Philokalia Ministries

To read Saint John and the other fathers, and to read their writings deeply is to find oneself caught up in wonder. We begin to see that so much of the spiritual life, its discipline, and the hardships the fathers endured, are a reflection of their desire.  These were men that were filled with a holy longing for what Christ alone could satisfy. They ran with a kind of swiftness and sought to unburden themselves from anything that would be an impediment or weigh them down and prevent them from entering into the fullness of the life and love of Christ. The remembrance of death and mourning over one’s sins are not practices that are abstracted from our relationship with Christ and the love that has been revealed to us in Him. All of these things spur us on to enter into His embrace, and never leave it.  If the Christian life and the ascetic life is seen outside of this relationship then, as Saint Paul tells us, we are the most pitiable of all men. God has created us for Himself and in so doing has created a hunger that He alone can satisfy. We have been made for love and our hearts will find no rest until they find the One for whom they long. --- Text of chat during the group: 00:26:26 Anthony: I believe I read part of St. Thomas More's meditation on death (he being quite Western), that the pain of the soul leaving the body, is quite real, and a necessary evil.   00:27:00 Anthony: I was just affirming what you wrote, that's all.  :)   00:35:34 Anthony: You said we magnify the importance of things out of proportion to their value - this is fearing things temporal, but not having fear of the Lord, isn't it?   00:42:51 Sheila Applegate: As much as I know in my heart God fulfills and heals and is all, sometimes.God feels empty and disconnected and lacking and the things here feel fulfilling or at least tangible and in that, familiar and comforting.  So therein lies a temporal conflict of interest.   00:49:48 Sheila Applegate: Yeah. That makes sense.   00:49:58 Sheila Applegate: We grasp at the concrete.   00:59:59 Anthony: TO combine a martial arts analogy with the Crucifixion - this fear is like throwing the enemy off balance.  Christ was the bait swallowed by death willingly, so that He could catch death and defeat it.  We follow His example, and take hold of this enemy so that we can in His grace and example direct death to our benefit>   01:15:31 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: Lord, give us Your Love to love you with!   01:16:26 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 🙂   01:16:27 Jeffrey Ott: Thank you!! Happy Thanksgiving!   01:16:28 Deiren Masterson: God bless father - all. Thank you   01:16:29 Rachel: Thank you  

This evening we concluded Hypothesis 29. We heard from one father after another of the importance of having a spirit of gratitude in our lives. We are to enter into the spiritual battle, expecting affliction, temptation and hardship. Furthermore, we are to see these things as coming to us through the providence of God.    Is it not this that we are often tempted to reject?  We question: “Does God really ask this of us? Is he truly present to us or has he abandon us by allowing us to experience such great crosses in our lives?”  The resounding answer to all these questions from the fathers is that God permeates these crosses, knows how they will they will affect and afflict us and how his grace will also perfect the virtue within us if we hope in Him. We often fail to see how deeply the “prosperity” gospel has permeated our minds and our hearts. So often we think faith in God should bring us certain blessings in this world. Even if this is not consciously on our minds, it is often what we desire; that God would bless our lives, our work and our relationships. It is tantamount to what Karl Barth called “practical atheism.”  We believe in our minds, but in our daily actions towards others, and in our unwillingness to embrace our cross, we show that we lack the faith and the resolve of the Saints. --- Text of chat during the group:  00:31:01 Ambrose Little, OP: Can’t recall if we’ve covered this before, but most of the strivings of the monks in these writings seem to be doing so on behalf of themselves, at least there is little note made of intercessory prayer. But I think I recall that a key aspect of Western monasticism, especially cloistered, is that they are ever interceding for the world and the Church. Is this an accurate impression and, if so, why do you think they don’t make as much of it in the desert monastic spirituality? It’s almost like (as in this reading), they more or less just consign the world and worldly to hell if they’re not entering into monasticism or the hermit life.   00:34:11 Anthony: If Macchiavelli, Sun Tzu and Von Clausewitz have numerous strategies to take over an enemy, demons would have many more insofar as they were present when we were created and are by nature more "intellectual" than us.  So maybe they can perceive more than us and try to anticipate our future victories and sabotage them before we have an inkling that we can be the victors.   00:35:38 Jack: Thats what I understand “psychics" to be   00:36:05 Jack: communicating with fallen spirits   00:37:13 Anthony: medium   00:43:22 Ambrose Little, OP: What does it mean “never satisfied his own will” there?   00:46:07 carol: Even with psychological strain its easy to turn to self focus   00:51:13 Anthony: Thus the children of Israel when leaving Egypt were not led out to the land of the Philistines, lest they be discouraged by those strong people.   00:53:02 Anthony: and listening to the counsel develops virtue of obedience   01:03:51 Anthony: There is something in Revelation that cowards can't enter Heaven.  God is giving us the practice we need against cowardice.  and Pope St Peter has something about the trying of our faith working patience, etc.    

