

Spiritual Life and Leadership
Markus Watson
Ministry leadership is about more than just growing your church or organization. It’s about participating in God’s mission in the world. But how can leaders know God’s mission or their unique place in it? Faithful ministry leadership is rooted in a life of deep and abiding faithfulness to Jesus. In “Spiritual Life and Leadership,” Markus Watson and his guests explore what it means to be faithful leaders whose ministry flows from their ever-deepening relationship with God.
Episodes
Mentioned books

Sep 19, 2023 • 7min
182. Engaging with Diverse Voices for a More Faithful Discipleship, a Quick Conversation with Tod Bolsinger and Markus Watson
 In this episode, Tod Bolsinger and Markus Watson discuss the influence of the Enlightenment and individualism on middle-class white individuals, and how this impacts their understanding of faith and community. They emphasize the importance of engaging with different perspectives and reading the Bible in community with people who are not like us in order to break free from these cultural norms and develop a more holistic understanding of spirituality and leadership.Tod Bolsinger and Markus Watson discuss this quote from Tom Sine in Episode 118: Forecasting and Innovation.“I think a lot of us in Western culture have allowed the Enlightenment and a very individualistic way of life to become normative, particularly for middle-class white folks.” Ep. 118 is a conversation inspired by Tom Sine and Dwight Friesen's book, 2020s Foresight.Send me a text! I’d love to know what you're thinking!Click HERE to get my FREE online course, BECOMING LEADERS OF SHALOM. 

Sep 12, 2023 • 40min
181. How Stories Shape Our Spiritual Lives and Leadership, with Jennifer Holberg, author of Nourishing Narratives
 Jennifer Holberg, a Professor and Chair of the English Department at Calvin University, discusses how storytelling shapes our spiritual lives. She emphasizes the importance of recognizing the diverse narratives within church communities and how storytelling can empower individuals. Holberg believes that the stories we tell ourselves influence our identities and that church narratives offer hope and belonging. She urges pastors to create spaces for sharing personal stories, highlighting their impact on leadership and spiritual growth. 

Sep 5, 2023 • 8min
180. The Key Relationships Every Leader Needs, a Quick Conversation with Tod Bolsinger and Markus Watson
 In this episode, Tod Bolsinger and Markus Watson discuss the vital role of relationships in ministry leadership. Tod emphasizes the importance of cultivating partnerships, friendships, and mentorships as essential sources of support and vulnerability. They explore the connection between relationships and self-reflection, particularly in navigating challenging leadership situations. With practical insights and personal anecdotes, this episode offers guidance on building a strong support network for leaders seeking to grow both their outer ministry and inner discipleship. Don't miss this enlightening conversation on the transformative power of relationships in leadership.Tod Bolsinger and Markus Watson discuss this quote from Tod Bolsinger in Episode 120: Forming Leadership Resilience."We need more relationships. If you do nothing else this year, ask yourself, 'Do I have the kinds of relationships that allow me to do vulnerable self-reflection?'" Ep. 120 is a conversation inspired by Tod Bolsinger's book, Tempered Resilience.Send me a text! I’d love to know what you're thinking!Click HERE to get my FREE online course, BECOMING LEADERS OF SHALOM. 

Aug 29, 2023 • 39min
179. The Neuroscience of Spiritual Formation, with Jim Wilder, author of Renovated
 Jim Wilder, author of Renovated: God, Dallas Willard, and the Church That Transforms, discusses the role of the brain in spiritual formation. He highlights the importance of attachment love in developing relationships with God and others. Mutual mind, where subconscious processing aligns, plays a key role. The podcast explores becoming our true selves, finding peace through gratitude, and the significance of joy in spiritual formation. 

Aug 22, 2023 • 7min
178. Embracing the Future, a Quick Conversation with Tod Bolsinger and Markus Watson
 Tod Bolsinger and Markus Watson discuss embracing the future while letting go of the past. They explore adaptive leadership and the work of the Church Leadership Institute. They emphasize the significance of relying on God, having hope, and the Lord's Supper. Valuable advice on transitioning and adapting core values is provided. 

