The Startup Defense

Startups can’t afford to be wrong on an 18-month cycle—and neither can the services or the acquisition system that supports them. Callye and Noah deconstruct the so-called “valley of death,” separating structural reality from self-inflicted pain and inexperience. They dig into how narrative, incentives, and tighter demo cycles can compress risk and get real capability into the hands of operators faster.TopicsWhy the “valley of death” is often more mirage than destiny—and where it’s brutally realHow information, narrative, and media shape behavior in defense and critical industriesKform’s evolution from a third-generation machine shop to a commercialization partner for defense startupsCompetition-based drone events and what they reveal about the future of acquisitionUsing rapid demos and shared customers to shrink timelines from years to weeksTakeawaysThe valley of death isn’t an inescapable trap; it’s a series of predictable transitions that punish inexperience, poor capital efficiency, and lack of customer focus.In defense, you may only get one meaningful shot every 12–18 months, so choices around SBIRs, sponsors, and end users are not “free”—they are existential.Tight feedback loops—design, build, demo, adjust—run on weeks instead of years can derisk programs, align incentives, and help both startups and the government “be slightly wrong and get less wrong” much faster.Timestamped Highlights[00:00] - Why startups (and DoD) can’t afford 18-month mistakes[02:34] - Rethinking the “valley of death” and reclaiming agency[05:24] - A contrarian view: the valley as mirage and self-inflicted pain[09:02] - “SBIR is not free money” and the cost of choosing the wrong sponsor[11:54] - Defense tech jobs, new attention, and why this moment matters[17:33] - Kform’s roots: from Navy machinist and Circle K to Kform[23:55] - Building Kform’s playbook: the “team behind your team”[26:29] - Steam Studios and competition-based drones as a new acquisition pattern[31:20] - Tight demo loops: slightly wrong every two weeks vs. catastrophically wrong in 18 months[36:57] - Policy shifts, acquisition reform, and closing reflectionsResources & LinksKform — https://kform.comCrossing the Valley (podcast) — https://www.frontdoordefense.com/podcastFront Door Defense Jobs — https://www.frontdoordefense.comSteam Studios — https://www.steamstudio.ioU.S. National Drone Association — https://www.usnda.org“We can’t afford to be wrong in 18 months. We can afford to be slightly wrong—and getting less wrong—every two weeks.”To partner with Kform, explore collaboration, or bring a product from prototype to field faster, visit kform.com and reach out to the team. If this episode resonates, share it with a founder, operator, or investor who cares about actually fielding capability—not just talking about it.

Will Hurd – Chief Strategy Officer, Chaos Industries - former CIA officer, Member of Congress, and cybersecurity founderChaos Industries is quietly shipping modern radar and autonomy tools into some of the hardest environments on earth—from Ukraine to the Middle East—while most of the market is still talking.Will Hurd joins Callye to break down why giving warfighters time is the real advantage, why “volume beats exquisiteness,” and how Chaos went heads-down to build radar that sees farther, sets up faster, and costs a fraction of legacy systems.TopicsWhy autonomy and sensing at the edge are reshaping domain awareness and air superiorityHow Chaos Industries approached building a new class of expeditionary radar (Vanquish) instead of iterating on 1970s conceptsThe deliberate choice to stay quiet, build first, and market later—and why over-promising kills credibility in defenseOperating in Ukraine and other high-end environments as a proving ground for hardware, networking, and EW resilienceWhy partnerships (e.g., Forterra) and culture-matched sprint cycles are critical for turning point tech into real capabilityTakeawaysTime is the real currency on the battlefield. Moving from seconds of warning to minutes fundamentally changes what warfighters can do with the systems they already have.Defense hype without working hardware is a dead end. In a world where radars designed in the 1970s are still in service, the bar is not slogans—it’s reliable, repeatable performance in the field.Partnerships and speed win. Companies that can integrate, iterate on two-week cycles, and plug into existing platforms and contracts will outpace those trying to boil the ocean alone.Timestamped Highlights[00:00] - Why Will joined Chaos and the autonomy problem[02:12] - Systems vs point solutions on the battlefield[03:19] - Chaos’ stealth phase and real-world deployments[05:17] - Updating 1970s radar for modern threats[07:44] - Build first, talk later: Chaos’ GTM philosophy[12:22] - Speed, OODA loops, and 10x building over marketing[13:36] - Hype vs reality when your widget is tested[15:05] - Partnering with Forterra on autonomous ground vehicles[19:30] - Outcome over widgets and culture-fit partnerships[20:37] - Looking ahead to maritime autonomy and closing remarksResources & LinksChaos Industries — https://www.chaosinc.comForterra — https://www.forterra.com/ConnectWill Hurd — https://www.linkedin.com/in/wbhurd/Callye Keen — https://www.linkedin.com/in/callyekeen/“In today’s battlefield, the winner isn’t the biggest—it’s the fastest. If you can’t upgrade at the edge and iterate in weeks instead of years, you’re already behind.”To explore how Kform helps defense innovators move from idea to fielded capability, visit kform.com. If this episode was useful, share it with a builder, operator, or investor who needs to hear a no-nonsense view of defense autonomy and sensing.

