Mahon McCann

We are back with a final conversation in this AI series, bringing together John Verveake and Sam Tideman to discuss the limits of artificial intelligence.For me, this conversation is a watershed moment in the AI debate. Based on John’s work (read the paper here ), there is a fundamental difference between the AI/computer science paradigm and human intelligence, which the current genre of artificial intelligence cannot cross! So we can stop worrying about the machines replacing us! But we need to start worrying about the delusions of those who think they’re making humanity 2.0…This conversation delves into the profound difference between AI algorithms and relevance-realizing agents, sparking thought on the concept of relevance realization and its pivotal role in organismic agency, cognition, and consciousness. It underscores that organismic agency and cognition transcend computational nature and cannot be fully encapsulated by algorithmic approaches.Timestamps:00:00 Introduction and Background08:20 The Role of Relevance Realization in Organismic Agency and Cognition14:16 The Limitations of Current AI Models in Comprehending Purpose25:12 Exploring the Potential for Artificial Life and Relevance Realization in AI33:31 AI: Neither Just a Tool nor a Full-Blown Agent37:10 The Deflation of AI and the Search for Purpose39:29 Caring for the True, Good, and Beautiful44:54 The Difference in Caring48:31 Starting at the Pinnacle of Cultural Ratcheting53:31 The Limitations of Imitation55:47 Relevance Realizing Machines01:02:57 Theological Considerations01:06:38 The Sin of Displacement01:10:45 Philosophical and Theological Reflection Get full access to Raising the Cross at www.mahonmccann.com/subscribe

Sam Tideman is the host of Transfigured, a profound religious and philosophical thinker, and a Google data engineer.Check out Sam's channel: https://www.youtube.com/@transfigured3673In this podcast, we are talking about the limits of artificial intelligence, social media, evolution and the cult of trans-humanism.Chapters:00:00 Introduction and Skepticism of AI's Capabilities09:12 The Challenge of Quantifying Wisdom and Enlightenment in AI33:23 The Limitations of AI and the Need for Human Intervention52:44 The Risks of AI Cults and the Importance of a Religious FrameworkPS want to support the Wisdom Dojo?You can sign up for a one-time gift or a monthly donation, and all funds are used to cover the running costs of the pod 👇www.mahonmccann.com/gift Get full access to Raising the Cross at www.mahonmccann.com/subscribe

D. C. Schindler is professor of metaphysics and anthropology at the John Paul II Institute, Washington, DC. He is the author of eleven books, including Freedom from Reality: The Diabolical Character of Modern Liberty (University of Notre Dame Press, 2017) (get his books here: https://www.amazon.co.uk/D-C-Schindler/e/B001JRTOAU)The podcast discusses the ontology of stories, fact vs fiction, materialism, perception, naive realism, platonism, Christianity and more.Chapters:00:00 The Ontological and Epistemological Status of Stories03:34 The Separation Between Fact and Fiction07:27 The Reductionist View of Truth10:25 The Role of Stories in Mapping Reality13:07 The Limitations of the Scientific Model of Reality15:21 The Journey of Knowing and Understanding19:06 The Misuse of the Term 'Artificial Intelligence'21:45 The Breakdown of the Bond Between Reality and Truth23:28 The Influence of the Enlightenment25:45 The Role of Nominalism in the Shift in Perception of God27:07 The Journey Towards the Really Real29:53 The Self-Defeating Nature of Denying All Truth31:44 Starting with What People Care About31:57 The Inescapability of the Good33:03 The Significance of a Troubled Conscience34:15 The Connection Between Universal and Particular Stories35:12 The Role of Transcendent Goodness in Drama37:07 The Presence of Goodness in Characters38:29 The Dramatic Power of Forgiveness39:21 The Revelation of Character in Decisions40:34 The Role of Goodness in Decision-Making41:25 Truth as Disclosure and Revelation43:30 The Loss of Meaning and the Need for Stories44:29 The Connection Between Stories and Tradition45:45 The Disconnect from Tradition and the Search for Meaning46:13 Christianity as the Ultimate Story46:56 The Parallels Between Christianity and Plato's Philosophy48:22 The Distrust and Loss of Meaning in a Secular Culture50:30 The Difference Between Story and Entertainment51:50 The Relevance and Universality of Meaningful Stories52:31 The Connection to Tradition and the Bigger Order of Things53:27 The Anti-Traditionalism of American Culture55:20 The Truncated Sense of Tradition in Modern Culture57:21 The Disconnect from Wisdom and Deep Stories58:26 The Need for a Recovery of Tradition and MeaningPS want to support the Wisdom Dojo?You can sign up for a one-time gift or a monthly donation, and all funds are used to cover the running costs of the pod 👇 Get full access to Raising the Cross at www.mahonmccann.com/subscribe