We take a step now with Saint John that one likely would not consider as essential - The Remembrance of death. John begins by makes some important distinctions for us. There is a fear of death that is rooted in its very nature; the loss of life and the end of life as we know it because of the Fall. There is also a kind of terror of death that is rooted in unrepented sins. Focus upon God and his love, a repentant spirit, drives out fear from the human heart. At one point John describes it as a “fearless fear”. We acknowledge our own mortality, the brevity of this life, the weight and significance of our actions; however, in light of our relationship with Christ and the conquering of death through the resurrection, the mindfulness of death is something that always leads to hope. Our mindfulness of our mortality sharpens our focus upon what has value and weight. The deeper and more perfect faith becomes, the more we are going to long to be with Christ in such a way that knows of no impediment and no limitation. Of course there are going to be those who are incorrigible; those so deeply rooted in the things of this world and the pursuit of satisfying their own desires, that the notion of remembering death seems cruel to them or meaningless. For Christians, however, it becomes the path to virtue and once we have tasted it, experienced the disciplines that surround the remembrance of death, then our hearts begin to be filled with joy. Ultimately this is where John is leading us; from the sorrow and mourning of our sin to the fruit of repentance - joy! --- Text of chat during the group:  00:26:57 FrDavid Abernethy: page 107   00:36:07 Anthony: So the remembrance of death is an antidote to avarice:  Lust of flesh, lust of eyes, pride of life?   00:50:40 Anthony: Is fear sometimes from an overexaggerated sense of duty?   01:12:35 Bridget McGinley: I once was advised to fast from speech..... it transformed my spiritual life. Fasting can be in various forms I suppose.   01:14:24 Anthony: I at times read about a Russian Martial Art called "Systema." It incorporates ascetic practice and Russian Orthodox faith into its mindset and training; and the persons who testify to it say their experience is life changing; instructors claim to have many godchildren around the world because their came to appreciate Orthodoxy through living this ascetic and self-aware. martial art.   01:23:33 Rebecca Thérèse: Fasting also has many physical health benefits   01:24:14 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂   01:25:15 Rafael Patrignani: thank You father  

We found ourselves this evening entering more deeply into the nature of the spiritual struggle and warfare and the effects that it has upon us and others. We do not exist in isolation and there is no passive position in the spiritual life or our relationship with God. We either struggle with the passions or they gradually direct our life. We either struggle with God and those he has given to support us and to be our allies in the battle or we begin to war with the tyrant. Our willingness to enter into the struggle with temptation, to fearlessly endure the trials that we undergo in life begins to reveal more and more to the soul. We begin to be able to distinguish between virtue and vice with a greater clarity. We also acquire virtue by this warfare and toil and so begin to see that we are more steadfast when embattled. Though stronger, however, we also learn that we must remain humble and hate vice so as to avoid it. Finally, we see our frailty in all of its fullness and the love and the power of God. The very battle itself reveals so much about ourselves and the hidden regions of the unconscious; that have been wounded by our sin or from having lived in a fallen world. Yet, it also reveals to us the very desire of God. God longs and yearns for our love. He thirsts for it. Such things are not learned from books but rather through the experience of the Paschal mystery. It is through dying to sin and self and rising to life in Christ that we come to know Him and to understand the nature of divine love.   ---   Text of chat during the group:    00:38:39 Eric Ewanco: this paragraph really resonates with my recent experience!!   00:52:17 Anthony: Pope Benedict wrote about a non-sinful understanding of Eros.   00:52:45 Anthony: Spe Salvi?   00:54:04 Rachel: Can one experience these temptations so keenly that they feel as if they are actually doing violence to themselves? Especially when it come to thoughts. Where one does not wish to sin in the thoughts let alone sins of action. Do the demons and our wounds from past sins attack us even greater and rebel when we have set our hearts on God and his will alone? I know someone who described the fight as almost maddening because they had been so steeped in sin that the battle would even feel physically and mentally wounding. it reminds me of when Saint may of Egypt told Abba Zosimas that there were some days she would spend face down on the ground until they passed. Calling on the name of Jese.   00:54:11 Rachel: Jesus.   