
Unbundled Attorney Mastermind
In the Unbundled Attorney Mastermind podcast, we interview our provider attorneys and leading experts in the legal industry to identify best practices for fielding internet generated leads. We also discuss how to ethically and effectively offer unbundled legal services and other affordable options in your legal services practice.
Latest episodes

Jan 27, 2017 • 1h 17min
How to Relocate a Law Practice to a New Region: Creating Relationships with Local Courts, Bartering with Clients, and Building an Efficient Firm
Episode 24: How to Relocate a Law Practice to a New Region: Creating Relationships with Local Courts, Bartering with Clients, and Building an Efficient Firm
Before Charles Skinner became an attorney, he worked as a machinist for over 10 years. That experience taught him a lot about how to streamline processes and build an efficient business model. Today, Charles shares how he transferred this approach to his law practice by building systems that streamline workflows. We also explore how he was able to successfully relocate his law practice from El Paso to Dallas, TX. He examines some of the mistakes he made and shares valuable lessons learned along the way. He also talks about the alternative fee arrangements he has implemented with his clients, such as bartering his services for assets or property, as well as some strategies he has developed in his mediation practice.
In this episode, you’ll learn:
How to evaluate the essentials of every process and task in your practice and build systems to automate and streamline them
How to offer services to clients with limited cash by bartering for assets and property, including some examples of arrangements he has created with his clients
The value of being able to provide services in multiple areas of the law, and how this “holistic” approach can allow you to offer more billable services to each client
The importance of creating relationships with other lawyers and professionals as a great source of referrals
How Charles was able to transition his law practice from El Paso to Dallas, TX on short notice
How to ethically wind up your existing practice, including how to communicate with and wrap up relationships with those clients
How to start a practice in a new county, including strategies for creating relationships with local judges and clerks
How to maximize your air miles if you need to fly when you are moving your practice
The mediation services Charles offers, and how he effectively communicates the value and requirements of mediation to his clients
The vital importance of responding to leads immediately and then consult with them about their case right then and there
And much more...
If you enjoy this podcast, please head over to iTunes, subscribe to the show, and leave us a review. We love hearing from our listeners and look forward to reading your feedback!
For more information about Unbundled Attorney and how our Lead Generation services help grow your practice, visit: https://www.unbundledattorney.com

Jan 13, 2017 • 1h 4min
Launching a New Solo Practice: From Law School Graduate to 65 New Paying Clients in 3 Months
Episode 23: Launching a New Solo Practice: From Law School Graduate to 65 New Paying Clients in 3 Months
Andrew Burgess is 9 months out of law school and has already built a thriving and successful solo practice. This growth is largely fueled by a high volume of Unbundled Attorney leads, his effectiveness in fielding those leads, and the affordable unbundled options he offers his clients. Today, Andrew shares the strategies he has implemented to make contact with almost every lead he talks to, and he provides a specific, detailed analysis of the economics of unbundling. He makes a very strong case to attorneys that by offering unbundled options they can provide valuable services to lower income families and still make a ton of money in the process.
In this episode, you’ll learn:
The strategies Andrew has implemented that allow him to make contact with almost every lead he receives
How he handles the initial phone consultation that enables him to meet with 6 to 7 out of every 10 leads in his office
How to respond to clients when they say they don’t have a lot of money
How to represent clients on a “pay-as-you-go” basis, one step at a time
The importance of never pre-judging a lead, even if it states they have little or no money
How Andrew earns an effective hourly rate of $400 to $500 per hour with his unbundled options
An analysis of the three types of engagement letters he uses based on the types of unbundled or full representation options he is providing
How he helps keep clients that are on payment plans organized and paying on time
The best practices for offering payment plans, including how to evaluate the client’s ability to pay and scheduling payments, meetings and services accordingly
And much more...
If you enjoy this podcast, please head over to iTunes, subscribe to the show, and leave us a review. We love hearing from our listeners and look forward to reading your feedback!
For more information about Unbundled Attorney and how our Lead Generation services help grow your practice, visit: https://www.unbundledattorney.com