Bringing modern compute, edge AI, and hard-tech investing into orbitGuest: Edward Ge – Founder & CEO, AetherMost spacecraft still fly computers comparable to late-1990s desktops while our phones race ahead with Moore’s Law. In this episode, Edward Ge explains how Aethero is building radiation-tolerant, long-life computing for space and enabling distributed AI at the edge in orbit. We also dig into why hard tech rarely “goes to zero,” and how space + defense will shape the next generation of infrastructure and talent.TopicsWhy space missions still run on decades-old processors and what must changeBuilding reliable, radiation-tolerant compute and distributed systems for multi-year space missionsHard-tech fundraising, human capital, and defense as the launch customer for orbital computeTakeawaysModern compute in space is constrained by reliability and radiation, not just performance and power.Hard-tech investments compound via infrastructure and talent, even when individual startups fail.Real orbital data centers will likely emerge from defense-driven, distributed edge compute in space.Timestamped Highlights[00:00] - Ed’s background, Athero intro, why space, autonomy, and AI matter now[00:38] - Astrobiology, Mars biosignatures, and why life may exist in our backyard[02:16] - Moore’s Law on Earth vs. space; Perseverance’s 1990s-class flight computer[04:04] - Reliability over 5–15 years and why “it cannot break” dominates design[06:18] - Raising capital for space; why top funds are pivoting into hard tech[08:36] - Hard tech, human capital, and the halo effect of companies like SpaceX[15:03] - New satellites, defense missions, and Athero’s distributed computing in orbit[17:40] - “Only telecom and defense” as the core space business models today[20:44] - Dropout advice, conviction, and being direct with investors and partnersResources & LinksAethero — https://www.aethero.comKform — https://kform.comConnectGuest: Edward Ge — https://www.linkedin.com/in/edwardge9/Host: Callye Keen — https://www.linkedin.com/in/callyekeen/“In space, your computer can’t just reboot. It has to not break for 5, 10, 15 years.”Support The Startup Defense by sharing this episode with a founder, engineer, or investor in space, autonomy, or defense tech—and visit kform.com to learn how we help hard-tech teams go from prototype to production

Callye Keen and Bret Boyd discuss the challenges and opportunities in the manufacturing sector, particularly in relation to supply chain management and defense manufacturing. They explore the importance of connecting small manufacturers, the role of technology and AI in procurement, and the need for a robust ecosystem to support manufacturing growth. Boyd shares insights from his experience in the military and how it informs his approach to building Sustainment, a company focused on improving supplier discovery and connectivity in the manufacturing space. The discussion also touches on compliance challenges and the future of defense manufacturing in the U.S.TakeawaysPeople and mission excite us.Building teams and solving problems is essential.Manufacturing is a long tail of small businesses.Finding U.S. manufacturers can be frustratingly hard.The military's logistics and sustainment groups face supplier challenges.AI can help identify manufacturing suppliers.Ecosystem development is crucial for manufacturing growth.Compliance costs can be prohibitive for small manufacturers.National strength is tied to industrial strength.A manufacturing ready reserve could enhance defense capabilities.Chapters00:00 Connecting People and Purpose04:27 The Challenge of Supply Chain Management10:04 Navigating Manufacturing Complexities15:43 Building Manufacturing Ecosystems21:35 The Cost of Compliance in Defense Manufacturing26:46 Bridging the Gap Between Innovation and Tradition

