

Real Organic Podcast
Real Organic Project
Farmers interview scientists, activists, politicians, and authors engaged in protecting USDA organic food against an active corporate takeover. Real Organic Project released its add-on food label in stores and markets in 2021, and is focused on introducing eaters across the United States to our movement and its allies. In this podcast series, you'll meet the best organic and regenerative farmers around, as well as journalists, climate experts, policy makers and chefs (Dr. Vandana Shiva, Paul Hawken, Leah Penniman, Bill Mckibben, Alice Waters, Dan Barber, and Eliot Coleman - to name a few!) who support our mission and have lent their voices and insights to explaining the importance of keeping corporate cheaters out of the real food movement. As bad players aim to redefine what food is for the sake of their own profits, we believe there is too much at stake for both human and planetary health today and into the future. Feed the soil, not the plant!!
Episodes
Mentioned books

Sep 7, 2025 • 37min
Larry Jacobs: Lawsuits + Labeling In USDA Organic
#239: California organic farmer and Del Cabo cooperative founder Larry Jacobs returns to discuss why organic farming must remain firmly rooted in soil and not bend to allow hydroponics. Larry’s proven commitment to integrity comes through via his role in a lawsuit against the USDA over the inclusion of hydroponics under the organic seal, as well as his efforts to educate his staff about the issues facing the organic movement, beyond their daily work.https://realorganicproject.org/larry-jacobs-lawsuit-labeling-organic-239The Real Organic Podcast is hosted by Dave Chapman and Linley Dixon, engineered by Brandon StCyr, and edited and produced by Jenny Prince.The Real Organic Project is a farmer-led movement working towards certifying 1,000 farms across the United States this year. Our add-on food label distinguishes soil-grown fruits and vegetables from hydroponically-raised produce, and pasture-raised meat, milk, and eggs from products harvested from animals in horrific confinement (CAFOs - confined animal feeding operations).To find a Real Organic farm near you, please visit:https://www.realorganicproject.org/directoryWe believe that the organic standards, with their focus on soil health, biodiversity, and animal welfare were written as they should be, but that the current lack of enforcement of those standards is jeopardizing the ability for small farms who adhere to the law to stay in business. The lack of enforcement is also jeopardizing the overall health of the customers who support the organic movement; customers who are not getting what they pay for at market but still paying a premium price. And the lack of enforcement is jeopardizing the very cycles (water, air, nutrients) that Earth relies upon to provide us all with a place to live, by pushing extractive, chemical agriculture to the forefront.If you like what you hear and are feeling inspired, we would love for you to join our movement by becoming one of our 1,000 Real Friends:https://www.realorganicproject.org/real-organic-friends/To read our weekly newsletter (which might just be the most forwarded newsletter on the internet!) and get firsthand news about what's happening with organic food, farming and policy, please subscribe here:https://www.realorganicproject.org/email/

Aug 31, 2025 • 1h 12min
Cameron Molberg: Real Organic Poultry At Scale
Cameron Molberg, CEO of Greener Pastures Chicken and a key voice in organic standards, discusses the complexities of scaling pasture-raised chicken production. He reveals the stark contrasts between genuine organic practices and USDA loopholes that enable misleading labels. From navigating market challenges to ensuring animal welfare, he shares insights on sustainable farming. The conversation also addresses crucial issues like avian influenza, funding cuts, and the evolution of organic certifications, stressing the importance of transparency in the poultry industry.

Aug 24, 2025 • 46min
Dick Schwartz: IFS and the Middle Way
#237: In this follow-up conversation, Dick Schwartz, founder of Internal Family Systems therapy, speaks with Dave about how IFS applies far beyond the therapy room. Together, they explore the “middle way” in activism - finding courage and clarity without being consumed by rage or fear. From conflicts in the Middle East to economic inequality and corporate power, Schwartz explains how healing our inner parts can ripple outward to transform politics, community, and the planet.https://realorganicproject.org/dick-schwartz-ifs-middle-way-237The Real Organic Podcast is hosted by Dave Chapman and Linley Dixon, engineered by Brandon StCyr, and edited and produced by Jenny Prince.The Real Organic Project is a farmer-led movement working towards certifying 1,000 farms across the United States this year. Our add-on food label distinguishes soil-grown fruits and vegetables from hydroponically-raised produce, and pasture-raised meat, milk, and eggs from products harvested from animals in horrific confinement (CAFOs - confined animal feeding operations).To find a Real Organic farm near you, please visit:https://www.realorganicproject.org/directoryWe believe that the organic standards, with their focus on soil health, biodiversity, and animal welfare were written as they should be, but that the current lack of enforcement of those standards is jeopardizing the ability for small farms who adhere to the law to stay in business. The lack of enforcement is also jeopardizing the overall health of the customers who support the organic movement; customers who are not getting what they pay for at market but still paying a premium price. And the lack of enforcement is jeopardizing the very cycles (water, air, nutrients) that Earth relies upon to provide us all with a place to live, by pushing extractive, chemical agriculture to the forefront.If you like what you hear and are feeling inspired, we would love for you to join our movement by becoming one of our 1,000 Real Friends:https://www.realorganicproject.org/real-organic-friends/To read our weekly newsletter (which might just be the most forwarded newsletter on the internet!) and get firsthand news about what's happening with organic food, farming and policy, please subscribe here:https://www.realorganicproject.org/email/

