This is a Design Thinking 101 episode in the Ask Like a Designer series. Ask Like a Designer helps people explore creating services and solutions by thinking and solving like a designer. You’ll learn about design thinking, service design, learning design, leading and building high-performing teams, and ways to achieve better outcomes. This episode is based on this article: ALD014 // 5 Ways Nobody Cares About You and How They Make You a Better Designer. Read the article and others like it on Fluid Hive’s Ask Like a Designer. What did you think of this episode? Please send your questions, suggestions, and guest ideas to Dawan and the Fluid Hive team. Cheers ~ Dawan Design Thinking 101 Podcast HostPresident, Fluid Hive Show Highlights [00:51] Your tiny narcissist. [00:55] The five ways nobody cares about you. [01:52] Nobody cares what you create. [02:13] Nobody cares about the problems you solve. [02:35] Nobody cares what you know. [02:56] Nobody cares about your experience. [03:19] Nobody cares if you win. [03:51] Fluid Hive’s free thinking tool has all of the questions you need to answer to keep your inner narcissist in check.  The Design Thinking 101 Podcast’s Ask Like a Designer series Ask Like a Designer — DT101 E61 Design, and One Question to Rule Them All // ALD 002 — DT101 E63 There Are No Problems Worth Solving — Only Questions Worth Asking // ALD 003 — DT101 E65 Your Good-Life OS: Designing a System for Living Well and Peak Performance // ALD 004 — DT101 E67 The Swiss-Army Lives of How-Might-We Questions // ALD 005 — DT 101 E69  Designing Facilitation: A System for Creating and Leading Exceptional Events // ALD 006 — DT101 E73  The Innovation Saboteur’s Handbook // ALD 007 – DT101 E77  Three Little Words for Better (Business) Relationships // ALD 008 — DT101 E79  The 30-Minute Solution Matrix: How to Think and Solve Under Pressure // ALD 009 — DT101 E87  Protect Your Solutions with Transformation Stories: Part 1 — Crafting Well // ALD 010 — DT101 E89  Protect Your Solutions with Transformation Stories: Part 2 — Telling Well // ALD 011 — DT101 E92  Want Better Outcomes? Find Better Problems. // ALD 012 — DT101 E99  Designing a Learning System for the Good Life // ALD 013 — DT101 E108

Julie Dirksen is the author of the books Design for How People Learn and Talk to the Elephant: Design Learning for Behavior Change. She is a learning strategy consultant with a focus on incorporating behavioral science into learning interventions. Julie was my guest for episode 42 of the show. In this episode, we talk about her latest book, ways to motivate learners and workshop participants, designing learning experiences for skill development, and more. Listen to learn about:>> Julie’s latest book, Talk to the Elephant: Design Learning for Behavior Change >> Behavior change challenges >> The biggest challenge when creating virtual learning experiences >> Motivating and engaging learners >> AI in education Our Guest Julie Dirksen is the author of the books Design For How People Learn and Talk to the Elephant: Design Learning for Behavior Change. She is a learning strategy consultant with a focus on incorporating behavioral science into learning interventions. Her MS degree is in Instructional Systems Technology from Indiana University. She’s been an adjunct faculty member at the Minneapolis College of Art and Design and is a Learning Guild Guildmaster. She is happiest when she gets to learn something new, and you can find her at usablelearning.com. Show Highlights[02:02] Julie gives a quick summary of her first book and how Talk to the Elephant is its natural sequel. [02:42] The new book tackles the challenges in actually changing behavior. [04:26] On learning experiences. [05:21] Julie is starting to organize a third book, which will be on skill acquisition. [05:34] The evolution of behavioral design. [06:21] The COVID-19 pandemic is the biggest behavior change experiment in the history of the world. [07:06] The book’s audience are those in the learning and development field — people who design learning experiences. [08:00] The Change Ladder. [08:54] Julie offers one case study she uses in the book to demonstrate the challenges around behavior change. [14:17] The importance of communicating and working with the people you serve when it comes to changing behaviors. [14:58] Julie tells a story illustrating the importance of talking to and understanding the people you serve and their needs. [17:57] It’s important for people to participate in their own behavioral design. [20:15] Creating the conditions for learners to motivate themselves. [21:22] Making things as easy as possible for someone to do. [22:42] A Miro Moment. [25:27] Creating learning experiences that engage learners. [26:14] The biggest challenge in designing virtual workshops. [27:55] Why Julie is interested in Virtual Reality. [29:34] The top two challenges Julie sees in almost every behavior change. [34:55] Immediate impact and immediate rewards help learners stay motivated. [37:21] Helping learners see what