The Modern Therapist's Survival Guide with Curt Widhalm and Katie Vernoy

Curt and Katie talk about treatment teaming as a therapist. We look at why you should do it, things to consider, and what it looks like in different settings.     It’s time to reimagine therapy and what it means to be a therapist. To support you as a whole person and a therapist, your hosts, Curt Widhalm and Katie Vernoy talk about how to approach the role of therapist in the modern age.In this episode we talk about: Treatment teams as the most effective way to work with clients The education gap for people related to creating treatment teams The difficulty with the model of the therapist being the primary agent for change The different roles of treatment team members, especially as a therapist The distinction between diagnosis for medical necessity and for the clinical case conceptualization Specific things related to working with psychiatrists The challenge related to perceived hierarchy within the profession The value of having a treatment team leader and how to identify who should be the leader The importance of having a lot of information and additional perspectives The scope of practice considerations and how to talk with someone who has a different scope Fragmented communication within treatment teams Community Mental Health programs that require treatment teaming The different way that we set up a treatment teams when we’re in private practice Confidentiality and communication concerns when treatment teaming How to interact with the other team members The educational considerations related to treatment teaming The “mercenary” reason to do treatment teaming Our Generous Sponsor:Therapy Reimagined 2019: The Modern Therapist Conference presented by SimplePracticeOctober 18 and 19th in Universal City, CA – Hang out with the cool #moderntherapists! We are sponsoring our own podcast because we are so excited about the conference!Grab your continuing education for the year and get trained up on business building, diversity, technology, self-care and all-around amazing professional development this October! Come join us in-person for the same fun we bring to the podcast!!Use the promo code MTSG50 to get $50 off your full conference ticket.Resources mentioned:We’ve pulled together resources mentioned in this episode and put together some handy-dandy links.Wraparound Services within Community Mental HealthArticle: Hoge MA, Morris J, Daniels A, et al. (2007). An Action Plan on Behavioral Health Workforce Development. Rockville, Md, Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration Relevant Episodes:In-Person Networking Our Facebook Group – The Modern Therapists Group Therapy Reimagined 2019 Our consultation services:The Fifty-Minute HourCredits:Voice Over by DW McCann https://www.facebook.com/McCannDW/Music by Crystal Grooms Mangano http://www.crystalmangano.com/  

An interview Megan Costello, LMFT on taking the best of Community Mental Health into your private practice. Curt and Katie interview Megan about her very successful private practice that is 100% home and field-based. They talk about how to a field-based practice works, including practical considerations.It’s time to reimagine therapy and what it means to be a therapist. We are human beings who can now present ourselves as whole people, with authenticity, purpose, and connection. Especially now, when therapists must develop a personal brand to market their practices.To support you as a whole person and a therapist, your hosts, Curt Widhalm and Katie Vernoy talk about how to approach the role of therapist in the modern age.Interview with Megan Costello, LMFTMegan Costello, LMFT, is a person-centered behaviorist providing in-home counseling for families in Los Angeles. Megan has provided services to clients in their homes or the community for almost 15 years. Megan started her career as a behavioral technician, providing behavioral therapy under the supervision of Board Certified Behavior Analysts (BCBA) before she moved into a supervisory role for Applied Behavioral Analysis (ABA) cases (both in- home and school-based cases). Megan continued this work as she obtained her Masters of Science in Counseling at California State University, Long Beach. Megan then added clinical work in community mental health, providing specialized support to children on the autism spectrum with trauma histories. When Megan moved into private practice, she incorporated the best of the in-home and behavioral interventions into her treatment model. She brings practical advice and strategies to her clinical work, providing specialized, comprehensive treatment to higher needs or atypical cases. In this episode we talk about: Megan’s perspective and a new model for private practice How to make applied behavioral analysis more person-centered The value of being relentlessly client-centered and doing the highest impact work, regardless of how convenient to the therapist The types of clients who would benefit more from in-home and school-based therapy The benefits of in-home therapy over in-office therapy The need to price your services accordingly How to create an office in your car How to manage your scheduling The unique challenges of working in the home, looking at confidentiality, family involvement The model that requires family and parent involvement Safety assessments prior to going out to the home How to assess over the phone prior to starting home-based treatment Getting parent buy-in for active involvement in treatment for their child  Relevant Resources:We’ve pulled together any resources mentioned in this episode and put together some handy-dandy links:Megan’s website: https://www.megcostello.com/Megan’s consultation: https://www.megcostello.com/consultingAND WE HAVE A PICTURE OF MEGAN'S TRUNK ON THE WEBSITE!  