Why Should We Care About the Indo-Pacific?

Pulitzer Prize-winning investigative journalist Ian Urbina returns to “Why Should We Care About the Indo-Pacific” to preview Season 2 of his acclaimed Outlaw Ocean podcast, exposing the hidden world of human rights and environmental abuses on the high seas—from brutal labor conditions on distant-water fishing vessels to coercive processing centers in China, India, and beyond.Urbina, founder and director of the Outlaw Ocean Project, dives into the maritime underworld and examines what’s changed—and what remains unchanged—since his first appearance on the pod. The conversation unfolds in two parts:1. China’s Distant-Water Fleet & At-Sea Abuses- Fleet scale and state ties: China’s distant-water fleet dwarfs all others, with estimates ranging from 2,700 to 17,000 vessels; Urbina’s team calculated about 6,500 ships, one-third of which have direct state involvement.- Illegal fishing and geopolitical power: Chinese longliners and squid jiggers routinely engage in illegal, unreported, and unregulated (IUU) fishing—invading marine protected areas, overfishing, and crossing exclusive economic zones—thereby gaining economic advantage and shaping “facts on the water” to support territorial claims. - Life on board squid jiggers: These industrial vessels use hundreds of bright lights and metal arms to jig for squid. Crews of 30–50 often endure two- to three-year contracts at sea with no shore leave, cramped and unsanitary conditions, malnutrition, and no Wi-Fi. Laborers—initially foreign but increasingly rural Chinese—face debt bondage, violence, passport confiscation, and forced labor. 2. On-Land Processing & Global Supply Chains- Scope expansion: Season 2 follows seafood from ship to shore, uncovering forced labor in processing plants across China, India, and along the North Korean border. - Chinese processing centers: Utilizing open-source intelligence and encrypted Chinese platforms, Urbina’s team documented state-orchestrated labor transfers of Uyghurs from Xinjiang to coastal seafood factories—facilities that supply major global buyers, including U.S. government cafeterias. Workers face locked compounds, surveillance, and coercion akin to modern slavery. - North Korean laborers: Thousands of North Korean women are trafficked into Chinese factories under government vetting. Held in locked dorms and subjected to widespread sexual abuse and forced overtime, these women are trapped by debts owed to smugglers and extortion from border officials. - Indian shrimp processing: A whistleblower’s 50,000-page dossier exposed debt bondage, physical confinement, and antibiotic-tainted shrimp at processing plants in India. As Western buyers migrated from Thailand to India, the same labor abuses reemerged, threatening food safety and ethical sourcing.By weaving narrative storytelling with hard data and firsthand testimony, this episode underscores the urgent need for transparent supply chains and international enforcement to protect vulnerable workers and marine ecosystems. Visit TheOutlawOcean.com for updates, subscribe to the newsletter, and tune into Season 2 for deep-dive investigations that track seafood—and human exploitation—from ocean depths to dinner tables.

In this episode, hosts Ray Powell and Jim Carouso interview Professor Gordon Flake, CEO of the Perth USAsia Centre, about South Korea's political transformation following six months of unprecedented turmoil.The discussion centers on South Korea's remarkable democratic resilience after former President Yoon Suk-yeol's shocking martial law declaration in December 2024, which triggered his impeachment and removal from office, and Lee Jae-myeong's subsequent election victory. Flake emphasizes that despite the chaos—including four different acting presidents—South Korea's institutions held firm, demonstrating the strength of its democracy.The new president faces immediate pressure from Trump administration tariffs affecting Korean exports, with the economy shrinking in the first quarter and auto sales to the US down significantly. Flake warns against conflating trade negotiations with alliance burden-sharing discussions.Lee Jae-myeong has already engaged with President Trump and Japanese Prime Minister Ishiba, signaling continuity in South Korea's internationalist approach despite his progressive background. The episode explores Korea's potential participation in regional frameworks like Quad-Plus and the Comprehensive and Progressive Trans-Pacific Partnership.Tensions are escalating in the Yellow Sea's Provisional Measures Zone, where China has installed aquaculture facilities without coordination with Seoul. This represents a new kinetic challenge similar to South China Sea disputes.Flake highlights opportunities for US-Korea naval cooperation, noting Korean shipbuilders like Hanwha Ocean's acquisition of Philadelphia shipyard and increased stakes in Australian defense contractor Austal.Flake predicts Lee's first 100 days will prioritize economic growth over progressive social policies due to external pressures. His attendance at the G7 meeting represents crucial engagement with like-minded democracies amid regional uncertainty (this episode was recorded before President Lee elected not to attend the G7).The episode provides essential insights into how South Korea's democratic institutions weathered the crisis, while positioning the country as a consequential middle power navigating complex US-China competition and regional security challenges.Follow the podcast on X, @IndoPacPodcast, LinkedIn, or BlueSkyFollow Ray Powell on X, @GordianKnotRay, or LinkedInFollow Jim Carouso on LinkedInProduced by Ian Ellis-Jones and IEJ Media, on X, @ianellisjonesSponsored by BowerGroupAsia, a strategic advisory firm that specializes in the Indo-Pacific