they will be able to do with this new skill or new knowledge. [42:53] Julie shows appreciation for how video games onboard players as a great example of guiding people along the learning curve. [45:11] Designing learning experiences to make your learner feel smart and capable as they acquire new skills and knowledge. [48:42] Julie talks about research on self-directed learning by Catherine Lombardozzi. [49:20] Julie and Catherine will be doing a webinar on the key behaviors seen in good self-directed learners. [52:05] Julie ponders how systems thinking and design fits into behavior change. [52:54] Dawan and Julie talk about AI and its role in education. LinksJulie on LinkedIn Usable Learning Designing for how people learn Book RecommendationsDesign for How People Learn, by Julie Dirksen Talk to the Elephant: Design Learning for Behavior Change, by Julie Dirksen Thinking, Fast and Slow, by Daniel Kahneman Nudge: The Final Edition, by Richard Thaler and Cass Sunstein How Change Happens, by Cass Sunstein Misbelief: What Makes Rational People Believe Irrational Things, by Dan Ariely Predictably Irrational, Revised and Expanded Edition: The Hidden Forces That Shape Our Decisions, by Dan Ariely DT 101 EpisodesLearning Design + Designing for How People Learn with Julie Dirksen — DT101 E42 Learning Design with Yianna Vovides — DT101 E58 Adding System Awareness to System Design to Your Innovation Stack with Julie Guinn — DT101 E43

David Lemus is an independent design strategist with engineering roots working with organizations to empower teams to be customer obsessed and have a culture of iterative learning. He has designed and facilitated dozens of design thinking workshops across Fortune 500 companies, non-profit and government organizations. David is also currently an adjunct professor at the University of Portland's Pamplin School of Business and leads the Portland Design Thinking Meetup community. Listen to learn about: >> Team facilitation >> Human centered-design: mindsets over methods >> [Re]Building human connection  Our Guest David Lemus is an independent design strategist with engineering roots working with organizations to empower teams to be customer obsessed and have a culture of iterative learning. He has designed and facilitated dozens of design thinking workshops across Fortune 500 companies, non-profit and government organizations. David was in-house at Capital One on the Design Thinking and Strategy team. That team focused on changing the way the enterprise worked by empowering all employees with the mindsets and tools of design thinking. His team scaled practitioner and senior leadership programs throughout the risk-averse organization. Prior to Capital One, David was a senior consultant at Peer Insight, a service design and innovation firm where he led service design projects with Fortune 500 and non-profit clients. David is also currently an adjunct professor at the University of Portland's Pamplin School of Business and leads the Portland Design Thinking Meetup community. David has a B.S. in Mechanical Engineering from the University of Maryland. Show Highlights [02:10] How David went from engineer to design strategist. [02:59] The two experiences as an engineer that led David into design thinking. [04:46] Experimenting to find the right career path. [06:54] The challenges of experimentation and risk-taking in the workplace. [09:07] Teaching human-centered design and creativity at Capital One. [11:16] David’s focus is on mindsets, not methods, when it comes to teaching design thinking to others. [14:08] Helping non-designers to understand and use human-centered design in their work.[17:04] A Miro Moment. [18:53] Breaking down silos. [20:29] The lack of skilled facilitators for collaboration at work. [21:20] Finding ways to make meetings productive and fun. [22:40] Do you really need a meeting? [24:47] Designing meetings. [26:09] Practicing active listening during meetings. [27:26] Cultivating the right energy in the team and creating the right environment in the room for the work you’re doing. [27:26] Designing the right activities for your meeting in order to achieve the meeting’s goals. [30:46] David and Dawan talk about why people’s design thinking expectations are often not met in reality. [33:23] What David is working on now: Connection. [38:37] Where to learn more about David’s work. LinksDavid on LinkedIn lemus&co David’s website Other Design Thinking 101 Episodes You Might Like Public Sector Design + Outcome Chains + Prototyping for Impact with Boris Divjak — DT101 E26 Designing for Healthcare vs Sick Care + The Emergency Design Collective — DT101 E52 The Experimentation Field Book with Natalie Foley — DT101 E123

Learn about teaching and applying design thinking in higher education with Liz Chen, Design Thinking Lead at Innovate Carolina and co-author of The Experimentation Field Book. Topics include Innovate Carolina, The Experimentation Field Book, design thinking and public health, design thinking in strategic planning, and more.