The Modern Therapists Group on FacebookTherapy Reimagined 2019Credits:Voice Over by DW McCann https://www.facebook.com/McCannDW/Music by Crystal Grooms Mangano http://www.crystalmangano.com/ 

Curt and Katie talk about how we value our time, looking at time when we are generating revenue AND the time when we are not generating revenue.    It’s time to reimagine therapy and what it means to be a therapist. To support you as a whole person and a therapist, your hosts, Curt Widhalm and Katie Vernoy talk about how to approach the role of therapist in the modern age.In this episode we talk about: The initial conversations about time: Curt’s FB post, Jo Muirhead’s Article Philosophical musings about the value of time Podcastception: a podcast sparked by a blog post which was sparked by one of our Facebook posts The value of client hours above other hours How to value non-revenue time The types of non-revenue generating time Valuing time in different ways The importance of self-care hours for many of our listeners and the lesser value that Curt places on these type of hours Decision-making when looking at whether hiring someone to do work for your business The different types of time (self-care, self-maintenance, rest, creative, content creation, work time, maintenance, etc.) and the different types of return on investment for those types (monetary, increased efficiency, positioning, strategic advantage, fulfillment, meaning, purpose, sustainability, quality of life, mission-driven, connection, etc.) The importance of balancing these types of time to avoid burnout or washout The unique return of investment for each person Future-proofing your work (being able to plan for sustained work and retirement) Looking at your whole career when you think about how you do your work Burnout or moral injury as risks for clinicians  Resources mentioned:We’ve pulled together resources mentioned in this episode and put together some handy-dandy links. Curt’s Facebook Post on the value we place on time Jo Muirhead’s Blog Post: What if Our Time Isn’t Valued in Monetary TermsJames Clear Blog on How to Track Money and Time Daniel Pink’s book When: The Scientific Secrets of Perfect Timing Relevant Episodes:Jo Muirhead’s Podcast Episode: Clinician and Entrepreuner Howard Spector’s Episode: Investing in Yourself as an Entrepreneur Our Facebook Group – The Modern Therapists GroupTherapy Reimagined 2019 Our consultation services:The Fifty-Minute Hour Credits:Voice Over by DW McCann https://www.facebook.com/McCannDW/Music by Crystal Grooms Mangano http://www.crystalmangano.com/  

An interview Laura Westmoreland, LMFT on addressing body bias, body shaming, and health at every size (HAES) in therapy. Curt and Katie talk with Laura about the common mistakes that therapists make when working with clients living in larger bodies.Interview with Laura Westmoreland, LMFTLaura Westmoreland, LMFT identifies as a white woman living in a larger body, cisgender, straight, and able-bodied; her pronouns are she/her. She acknowledges that she has white privilege.She works with individuals, couples, and families who want to explore what is holding them back from leading the life they desire; both personally and professionally. The key to her work is the relationship developed. Together with her clients, she can create a brave space; a brave space requires stepping out of your comfort zone, risking vulnerability, and being curious.Laura believes... what we struggle with provides insight and can help us grow connection is key; reciprocal relationships require effort regularly engaging in pleasurable activities fosters joy and happiness in nourishing mind, body, and soul that self-compassion is vital to wellbeing all bodies are good bodies  In this episode we talk about: The importance of inclusion related to body diversity What body bias looks like in a therapist office Health At Every Size (HAES) The challenges of living in a larger body The war on obesity and walking into a war zone The medicalization of body diversity with words like “overweight” and the pathologizing of different bodies The danger of colluding with the diet culture The controversy that exists within the eating disorder community related to HAES Focusing on the client’s lived experience, rather than the societal expectations Sorting through when larger bodies suggest symptomology of a mental health or trauma concern versus when someone is healthy in a larger body Showing curiosity around what “feeling fat” means, rather than suggesting a diet or fix The danger of prescribing to people