In this episode, hosts Ray Powell and Jim Carouso explore the critical concept of techno-nationalism with expert Alex Capri, author of "Techno-Nationalism: How It's Reshaping Trade, Geopolitics and Society."Techno-nationalism represents the intersection of technology, national security, and economic power in the Fourth Industrial Revolution. Capri explains how nation-states are leveraging 12 key power-multiplier technologies--including semiconductors, artificial intelligence, quantum science, hypersonics, biotech, and advanced manufacturing--to maintain competitive advantages and protect national interests.The discussion reveals how China's strategic approach to technology development caught the West off-guard. While Western companies focused on trade liberalization and efficiency, China implemented long-term techno-nationalist policies, including preemptive decoupling in critical sectors like telecommunications and banking. The Great Firewall, established in the mid-1990s, was an early indicator of China's protective stance toward strategic technologies.Capri outlines the six core elements of modern techno-nationalism:1️⃣ Weaponization of supply chains through export controls and investment restrictions2️⃣ Strategic decoupling from potential adversaries3️⃣ Offshoring reversal via reshoring and friend-shoring initiatives4️⃣ Innovation mercantilism through government industrial policy5️⃣ Tech diplomacy for strategic alliance building6️⃣ Hybrid Cold War dynamics amid ongoing commercial activityThe Huawei 5G ban exemplifies techno-nationalist concerns about critical infrastructure security. The company's global telecommunications footprint, built through massive state support, raised red flags about potential surveillance capabilities. Similarly, TikTok represents the dual-use nature of modern technology—commercially popular but potentially strategically valuable for data collection and analysis.Despite China's advances, the US maintains advantages in university systems, defense technology, and innovation ecosystems. However, success requires strategic partnerships with allies, particularly in semiconductor manufacturing and critical mineral supply chains. The conversation highlights concerns about policy continuity across political administrations and the importance of sustained investment in STEM education and public-private partnerships.Techno-nationalism isn't just about US-China competition—it's a global phenomenon affecting all nation-states as they navigate security, economic stability, and technological sovereignty in an interconnected world.Follow our podcast on X, @IndoPacPodcast, LinkedIn or BlueSkyFollow Ray Powell on X (@GordianKnotRay) or LinkedInFollow Jim Carouso on LinkedInSponsored by BowerGroupAsia, a strategic advisory firm that specializes in the Indo-Pacific