Andy Markoff joins Callye to unpack why he left uniformed service to build Smack Technologies—and how his team is pursuing “decision dominance”: fusing multi‑modal data and using reinforcement learning to turn analysis into actions faster than adversaries. Andy explains where Smack sits in the modern “kill web,” why teaming beats rip‑and‑replace, and the biggest mistake he sees new defense founders make (hint: losing touch with the end user). The conversation closes with an honest look at culture—how to let scientists and engineers coexist under a shared mission without blowing deadlines or technical rigor. Key TakeawaysMission → Company: Andy’s service in Iraq and Afghanistan—and the pain of running the “kill chain in Office 365”—pushed him to build technology outside the wire and bring it back in.Where Smack fits: Not a data‑integration shop. Smack focuses on the model/reasoning layer (reinforcement learning) and the application layer that surfaces decisions—designed to plug into others’ data layers and UI/briefing tools (think Palantir for integration, OneBrief for CONOPS visualization).Teaming > Turf: Modern defense delivery splits across four components: data integration, model/reasoning, application, and an operating layer. No single vendor wins everywhere—learn to team or walk away.Don’t forget the user: The pendulum swung from “only talk to end users” to “only sell to program offices/Congress.” You must work all three—user, program office, and appropriators—or you’ll ship tech that gets funded but never used.Iterate in the field: Replace “perfect‑then‑procure” with rapid fielding, frequent touchpoints, and continuous deployment—even for HW/SW systems supporting AI at the edge.Comms in contested environments: A future fight breaks our assumption of fat pipes. Andy highlights secure 5G efforts (e.g., Cape) and calls for autonomous communications relay as an under‑served, solvable gap.Power is a feature: Edge systems die without expeditionary power—solve it early, not after the ruck weighs 200 lbs in batteries.Culture that ships: Balance “what’s right” (scientists minimizing tech debt) with “ship it” (engineers hitting milestones). Mission alignment is the glue.Chapters & Timestamps00:00 — Cold open & intro00:23 — What Andy’s passionate about now: service, purpose, and the national‑defense mission01:14 — Marine Corps to Marine Raider: finding purpose, then deciding to build from the outside03:22 — 2016 Iraq: running the kill chain in Office 365 & the moment of founder clarity05:56 — From PowerPoint and whiteboards to decision dominance07:41 — The “four components” of defense decision tech & where Smack sits10:46 — Teaming with Palantir/Anduril/OneBrief vs. competing with them12:23 — What new entrants get wrong: forgetting end users (or only courting PMOs)14:38 — Rapid fielding mindset: iterate with real users, not just SBIR slides16:22 — Hardware as the house where AI lives; why iteration matters18:18 — Startups to watch & the comms relay gap; secure 5G in the mix20:32 — Moving data ≈ asking better questions; legacy links won’t carry modern fusion22:19 — Power at the edge & unsexy problems that win fights24:37 — Golden nugget: build cultures where scientists and engineers both thriveAbout Andy MarkoffAndrew brings more than a decade of leadership in the U.S. Marine Corps, including roles as a Marine Special Operations Officer, Fires Instructor at MAWTS-1, and Special Operations Forces J3 during the Battle of Mosul. His experience spans four combat deployments in Iraq and Afghanistan, as well as leading operations and strategy at Palantir. Andrew holds a BA in Political Science from Princeton University. 

Callye Keen interviews Robert Fehlen about his work with Mission Cultivate and Dark Corner Solutions. They discuss the importance of community and networking in the defense innovation space, the challenges of duplication of efforts within military projects, and the need for a centralized platform to connect industry capabilities with military needs. Robert shares insights on the significance of teaming in defense contracts and the future plans for Mission Cultivate, which aims to create a more effective ecosystem for defense innovation.TakeawaysRobert Fehlen's passion is rooted in his family's military background.Dark Corner Solutions focuses on uncovering overlooked stories in defense.Networking is crucial for success in the defense industry.Duplication of efforts in military projects is a significant issue.Mission Cultivate aims to connect industry capabilities with military needs.Building a community is essential for fostering innovation.Teaming is the only way to succeed in defense contracts.The defense marketplace is complex and requires strategic navigation.Quality over quantity is a key principle for Mission Cultivate.Human connections are vital in the defense contracting space.About Robert FehlenWebsite: https://www.missioncultivate.com/

Andre Wegner believes the biggest choke-point in defense manufacturing isn’t hardware—it’s the months (or years) lost inside data-starved black boxes. He and host Callye Keen unpack how capturing every shred of context across design, engineering, and shop-floor workflows—then feeding it to AI—can turn a decade-long program into a months-long sprint. If you care about rebuilding U.S. industrial agility, hit play.Topics We CoverWhy “idea → part” speed is now a national-security metricThe cost of invisible data: 16k+ parts “too expensive to reverse engineer”Creating a new categoryKey TakeawaysTransparency beats paperwork. Drawings alone can’t scale or automate production; live context must flow from concept through machining.AI makes the unsexy sexy. Large language models can surface risks and bottlenecks instantly—if the data exhaust is captured.Own the ability to build. You don’t truly own IP when the know-how to make it sits outside your walls.Chapters00:00 | Welcome & guest intro02:58 | The Authentise journey—from secure print streaming to DoD prime 05:12 | Obsessing over months-not-years product cycles 10:18 | The “blind-men & elephant” parable of fragmented manufacturing data17:21 | Why the golden-thread metaphor fails in a multidimensional world 23:40 | Naming a new category: Continuous Engineering Operations 26:17 | $700 pocket sculptures & reframing value 31:58 | Cheap drones, culture change, and AI-enabled transparency 34:48 | Closing thoughts & future collaborationResources & LinksAuthentise — https://authentise.comKform — https://kform.comConnectAndre: LinkedIn / X / AuthentiseCallye: LinkedIn / X / Kform“You don’t really own your IP if you can’t make it.” — Callye KeenEnjoyed the episode? Follow The StartupDefense and share it with a fellow builder. Powered by Kform—defense tech transformation from concept to production.