Jan 1, 2017 • 1h 12min
Chronicling the Journey From a New Solo Practice to a Small Law Firm: Limited Appearances, Hiring Contract Lawyers, and Scaling Up a Practice
Episode 22: Chronicling the Journey From a New Solo Practice to a Small Law Firm: Limited Appearances, Hiring Contract Lawyers, and Scaling Up a Practice
After many years working as a prosecuting attorney and then as a contract lawyer for a firm on the east coast, David Gross decided to start his own practice out of Vancouver, WA, in March of 2015. In this episode David chronicles his firm’s growth from solo practitioner and “wearing all the hats,” to the small firm he has now, along with the many challenges he has overcome along the way. He shares valuable insights on the best practices for offering limited appearances, including what pitfalls to avoid. He also gives some very practical advice on how to hire contract lawyers and scale from solo practitioner to a small law firm.
In this episode, you’ll learn:
The unbundled document services David offers and how he explains these services to his clients
The benefits and pricing considerations involved in offering limited appearances, as well as common pitfalls to avoid
How to provide a limited appearance in court on paperwork that you didn’t prepare
The value of preparing a fresh written declaration when clients have already prepared and filed their own
How to coach pro se litigants on how to represent themselves in court
How to leverage legal technology and software to streamline many tasks in your practice
The value of hiring an assistant to help with administrative tasks and document preparation
How to source and hire excellent contract lawyers, and the valuable lessons David learned from mistakes he made along the way
The most important metrics to measure and keep track of in your practice, and how they can inform your decisions
And much more...
If you enjoy this podcast, please head over to iTunes, subscribe to the show, and leave us a review. We love hearing from our listeners and look forward to reading your feedback!
For more information about Unbundled Attorney and how our Lead Generation services help grow your practice, visit: https://www.unbundledattorney.com

Dec 16, 2016 • 1h 7min
Building Blocks for Great Relationships with Clients, Mobile-Lawyering, and Strategies to Convert Estate Leads
Episode 21: Building Blocks for Great Relationships with Clients, Mobile-Lawyering, and Strategies to Convert Estate Leads
Bill Fix didn’t become a lawyer straight out of college. Instead, he worked in sales and as an investment advisor before enrolling in law school. These experiences taught him valuable lessons that later influenced how he manages his practice. Today, Bill shares many of these valuable lessons, including how to relate well and communicate effectively with clients. We discuss mobile lawyering, how to build a law practice from home, and strategies he has developed to call and convert estate leads effectively.
In this episode, you’ll learn:
The valuable lessons Bill learned from knocking on 100 doors a day, selling books door to door for two summers
Strategies for cultivating a strong mindset that can empower you to overcome challenges
The core principles of relating well to your clients, including the “community minded” approach to building relationships
How Bill was able to build a brand new law practice working from home with a newborn child
The strategies and technology of mobile lawyering including e-fax, virtual and mobile offices, and house calls
Lessons Bill learned from working as an investment advisor at Edward Jones, and how he applies those lessons when working with estate and probate clients.
The process Bill follows to call and convert estate leads into paying clients
The importance of cultivating relationships with other professionals including financial planners and insurance agents, especially for estate lawyers
And much more...
If you enjoy this podcast, please head over to iTunes, subscribe to the show, and leave us a review. We love hearing from our listeners and look forward to reading your feedback!
For more information about Unbundled Attorney and how our Lead Generation services help grow your practice, visit: https://www.unbundledattorney.com

Dec 5, 2016 • 1h 4min
Lessons from 50 years of Practicing Law: Empathetic Listening, Limited Scope, and the Disrupted Legal Market
Episode 20: Lessons from 50 years of Practicing Law: Empathetic Listening, Limited Scope, and the Disrupted Legal Market
Richard A. Shannon is an exceptional attorney with over 50 years of experience. After studying liberal arts and graduating from UT School of Law, he served as an Assistant Attorney General of Texas and Special Counsel to the Commissioner of Insurance, before starting his private practice in family law over 20 years ago. Today Richard joins us on the show to share his broad perspective on the changes that have occurred in the legal marketplace during the past 10-20 years. He explains ways that attorneys may need to adapt in order to continue to succeed. He also discusses practical strategies to improve how you serve your clients, including empathetic listening, limited scope representation, and the true meaning behind being a “counselor” at law.
In this episode, you’ll learn:
The difference between empathy and sympathy, and how expressing empathy and compassion can alleviate suffering
Richard’s interpretation of the meaning of Warren Burger’s quote, “Our profession is about healing human conflict”
Why good lawyering not only involves knowing the law, but also understanding how human relationships work and how to stay in touch with your own motivational drivers
Why Richard typically spends 20-30 minutes on each phone consultation, and how he uses this process to “qualify” each client before he meets with them
How the shrinking middle class has become a major disruptor in the legal industry, and why Richard feels offering limited scope options plays a critical role in adapting to these changes
The costs of the adversarial court system, and how the non-profit that Richard has founded is beginning to explore some fundamental changes that could mitigate some of these costs.
The cost and return on investment from internet leads and how this compares to traditional forms of advertising
The different types of limited scope options he offers his clients, and how he evaluates his clients’ competency and determines what they can afford
And much more...
Resources Mentioned:
Limited Scope Legal Services: Unbundling and the Self-Help Client by Stephanie Kimbro
Enlightened Family Justice Institute
Be sure to visit our website and register for our newly created free webinar class - How to Build a Thriving Practice Using Internet Leads and Unbundled Legal Services. This webinar condenses many of the strategies our provider attorneys have shared on the show into a concise list of fundamentals that we cover in less than an hour.
If you enjoy this podcast, please head over to iTunes, subscribe to the show and leave us a review. We love hearing from our listeners and look forward to reading your feedback!
For more information about Unbundled Attorney and how our Lead Generation services help grow your practice, visit: https://www.unbundledattorney.com