Hosts Ray Powell and Jim Carouso interview Congressman Don Bacon (R-NE), a retired Air Force Brigadier General with 29 years of military service. Rep. Bacon serves on the House Armed Services Committee and brings unique insights from both military leadership and congressional oversight.Congressman Bacon is concerned that America is spending just 2.9% of GDP on defense—the lowest level since 1940, before Pearl Harbor. He argues for increasing defense spending to 4% of GDP, approximately $150 billion more annually, to address critical modernization needs including nuclear triad upgrades, fifth and sixth-generation fighters, attack submarines, and improved military quality of life.The discussion highlights America's innovation deficit, particularly in drone technology and electronic warfare, where Ukrainian forces have outpaced U.S. capabilities. Bacon emphasizes how Ukraine's recent destruction of 41 Russian strategic bombers using $5,000 drones demonstrates the power of cost-effective innovation over expensive legacy systems.Bacon addresses growing tensions within the Republican Party between traditional alliance supporters and isolationist factions, drawing parallels to 1930s isolationism. He warns that current diplomatic approaches risk alienating key allies, citing business challenges with Canada and European partners. The congressman advocates for maintaining America's role as "leader of the free world" while acknowledging the need for burden-sharing.With China potentially spending $700 billion on defense (despite claiming $170 billion), Bacon emphasizes the urgency of military modernization focused on long-range precision weapons, air and missile defense, and drone swarm technology. He stresses that deterring China requires immediate weapons deliveries to Taiwan, noting billions in delayed military aid.Two years of continuing resolutions have hampered military readiness and prevented new program starts. Bacon explains the bipartisan nature of the Armed Services Committee while criticizing broader congressional dysfunction that prioritizes partisan politics over national security.Bacon highlights critical nuclear deterrent gaps, including 50-year-old Minuteman III ICBMs that cannot be extended, aging B-2 bombers with outdated stealth technology, and Ohio-class submarines reaching end-of-life. With Strategic Air Command (SAC) Headquarters located at Offutt Air Force Base in his district, he argues these systems are essential for countering both China and Russia.Despite being a deficit hawk concerned about the $36 trillion national debt, Bacon argues that defense spending increases are necessary while addressing mandatory spending on Social Security and Medicare, which comprises 73% of federal spending.This episode provides essential insights into America's defense readiness challenges, alliance management complexities, and the urgent need for strategic clarity in confronting great power competition in the Indo-Pacific region.👉 Follow Rep. Bacon on X, @RepDonBacon👉 Follow our pod on X, @IndoPacPodcast, and LinkedIn👉 Sponsored by BowerGroupAsia

In this insightful discussion, Dr. Ely Ratner, former U.S. Assistant Secretary of Defense for Indo-Pacific Security Affairs, advocates for a collective defense pact between the U.S., Japan, Australia, and the Philippines to counter China's military rise. He underscores the necessity of moving away from outdated alliances and embracing a unified strategy. Ratner addresses concerns about Australia's commitment and emphasizes enhanced regional cooperation. The conversation delves into practical challenges and the evolving role of the Philippines as a crucial ally in this defense framework.

In this illuminating bonus crossover episode, co-hosts Ray Powell and Jim Carouso joined the "At the Boundary" podcast from the Global and National Security Institute to discuss the critical importance of the Indo-Pacific region for global security and implications for the second term of the Trump administration.Explore key issues, including China's territorial ambitions, the strategic importance of the Indo-Pacific, and how these dynamics influence U.S. foreign policy and global stability - because China’s approach in the South China Sea is only becoming more aggressive."At the Boundary" with Jim Cardoso and Tad Schnaufer II features global and national security issues found to be insightful, intriguing, fascinating - maybe controversial - but worth talking about. The mission of the Global and National Security Institute (GSNI) is to provide actionable solutions to 21st-century security challenges for decision-makers at the local, state, national, and global levels.👉 Subscribe and watch more episodes of "At the Boundary" here, and follow GSNI on X, @USF_GNSI, LinkedIn, or YouTube👉 Follow our podcast on X, @IndoPacPodcast, LinkedIn, or BlueSky👉 Follow Ray Powell on X, @GordianKnotRay, or LinkedIn👉 Follow Jim Carouso on LinkedIn