John is a professor of cognitive science and cognitive psychology at the University of Toronto and the creator of "Awakening from the Meaning Crisis." (check out his channel here and the PP and RR integration talk here ).In this podcast, we are discussing* predictive processing* John’s integration of predictive processing and relevance realisation* the nature and function of attention* Attention’s relation to agency and meaning in life* How can this new understanding of human beings be used to create aligned AIChapters:00:00 The Quest for Inner Peace and Optimal Agency00:23 Welcoming John Verveke: A Dialogue on Attention and AI00:32 Unveiling the Intricacies of Attention00:45 Predictive Processing and Relevance Realization: A Deep Dive01:51 Exploring the Spotlight Metaphor of Attention02:35 Beyond the Spotlight: A New Understanding of Attention04:04 Attention as Cognitive Unison: A Revolutionary Perspective05:21 The Interplay of Attention and Relevance Realization06:35 Precision Weighting: Bridging Predictive Processing and Relevance Realization07:30 From Cause Theories to Effect Theories of Attention09:19 The Emergence of Agency and the Role of Relevance Realization10:13 Predictive Processing: A Framework for Anticipation10:40 The Meta Problems of Anticipation and Relevance Realization14:46 Predictive Processing and the Sensory Motor Loop18:39 The Bias-Variance Trade-off in Predictive Processing20:34 Opponent Processing and Optimal Grip: A New Model of Attention22:52 Enhancing Agency and the Potential for Self-Deception25:26 Agency Emerges: Autopoietic Correction and Self-Organization27:17 Meaning as Optimal Agency: The Confluence of Predictive Processing and Relevance Realization29:12 The Autopoietic Nature of Mind and Body29:55 Plato's Insights on Internal Coordination30:33 The Quest for Optimal Agency and Inner Peace31:12 Predictive Processing and Motivation32:23 The Role of Persuasive Technologies32:44 Anticipation in Spatial and Temporal Contexts34:56 Optimal Agency and Collective Intelligence36:00 The Platonic Proposal for Human Flourishing37:55 AI as Agents vs. AI as Environment42:32 The Potential of AI to Foster Human Enlightenment43:45 Mentoring Machines for a Better Future45:18 The Challenge of Social Media Reform46:22 The Wicked Problem of Relevance Realization51:25 Stealing the Culture: A Bottom-Up Approach52:36 Historical Precedents for Cultural Transformation53:35 The Advent of a New Sacredness57:35 Redefining Success and Addressing Existential Questions01:01:21 The Silicon Sages: A Vision for AI01:01:37 Concluding Thoughts and Hopeful OutlookPS want to support the Wisdom Dojo?You can sign up for a one-time gift or a monthly donation, and all funds are used to cover the running costs of the pod 👇www.mahonmccann.com/gift Get full access to Raising the Cross at www.mahonmccann.com/subscribe