00:54:15 Eric Ewanco: I don't see "eros" occur in Spe Salvi   00:55:50 Ashley Kaschl: I think it might be in Deus Caritas Est   00:56:32 Eric Ewanco: probably; I see 34 hits for eros there   01:00:14 Anthony: For what it's worth, sometimes, I almost feel that the devils even wish to snatch away prayer or take over consciousness to direct my attention away from God and to them.   01:01:10 Eric Ewanco: oh yeah; definitely, @anthony   01:01:40 Anthony: On the timelessness of the unconscious, "Iconostasis" by Fr. Pavel Florensky opens with this theme.   01:03:57 Rachel: Yes! This is precisely what I hoped you would touch upon.   01:06:48 Rachel: Where it would seem to bring a person the the edge of sanity but that is precisly where all of our ideas that we had of ourselves and of God are brought into the light. Where one become disillusioned with oneself and realizes that they have been brought to the threshold of the bridal chamber. Where there are no illusions and one stands as they are, in God. Where on e allows themselves to be loved as they have always been.   01:08:32 Ashley Kaschl: Took me a little longer to type this out but I wanted to bounce off of Anthony’s comment on eros, I was recently talking to some friends about Pope Benedict’s clarifying of what God’s love looks like. Pope B says something like “on the Cross, God’s eros is made present for us.” Because His love is both agape and eros. Agape because it is selfless, self-gift, unconditional, sacrificial, etc. AND eros because God yearns for His people in the same way that eros burns passionately for the beloved. Eros moves the lover to become one with the beloved, ie, Christ and His church and through the Eucharist. So on the Cross, God begs the love of His people. Prayer is our act of eros back to God, where our own yearning for Him is most present within us as we call out to Him from our innermost being. So prayer is also the biggest target of the enemy because he knows that if he can destroy our connection to God, he greatly frustrate our passionate desire for Him.   01:13:43 Babington (or Babi): Thank you!  

It has always been difficult for men to allow God to lead them in accord with His wisdom. There is always a part of us that wants to embrace what fits in with our judgment and view of things rather than allowing God to reveal - that is, to draw back the veil - in order that we might see the deeper truth. This is especially true when it means being drawn into the Paschal Mystery; the dying and rising of Christ and also our participation in that dying and rising. What does this mean for us, what does it mean to be faced with the abyss of sin and its darkness and to experience this darkness within our hearts? What does it mean to walk in hope even though we cannot see what lies ahead, when no light penetrates the darkness. St. John invites us to make that journey. The spiritual life takes place in the context of this tremendous mystery. It is not going to be comfortable and we will often  want to look away or rationalize why this mystery cannot or does not touch our lives. It becomes very difficult for us to trust in the mercy of God when He invites us so deeply into the mystery of our own redemption. We would still have it our own way. The path of humility and obedient love, especially as we see it manifest on the cross is always going to be a test to our faith and our desire for God. --- Text of chat during the group:  00:13:45 Cindy Moran: I am changing my name to Cindy Fitznstartz.   00:14:44 Mark Cummings: 😂   00:14:44 Cindy Moran: This was from something you said in your session on Monday.   00:35:24 Cindy Moran: Were the men in the "Prison" still under any obligation to recite the Psalms or something of the like?   00:52:25 Sr Mary of our Divine Savior solt: 2 Peter 2:22 It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness than to have known it and then to turn away from the holy commandment passed on to them. 22Of them the proverbs are true: “A dog returns to its vomit,” and, “A sow that is washed goes back to her wallowing in the mud.” Berean Standard Bible · Download     Cross References Proverbs 26:11 As a dog returns to its vomit, so a fool repeats his folly.   John 10:6 Jesus spoke to them using this illustration, but they did not understand what He was telling them.     Treasury of Scripture But it is happened to them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.   The dog.   Proverbs 26:11 As a dog returneth to his vomit, so a fool returneth to his folly.   2 Peter 2:22 " The dog returns to its own vomit and the sow afer washing herself, returns to wallow in the mire..   00:53:07 Sr Mary of our Divine Savior solt: sorry I was thinking about this passage and by accident sent it too quickly   00:57:19 Robert Anderson: that others may be holier than me...powerful   00:59:35 Robert Anderson: the only thing I can take credit for is my sins   00:59:59 Eric Ewanco: 👍🏻   01:01:01 Anthony: The prayers attributed to St. Basil in the Publican's Prayer Book are examples of deep self-knowledge and poverty.  They inspire me in self--knowledge and contrition.   01:07:27 Ambrose Little, OP: Aside: Origen was no atheist. ;)   01:10:12 Daniel Allen: There is an amazing book called Laurus. It’s a recent novel, but it may flesh out the concept of the prison in a detailed way   01:20:20 Anthony: The more deeply and purely one loves, the more grieved one is by evil towards the lover - and horrified when _we did the evil against the Pure Beloved._   01:27:26 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 🙂   01:27:41 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father  