Nov 18, 2016 • 1h 1min
Starting a Solo Practice in Your Forties: Embracing Tech, Leveraging an Assistant, and Flexible Payment Plans
Episode 19: Starting a Solo Practice in Your Forties: Embracing Tech, Leveraging an Assistant, and Flexible Payment Plans
Kathy Orr has been practicing family law for over 15 years, and what makes her stand out from our other guests is that she took up the practice of law in her forties. After graduating magna cum laude, besting her younger classmates, she decided to start a solo practice right out of law school. Today, Kathy joins us and gives some practical tips for new lawyers. She also highlights the importance of having an assistant, and explains how her payment plans have helped increase monthly cash flow and serve more clients.
In this episode, you’ll learn:
The importance of keeping your overhead low when first starting a new practice
How hiring an assistant can help increase your caseload, streamline your work flows, and keep you focused on high priority tasks
How to find the balance between calling new leads and working on active cases
How delivering flat rate unbundled document services helps you to earn an effective hourly rate of $400 per hour or more
How leveraging document automation software can significantly lower the amount of time and cost to complete documents, and increase your profit margin
The questions Kathy asks her clients to discreetly evaluate their financial resources
The types of payment plans Kathy offers her clients, and how these options have helped her increase monthly cash flow and acquire more paying clients
Why offering unbundled services and affordable payment plans to pro se clients supports your local court system
And much more...
Be sure to visit our website and register for our newly created free webinar class - How to Build a Thriving Practice Using Internet Leads and Unbundled Legal Services. This webinar condenses many of the strategies our provider attorneys have shared on the show into a concise list of fundamentals that we cover in less than an hour.
If you enjoy this podcast, please head over to iTunes, subscribe to the show and leave us a review. We love hearing from our listeners and look forward to reading your feedback!
For more information about Unbundled Attorney and how our Lead Generation services help grow your practice, visit: https://www.unbundledattorney.com

Nov 4, 2016 • 1h 24min
Scaling Up Your Practice: How to Expand From Solo Practitioner to Small Law Firm in Under 3 Months
Episode 18: Scaling Up Your Practice: How to Expand From Solo Practitioner to Small Law Firm in Under 3 Months
Rhonda Telford Naidu has been an Unbundled provider attorney out of Oklahoma City, OK for about 3 months. During this time her client base has grown from 9 active clients to 51 which has required her to hire two new attorneys. She is also working on opening new offices that will allow her firm to expand to serve the entire state of Oklahoma. Today, she and her partner/office manager, Jayshree, walk us through how they have scaled their practice so quickly. They also give us a very convincing argument for why it makes both moral and financial sense for attorneys to offer payment plans for their clients.
To read the complete transcript of this interview, click here
In this episode, you’ll learn:
The main phases for scaling a law firm, and the how to execute them in the proper order
How Rhonda and Jayshree were able to leverage internet leads and acquire 41 new clients in only three months
How to source, hire, and pay contract attorneys to work in your office or open satellite offices in other cities
Some of the emotional challenges and personal barriers that come with transitioning from solo practitioner to a small firm, and how to overcome them
The value of hiring a financial manager to communicate your fees, work out payment arrangements, and handle billing issues, so you can focus solely on serving your clients
Why attorneys should make the “leap of faith” and start offering payment plans to their clients, and how the monthly cash flow can significantly impact the health of the business
Why they charge a fee for clients who meet with them in their office, and the strategies used to sell their consultation and services on the initial phone call
How to transition someone else in the firm to field the lead calls for when you are unavailable
And much more...
To read the full transcription from this interview, or to ask a question or make a comment, click here
If you enjoy this podcast, please head over to iTunes, subscribe to the show and leave us a review. We love hearing from our listeners and look forward to reading your feedback!
For more information about Unbundled Attorney and how our Lead Generation services help grow your practice, visit: https://www.unbundledattorney.com