Dr. Lesley-Ann Noel, Afro-Trinidadian design educator, discusses her approach to design thinking with a focus on equity and social justice. They explore the significance of design studies and the power of individuals to make change, as well as the concept of dreaming together to create gradual change.

Victor Udoewa, who works at the CDC, discusses radical participatory design, civic design, relationships in complex systems, and the fallacy of problem solving. He highlights the importance of involving communities in design, recognizing their skills, and incorporating the 'peopleness' of organizations into the process.

Pinar Guvenc is a partner at the award-winning global design studio SOUR, where she leads design innovation strategy. Pinar is also a member of the faculty at Parsons School of Design, and she serves on the Board of Directors at Open Style Lab, a National Design Award-winning nonprofit organization initiated at MIT, with the purpose of making style accessible to people with disabilities. Today on the show, we talk about inclusive design, and making collaboration and co-creation meaningful. Listen to learn about:>> What it really means to collaborate >> Inclusive design and designing for inclusivity >> Teaching the next generation of designers Our GuestPinar Guvenc is a Partner at SOUR — an award-winning global design studio with the mission to address social and urban problems — where she leads design innovation strategy. Prior to SOUR, Pinar co-founded various ventures where she helped set up and grow them through incubation, achieving international recognition and funding from innovation centers and accelerators such as Plug and Play and Climate KIC. Pinar is a member of the faculty at Parsons School of Design, MS in Strategic Design and Management program, author and instructor of the "Inclusive Design" course at School of Visual Arts, and the author and facilitator of the workshop series "Strategic Collaborations" at Pratt Center for Community Development. She serves on the Board of Directors at Open Style Lab, a National Design Award-winning nonprofit organization initiated at MIT, with the purpose of making style accessible to people with disabilities. Pinar is a frequent public speaker and host of the podcast "What's Wrong With": a series of discussions with progress makers and experts to diagnose problems in industries, ideate solutions, and raise awareness among the general public. Show Highlights[02:25] Pinar’s design career began in industrial engineering and finance. [02:57] Becoming an “accidental entrepreneur” and discovering design along the way. [04:10] Pinar’s frustration with the word “collaboration.” [05:43] Designing collaborations. [06:50] What is collaboration? [07:07] Start with the people, then move to process. [10:17] Processes help us stay focused when things are rushed. [11:02] Recognizing our biases and sharing power when collaborating. [11:37] Fully integrating design into an organization. [12:44] Storytelling is part of the design process. [14:51] Our work leadership style needs a fundamental change. [15:37] Adults need to create and learn, just like children. [16:16] A Miro Moment. [18:06] Knowing what you don’t know is an asset. [20:49] How SOUR works inclusivity into the design team and project. [22:12] Pinar gives a shout-out to David Dylan Thomas (DT101 Ep 112). [22:19] Thomas’ Red Team-Blue Team exercise. [22:41] SOUR’s Co-Creation Panel. [23:51] “Design spies!” and just doing the work of co-creation. [24:55] How Pinar brings inclusivity into her teaching. [25:07] Guest lecturers and keeping it real. [27:11] Inclusivity begins during the research stage. [27:52] Generative AI is great for showing us our prejudices and biases. [31:13] The importance of being better, active listeners. [32:28] As designers, we always need to be mindful of our responsibility for what we’re putting out in the world. LinksPinar on LinkedIn Pinar on The New School Parsons SOUR Open Style Lab What’s Wrong With podcast A SOUR Perspective on design Bringing Design Closer: Understanding Architecture's role in designing inclusive spaces Book RecommendationsDesign for Cognitive Bias, by David Dylan Thomas Other Design Thinking 101 Episodes You Might Like Cognitive Bias + Ethics + Dreaming the Future of Design with David Dylan Thomas — DT101 E112 Designing Your Team + Teams in Design Education + Coaching Design Teams with Mary Sherwin and David Sherwin — DT101 E49 Designing Facilitation: A System for Creating and Leading Exceptional Events // ALD 006 — DT101 E73