Callye Keen and Steve Simone discuss the evolving landscape of defense technology, particularly in countering unmanned aerial systems (UAS). Steve shares his passion for building businesses in this sector, the challenges of developing effective counter-drone solutions, and the importance of private capital in fostering innovation. They explore the dynamics of the defense market, the acquisition processes, and the need for startups to anticipate future requirements rather than react to current demands.Chapters00:00 Introduction to Defense Tech and Passion for Building01:38 The Shift to Counter UAS and Drone Warfare03:58 Challenges in Developing Kinetic Solutions06:17 Navigating the Defense Startup Landscape09:27 Funding and Innovation in Defense Tech11:10 Overcoming Challenges in Defense Startups15:09 Market Changes and Acquisition Processes18:16 Future Opportunities in Defense TechAbout Steve SimoniSteve is a Navy veteran and a nuclear engineer who worked on instrumentation and control systems for Navy nuclear reactors. He previously was CEO and co-founder of Bbot, a software and robotics restaurant technology startup which was acquired by DoorDash. He’s also held sales, product and engineering roles in marketing technology. LinksWebsite: https://www.allencontrolsystems.com/LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevensimoni/

Callye Keen interviews Noam Oz, a former director of innovation operations at Naval X, discussing his extensive background in defense and technology innovation. They explore the challenges of navigating the defense acquisition landscape, the importance of iterative development, and the need for effective communication between operators and solution providers. Noam emphasizes the significance of understanding risk and readiness in defense technology, as well as the potential of new acquisition pathways like SBIRs and OTAs. The discussion also touches on future trends in defense technology, particularly the need for modularity and adaptability in solutions.TakeawaysNoam Oz has a rich background in defense and technology innovation.90% of success in defense innovation is about managing personalities.Iterative development and user feedback are crucial for effective solutions.Embedding operators in the innovation process enhances relevance.New acquisition pathways like CSOs and OTAs are changing the landscape.Understanding risk and readiness is essential for defense tech.The operator community often feels neglected in the acquisition process.Modularity in defense technology can enhance operational effectiveness.Startups should focus on how their products can be easily deployed in the field.There is a growing opportunity for additive manufacturing in defense.About Noam OzDefense Acquisition Expert & Former Director for Innovation Operations at NavalX, Office of Naval ResearchNoam Oz is the former Director for Innovation Operations at NavalX, the innovation arm of the U.S. Navy and Marine Corps, where he led efforts to quickly equip Sailors and Marines with needed capabilities and coordinated efforts with innovation cells across the armed services. In addition to his corporate experience at Lockheed Martin and Noblis, Mr. Oz has dedicated more than 16 years as a DoD civilian serving in the Office of the Under Secretary of Defense for Acquisition & Sustainment, Office of the Chief of Naval Operations, Office of the Assistant Secretary of the Navy (Research, Development & Acquisition), and Naval Sea Systems Command.

Callye Keen and Chelsea Roberts (Meggitt) discuss the evolving landscape of the defense industry, particularly for small businesses. Chelsea shares insights on recent changes in government contracting, the importance of rapid prototyping, and the need for small businesses to adapt to new acquisition processes. They also explore the role of Collaborative Compositions in supporting small businesses and the common pitfalls to avoid in government contracting. Chapters00:00 Introduction to the Defense Industry and Small Business Opportunities02:00 Recent Changes in the Defense Acquisition Landscape07:20 The Importance of Rapid Prototyping and User Feedback12:45 Navigating Traditional vs. Non-Traditional Acquisition Methods20:23 Chelsea Meggitt's Background and Collaborative Compositions28:46 The Need for Education and Resources in GovCon34:25 Advice for Innovators and Startups in the Defense SectorAbout ChelseaChelsea is the founder and CEO of Collaborative Compositions, a consulting firm dedicated to guiding small and mid-sized businesses through the complexities of federal contracting. With over a decade of experience in the industry, Chelsea specializes in helping clients launch and expand their government contracting ventures, ensuring they have the strategies and systems in place to secure and manage contracts effectively.LinksLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/chelseadroberts/Website: https://collaborativecompositions.com/