Aug 15, 2023 • 44min
177. Exploring New Forms of Church, with Shannon Kiser, Director of Coaching and Training at Fresh Expressions
 Shannon Kiser is Director of Training and Coaching for Fresh Expressions North America and one of the pastors at Riverside Presbyterian Church in Sterling, Virginia.In this episode, we have a great conversation about how she and the congregation she pastors have experimented with new forms of church, as well as what they've learned in that process.  We also discuss how the Church Leadership Institute’s Adaptive Church Leadership Cohort can help you lean into the kind of experimentation that’s necessary when following the Holy Spirit into whatever new expressions of church you’re being led toward. THIS EPISODE'S HIGHLIGHTS INCLUDE:Shannon Kiser is Director of Training and Coaching for Fresh Expressions North America and one of the pastors at Riverside Presbyterian Church in Sterling, Virginia.Fresh Expressions and the Church Leadership Institute together are trying to make sense of what it means to be a vital witness in the 21st century.Fresh Expressions is a movement that comes out of the UK where a traditional and heritage church was experimenting with what it looks like to engage in some experimental missions on the edges while still valuing the inherited church.Shannon Kiser says, according to Fresh Expressions, we don’t have to give up what we love and cherish about the inherited church to also experiment on the edges.Shannon Kiser describes how her church began experimenting with new ways of doing ministry, including opening a coffee shop for the community.A Fresh Expressions kind of ministry as Shannon describes can be messy.  The church doesn’t get to control the narrative.When things get messy, it’s important to be clear on your values so you know when to say yes and when to say no to opportunities that emerge.According to Shannon Kiser, it is possible for you to connect with a changing culture and yet still live out some of the rhythms and depth of the inherited church that feeds you.Churches have to cultivate a culture that is more ripe for experimentation, which then creates the field where new and fresh expressions of ministry can more easily grow.Fresh Expressions teaches as very simple journey.  It involves:Listening to your neighborsLoving our serving your neighbors based on what you have learnedBuilding community with your neighborsAllow a new form of church to emergeShannon Kiser explains how the Church Leadership Institutes Adaptive Capacity Cohort help churches engage this process.RELEVANT RESOURCES AND LINKS:Books mentioned:Canoeing the Mountains, by Tod BolsingerFreash Expressions:www.freshexpressions.comChurch Leadership InstituteAdaptive Church Leadership CohortSend me a text! I’d love to know what you're thinking!Get Becoming Leaders of Shalom for free HERE.Click HERE to get my FREE online course, BECOMING LEADERS OF SHALOM. 

Aug 8, 2023 • 7min
176. Building Bridges in a Polarized World, a Quick Conversation with Tod Bolsinger and Markus Watson
 In this episode, Tod Bolsinger and Markus Watson delve into the importance of understanding and empathizing with others' beliefs, especially in times of political and cultural polarization. They discuss the role of churches in bridging divisions and striving for unity, highlighting the need to move away from comfortable spaces and embrace discomfort as an opportunity for growth. With insights from leaders such as Jim Harrington and Allen Hilton, this episode offers valuable perspectives on creating a sense of shalom across diverse backgrounds.Tod Bolsinger and Markus Watson discuss this quote from Allen Hilton in Episode 135: Leading Your Church Through Political Division.“Our shalom job right now—in this place and time—is to get good at being together across difference.” Ep. 135 is a conversation about Allen Hilton's book, A House United: How the Church Can Save the World.Send me a text! I’d love to know what you're thinking!Click HERE to get my FREE online course, BECOMING LEADERS OF SHALOM. 

Aug 1, 2023 • 46min
175. From Burnout to Resilience, with Jason Young, co-author of Don't Burn Out, Burn Bright
 How can we avoid burnout in ministry?Jason Young is a keynote speaker, coach, and consultant who helps churches and businesses thrive, and the co-author of Don’t Burn Out, Burn Bright.In this episode, Jason Young and Markus Watson get real specific about what can lead to burnout in ministry and what we can to do prevent it.THIS EPISODE'S HIGHLIGHTS INCLUDE:Jason Young is a keynote speaker, coach, and consultant who helps churches and businesses thrive, and the co-author of Don’t Burn Out, Burn Bright.Jason wants to help leaders, not only prevent burnout in ministry, but structure their lives and ministries in such a way that they truly thrive in all areas of life.“When discouragement creeps in, destruction is nigh.”According to Jason Young, burnout in ministry leadership is not inevitable.Control isolates.  Control rarely invites.Staff members want to know two things in their work:Will I be successful if I do this?What’s in it for me?Jesus, too, was motivated by what was in it for him.  Hebrews says it was “for the joy set before him” that he endured that cross.Jason Young discusses the connection between entanglements and burnout in ministry.According to Jason Young, leaders read too much.  Maybe leaders need to do less reading.Sometimes in all our reading and consuming of information, we may begin to forget the voice of God.In his early ministry years, Markus Watson wanted to attend lots of conferences.  In his middle ministry years, Markus took lots of classes.  At this stage of his ministry, Markus recognizes that he’s filled his mind with plenty of information; now he wants to pursue life experiences.Exhaustion and burnout in ministry leadership doesn’t show up suddenly; it creeps in and slowly drains you.“If God called you to ministry, it’s his.  And he would like for you to be openhanded with his ministry because he wants to trust you with more.”RELEVANT RESOURCES AND LINKS:Book mentioned:Don’t Burn Out, Burn Bright, by Jason Young and Jonathan MalmJason Young:Catchfiredaily.comDrjasonyoung.comChurch Leadership InstituteSend me a text! I’d love to know what you're thinking!Get Becoming Leaders of Shalom for free HERE.Click HERE to get my FREE online course, BECOMING LEADERS OF SHALOM. 