In this episode, hosts Ray Powell and Jim Carouso welcome National Review senior political correspondent & Washington Post columnist Jim Geraghty for a wide-ranging discussion that moves from how intelligence agencies are increasingly convinced that Beijing covered up COVID-19's laboratory origins to China's heavy influence on U.S. and international institutions to America's shifting global media strategy under Donald Trump.Geraghty, who began investigating COVID's origins in March 2020, discusses recent German intelligence reports confirming an 80-95% likelihood that COVID-19 escaped from a Wuhan laboratory. He explains why this matters beyond the pandemic: "I'm trying to think of anything any government has done that is more harmful than the ultimate effect of the COVID pandemic." The conversation explores how China's cover-up cost the world "a year of our lives" and why real accountability remains elusive.The discussion examines how the WHO fumbled its COVID response, with China effectively having "veto power" over declaring a global pandemic. Geraghty argues that international health institutions may never recover the trust they lost during the pandemic, creating dangerous vulnerabilities for future health crises.From Hollywood's Transformers movies featuring heroic Chinese military scenes to NBA censorship of Hong Kong support, Geraghty details how China has successfully influenced American institutions. "We didn't bring our values to China. We're bringing their values here," he explains, describing how American organizations increasingly behave with Chinese-style authoritarianism.With 90% of Radio Free Asia's staff facing layoffs and Voice of America's future uncertain, the hosts and Geraghty discuss the strategic implications of dismantling America's global media presence. While Russia and China invest billions in propaganda, the US is "disarming" its information warfare capabilities just as authoritarian influence operations intensify.The conversation turns to how Trump's unpredictable approach affects Indo-Pacific allies, with Australia's recent elections influenced by concerns about potential US abandonment. Geraghty warns that allies watching Trump's treatment of Ukraine and Canada are asking: "That could happen to us."Geraghty describes the emerging "axis of A-holes" - Russia, China, Iran, and North Korea - working together against Western interests, citing examples like Houthis avoiding attacks on Chinese and Russian vessels in the Red Sea.This episode provides essential analysis for anyone following US-China relations, pandemic accountability, and America's evolving role in global information warfare.Follow Jim Geraghty on X, @JimGeraghty, and at the National Review or Washington PostSponsored by BowerGroupAsia

In this episode, hosts Ray Powell and Jim Carouso sit down with Cleo Paskal, a leading Indo-Pacific analyst and non-resident senior fellow at the Foundation for the Defense of Democracies, to unpack the growing threat of China’s gray zone influence in the Pacific Islands and why it matters for the United States and its allies.Paskal explains the strategic significance of the Pacific Islands, which include U.S. territories and the three Compact of Free Association states—Palau, the Marshall Islands, and the Federated States of Micronesia. These islands serve as America’s “gateway to Asia,” enabling military access and power projection across the Pacific to key allies like Japan and Taiwan. Historically, whoever controls these islands can threaten the U.S. mainland and dominate Pacific trade routes—a reality recognized since the days of President McKinley and the Spanish-American War.Cleo prefers the Filipino term “ICAD” (Illegal, Coercive, Aggressive, and Deceptive) over “gray zone” to describe China’s activities. She details how Beijing uses a “braided” approach that combines commercial investments, strategic infrastructure, and criminal enterprises. Chinese-linked businesses often promise development but end up facilitating elite capture, corruption, and even state capture, while most of the population sees little benefit. Activities include:Bribery and elite capture of local officialsStrategic port and real estate acquisitions near sensitive military sitesCriminal networks trafficking drugs, gambling, and human traffickingPolitical interference, media manipulation, and lawfare against local oppositionThe podcast explores how China’s influx of money and promises of quick infrastructure projects are hard for small island economies to resist—especially when Western aid is slow, bureaucratic, or absent. However, Cleo notes that Chinese economic engagement often benefits only a narrow elite and can leave countries worse off, both economically and environmentally. She argues that the West, especially the U.S., must offer meaningful economic alternatives and support for good governance, not just military or diplomatic engagement.Despite U.S. political polarization, Cleo notes that support for the Pacific Islands remains bipartisan, especially regarding the renewal of the Compacts of Free Association. She also stresses that Pacific Islanders view the U.S. differently from former colonial powers, seeing America as a beacon of liberty and democracy—an image China is actively trying to undermine through narrative warfare.This episode makes clear that the Pacific Islands are not just remote dots on the map but are central to U.S. security, the rules-based order, and the future of the Indo-Pacific. China’s gray zone campaign is a sophisticated, multi-layered threat that demands urgent, coordinated action from the U.S. and its allies—combining hard security, economic opportunity, and support for local agency and resilience.Follow our podcast on X, @IndoPacPodcast; or on LinkedIn or BlueSkySponsored by BowerGroupAsia

