion. So there's a difference between saying, yeah I'm unconsciously biased, I can't help it everybody has it. To I will consciously include, and in this case women and finance, I will consciously include them at the table. If women have trends when they enter a room of more than 10 people with, you know, eight chairs at the table and five along the wall, they'll sit against the wall cause just don't want to take up a chair. Ask them to take a seat at the table, literally. We tend to when asked what we want to do with our careers, we say, well I want to add value and be happy. Men tend to say, I want to be CFO. And so if you can not let women get away with that answer and instead of, you know, ripping off the bandaid, you can say, well, whose job do you want next? What job do you want to do, you know really help us come to the conversation in a way that will be heard because we don't answer questions the same way, we don't communicate the same way, we don't act the same way. So I really think if you change your unconscious bias, become aware of it, but flip it to that conscious inclusion and really make an effort, it'll make a huge difference. The other thing I have to call out is the elephant in the room and it's money. You gotta pay us the same. And right now for me, you can do all those other things, but if it comes down to a life-changing moment, elderly care, child care, a spouse at home, a partner at home, and somebody makes less money than somebody else, generally speaking, the one who makes less money stays home. And unless you start paying women the same, they're going to stay home. So to me, start with the pay, you're not getting a bargain if your women in your department are getting paid less now they will leave. You will have a brain drain, pay them the same and then consciously include in the conversations in the career progression, speak the way we need to be heard and help us speak so you can hear us.Mitch: (07:34)You know, I really love that conscious inclusion and we have done a lot as far as unconscious bias and we just released a report on, you know, diversity, equity and inclusion. As you said, all of these, everybody's aware of them at this point, you know, everything going ...