living in larger bodies what we would treat in eating disorder clients (i.e., restriction) How a clinician’s body bias can negatively impact treatment efficacy Intuitive eating – paying attention to hunger and satiety cues Joyful movement, rather than trudging to the gym The importance of finding your healthy practices Assessment best practices Harvard Implicit Bias Tests The different biases that Curt and Katie hold around body sizes Bias and microaggressions that can show up in the therapist office What therapists can look for when assessing whether clients feel comfortable in their own bodies  Relevant Resources:We’ve pulled together any resources mentioned in this episode and put together some handy-dandy links:Laura Westmoreland’s WebsiteFB: Laura Westmoreland LmftIG: haes_therapist_in_laTwitter: @haestherapistlaIntuitive Eating WebsiteBe NourishedJeffery Hunger’s PublicationHarvard Implicit Bias Tests(Association for Size Diversity and Health) ASDAH Dr, Vincent Felitti talks about the Adverse Childhood Experiences StudyThe Modern Therapists Group on FacebookTherapy Reimagined 2019Credits:Voice Over by DW McCann https://www.facebook.com/McCannDW/Music by Crystal Grooms Mangano http://www.crystalmangano.com/

Curt and Katie talk about evidence-based practices, clinician training, and when even the evidence base can go wrong.    It’s time to reimagine therapy and what it means to be a therapist. To support you as a whole person and a therapist, your hosts, Curt Widhalm and Katie Vernoy talk about how to approach the role of therapist in the modern age.In this episode we talk about: How we know better than the evidence The need for evidence-based practice in community mental health Funding, efficiency, and diagnosis The difference between the clientele in public mental health and private practice Evidence-based practices pros and cons The science, the efficacy, replicability of EBPs The pros and cons of EBPs in community mental health The need to include individual factors in EBPs EBPs versus relational style (and how they may not be mutually exclusive) The question about personality characteristics of CBT therapists The opinion about rapport being missing from EBPs How training jumps to EBP, to the detriment of the relationship The problem with people who overuse or oversimplify the need for each orientation Strong clinical orientation versus the “eclectic” or “integrative” psychotherapy The Medical Model The challenge of training therapists in relational skills and how to be a better therapist, rather than teaching specific handful of skills The importance of proving efficacy, getting funding for services Treatment decision-making and collaboration in public mental health versus private practice The complexity of actual clients and the need for more than just one EBP to use for treatment The problems with new clinician training related to EBPs Resources mentioned:We’ve pulled together resources mentioned in this episode and put together some handy-dandy links. Dr. Scott Miller: Feedback Informed TreatmentDr. Ben Caldwell Modern Community Mental Health: An Interdisciplinary Approach by Kenneth Yeager, David Cutler, Dale Svendsen, and Grayce M. Sills Relevant Episodes:Therapist Know ThyselfOur Facebook Group – The Modern Therapists Group Therapy Reimagined 2019Our CALL FOR SPEAKERS!! Our consultation services:The Fifty-Minute HourCredits:Voice Over by DW McCann https://www.facebook.com/McCannDW/Music by Crystal Grooms Mangano http://www.crystalmangano.com/ 

An interview Joel Schwartz, PsyD on neurodiversity, Autism Spectrum Disorders, and neurodivergence. Curt and Katie talk with Joel about how often our natural spectrum of neurodiversity is pathologized.It’s time to reimagine therapy and what it means to be a therapist. We are human beings who can now present ourselves as whole people, with authenticity, purpose, and connection. Especially now, when therapists must develop a personal brand to market their practices.To support you as a whole person and a therapist, your hosts, Curt Widhalm and Katie Vernoy talk about how to approach the role of therapist in the modern age.Interview with Joel Schwartz, PsyDDr. Joel Schwartz is a licensed clinical psychologist with a private practice in the South Bay of Los Angeles County. He specializes in therapy and testing for the misunderstood. As a therapist, he is warm, compassionate, and strongly humanistic, allowing for all the oddities and unexplored aspects of his clients to emerge and be validated. As a testing psychologist, Dr. Schwartz specializes in difficult and complex cases.Dr. Schwartz grew up in Southern California. He developed an early interest in psychology, strangely enough, from a childhood filled with science fiction stories. These stories often provided fascinating looks into human psychology and the human spirit. Dr. Schwartz attended UCLA as an undergrad where he conducted research in the field of neurolinguistics. From there, he attended Yeshiva University’s Ferkauf School of Clinical Psychology for his Master’s and Doctorate degree. He has worked in various settings including colleges, clinics, a federal prison, and residential treatment centers. Through