Justin is an internationally-renowned design leader, author and speaker from Chicago. You'll often find him at AIGA's speaking events, he’s been interviewed in Forbes magazine and Medium's "Forge" publication, and he writes articles for Aquent, CEO World Magazine, and A List Apart. He speaks internationally on culture and design, and today on the show, we talk about values, aligned design, nurturing teams, and design leadership. Listen to learn about:>> Discovering and leveraging our core values >> Why humility is the most important trait for a designer>> Building and nurturing teams >> Justin’s latest book, In Fulfillment: The Designer’s Journey Our Guest Justin is an internationally renowned design leader, author, and speaker from Chicago. You'll find him often engaging with the AIGA's speaking events, interviewed in Forbes magazine and Medium's "Forge" publication, and penning articles for Aquent, CEO World Magazine, and A List Apart. He speaks internationally on culture and design, including keynotes at the UXPA International conference, Midwest UX, and St. Louis Design Week. Justin is also the writer of the celebrated book "Creative Culture," a former VP of Design at bswift (a CVS Health company), and the founder of design leadership consultancy Anomali. Show Highlights[02:11] Justin’s design “Eureka!” moment in high school. [03:12] The Art Institute of Chicago and teaching himself how to code. [05:24] The most important part of being a designer. [05:50] From Me to We. [07:10] Justin talks about the writing of his latest book, In Fulfillment. [08:02] Transitioning from hands-on fulfillment toward mentorship and leadership. [09:46] Identifying the core set of values that lead us to feeling fulfilled. [10:29] Humility and design. [11:39] How Justin helps people find their core set of values. [12:03] Using the Make Meaningful Work platform. [12:55] What drives us to do what we want to be doing? [14:04] Knowing our core values helps create a healthier work environment. [14:55] Our core values are portable, no matter where we may work throughout our career and in any field. [15:50] Why humility is the most important trait for a designer. [17:25] Our energy pool is a finite resource. [19:06] How an organization’s website implicitly shines a light on what they value. [23:11] The best teams are diverse, inclusive teams. [23:52] Dawan talks about empathy theater and taking the next steps beyond empathy. [26:15] A Miro Moment. [27:44] Justin talks about nurturing teams. [28:15] Allowing for time to pause and connect within the workspace. [29:06] Dawan talks about the benefits of not being 100% occupied 100% of the time. [30:43] Supporting “real life” in our work environments. [33:26] We need to adjust how we work and our expectations about the “right” way to work. [34:57] Justin offers thoughts on how to make the hiring and onboarding process better. [40:05] How to design and nurture a better work culture. [42:22] Justine talks about some of the work being done by his company, Anomali by Design.[46:43] Justin offers some last words of advice for all of us about taking time to pause with intent. LinksJustin on Twitter Justin on LinkedIn Justin on Medium Justin on Instagram Anomali By Design Anomali on Twitter Practical Design Leadership podcast The Essential Fusion of Culture & Design with Justin Dauer Make Meaningful Work   Book Recommendations In Fulfillment: The Designer’s Journey, by Justin Dauer Cultivating a Creative Culture, by Justin Dauer   Other Design Thinking 101 Episodes You Might Like Employee Experience by Design: How to Create an Effective EX for Competitive Advantage with Belinda Gannaway — DT101 E75 Designing Your Team + Teams in Design Education + Coaching Design Teams with Mary Sherwin and David Sherwin — DT101 E49 Healthcare Design Teams + Wellness + ScienceXDesign with Chris McCarthy — DT101 E24

