The Covert Narcissism Podcast

Psychologist Dr. Erica Ellis joins us in this episode. She brings wonderful expertise regarding high conflict divorce and how to protect the children. Dr. Ellis is not only a licensed psychologist, but also a best-selling author, and a leading expert on child centered divorce. After working with over 1,000 divorcing families, many of which were high-conflict, over the past 30 years, she has discovered the crucial steps that every parent must take to protect their children and create a healthy future for their new family. For more information on her programs, click below: How to Co-Parent with a Narcissist The 30-Day Divorce Triage With her unique approach to divorce, Dr. Ellis has helped countless families navigate the divorce process in a way that reduces conflict, stress, and uncertainty, and sets the children up for a lifetime of healthy relationships, emotional stability, and personal success. The questions addressed in this episode include: 1) From a psychological perspective, why is it important to understand the difference between a true narcissist vs a person whose behavior/emotions have significantly deteriorated during the stress of a marriage ending? 2) Given how important it is to have realistic expectations for your narcissistic ex’s behavior, can you talk about why parenting itself poses such a challenge for them and how this tends to play out in their relationship with their children? 3) All of those challenges often leave the other parent feeling totally hopeless, helpless, and lacking any ability to protect themselves and their children from any further emotional damage. Can you talk about this sense of powerlessness and your thoughts about how to help people get beyond it? 4) I know that your main focus is on helping parents learn how to best protect their children from divorce-related damage. How is it possible to accomplish that goal when dealing with a narcissistic parent? For more information on her programs, click below: How to Co-Parent with a Narcissist The 30-Day Divorce Triage --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/covertnarcissism/support   I am Renee Swanson, and I help people recover from covert narcissistic abuse. Are you tired of feeling isolated and alone?  Are you searching for people who get it?  Are you confused, reactive and unsure what to do?  Are you running in circles in your mind? Are you worried for your kids and the effect this is having on them?  Do you want to know how not to raise another narcissist in this world? I can help you! I offer both group and individual coaching, which you can find at www.covertnarcissism.com   Renee Swanson, Certified Coach and Advocate for Victims of Covert Narcissistic Abuse http://www.covertnarcissism.com https://www.tiktok.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.youtube.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.facebook.com/renee.covertnarcissism

Covert narcissism is so well hidden that most victims have no idea that it is abuse until they are many years, even decades, into a relationship. Some never ever see it. This is part 2 of the signs of covert narcissism. If you missed part one, go back and listen to last week’s episode. It is titled It’s About What the Victim Doesn’t See. In that episode I talk about the fact that the victim doesn’t see the abuse. I don’t want to take anything away from the fact that the world doesn’t see it either. They certainly don’t! This is an issue that I will be addressing here in a future episode. So that last episode is the covert narcissism checklist, and I explain how each abusive characteristic is so easily hidden from the victim. Now part 2 is about the signs that are in you, the victim. Sometimes the best way to tell if a person is narcissistic is to look at the thoughts and feelings of those closest to them. You need to take a deep look inside of you to see if the signs of abuse are there. --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/covertnarcissism/support   I am Renee Swanson, and I help people recover from covert narcissistic abuse. Are you tired of feeling isolated and alone?  Are you searching for people who get it?  Are you confused, reactive and unsure what to do?  Are you running in circles in your mind? Are you worried for your kids and the effect this is having on them?  Do you want to know how not to raise another narcissist in this world? I can help you! I offer both group and individual coaching, which you can find at www.covertnarcissism.com   Renee Swanson, Certified Coach and Advocate for Victims of Covert Narcissistic Abuse http://www.covertnarcissism.com https://www.tiktok.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.youtube.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.facebook.com/renee.covertnarcissism