Recorded live at the 40th Space Symposium event in Colorado Springs, CO, this week's bonus crossover episode features a powerful conversation from HawkEye 360’s Salon Breakfast Panel, Illuminating Chinese Military Activity in the Indo-Pacific Region.Moderated by Kari Bingen, the panel brings together expert perspectives from co-host Ray Powell, Kimberly Lehn, Corey Johnston, and Mike Studeman to explore the shifting dynamics of the Indo-Pacific, including maritime domain awareness, grey zone operations, and the critical role of commercial space-based RF data in enhancing strategic visibility.Tune in for sharp insights into one of today’s most pressing geopolitical challenges—and how space-based capabilities are reshaping our understanding of activity in the region.For those interested in following HawkEye 360, visit www.he360.com or follow @hawkeye360 on X, LinkedIn, and YouTube.Follow our podcast on X, @IndoPacPodcast; or on LinkedIn or BlueSky at our show title, Why Should We Care About the Indo-Pacific?Follow Ray Powell on X (@GordianKnotRay) or on LinkedIn.

In this compelling episode, hosts Ray Powell and Jim Carouso interview Luke de Pulford, founder and executive director of the Inter-Parliamentary Alliance on China (IPAC), who provides an in-depth look at this growing international coalition’s mission of transcending borders and party politics to reform policy on China.IPAC is a cross-party alliance of lawmakers from democratic countries focused on reforming policy approaches toward China. Founded on June 4, 2020 (the anniversary of the Tiananmen Square protests), IPAC began with representatives from eight countries and has now expanded to include nearly 300 legislators from 40 countries worldwide.De Pulford explains that IPAC emerged from growing frustration that many governments weren't taking the necessary steps to defend the rules-based international system, their sovereignty, and human rights in response to China's abuses. The alliance aims to create conditions for collaboration across countries and political ideologies to push governments to reform their China policies.The conversation highlights several major areas of IPAC's focus:Human Rights in Xinjiang: De Pulford discusses evidence of what he and others consider genocide against Uyghurs and other ethnic minorities in northwest China, particularly through forced sterilization programs. IPAC has led calls for political action in response to these abuses.Hong Kong's Autonomy: The alliance has been active in responding to China's National Security Law in Hong Kong, which violated promises made in the Sino-British Joint Declaration. De Pulford expresses disappointment that his own country, the United Kingdom, hasn't done more to hold China accountable.Economic Coercion: The interview explores how China uses economic leverage to silence criticism, citing examples like Australia facing 220% tariffs on wine after calling for an investigation into COVID-19's origins.Transnational Repression: De Pulford shares concerning examples of China's efforts to control dissidents abroad, including the recent forced repatriation of Uyghurs from Thailand.The alliance has seen many of its members progress into influential government positions, including Marco Rubio becoming U.S. Secretary of State and other members taking defense and foreign ministry positions across Europe and Asia. This "maturing of the network" has increased IPAC's ability to influence policy.De Pulford argues that addressing human rights issues in China requires economic solutions, as "the human rights questions in China are fundamentally economic questions." He points to successes like Volkswagen and BASF withdrawing from Xinjiang under pressure from IPAC politicians.The interview concludes with De Pulford discussing the personal costs of his advocacy, including cyber attacks, impersonation attempts, and being named as a "co-conspirator" in Jimmy Lai's trial in Hong Kong. Despite these challenges, he remains committed to IPAC's mission of uniting lawmakers to counter China's influence and protect democratic values.👉 For those interested in following IPAC's work, De Pulford recommends visiting ipac.global or following @IPACglobal on X.🔥 Sponsored by BowerGroupAsia, a strategic advisory firm that specializes in the Indo-Pacific.