Adam Safron, Ph. D., is a Cognitive Scientist and psychologist who studies the nature of preferences and motivation from mechanistic, developmental, and evolutionary perspectives. Recently, he has proposed a model of embodied agency and free will and is working on a unified mechanistic account of psychedelics.This podcast discusses free will and embodied agency, the key role of attention and imagination, and the consequences of an individual's pursuit of meaning in life.Check out Adam's website 👇https://www.adamsafron.com/Google Scholar 👇https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=dZOoilgAAAAJ&hl=enThe Paper discussed on embodied agency 👇https://www.mdpi.com/1099-4300/23/6/783Chapters:00:00 Struggling with the Question of Free Will04:14 Starting from the Fundamental Mechanics06:34 Understanding How Agency Works09:46 Unifying Physicalism and Idealism12:24 Bridging the Gap Between Religion and Science17:48 Tracing the Mechanics of Action Selection18:16 The Evolution of Inhibition and Mental Simulation22:19 Conscientiousness and the Ability to Inhibit Distraction25:32 Embodied Self Models and Conscientiousness28:02 The Connection Between Conscientiousness and Conscience31:14 The Development of Imaginative Capacity for Agency35:02 The Connection Between Embodied Self Models and Meaning39:03 The Pursuit of Developmental Meaning42:43 The Disconnect Between Fitness in Reality and Digital43:51 The Normative Constraint of Imaginative Capacity45:28 The Destination of Agency: Enslavement to the Highest Good46:38 Neoplatonic Philosophy and Predictive Processing50:29 Distributed Cognition and Democracy51:13 Unity of the Soul and the Polis52:11 Practical Applications of Understanding Agency54:08 Creating Benevolent Agents55:22 Ethics and Principles in Technology56:19 Mission and Conclusion Get full access to Raising the Cross at www.mahonmccann.com/subscribe

Rick Repetti is a philosophy professor, meditation teacher, and author of several publications on free will (find more of Rick's work below).Rick’s website: https://www.rickrepetti.com/Awaken to meaning: https://awakentomeaning.com/American Philosophical Practitioners Association: https://appa.edu/In this podcast, we are critiquing Sapolski’s “determined” steel manning his case with the philosophy of determinism and showing how human beings possess the “degrees of freedom worth having” and how wisdom and spiritual traditions offer tools to enhance our agency.Check out the conversation 👇https://youtu.be/AJGyeZkGFLoTimestamps:00:00 Introduction and Sapolsky's Argument04:19 Critique of Sapolsky's Argument07:31 Legacy of Newtonian Causality09:45 Determinism and Free Will11:13 Indeterminism and Free Will16:46 The Dialogical Self19:40 Meditation and Self-Conditioning26:28 Ultimate Moral Responsibility32:37 Self-Forming Actions and Free Will37:18 The Dialogical Self and Agency42:02 Attention and Agency48:00 Cultivating Agency through Meditation51:05 Opponent Processing and Evolution52:07 Attentional Flexibility and Imaginary Attention53:01 Simulating Other Minds and Counterfactual Reasoning54:07 Simulating the Future and Rational Deliberation55:07 Taking Processes Offline and Online56:32 Rational Agency and Thinking57:03 Liver Enzymes and Rationality57:29 Simulating Ideas and Writing58:25 Inhibition and Simulation59:33 Attentional Deficit and Meditative Practices01:00:15 Organizing Behavior Across Time01:01:14 Prudential Reasoning and Agency01:02:11 Debating Sapolsky and Future Projects01:03:37 Philosophical Practitioners Association and Book Club01:05:43 Philosophy of Meditation Series and APA Courses01:06:08 Weekly Meditations and Starter Ecology of Practices Get full access to Raising the Cross at www.mahonmccann.com/subscribe