Oct 21, 2016 • 56min
How Offering “Pay-As-You-Go” Options Can Dramatically Increase the Number of Clients You Can Profitably Serve
Episode 17: How Offering “Pay-As-You-Go” Options Can Dramatically Increase the Number of Clients You Can Profitably Serve
Barbara Rogachevsky has been an Unbundled provider attorney out of Akron, Ohio, for over two-and-a-half years now. Today Barbara shares the types of unbundled and “pay-as-you-go” options she offers that can fit into the budget of almost any client she works with. She explains how she uses the script to determine her client’s legal needs, financial budget, and how to formulate a “plan” to help them accomplish their goals. She also shares a unique “risk-free” offer for her clients to meet with her for the initial consultation that allows them to feel comfortable taking the next step; while at the same time she screens out clients that don’t value her time.
In this episode, you’ll learn:
How Barbara uses the script to identify the client’s legal needs and financial circumstances so she can create a tailored plan to help them
The impact of responding to leads via text messages, and some best practices on how to do so effectively
The types of “pay-as-you-go” options she offers, and how these options have helped her serve more clients and increase her income
The importance of having a clear fee agreement when offering unbundled and “pay-as-you-go” options, and some of the items to include
The importance of “playing the long game” and focusing on building relationships, instead of just trying to convert the client
Barbara’s “risk-free” initial in-office consultation, and how it has helped her increase her conversion rate, while screening out clients that could become time-wasters
And much more...
If you enjoy this podcast, please head over to iTunes, subscribe to the show and leave us a review. We love hearing from our listeners and look forward to reading your feedback!
For more information about Unbundled Attorney and how our Lead Generation services help grow your practice, visit: https://www.unbundledattorney.com?t=podcast

Oct 8, 2016 • 1h 11min
Proven Sales Strategies to Convert More Leads and Eliminate No-Shows
Episode 16: Proven Sales Strategies to Convert More Leads and Eliminate No-Shows
Tera Lee is a long-time unbundled provider attorney based in San Bernardino, CA who has applied best practices and strategies he learned from his background in sales to calling leads. Today Tera joins our show to discuss the importance of embracing sales as a critical component of building a successful law practice, and how to develop systems to consistently improve your sales process over time. He also shares many of the effective sales tactics he has developed, including how to completely eliminate “no-shows” from your practice without having to charge a fee to secure an appointment.
To read the complete transcript of this interview, click here
In this episode, you’ll learn:
How to employ a secretary who will respond to leads in real time when you are not available, and not lose prospective clients in the process
How Tera’s strategy allows him to completely eliminate “no-shows” from his appointment schedule, without requiring clients to pay upfront fees to secure an appointment
His four step approach for the initial phone consultation with your leads
How to overcome some of the top objections you can get from a phone consultation; such as “I need to think about it,” or “I need to talk to my wife/husband/3rd party”
How to adapt your consultation when clients are reluctant or unable to travel to your office, such as using facetime, skype, or video conferencing alternatives
The benefits of offering a flat rate retainer for certain types of cases or tasks
And much more...
If you enjoy this podcast, please head over to iTunes, subscribe to the show and leave us a review. We love hearing from our listeners and look forward to reading your feedback!
For more information about Unbundled Attorney and how our Lead Generation services help grow your practice, visit: https://www.unbundledattorney.com?t=podcast

Sep 23, 2016 • 1h 5min
Streamlining Your Enrollment Process: Electronic Payments, Online Client Intake, and Creative Unbundling
Episode 15: Streamlining Your Enrollment Process: Electronic Payments, Online Client Intake, and Creative Unbundling
Obreziah Bullard is an unbundled provider attorney out of Atlanta, GA that converts about 75% of the leads she receives into paying clients. That’s an impressive conversion rate, but even more impressive is the fact that 98% of these converted leads retained her services over the phone, without ever meeting her in person. Today, she shares how she has used technology to develop a streamlined electronic enrollment process, and walks us through some very unique and creative unbundled options that have never been divulged on the show before.
In this episode, you’ll learn:
The step-by-step process Obreziah uses to enroll leads over the phone, without ever meeting her in person
The importance of taking time to build rapport with your leads on their initial call
Why the majority of her clients elect to retain her for unbundled legal services instead of full representation
The ROI from following up with your clients once you have delivered them your unbundled services
The suite of unbundled service options she offers, including a couple new options you may not have considered before, with price points for each
How to increase your “effective hourly rate” to as high as $500 per hour by streamlining your unbundled services and charging a flat rate
How being a “mobile attorney” has impacted her firm’s success and benefited her clients
And much more...
If you enjoy this podcast, please head over to iTunes, subscribe to the show and leave us a review. We love hearing from our listeners and look forward to reading your feedback!
For more information about Unbundled Attorney and how our Lead Generation services help grow your practice, visit: https://www.unbundledattorney.com?t=podcast