his experience with a vast array of individuals he has stuck with one important lesson among many; as the psychoanalyst Harry Stack Sullivan said, “We are all more human than otherwise.”In this episode we talk about: The problem of the medical model Looking at neurodiversity as a spectrum and a natural part of life Defining neurodiversity and neurodivergence Looking at differences as okay, and not disordered Traditional versus neurodiversity affirmative practices The strain of compensatory behaviors when one is neurodivergent and trying to fit in Problematic assumptions that do not welcome neurodivergent folks Practical ways to create an office that supports the full spectrum of neurodiversity The importance of clear instructions, options, and sensitivity to the different Radical acceptance The freedom and relief of not having to learn, when everything is explained. The debate about ABA and behavioral interventions The social justice aspects of working with neuro-minorities The importance of representation of neurodivergent people in all aspects of society Autistic people are demanding representation, are consulting, and are acting in roles Looking at the nuance of radical acceptance – when intervention is required, rather than acceptance The problem of behaviorism leading to repression and dissociation Having the goal of decreasing a behavior, shouldn’t be the final goal The problems of having ABA therapists not address their own emotions The problem with having neurotypical people setting goals for neurodivergent people Looking at the invalidation of modifying behaviors How to balance what society will accept as well as validating the person How do we set them up for success, without pathologizing their behavior Self-regulatory behaviors – comparing them to coffee drinking The need to move toward societal change

Curt and Katie reflect on 100 podcast episodes, what the experience has been like, and where we want to take the podcast next.  It’s time to reimagine therapy and what it means to be a therapist. To support you as a whole person and a therapist, your hosts, Curt Widhalm and Katie Vernoy talk about how to approach the role of therapist in the modern age.In this episode we talk about: How much we appreciate listener connection and feedback Self-reflection on the previous 99 episodes A new hashtag: #teamcurtie Our switch from 2 episodes per week to 1 episode per week How podcasting has improved our speaking and thought processes The impact of hearing from listeners of the podcast at the conference How we recorded and put out the Therapist Safety episodes Our goal to catalyze the diverse voices in our community to stand up How we have made mistakes publicly in order to have healing conversations publicly The level of disclosure we have on the podcast The surprise that our moms aren’t the only people listening every week The way we talk about our profession in order to improve it How we are going to grow and change the podcast What are #moderntherapist conversations (and what are not) Guiding principles of what we’re talking about How we are different from other groups, other podcasts The origin of the podcast as a marketing plan for a conference, and then it evolved into its own thing Relevant Episodes:So You Want to Plan a ConferenceTherapist SafetyAttracted ClientsLet’s Talk About Race AgainVulnerability, the News, and YouToxic Work EnvironmentsTake Action Like a BOSS Social Media and Video Marketing with Ernesto Segismundo, Jr M.S. LMFTBecoming a Group Practice Owner with Maureen WerrbachOur Facebook Group – The Modern Therapists GroupTherapy Reimagined 2019Our CALL FOR SPEAKERS!!Our consultation services:The Fifty-Minute HourWho we are:Curt Widhalm is a Licensed Marriage & Family Therapist in private practice in the Los Angeles area. He is a Board Member at Large for the California Association of Marriage and Family Therapists, a Subject Matter Expert for the California Board of Behavioral Sciences, Adjunct Faculty at Pepperdine University, and a loving husband and father. He is 1/2 great person, 1/2 provocateur, and 1/2 geek, in that order. He dabbles in the dark art of making "dad jokes" and usually has a half-empty cup of coffee somewhere nearby. Learn more at: www.curtwidhalm.comKatie Vernoy is a Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist, coach, and consultant. As a helping professional for two decades, she’s navigated the ups and downs of our unique line of work. She’s run her own solo therapy practice, designed innovative clinical programs, built and managed large, thriving teams of service providers, and consulted hundreds of helping professionals on how to build meaningful AND sustainable practices. In her spare time, Katie is secretly siphoning off Curt's youthful energy, so that she can take over the world. Learn more at: www.katievernoy.comA Quick Note:Our opinions are our own. We are only speaking for ourselves – except when we speak for each other, or over each other. We’re working on it.Our guests are also only speaking for themselves and have their own opinions. We aren’t trying to take their voice, and no one speaks for us either. Mostly because they don’t want to, but hey.