So you find yourself trying to answer some questions. Is my partner a covert narcissist? Am I a victim of abuse? What exactly is a covert narcissist? Many people know the term narcissist. We see it as the loud, boisterous person who is always the center of attention. They are arrogant, superior to everyone else, and a know-it-all. They don’t bother trying to hide this and in fact seem to love it about themselves. You might be thinking, “This description doesn’t quite fit my partner. The arrogance is there, but they aren’t loud and boisterous. Their superiority is so covered that no one really sees it. In fact, I’m not even sure that it is there. They seem to carry some aspects of narcissism, but then again, maybe I’m imagining it.” I was once asked, “What makes a narcissist covert? Don’t they all do things in secret? Wouldn’t that mean that all narcissists are covert?” It is true that narcissists abuse behind closed doors. They have affairs in secret and live secret lives. However, with covert narcissists, it isn’t that the world doesn’t see the abuse. It’s that the victim doesn’t see it. The covert part of narcissism is that you, the victim, don’t see the abuse!! The victim does not know that they are being abused, and this makes it so much worse! To make matters worse, you begin to talk with your family and friends. And they blow it off. They tell you that you are over-reacting. That you are making something out of nothing. That he is a wonderful person. So you doubt yourself even more! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/covertnarcissism/support   I am Renee Swanson, and I help people recover from covert narcissistic abuse. Are you tired of feeling isolated and alone?  Are you searching for people who get it?  Are you confused, reactive and unsure what to do?  Are you running in circles in your mind? Are you worried for your kids and the effect this is having on them?  Do you want to know how not to raise another narcissist in this world? I can help you! I offer both group and individual coaching, which you can find at www.covertnarcissism.com   Renee Swanson, Certified Coach and Advocate for Victims of Covert Narcissistic Abuse http://www.covertnarcissism.com https://www.tiktok.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.youtube.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.facebook.com/renee.covertnarcissism

I hear so many people say, "My therapist doesn't have a clue about narcissism. And especially covert narcissism." They go to therapy for years and seem to make no progress in healing. Therapists, no matter how good they are, if they haven't lived through covert narcissism, then they will not entirely understand. I was blessed to have found a therapist that understood narcissism. In fact, it was the first therapist I went to regarding my marriage. He was such a huge help to me. He had lived narcissism in his past, so he understood what I was going through. Because so many people are struggling to make progress in healing and struggling to find help, I want to give you two tools that helped me tremendously in my healing journey. These tools came from the work I did with my therapist combined with the massive amount of researching I was doing, and they were life-changing! No one learns as much about narcissism as one who is living it. In my situation, this enormous amount of research paid off! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/covertnarcissism/support   I am Renee Swanson, and I help people recover from covert narcissistic abuse. Are you tired of feeling isolated and alone?  Are you searching for people who get it?  Are you confused, reactive and unsure what to do?  Are you running in circles in your mind? Are you worried for your kids and the effect this is having on them?  Do you want to know how not to raise another narcissist in this world? I can help you! I offer both group and individual coaching, which you can find at www.covertnarcissism.com   Renee Swanson, Certified Coach and Advocate for Victims of Covert Narcissistic Abuse http://www.covertnarcissism.com https://www.tiktok.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.youtube.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.facebook.com/renee.covertnarcissism

I am losing my mind! Apparently everything I do hurts his feelings. I can’t get anything right. I go out of my way to make him feel happy and everything hurts his feelings. I go out of my way to leave him alone and give him space and everything hurts his feelings. One day he says this, the next day he says that. I don’t know what to do anymore. If this is you, you might be dealing with a covert narcissist! Their passive aggressiveness and gaslighting create an environment where you are constantly walking on eggshells around their hurt feelings. You feel totally responsible for their happiness and unhappiness in life. It is not only exhausting, it is impossible! This is a situation where you, the victim/target, are destined for failure. It does not matter how determined you are. It does not matter how educated, experienced, compassionate, or anything else that you are. It simply does not matter! A covert narcissist is the world's greatest victim and passive aggressiveness is one of their most effective tools! Everything you do is capable of hurting their feelings, and I mean everything. It is not possible to know what will and what won't, so you are on guard all the time. And no matter how good your guard is, it will never be good enough! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/covertnarcissism/support   I am Renee Swanson, and I help people recover from covert narcissistic abuse. Are you tired of feeling isolated and alone?  Are you searching for people who get it?  Are you confused, reactive and unsure what to do?  Are you running in circles in your mind? Are you worried for your kids and the effect this is having on them?  Do you want to know how not to raise another narcissist in this world? I can help you! I offer both group and individual coaching, which you can find at www.covertnarcissism.com   Renee Swanson, Certified Coach and Advocate for Victims of Covert Narcissistic Abuse http://www.covertnarcissism.com https://www.tiktok.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.youtube.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.facebook.com/renee.covertnarcissism