It’s hard to imagine the depths of the beauty of the fathers’ insights into the nature of spiritual warfare. Having read the writings of the fathers throughout the years, it’s not an easy thing to say that that Hypotheses 28 and 29 are the finest description I’ve ever read not only on the nature of asceticism but of spiritual warfare. The compiler of The Evergetinos draws together the wisdom of the fathers in such a way that it paints an image of such detail that it creates a visceral experience and compels one to do some soul-searching. Are we engaged in the spiritual battle and aware of its nature? Do we understand the nature of the enemy that we war against and his tactics? Do we understand that there is no neutral territory in this world in regards to the spiritual life? The enemy is a tyrant and those who give themselves over to him freely will find them selves under his control. “From among men who have been taken captive by barbarians and are under the thumb of a tyrant, all those who rejoice at the successes of the enemy by whom they have been captured gladly remain close to the foe, without fetters and confinement, and struggle for the victory of the enemy, and, in fact, are used as spies, to the detriment of their compatriots.” All those who wish to be free from bitter slavery to the enemy must undertake open warfare against him. It is necessary for strugglers to call on the aid of God unceasingly. He is not only our ally but our only hope in the battle. It is by His Grace and strength that we can conquer the persistent and merciless enemy. --- Text of chat during the group:  00:18:53 FrDavid Abernethy: page 243   00:23:21 Bridget: Acedia.  I am infected with it these days!   00:28:22 Anthony: Why can't we just decide not to let it bother us? why does it cling?   00:30:03 Carol Nypaver: Page?   00:30:28 Carol Nypaver: ty   00:58:48 Anthony: A note on culture for Part G, paragraph 4.  Rusks (in Italian cooking) are twice-baked circular loaves of bread.  They can be stored for several months.  To eat, first moisten under water, then top with a spread or cold cuts.  I love them with an eggplant and olive mixture spread (like eggplant caponata) on top.   01:00:08 Eric Ewanco: I need those   01:20:15 Anthony: I think the concept of spiritual warfare highlights the difference between monergism (that all of salvation is God's work and we contribute nothing) and synergy (that we are required to work with God's work in our salvation).  At least, that is my experience having been in a monergist tradition and talking with friends still in that tradition; and that monergism formed our American culture.  It's like the way of thinking about God neutralizes the believer in that tradition against the thought of considering spiritual warfare.  It is in a way very hard to be Catholic.   01:27:09 Rachel Pineda: But Climacus and Saint Issac etc are saying the same thing!   01:28:04 Rachel Pineda: Thank you  

As a group we read through Saint John’s description of the “Prison”, that place of deep repentance freely entered and embraced by those who had broken their vows and sinned against God.  John holds the image of this place before our eyes in order that it might act as a mirror. Listening to the description and envisioning it within our minds, we are to ask ourselves: Do we see the same kind of sorrow over sin and infidelity in the face of Love? Do we see anything within us of the zeal that these men have for the Lord? Having fallen into the pit of iniquity are we equally willing to sink into the abyss of the humility of the repentant?  We seem perfectly willing to bear the indignity of sin and its tyranny even though we understand that Christ took our flesh upon Himself, made Himself to be sin in order that He might also take upon Himself the consequence of that sin which is death. What is our awareness of that reality and faith revealed to us? Does it pierce the heart? Do we bewail the loss of virtues as if they were children that have died? Do we cry out, where is my purity of prayer? Where is my former boldness? Where the sweet tears instead of the bitter? Where is the hope of perfect chastity and perfect purification? Where is my faith in the shepherd? --- Text of chat during the group:  00:17:46 Anthony: "Blessed are those who mourn for they shall be comforted."   00:25:40 Anthony: Perhaps this mourning is actually the goal of even modern day sentences for fallen religious to retire to a monastery and do penance for great sins?  This sounds like it is for the most serious of sins.   00:32:12 Daniel Allen: This oddly makes me think of Mary holding Jesus when he was taken from the cross. Her Son, all her joy and blessing, now lifeless and in her hands but not there. But awaiting the resurrection   00:39:21 Carol: It reminds me of the Song of Songs, chasing after the Beloved.   