An interview Yin Li, LMFT about Asian American and Pacific Islanders in therapy and as therapists. Curt and Katie talk with Yin about how often AAPI individuals are not included in the conversation about racism, culture, and mental health.It’s time to reimagine therapy and what it means to be a therapist. We are human beings who can now present ourselves as whole people, with authenticity, purpose, and connection. Especially now, when therapists must develop a personal brand to market their practices.To support you as a whole person and a therapist, your hosts, Curt Widhalm and Katie Vernoy talk about how to approach the role of therapist in the modern age.Interview with Yin Li, MA LMFTYin Li a marriage and family therapist licensed in California and Oregon and founder of Theralane. She works primarily with Asian Americans on a range of concerns ranging from challenging family dynamics, chronic relationship difficulties (romantic, love, family, work), life transitions, career challenges, identify questions, high functioning depression, and anxiety. Yin is very passionate about normalizing mental health, wellness, and therapy services in Asian communities. She has spoken and provided workshops on Asian American Mental Health and Wellness. For white identified clinicians working with Asian Americans, Yin is available for consultation.Website www.theralane.comEmail: yin@theralane.comInstagram: @theralane.counseling In this episode we talk about: Being called out by listener, Yin Li about not talking about Asian American and Pacific Islanders in our conversations about Race to date. Thoughts on why AAPI individuals are often left out of the conversation or ignored The “Model Minority” myth The problem of using aggregate data Language barriers and self-segregation The problem of not knowing what we don’t know Deep-rooted racism in the United States How do we identify and address our blind spots The factors that might enter into the perspective of AAPI individuals on getting therapy or entering the therapy profession What to do when you identify this blind spot Looking at what can be missed when working with AAPI clients How race might come into the room, even if it is not the primary reason for treatment Family immigration stories, language differences Hoping space for cultural stories and the context in which your client lives The problem of not talking about race with Asian American clients How to get over the nervousness of talking about race with AAPI clients How do the conversations relate to the needs of the client, with intention The problem of addressing race and culture to check a box – which comes from a place of privilege The complexity of mixed race – looking at unique factors How integration as an individual is impacted by where one lives, with whom they live (e.g., AAPI child adopted into a white family, living in 2 cultures) The importance of exploring the individual experience due to the complexity of the conversation Developmental stages of cultural and racial identity The impact of where you live on your sense of self Marriage and Family Therapists: only 0.4% are AAPI The assumption in all of therapeutic education that clients are white The common requirement for AAPI therapists to learn on their own how to effectively treat AAPI clients The value of consultation What educators and professional associations can do to improve the situation Calling out when the education is not enough Messages Yin Li has for Asian American therapists

An interview with Katie Read, LMFT about what it means to be a Therapreneur and the frequent mistakes that therapists make when writing their websites. Curt and Katie interviewed Katie about the unique challenges for therapist marketing and how to use Motivational Interviewing to improve your website.It’s time to reimagine therapy and what it means to be a therapist. We are human beings who can now present ourselves as whole people, with authenticity, purpose, and connection. Especially now, when therapists must develop a personal brand to market their practices.To support you as a whole person and a therapist, your hosts, Curt Widhalm and Katie Vernoy talk about how to approach the role of therapist in the modern age.Interview with Katie Read, LMFTKatie Read, LMFT, helps therapists grow...then OUTgrow...their practices! Katie helps clinicians overcome scarcity-mindset, get clear on their most meaningful work, create highly-converting websites, and create additional income streams in coaching, consulting, course creation, and more!Connect with Katie here:www.katieread.comwww.facebook.com/groups/therapreneurswww.facebook.com/therapreneurcoach In this