A Covert narcissist takes over your life. I have heard so many victims so I don’t even recognize myself anymore. I just want to be me again. I feel like I lost myself. One of the problems of living with a covert narcissist is that your mind is constantly wrapped up in the past and the future. The present is NOT safe. Out of the need for survival, we stay in the past and future. One of the pitfalls of covert narcissists is that they are completely wrapped up in their own mind. They are living entirely in the past or the future. Their present moment doesn’t exist. Because you are dealing with them on a daily and intimate level, you are forced into their world of existence. One of the biggest reasons that victims say I don’t even recognize myself anymore is because they are spending so much energy anticipating and dancing around the expectations of this abuser in their life. The absolute first step is to stop playing their game. As you do, you will start experiencing more and more head space freeing up inside you. You will have room to breathe, room to think, room to find you again. --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/covertnarcissism/support   I am Renee Swanson, and I help people recover from covert narcissistic abuse. Are you tired of feeling isolated and alone?  Are you searching for people who get it?  Are you confused, reactive and unsure what to do?  Are you running in circles in your mind? Are you worried for your kids and the effect this is having on them?  Do you want to know how not to raise another narcissist in this world? I can help you! I offer both group and individual coaching, which you can find at www.covertnarcissism.com   Renee Swanson, Certified Coach and Advocate for Victims of Covert Narcissistic Abuse http://www.covertnarcissism.com https://www.tiktok.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.youtube.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.facebook.com/renee.covertnarcissism

How do I fix this? I used to ask that for years. Every day of my life I can fix anything. If I can just help him to see… If I can just find the right words… How does this get better? I get asked this by so many people. Victims who are in the exact place that I used to be. Women and men who are desperate for things to get better. And these are people who are willing to do whatever it takes. People who are dedicated with every fiber of their being. Let me tell you something - Your life gets better when you put yourself back as the main character of your own life. Who is your current main character of your life? What about of your mental life, your head space? If you are in an intimate relationship with a covert narcissist, such as spouse or close family member, then that person plays a very dominant role in your mental world. they have their own life to live. You CANNOT live it for them! This is your life! The only one you get. Be the main character of YOUR story! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/covertnarcissism/support   I am Renee Swanson, and I help people recover from covert narcissistic abuse. Are you tired of feeling isolated and alone?  Are you searching for people who get it?  Are you confused, reactive and unsure what to do?  Are you running in circles in your mind? Are you worried for your kids and the effect this is having on them?  Do you want to know how not to raise another narcissist in this world? I can help you! I offer both group and individual coaching, which you can find at www.covertnarcissism.com   Renee Swanson, Certified Coach and Advocate for Victims of Covert Narcissistic Abuse http://www.covertnarcissism.com https://www.tiktok.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.youtube.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.facebook.com/renee.covertnarcissism

Covert narcissists seem to have absolutely no emotional intelligence, inside themselves or with the world around them. The general consensus is that they have no understanding of basic human emotion, especially other people’s emotions. But even their own. They continuously stomp all over your feelings and don’t show an ounce of care about it. They can talk harshly and callously one minute and be confused as to why you don’t want to hold their hand or go to bed with them the very next minute. Even when you try to explain it to them, they seem completely incapable of connecting the dots. In fact, just trying to talk with them about it can quickly start you on a never-ending downward spiral of verbal abuse. And again, the next day, it all just disappears, as though it never even happened in the first place. It is crazy!! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/covertnarcissism/support   I am Renee Swanson, and I help people recover from covert narcissistic abuse. Are you tired of feeling isolated and alone?  Are you searching for people who get it?  Are you confused, reactive and unsure what to do?  Are you running in circles in your mind? Are you worried for your kids and the effect this is having on them?  Do you want to know how not to raise another narcissist in this world? I can help you! I offer both group and individual coaching, which you can find at www.covertnarcissism.com   Renee Swanson, Certified Coach and Advocate for Victims of Covert Narcissistic Abuse http://www.covertnarcissism.com https://www.tiktok.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.youtube.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.facebook.com/renee.covertnarcissism