Aug 17, 2025 • 1h 4min
Emily Oakley: Small-Scale Farming In A Changing World
#236 - Small-scale, diversified farmer Emily Oakley returns to share her evolving philosophy on farming, business, and life as she continues to align her daily work with her personal value system. From growing fertility on the farm instead of relying on purchased inputs, to adapting to climate challenges, to finding a sustainable rhythm between work and personal life, Emily offers candid reflections on what it means to grow food with purpose in a changing world.https://realorganicproject.org/emily-oakley-small-scale-farming-episode-236The Real Organic Podcast is hosted by Dave Chapman and Linley Dixon, engineered by Brandon StCyr, and edited and produced by Jenny Prince.The Real Organic Project is a farmer-led movement working towards certifying 1,000 farms across the United States this year. Our add-on food label distinguishes soil-grown fruits and vegetables from hydroponically-raised produce, and pasture-raised meat, milk, and eggs from products harvested from animals in horrific confinement (CAFOs - confined animal feeding operations).To find a Real Organic farm near you, please visit:https://www.realorganicproject.org/directoryWe believe that the organic standards, with their focus on soil health, biodiversity, and animal welfare were written as they should be, but that the current lack of enforcement of those standards is jeopardizing the ability for small farms who adhere to the law to stay in business. The lack of enforcement is also jeopardizing the overall health of the customers who support the organic movement; customers who are not getting what they pay for at market but still paying a premium price. And the lack of enforcement is jeopardizing the very cycles (water, air, nutrients) that Earth relies upon to provide us all with a place to live, by pushing extractive, chemical agriculture to the forefront.If you like what you hear and are feeling inspired, we would love for you to join our movement by becoming one of our 1,000 Real Friends:https://www.realorganicproject.org/real-organic-friends/To read our weekly newsletter (which might just be the most forwarded newsletter on the internet!) and get firsthand news about what's happening with organic food, farming and policy, please subscribe here:https://www.realorganicproject.org/email/

Aug 10, 2025 • 60min
Steve Ela: Organic Isn't Linear Thinking
Steve Ela, a seasoned organic fruit grower and former NOSB member, shares insights from his decades of experience in Colorado. He discusses the critical transition from chemical farming to a biological mindset, highlighting the vital role of soil health in sustainable agriculture. The conversation dives into the complexities of organic standards, questioning the certification of hydroponics, and the impact of food choices on health. Ela advocates for a holistic understanding of farming practices, promoting a collaborative approach to strengthen the organic movement.

Aug 3, 2025 • 2h 20min
Episode Swap: JM Fortier Interviews Dave Chapman, Round Two
#234 - In our second episode swap with the Market Gardener Podcast, JM Fortier and co-host Chris Moran sit down with Dave Chapman and trade insights on decentralization, food politics, and how organic values can thrive in today's shifting agricultural landscape. From health and climate to corporate consolidation, their reflections connect farming and activism in powerful ways.https://realorganicproject.org/episode-swap-jm-fortier-interviews-dave-chapman-round-two/The Real Organic Podcast is hosted by Dave Chapman and Linley Dixon, engineered by Brandon StCyr, and edited and produced by Jenny Prince.The Real Organic Project is a farmer-led movement working towards certifying 1,000 farms across the United States this year. Our add-on food label distinguishes soil-grown fruits and vegetables from hydroponically-raised produce, and pasture-raised meat, milk, and eggs from products harvested from animals in horrific confinement (CAFOs - confined animal feeding operations).To find a Real Organic farm near you, please visit:https://www.realorganicproject.org/directoryWe believe that the organic standards, with their focus on soil health, biodiversity, and animal welfare were written as they should be, but that the current lack of enforcement of those standards is jeopardizing the ability for small farms who adhere to the law to stay in business. The lack of enforcement is also jeopardizing the overall health of the customers who support the organic movement; customers who are not getting what they pay for at market but still paying a premium price. And the lack of enforcement is jeopardizing the very cycles (water, air, nutrients) that Earth relies upon to provide us all with a place to live, by pushing extractive, chemical agriculture to the forefront.If you like what you hear and are feeling inspired, we would love for you to join our movement by becoming one of our 1,000 Real Friends:https://www.realorganicproject.org/real-organic-friends/To read our weekly newsletter (which might just be the most forwarded newsletter on the internet!) and get firsthand news about what's happening with organic food, farming and policy, please subscribe here:https://www.realorganicproject.org/email/