00:45:14 Rachel: you touched upon something that I was wondering about. How at the core of a lack of a desire to make reparation to live a penitential life in the acknowledgment of what sin does to us, is a lack of faith in the goodness of God.   00:54:42 Ren: The thought that is coming most to mind, for me, in reading this step is: do I take my sin seriously? Do I really accept the truth about what sin does, and what its “wages” are? - death. That death reenters the world within me with each sin. Or do I take the crucifixion for granted? So far removed from it as a historical event that I am comfortable with what has been done for me? Sadly, I realize that I really do hold sin lightly.   01:00:18 Anthony: The movie "The Professor and the Madman" illustrates this kind of lifelong mourning for a deed - even an evil deed that might not have been done by a madman.   01:00:35 Ashley Kaschl: Love that movie. So true.   01:00:39 Anthony: *might _have_ been done by a madman   01:05:21 Rachel: I want to add to what Ren was touching upon. Many people are uncomfortable with shame, I am speaking of a healthy shame that is the result of real sin. How one can be discouraged by others who are uncomfortable with really entering in to the suffering of another and what bigger suffering is there than sin and its consequences? This is why God became man.   01:08:58 Ashley Kaschl: A priest once helped someone I know to understand penance as a daily thing, not just something you do after confession, especially when he gave that someone a lifelong penance for a sin not connected to murder or something horrifically physical but for a spiritual sin. This priest did not do so as a punishment, and it was in the bounds of not being an unjust burden upon the person, but because the person had been approaching a sin against the Holy Spirit (despair of God’s mercy). So the balm, according to this confession, was a life-long, daily prayer as a penance so that the soul would not be confounded by this temptation. Obviously, this is not the norm these days, but I have met a few people who have such penances, who aren’t murderers or rapists or thieves, etc. But I think it is interesting to ponder.   01:15:11 Babington (or Babi): Thank you. 🙏🏼💔🙏🏼✝️   01:15:28 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 🙂   01:15:37 Cindy Moran: Thank you, Father.  

Once again we are presented with the fathers’ writing on asceticism. This evening we were given the essentials, the starting point for the pursuit of the spiritual life; fasting and vigils. We are told that without these practices we enter into the spiritual battle unarmed and no virtue will be gained. We fail to imitate Christ who, before taking up his public ministry, fasted and prayed in the desert for 40 days; precisely to show us what is necessary in the battle against the Enemy who tempted Him at the end of His fasting period. We may feel humiliated and weakened in body but on a spiritual level we come to know the strength and the virtue of Christ himself. Fasting from food and sleep reveals our basic desire for God and an acknowledgment that strength and grace come from Him alone. In all of this we have to have bravery and show great resolve and willingness to continue patiently in doing what is good, ever calling upon God to help and defend us. When we fail, we should not be indifferent or despair or abandon the attempt. Rather, we should increase our zeal and look to the instructions and guidance of the expert; first and foremost Christ himself and then all of the saints throughout the centuries who have conformed themselves to Him. --- Text of chat during the group: 00:34:29 Ren: I must say that, for myself, and though I do not have the opportunity for it anymore, that I have never felt more joy or peace or intimacy in prayer than that which I experienced in vigil adoration. Being someone who struggles with moderation in sleep, its hard to accept, but my own experience has confirmed what the Fathers say so many times over. It really does feel like a whole different kind of prayer. Something about the deep silence and stillness of the night bring us so close to God.   00:39:34 Ambrose Little, OP: It seems like it doesn’t have to be severe, to the point of being unhealthy, but more like discipline in the sense of exercise—limiting within reason, unless we feel God is calling us to do more at times. Like you (Father) have suggested—getting up in early morning for a time of prayer.  On the other hand, for many, in our day at least, we fail on the other side of it—often not getting enough sleep because of lack of discipline in favor of entertainment (for example). In that case, the better exercise might first be to be more disciplined about getting an appropriate amount of sleep, which may better set us up for success in regular prayer as well.   00:40:32 Ren: Oof. So true Ambrose. I’m sleep deprived half the time….and its not because of prayer. More like Frasier, or the Office.   00:41:04 Carol Nypaver: That’s an excellent point!  And—one I can relate to.😳   00:42:26 Anthony: Our modern theory of work is a Puritan tyranny.  We can't take it, it's "dominion" over this world outside of the natural and normal human rhythm.   