Jelle Bruineberg is an assistant professor at the University of Copenhagen, Department of Media, Cognition and Communication.Read his paper ‘Adversarial Inference: Predictive Minds in the Attention Economy’: https://academic.oup.com/nc/article/2023/1/niad019/7251284In this podcast, we discuss the attention economy, the psychology and cognitive science of attention, predictive processing, AI and the future of the internet. Watch the full conversation 👇https://youtu.be/W8BAXZVNph0Timestamps:00:00 Introduction to the Attention Economy and Adversarial Inference06:37  Limitations of the Broadbandian Conception of Attention08:14 The Role of Action in Attention11:51 The Relationship Between Attention and Executive Function15:36 External and Internal Triggers in Attention17:28 The Role of Self-Modeling in Attention and Agency20:28 The Impact of Digital Environments on Attention and Concentration25:06 Precariousness of Agency and Environmental Scaffolding27:46 The Role of Positive Affect and Dopamine in Attention31:59 Designing Environments to Support Attention and Agency36:29 The Influence of AI on the Attention Economy and Agency47:17 The Role of AI in Society48:44 The Impact of Technology on Affordances49:13 Regulating Digital Technologies50:12 Building Agency-Enhancing Technologies51:30 The Need for a New Philosophy53:55 The Challenge of a Unified Theory of Attention55:59 Attention as a Core Cognitive Process56:45 Rebuilding the InternetWant to support the podcast?Join up for a paid subscription 👇https://www.mahonmccann.com/subscribe?gift=true Get full access to Raising the Cross at www.mahonmccann.com/subscribe

Matthew David Segall, Phd, is a transdisciplinary researcher, writer, teacher, and philosopher applying process-relational thought across the natural and social sciences and to the study of consciousness. He is the Associate Professor in the Philosophy, Cosmology, and Consciousness Program at California Institute of Integral Studies in San Francisco, CA and the Chair of the Science Advisory Committee for the Cobb Institute.Get his new book ‘Crossing The Threshold: Etheric Imagination in the Post-Kantian Process Philosophy of Schelling and Whitehead’.Check out his youtube channel Footnotes2PlatoChapters:00:00 Introduction and the Kantian Divide04:59 Kant's Epistemological Dualism07:34 The Role of Imagination in Kant's Philosophy12:00 The Impact of Nominalism on Imagination17:28 The Connection Between Imagination and Self-Transcendence21:07 Whitehead's Cosmology and the Role of Imagination25:26 Transcendental Apperception and Contextualization29:16 Whitehead's Philosophy in Historical Context36:53 Whitehead's Panentheistic View of God46:06 Whitehead's View on Free Will and Determinism50:04 Whitehead's View on Human Agency and Evolution51:08 The Open Universe and Free-will52:16 The Vegetable Universe56:22 Life Precedes Matter58:07 Death as Part of Life59:32 Overcoming the Meaning Crisis01:00:38 The Role of Religion in Finding Meaning01:03:38 Translating Complex Ideas Get full access to Raising the Cross at www.mahonmccann.com/subscribe

The fourth dimension of meaning in life is not reported in the psychological literature but was added by Cognitive Scientist John Veraveke, and this dimension is called ‘depth’. He describes depth as the felt sense of being connected to ‘what is most real’. Read the full essay at www.mahonmccann.com Get full access to Raising the Cross at www.mahonmccann.com/subscribe

Dr Iain McGilchrist is a psychiatrist, neuroscience researcher, philosopher, literary scholar, and the world’s foremost expert on brain hemispheric differences. He has written several significant books, such as The Master and his Emissary: The Divided Brain and the Making of the Western World (2009) and the recent The Matter with Things (2021).Connect with Iain 👇 https://channelmcgilchrist.com/ https://www.youtube.com/@DrIainMcGilchrist Buy The Matter with Things 👇 https://www.amazon.co.uk/Matter-Things-Delusions-Unmaking-Paperback/dp/1914568257Timestamps:0:00 - intro0:29 - Functioning of the Two Cerebral Hemispheres1:10 - Attention in Perception and Understanding1:45 - The Influence of Context on Perception3:11 - Attention on Future Perception and Behavior 5:35 - Hemispheric Differences & Culture13:39 - The Role of Attention in Understanding Reality15:52 - Values in Perception and Attention34:00 - The Illusion of Materialistic Satisfaction37:51 - The Role of Dopamine and Addiction in Our Lives47:29 - The Threat of Technology and AI on Human Relationships50:17 - The Importance of Humanities in Education Get full access to Raising the Cross at www.mahonmccann.com/subscribe