
Night Owls
Joe Klein and John Ellis on what's happening and what happens next. Joe Klein is the author of seven books and "Sanity Clause," a Substack newsletter. John Ellis is the founder and editor of two Substack newsletters — News Items and Political News Items. The two friends have covered American politics for a combined 95 years.
Latest episodes

May 29, 2024 • 47min
Episode 24 (with epidemiologist Katelyn Jetelina)
Q. What do you do when you need a public health weather report? A. You talk to Katelyn Jetelina. That's what we did and this podcast is the result.

May 20, 2024 • 1h 7min
Episode 23 (with Cade Metz)
Our interview with New York Times tech correspondant Cade Metz, author of 'Genius Makers: The Mavericks Who Brought AI to Google, Facebook, and the World.' We talk all things AI.

May 13, 2024 • 48min
Episode 22
Joe praises Tom Friedman and ponders RFK Jr. John is all worked up about 7 EV chargers. Biology is being transformed by Google DeepMind. And more.

May 5, 2024 • 1h 7min
Episode 21
Financial expert Jim Cramer discusses China's demographic challenges, the importance of thorough research in financial news, and the impact of Chinese electric vehicles on the American market. He also explores semiconductor production for national security and shares perspectives on the election, streaming media, and historical parallels in economic approaches.

Apr 28, 2024 • 60min
Episode 20
Joe and John talk to veteran Democratic Party campaign manager Joe Trippi about why Trump might lose and what Biden has to do to beat him.

Apr 21, 2024 • 56min
Episode 19
Mark Tercek, CEO of the Nature Conservancy, discusses climate change challenges, clean energy solutions, Biden administration's environmental initiatives, and the importance of individual choices. They also explore varying perspectives on the energy industry and navigating business interests with environmental regulations.

Apr 14, 2024 • 50min
Episode 18
John and Joe consider the Arizona Supreme Court decision on abortion. Joe unpacks five potential threats to President Biden this fall. Plus, a discussion of NPR's integrity in light of a bombshell essay about its inherent bias.

Apr 8, 2024 • 59min
Episode 17
Joe and John interview Jane Perlez, former New York Times Beijing bureau chief, about her upcoming 8-part podcast series: "Face-Off, The U.S. vs. China." Once friends, now foes, the question is: what happens next?

5 snips
Apr 1, 2024 • 41min
Episode 16 (Part 2)
Author Nicole Perlroth discusses NSA surveillance, cyber espionage tactics, election security concerns, SISA challenges, cyber warfare threats, and the dangers of unchecked technology integration in critical infrastructure.

Apr 1, 2024 • 35min
Episode 16 (Part 1)
Part One of a two-part interview with Nicole Perlroth, author of "This is How They Tell Me The World Ends: The Cyber-Weapons Arms Race." It's the future coming at you.