00:49:31 Anthony: The only way Jesus could have done this (in my opinion) is out of love.  Love is the most powerful reason to put aside even unselfish weakness and even the use of reason "if I don't satisfy myself, I'll go nuts or die."   00:57:34 Anthony: This reminds me of the patristic idea that Jesus was acting as bait, which the devil thought was easy prey.  But the devil was tricked and defeated.  In imitation of Christ, then, we weaken ourselves and -only if? - we are united to the Vine, God desires us to be weakened and thus be a trap in the imitation of Christ.  "My strength is made perfect in weakness."   00:57:51 Anthony: And - is that feeling of being overwhelmed by vile thoughts a sin?   01:06:32 Rachel: If you were going to die tomorrow most would love fasting   01:14:28 Rachel: That is interesting. it reminds me of the saying that he who prays truly is a theologian. If one wishes to truly pray they must do the will of God. The simple thing like ordering all of ones life, everything, to the will of God. Rising, sleeping, eating, praying and everything in between. Why try to control ones thoughts if we cannot control our bellies or lose a little sleep? I am not saying to give up vigilance but to add to it the weapons the holy fathers are speaking of with patience and trust in His providence. A little grandmother hidden away can truly become a theologian this way   01:20:15 Anthony: The Christmas fast has different lengths.  I find the Slavic St. Philip's Fast good but awkward in the Roman Calendar.  Adding fasting to advent or practicing the shorter Melkite Fast could work, too.   01:21:45 Rachel: Wait, has anyones halloween candy ever lasted until Christmas??   01:23:37 Louis: Thank you Fr.!   01:23:52 Rachel: Thank you!   01:23:54 Babington (or Babi): Thank you  

Thank you to everyone who participated tonight in a very challenging reading and discussion of The Ladder of Divine Ascent. Synopsis: Tonight we began Step Five on painstaking repentance and an account of the Prison, another monastic community for those who have broken their vows and embraced a life of deep penance. This is probably the most difficult part of The Ladder to read. It requires the most work from us as readers to think about what John is doing. Why does he present us with such an image? Why paint a portrait of such a place of pain and affliction? Does he not risk losing readers because of the story? What is described is disturbing and meant to be so. For seeing what is so disturbing, our willingness to look at it and the unvarnished truth it present us with, also allows us to grasp its opposite – the invincible joy of knowing and loving Christ. Indeed, the sorrow is part of the joy.  We can only begin to understand St. John’s description of repentance and “the Prison” in light of the Cross itself. We see Christ take upon himself the sin of the world and what it cost him and how he sweat blood in the garden of Gethsemane. These men of the Prison, that place of deep penance, entered into the Paschal mystery so deeply and could see the beauty of it so fully that their mourning and sorrow was a participation in the sorrows of the cross. And the desolation that they experienced was that of Christ himself calling out “My God, My God, why have you forsaken me.” We tend to think of things in isolation and our own experiences in isolation from others and from those of Christ. But what we have seen with the fathers over and over again is this kind of radical solidarity that exists between us and that allows us to participate in the redemptive aspects of Christ’s work including the sorrows and darkness of the Cross and the descent into Hell.  “I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me.” Galatians 2:20. --- Text of chat during the group:  00:12:41 FrDavid Abernethy: Beginning Step 5 on page 97   00:33:32 Eric Ewanco: I've heard it said that the first sin involved eating which is why fasting is so important   00:47:59 Ashley Kaschl: In paragraph 7, that seems like a debilitating shame, how would one break free from that?   00:52:13 Cathy Murphy: The last sentence in paragraph 7 is challenging.  If they are full of sorrow and repentant how are their souls offering nothing to God?   00:58:13 Ambrose Little, OP: I find it difficult to reconcile what appears to be dwelling in sorrow with confidence in God’s work in our lives and the lives of others. If the promises are true, then it seems like we should mostly dwell in joy and gratitude as penitents.   01:17:33 Mary M: I might be off because I missed the reading itself, but it seems like one of those Catholic principles held in tension together, where it's "both and" rather than "either or." It's neither despair over the depth of the gravity of sin nor presumption on the mercy of God, but simultaneously the deepest sorrow and joy in light of the reality of our sin and God's mercy.   01:25:26 Ambrose Little, OP: Seeing it as a mirror of the effects of sin (a kind of picture of hell) is helpful to me.   01:34:11 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 🙂   01:34:12 Jeffrey Ott: Thank you so much! Great to be with you all.  