Scott Shigeoka is an internationally-recognized curiosity expert, speaker, and the author of SEEK: How Curiosity Can Transform Your Life and Change the World. He is known for translating research into strategies that promote wellbeing and connected relationships around the globe, including at the University of California Berkeley's Greater Good Science Center and through his groundbreaking courses at the University of Texas at Austin. Today on the show, we’ll talk about Scott’s book and the power of curiosity. Listen to learn about >> Why curiosity matters >> Shallow vs. deep curiosity >> Scott’s book, SEEK >> Ways to cultivate and practice using your curiosity >> The power of “I don’t know” and “Tell me more” Our Guest Scott Shigeoka is an internationally-recognized curiosity expert, speaker, and the author of SEEK: How Curiosity Can Transform Your Life and Change the World. He is known for translating research into strategies that promote positive well-being and connected relationships around the globe, including at the UC Berkeley’s Greater Good Science Center and through his groundbreaking courses at the University of Texas at Austin. Scott implements his curiosity practices in the public sector, Fortune 500 companies, Hollywood, media organizations, education institutions, and small businesses. Show Highlights [01:59] How Scott’s love of stories and storytelling brought him to where he is today.  [02:50] Majoring in journalism and psychology, and working in Iceland. [04:20] Designing and storytelling at IDEO and in Hollywood. [05:00] Scott’s response to the 2016 election and the polarization of America was a 13-month road trip around the country. [07:29] What is curiosity? [08:20] Shallow vs. deep curiosity. [11:22] How Scott approached talking with people at Trump political rallies. [13:44] The big lesson Scott learned during the road trip. [15:42] Curiosity is listening. [18:01] People want to feel that their stories, their lives, matter. [18:52] Scott talks about predatory curiosity. [21:36] What readers will find in Scott’s book, SEEK. [22:16] Curiosity can help us bridge our differences. [23:15] SEEK offers practical exercises and advice on how to exercise your curiosity. [25:07] The world needs more curiosity. [25:40] The four core “muscles” of deep curiosity. [31:20] Working with the three cardinal directions of curiosity. [34:40] A Miro Moment. [36:45] Scott offers up one way we can all practice more curiosity. [40:33] Challenge your assumptions. [43:42] Practice intellectual humility. Don’t be afraid to admit you don’t know the answer. [44:36] Effective leaders practice curiosity. [45:29] Use “Tell me more…” [48:15] Creating boundaries when it comes to practicing curiosity. [52:08] Embracing discomfort. [53:00] Curiosity is about understanding.[55:12] Where to find out more about Scott and his work. Links Scott on Twitter Scott on LinkedIn Scott on Instagram Seek the Book Perspectives in Design Scott Shigeoka Rural Assembly: Drawing Resilience: Scott Shigeoka Hachette Interview with Scott Audium: Scott Shigeoka – Bridging Divides Book Recommendations Seek: How Curiosity Can Transform Your Life and Change the World, by Scott Shigeoka The Karma of Success: Spiritual Strategies to Free Your Inner Genius, by Liz Tran Other Design Thinking 101 Episodes You Might Like Humble Design Leadership + Design Agency and Experience Design Evolution with Aleksandra Melnikova — DT101 E33 Three Little Words for Better (Business) Relationships // ALD 008 — Ep79 User Research + Asking Better Questions with Michele Ronsen — DT101 E88