Jul 27, 2025 • 59min
Nicole Dehne: When Certification Meets Conviction
#233 - Nicole Dehne, director of Vermont Organic Farmers, shares what it means to uphold real integrity in a shifting organic landscape. From hydroponics and organic standards to the struggles of small farms, she explains how certifiers like VOF are fighting to preserve the original values of organic - transparency, soil health, and farmer-driven accountability - in a system increasingly influenced by industrial interests.https://realorganicproject.org/nicole-dehne-conviction-meets-certification-233The Real Organic Podcast is hosted by Dave Chapman and Linley Dixon, engineered by Brandon StCyr, and edited and produced by Jenny Prince.The Real Organic Project is a farmer-led movement working towards certifying 1,000 farms across the United States this year. Our add-on food label distinguishes soil-grown fruits and vegetables from hydroponically-raised produce, and pasture-raised meat, milk, and eggs from products harvested from animals in horrific confinement (CAFOs - confined animal feeding operations).To find a Real Organic farm near you, please visit:https://www.realorganicproject.org/directoryWe believe that the organic standards, with their focus on soil health, biodiversity, and animal welfare were written as they should be, but that the current lack of enforcement of those standards is jeopardizing the ability for small farms who adhere to the law to stay in business. The lack of enforcement is also jeopardizing the overall health of the customers who support the organic movement; customers who are not getting what they pay for at market but still paying a premium price. And the lack of enforcement is jeopardizing the very cycles (water, air, nutrients) that Earth relies upon to provide us all with a place to live, by pushing extractive, chemical agriculture to the forefront.If you like what you hear and are feeling inspired, we would love for you to join our movement by becoming one of our 1,000 Real Friends:https://www.realorganicproject.org/real-organic-friends/To read our weekly newsletter (which might just be the most forwarded newsletter on the internet!) and get firsthand news about what's happening with organic food, farming and policy, please subscribe here:https://www.realorganicproject.org/email/

Jul 20, 2025 • 49min
Eli Pipkin: Mastering Whole Grain Bread
#232 - Stone Barns head baker Eli Pipkin reveals what it takes to bake whole grain bread that is alive with flavor, nutrition, and story. Rooted in the mission of chef Dan Barber's Blue Hill, Eli shares how his team mills fresh flour, bakes with intention, and builds a bread program that honors farmers and soil. This conversation digs deep into how bread - when made right - can restore health to people, ecosystems, and food culture itself.https://realorganicproject.org/eli-pipkin-mastering-whole-grain-bread-232The Real Organic Podcast is hosted by Dave Chapman and Linley Dixon, engineered by Brandon StCyr, and edited and produced by Jenny Prince.The Real Organic Project is a farmer-led movement working towards certifying 1,000 farms across the United States this year. Our add-on food label distinguishes soil-grown fruits and vegetables from hydroponically-raised produce, and pasture-raised meat, milk, and eggs from products harvested from animals in horrific confinement (CAFOs - confined animal feeding operations).To find a Real Organic farm near you, please visit:https://www.realorganicproject.org/directoryWe believe that the organic standards, with their focus on soil health, biodiversity, and animal welfare were written as they should be, but that the current lack of enforcement of those standards is jeopardizing the ability for small farms who adhere to the law to stay in business. The lack of enforcement is also jeopardizing the overall health of the customers who support the organic movement; customers who are not getting what they pay for at market but still paying a premium price. And the lack of enforcement is jeopardizing the very cycles (water, air, nutrients) that Earth relies upon to provide us all with a place to live, by pushing extractive, chemical agriculture to the forefront.If you like what you hear and are feeling inspired, we would love for you to join our movement by becoming one of our 1,000 Real Friends:https://www.realorganicproject.org/real-organic-friends/To read our weekly newsletter (which might just be the most forwarded newsletter on the internet!) and get firsthand news about what's happening with organic food, farming and policy, please subscribe here:https://www.realorganicproject.org/email/