We began hypothesis 28 this evening. I have to say that it is one of the clearest and most straightforward explanations and discussion of the ascetical life. What comes forward through the fathers’ teaching is not only the necessity of asceticism, of striving for God and for the life of virtue, but also the beauty that one begins to see and the sweetness of the life of virtue that one begins to taste. The ascetic life is indeed filled with toil and sweat. However, it is not simply a test of endurance. The Christian has set before his eyes the Beloved and the promises He holds out before us of intimacy with Him and the experience of the joy of the kingdom.  There are so many things that create a resistance within us to this kind of striving. Laziness and negligence can easily take over when that desire for God grows cold and when our hearts become indifferent to the blessings that He offers us as well as the consolation that comes from fidelity to His commandments. We must, the fathers tell us, have a good beginning. In fact, Abba Isaac tells us if we want to begin a Godly work, we must first give a promise to God that we will not live for the present life and that we will be prepared to die rather than sacrifice what is pleasing to Him. Hope for the present life ennervates the mind and does not allow us to make any progress. We must be clear in our purpose. The love of Christ must compel us. --- Text of chat during the group:  00:19:10 Anthony: EXACTLY:  We need a vision to love to make this irksome asceticism worthwhile. 00:23:58 Carol Nypaver: St. Josemaria Escriva called it “the heroic minute” when the alarm goes off in the morning. 00:29:37 Anthony: Is there some kind of hoe or spade available to cut thorns out without cutting our hands? 00:31:56 Lee Graham: In Therapy, ice water is used to help people stop cutting. They are told that whenever they get the urge to cut, to place their arm in ice water. 00:33:34 Lee Graham: Releases endorphins as does the cutting 00:42:07 Anthony: That is a Stoic understanding of asceticism.  They have nothing to love. And with our formerly Catholic culture stripped of beauty to become a Puritan existence, our positive asceticism for the beatific vision becomes mere endurance 00:57:00 Carol Nypaver: Please explain “casting oneself into the sea of afflictions.”  Seeking out afflictions? 01:07:55 Denise T. : As a mom of many children how do I maintain an indifference to all earthly things? What does that look like? I have a hard time with that concept.  01:09:33 Ashley Kaschl: Anecdotally, the parts of this concerning toiling and knowing without praxis, has me thinking about a period of aridity I was experiencing some time ago. Adoration is usually where I spend my time when this happens and I was so tired when I finally managed to get there one day that I assumed a position that I knew I could remain reverent in for a long time without growing weary of it, where I could remain still and quiet because interiorly I was anything but.  I asked the Lord why it was so hard to pray, why it was so hard hear Him, and why I was so restless all the time. And after a while, the answer came very clearly, accompanied by all the extra things I had taken on because of my restlessness and because of my lack of trust in Him, and He reminded me that, “I am a jealous God.” I think I’m very prone to forgetting this, that when the Lord has invited one along the narrow path, we are not supposed to pick up extra burdens, tasks, or to take up other paths when there is a storm when in reality the Lord 01:10:42 Ashley Kaschl: is only asking me to take shelter and not to deviate. 01:11:35 Ambrose Little, OP: @Denise, with regards to your comment above, I tend to think that part of our service to and love of God in this life, as parents, is to love our children--to seek their good selflessly. To use the things of this world in service of others, we can be personally indifferent while understanding how they are means to express that love. 01:15:18 Denise T. : Thank you, Father. That is helpful to me.