episode we talk about: How crappy therapist websites are The desire to move beyond the therapist office What a “Therapreneur” is How to outgrow the old ideas of what therapists can be When therapists are pushed down for being “too big” Debunking the idea that therapists are shy and mousy What happens when you look beyond the office The problems most therapists make when writing the copy for your website The importance of using the clients’ language when describing clinical concerns The scourge of psychobabble, academic, or jargon language used in websites How to include your achievements and CV information on your website, if it is relevant for ideal client What therapists bring to the marketing game Why videos are important for your marketing How to use Motivational Interviewing to write your website The awful truth that we all respond to scarcity marketing The unique challenge for marketing therapy (without scarcity as a possibility) Where the marketing questions can go wrong The tendency of therapists to copy other therapists in their marketing and water down their voice Why so many people use Brene Brown quotes Designing your profile to speak to your ideal clients How to find your voice and the language you can use to speak to the clients you serve The importance of Niche for marketing, specialization, training, and efficacy The fear of turning away clients – and why that is short-sighted How to grow by niching down sufficiently for your area

Curt and Katie talk about what to do when your clients report sexual or romantic transference. We look at how to explore these feelings, how to set boundaries, and what you need to be cautious about.  It’s time to reimagine therapy and what it means to be a therapist. To support you as a whole person and a therapist, your hosts, Curt Widhalm and Katie Vernoy talk about how to approach the role of therapist in the modern age.In this episode we talk about: How normal it is that clients become attracted to their therapists. The level of safety and intimacy in therapy can be so attractive to clients that they become romantically attracted to their therapist. Examples of how this type of attraction can show up in the room The caution to wait to jump to “Are you hitting on me?” Looking at what is appropriate and inappropriate, especially given cultural differences How supervisors can advise their supervisees in these situations The difference between a misunderstood connection and physical attraction – and thoughts on how to handle each one How physical appearance can impact the pre-treatment expectations A study on Attractive Business Women – the idea of the Femme Fatale Looking at how being gorgeous might impact your clinical work Be authentically yourself, with the understanding of what societal bias could come up When the clients start responding to the therapist as an individual, rather than the therapist or the therapy relationship – looking at transference/counter-transference How hard it can be to talk about the client’s sexual attraction in the therapy room Holding space – acceptance with clear boundaries Making sure to address safety Exploring the interplay between emotional intimacy and the expectation for sexual intimacy How to set the boundaries in the psychotherapy relationship when attraction has been disclosed by the therapist The caution to avoid shaming the client and how to do so The importance of consultation during these types of situations Factors that can impact these types of interactions in the treatment room The safety factors and risks to be aware of, when facing sexual or romantic transference  Our Generous Sponsor:Thanks again to our sponsor Katie Read! Katie helps therapists grow and they OUTgrow their practices. If you're in GROW mode, she can help you grow faster by knowing exactly how to create your therapist website to get the most possible calls with her two courses, Client Machine and Website Whisperer! If you're ready to OUTgrow your office, Katie helps clinicians know the exact right steps to add big extra income streams in coaching, consulting, or courses! Check out www.katieread.com for more information.Resources mentioned:We’ve pulled together resources mentioned in this episode and put together some handy-dandy links.Article: Attractive businesswomen viewed as less trustworthy 'femmes fatales' Our Facebook Group – The Modern Therapists GroupTherapy Reimagined 2019: Sign up here to get notified when the details are released.Our CALL FOR SPEAKERS!! Our consultation services:The Fifty-Minute HourCredits:Voice Over by DW McCann https://www.facebook.com/McCannDW/Music by Crystal Grooms Mangano http://www.crystalmangano.com/