Jul 13, 2025 • 1h 1min
The Real Story Of Whole Grain Bread with Michael Pollan + Dan Barber
#231 - In this special conversation, Michael Pollan and Dan Barber and other food system leaders explore the deep relationship between whole grain bread, human health, and agricultural resilience. From the nutrient losses caused by industrial milling to the taste and vitality of freshly milled, soil-grown grains, this episode calls attention to the most overlooked staple on our plates - and how its transformation mirrors the rise of processed food and holds the key to reclaiming health and democracy for all. Hear how real bread connects eaters to farmers, to flavor, and to the future of food.https://realorganicproject.org/real-story-whole-grain-bread-231The Real Organic Podcast is hosted by Dave Chapman and Linley Dixon, engineered by Brandon StCyr, and edited and produced by Jenny Prince.The Real Organic Project is a farmer-led movement working towards certifying 1,000 farms across the United States this year. Our add-on food label distinguishes soil-grown fruits and vegetables from hydroponically-raised produce, and pasture-raised meat, milk, and eggs from products harvested from animals in horrific confinement (CAFOs - confined animal feeding operations).To find a Real Organic farm near you, please visit:https://www.realorganicproject.org/directoryWe believe that the organic standards, with their focus on soil health, biodiversity, and animal welfare were written as they should be, but that the current lack of enforcement of those standards is jeopardizing the ability for small farms who adhere to the law to stay in business. The lack of enforcement is also jeopardizing the overall health of the customers who support the organic movement; customers who are not getting what they pay for at market but still paying a premium price. And the lack of enforcement is jeopardizing the very cycles (water, air, nutrients) that Earth relies upon to provide us all with a place to live, by pushing extractive, chemical agriculture to the forefront.If you like what you hear and are feeling inspired, we would love for you to join our movement by becoming one of our 1,000 Real Friends:https://www.realorganicproject.org/real-organic-friends/To read our weekly newsletter (which might just be the most forwarded newsletter on the internet!) and get firsthand news about what's happening with organic food, farming and policy, please subscribe here:https://www.realorganicproject.org/email/

Jul 6, 2025 • 1h 28min
Paul Hawken: Reversing Ecological Collapse
#230 - Paul Hawken returns to share his hopeful and hard-won perspective on how organic farming and climate solutions go hand-in-hand, and to reflect on the themes in his latest book Carbon. Drawing from his decades of work in food systems and regeneration, he explains why soil is one of our greatest allies and how organic farmers are leading the charge toward a livable, equitable future.https://realorganicproject.org/paul-hawken-reversing-ecological-collapse-230Paul Hawken is a climate activist, entrepreneur, and the author of nine books including Drawdown: The Most Comprehensive Plan Ever Proposed to Reverse Global Warming, Blessed Unrest: How the Largest Social Movement in History Is Restoring Grace, Justice, and Beauty to the World, Natural Capitalism: Creating the Next Industrial Revolution, 2022's best-selling Regeneration: Ending the Climate Crisis in One Generation, and his most recent publication - Carbon: The Book of Life. He serves on Real Organic Project's Advisory Board.You can follow along with his work here:https://regeneration.org/solutionsThe Real Organic Podcast is hosted by Dave Chapman and Linley Dixon, engineered by Brandon StCyr, and edited and produced by Jenny Prince.The Real Organic Project is a farmer-led movement working towards certifying 1,000 farms across the United States this year. Our add-on food label distinguishes soil-grown fruits and vegetables from hydroponically-raised produce, and pasture-raised meat, milk, and eggs from products harvested from animals in horrific confinement (CAFOs - confined animal feeding operations).To find a Real Organic farm near you, please visit:https://www.realorganicproject.org/directoryWe believe that the organic standards, with their focus on soil health, biodiversity, and animal welfare were written as they should be, but that the current lack of enforcement of those standards is jeopardizing the ability for small farms who adhere to the law to stay in business. The lack of enforcement is also jeopardizing the overall health of the customers who support the organic movement; customers who are not getting what they pay for at market but still paying a premium price. And the lack of enforcement is jeopardizing the very cycles (water, air, nutrients) that Earth relies upon to provide us all with a place to live, by pushing extractive, chemical agriculture to the forefront.If you like what you hear and are feeling inspired, we would love for you to join our movement by becoming one of our 1,000 Real Friends:https://www.realorganicproject.org/real-organic-friends/To read our weekly newsletter (which might just be the most forwarded newsletter on the internet!) and get firsthand news about what's happening with organic food, farming and policy, please subscribe here:https://www.realorganicproject.org/email/