Jul 25, 2023 • 7min
174. Addressing Unresolved Pain in Ministry Leadership, a Quick Conversation with Tod Bolsinger and Markus Watson
 Tod Bolsinger and Markus Watson discuss the transformative power of acknowledging and addressing our own pain as leaders. If our pain isn't transformed, it will be transmitted to others, potentially leading to harmful behaviors and dynamics within our ministries and organizations. By developing self-awareness, emotional health, and adaptive capacity, leaders can prioritize their mission over personal needs and avoid unconsciously inflicting pain on those they serve. This insightful conversation offers valuable insights and practical guidance for cultivating a healthy inner life of faithful discipleship and a healthy outer life of ministry leadership.Tod Bolsinger and Markus Watson discuss this quote from Tod Hall in Episode 136: Healthy Attachment and Spiritual Leadership.“If our pain isn’t transformed, it’s going to be transmitted.” Ep. 136 is a conversation about Todd Hall's book, The Connected Life.Send me a text! I’d love to know what you're thinking!Click HERE to get my FREE online course, BECOMING LEADERS OF SHALOM. 

Jul 18, 2023 • 42min
173. The Art of Interpreting Culture, with Justin Bailey, author of Interpreting Your World
 Justin Bailey is associate professor of theology at Dordt University and the author of Interpreting Your World: Five Lenses for Engaging Theology and Culture.What is culture?  Sometimes people say we need to "resist culture."  But the language of resistance seems to be rooted in fear—and I don’t think we’re meant to react to our culture from a place of fear.Maybe engaging with culture as the church requires something else.  Maybe what it requires is interpretation.  And then, maybe it requires thoughtful response and engagement.In this episode, Justin Bailey helps us dig into these issues--including a really helpful conversation about cancel culture!THIS EPISODE'S HIGHLIGHTS INCLUDE:Justin Bailey is associate professor of theology at Dordt University and the author of Interpreting Your World: Five Lenses for Engaging Theology and Culture.Justin’s books wants to help people understand their culture in a way that recognizes what isn’t life-giving, while also affirming that which is life-giving, generous, and generative.Justin Bailey offers two metaphors for understanding culture:Culture as a field or soil that nourishes and nurtures certain ideas and practices that can grow.Culture as a field of force in which certain things pull, push, and attract one in certain directions.Justin Bailey reflects on five lenses for interpreting culture:Meaning – How am I connected to the world around me?Power – Do I have real choices or am I at the mercy of greater powers?Ethics – What does it mean to be a good human?Religion – How do I face the anxiety of life and the certainty of death?Aesthetics – How do I live a life that is generative and beautiful?Outside the church, the lens that is most often used to interpret culture is the power lens.  But if this is the only lens we use, we will miss much of what is going on.Justin Bailey teaches students to analyze culture theologically in two movements:Movement 1 – From CultureMovement 2 – For CultureAccording to Justin Bailey, part of the work of ministry leadership is to discern, what might God’s Spirit be doing here in this culture to open people up to the Gospel?Justin Bailey discusses cancellation and complication as ways of responding to challenges within culture.The danger of an iconoclasm of cancellation is that we put ourselves up on the pedestals in the place of the thing we have dethroned.An iconoclasm of complication acknowledges that there is more than one story and things are more complicated than they once seemed.An iconoclasm of complication seeks to contextualize.RELEVANT RESOURCES AND LINKS:Books mentioned:Interpreting Your World: Five Lenses for Engaging Theology and Culture, by Justin BaileyJustin BaileyWebsiteTwitterSend me a text! I’d love to know what you're thinking!Get Becoming Leaders of Shalom for free HERE.Click HERE to get my FREE online course, BECOMING LEADERS OF SHALOM. 