There are some things that people should just never say to a victim of narcissistic abuse, and specifically covert narcissistic abuse. As a victim myself, I know that It is so hard sometimes to find people who understand and actually know how to provide the unique support that this victim needs. They need to feel heard and validated in a way that most people don’t seem to understand. In this episode, I discuss two things that people should never say to these victims, two things that you don’t want to hear in your world right now, and why they are so problematic. 1 - "Well, marriage does take effort." 2 - "You know, It does take two." Yes, marriage does take work. There are conversations that are hard, but there is a huge difference between conversations that should be hard and those that simply should not. Whether to move or not is a tough decision and should be hard. What do you want for dinner should not be a difficult conversation. Some conversations should be hard, but they should not ALL be hard! Yes, it does take two to make a strong marriage, but it only takes one to destroy it! If you are in the position of offering support to someone who is struggling in a narcissistic relationship, please know that this person feels utterly exhausted and completely overwhelmed. They have been working in overdrive and making absolutely no progress. Please do not add to their feeling of hopelessness by telling this these two things. Instead, help them to see that they are not solely responsible for fixing their marriage. It does take two, and they cannot fix this without some give from their partner too. --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/covertnarcissism/support   I am Renee Swanson, and I help people recover from covert narcissistic abuse. Are you tired of feeling isolated and alone?  Are you searching for people who get it?  Are you confused, reactive and unsure what to do?  Are you running in circles in your mind? Are you worried for your kids and the effect this is having on them?  Do you want to know how not to raise another narcissist in this world? I can help you! I offer both group and individual coaching, which you can find at www.covertnarcissism.com   Renee Swanson, Certified Coach and Advocate for Victims of Covert Narcissistic Abuse http://www.covertnarcissism.com https://www.tiktok.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.youtube.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.facebook.com/renee.covertnarcissism

Guilt is such a unique thing. It can be wonderful and horrible all at the same time. Many of us are raised to feel guilty when we do something that we should not or when we hurt someone’s feelings. We are taught that we should feel bad and make it right. This is not a bad thing Guilt motivates us to apologize. It motivates us to do right and to fix things. Without guilt, we might not make amends. We might not make it right. Guilt leaves this uncomfortable feeling inside of us and pushes us to resolve the issue at hand. We are motivated to get rid of this feeling. We don’t like it. We want to feel good in the relationship again. We want them to feel better about us again. We work hard to clear this all up. When dealing with a covert narcissist, it’s a problem. They are manipulators of this guilt. They will use this good trait against you in extreme ways. They will spin everything in just the right way to fully activate the guilt inside of you. They will do it with just enough truth in what they say to cause you to take full responsibility and work so hard to make everything right. Your own good conscience is used against you! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/covertnarcissism/support   I am Renee Swanson, and I help people recover from covert narcissistic abuse. Are you tired of feeling isolated and alone?  Are you searching for people who get it?  Are you confused, reactive and unsure what to do?  Are you running in circles in your mind? Are you worried for your kids and the effect this is having on them?  Do you want to know how not to raise another narcissist in this world? I can help you! I offer both group and individual coaching, which you can find at www.covertnarcissism.com   Renee Swanson, Certified Coach and Advocate for Victims of Covert Narcissistic Abuse http://www.covertnarcissism.com https://www.tiktok.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.youtube.com/@cngreneeswanson https://www.facebook.com/renee.covertnarcissism