Natalie Foley has over 20 years of experience leading teams in designing and launching new products, programs, and strategies across the private, public, and not-for-profit sectors. Recently, she joined Opportunity at Work, where she builds, tests, and launches new services to help rewire the labor market for the 71 million workers in America whose skills were acquired through alternative routes instead of a four-year degree. Today on the show, we catch up with Natalie, who was one of our first guests on the podcast, and talk about The Experimentation Field Book, which she co-authored with Jeanne Liedtka, Elizabeth Chen, and David Kester. Listen to Learn About >> Experimentation and iterative learning  >> The Experimentation Field Book >> Why experiment? The benefits of experimentation >> Opportunity@Work’s mission Our Guest Natalie has 20+ years of experience leading teams in designing & launching new products, programs and strategies across the private, public & not-for-profit sectors. Recently, she has joined Opportunity@Work, where she builds, tests & launches new services for employers and employer networks to help rewire the labor market for the 71M workers in America who are STARs* (Skilled Through Alternative Routes, instead of a four-year degree). At Peer Insight, she served as CEO & led partnerships that contributed to dozens of new business ventures with clients like Nike, Kimberly-Clark, AARP, Canon, the Good Samaritan Society and ArcBest, several of which have become multi-million dollar revenue streams. Natalie began her career at PricewaterhouseCoopers and IBM, where she supported clients such as Allstate, the World Bank, and the U.S. Agency for International Development (USAID) Afghanistan program in technology & strategy initiatives. She is the co-author of a forthcoming book (available soon for pre-order), The Experimentation Field Book: A Step-by-Step Project Guide. Show Highlights [03:02] Natalie offers gratitude for the DT101 podcast and the learning community it has fostered. [03:42] Natalie catches us up since her 2018 podcast episode. [04:03] Moving on from Peer Insight. [05:05] Taking a role at Opportunity@Work. [05:26] More than 50% of the American workforce are STARs. [08:12] Running experiments in one’s personal and professional life. [09:13] How design thinking frees the learner. [10:25] Why Natalie wrote The Experimentation Field Book. [12:49] Natalie offers thoughts on moving out of one’s comfort zone and trying something new. [16:59] The Experimentation Field Book will be available at booksellers November 24th. [17:12] How Natalie met Jeanne Liedtka. [17:50] Jeanne approached Natalie about Peer Insight’s “secret sauce.” [18:31] Design thinking’s superpower. [18:48] What’s missing from the design thinking methodology and how the book fills that gap. [20:36] The book gives the reader step-by-step ways to run their own experiments. [21:40] The baggage that can come along with the word experimentation. [24:16] The first step is to frame a testable idea. [28:23] Build like you’re right, and test like you’re wrong. [31:20] A Miro Moment. [33:32] Opportunity@Work is creating services to help broaden the hiring mindset from only equating degrees with skillsets to looking at other ways of determining someone’s ability to do the job. [34:17] Four things intriguing Natalie about her current nonprofit work. [34:48] We’re designing for a world that doesn’t exist yet. [36:11] Looking at how non-profits receive funding. [37:12] The ambiguity and attachment struggle in a non-profit world where people are very passionate about their mission. [37:49] Dealing with the feelings associated with the word experimentation. [38:44] The Experimentation Field Book is made for everyone, not just designers. [40:56] The process in the book helps people to not become too attached to one idea. [43:24] The book empowers anyone to put together and run an experiment on themselves or within their organization. Links Natalie on LinkedIn Natalie on Twitter Opportunity at Work Using Design Thinking to Empower the ‘Human’ in HR 6 steps to knowing how to know | Natalie Foley | TEDxCharlottesville Design Thinking: Four Steps for Innovation Peer Insight Book Recommendation The Experimentation Field Book: A Step-by-Step Project Guide, by Jeanne Liedtka, Elizabeth Chen, Natalie Foley, and David Kester Design Thinking 101 Episodes You Might Like Designing for the Greater Good, Strategy + Design Thinking, and Measuring Design Thinking with Jeanne Liedtka — DT101 E1 Leading a Design Thinking Consultancy, Betting Small to Win Big, and Driving Business Growth with Design Thinking with Natalie Foley — DT101 E5 Experiencing Design: The Innovator’s Journey with Karen Hold — DT101 E71