The Lawfare Podcast

Mosharaf Chowdhury, Associate Professor at the University of Michigan and Director of the ML Energy lab, and Dan Zhou, former Senior Research Scientist at the MIT Lincoln Lab, MIT Supercomputing Center, and MIT CSAIL, join Kevin Frazier, AI Innovation and Law Fellow at the University of Texas School of Law and a Senior Editor at Lawfare, to discuss the energy costs of AI. They break down exactly how much energy fuels a single ChatGPT query, why this is difficult to figure out, how we might improve energy efficiency, and what kinds of policies might minimize AI’s growing energy and environmental costs. Leo Wu provided excellent research assistance on this podcast.Read more from Mosharaf:The ML Energy Initiative“We did the math on AI’s energy footprint. Here’s the story you haven’t heard,” in MIT Technology ReviewRead more from Dan:“From Words to Watts: Benchmarking the Energy Costs of Large Language Model Inference,” in Proc. IEEE High Perform. Extreme Comput. Conf. (HPEC)“A Green(er) World for A.I.,” in IEEE International Parallel and Distributed Processing Symposium Workshops (IPDPSW)Find Scaling Laws on the Lawfare website, and subscribe to never miss an episode.To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/lawfare. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Jake Tapper, CNN's chief correspondent and author of "Race Against Terror," dives into the gripping story of Spin Ghul, the first major international terrorist tried in a U.S. civilian court. He shares how detailed investigations by the FBI and collaboration with international partners shaped the outcome. Tapper discusses the unique challenges of prosecuting terrorism, including political resistance and the role of classified evidence. He argues that civilian trials can enhance national security and provide valuable lessons about the justice system in a post-9/11 world.

Molly Roberts, a newly minted senior editor at Lawfare, joins the discussion alongside Benjamin Wittes and Kate Klonick. They delve into the Trump administration’s Gaza peace plan, exploring its implications and the ongoing conflict's fragility. They also tackle hot topics like the unprecedented political messaging during the government shutdown and its legal ramifications under the Hatch Act. Finally, the panel examines China's new export controls and their strategic impact on global supply chains, particularly in the tech sector.

Serhii Plokhii, a Harvard history professor and an expert on the Cold War and Ukraine, delves into the intricacies of nuclear proliferation in this enlightening discussion. He explores how fear and prestige drive nations to pursue nuclear arms, sharing insights on the devastating bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Plokhii also examines Ukraine's decision to relinquish its nuclear arsenal, the implications of the Budapest Memorandum, and warns of the dangers posed by Russian aggression to global non-proliferation efforts.

Laura Edelson, an Assistant Professor of Computer Science and former DOJ chief technologist, joins Erie Meyer, a Senior Fellow at Georgetown Law, to discuss the vital role of technologists in regulatory agencies. They explore how technical expertise can uncover insights within regulatory frameworks and improve casework. The duo emphasizes effective communication between tech and legal teams and addresses the challenges of recruiting tech talent. They also highlight the urgent need for regulators to adapt to AI developments and suggest actionable strategies for better tech integration in government.

Roger Parloff, a veteran legal journalist, joins the discussion about the habeas release evidentiary hearing for Kilmar Abrego Garcia and the government’s challenges in identifying removal destinations. The team also delves into the implications of various legal issues regarding National Guard deployments in Portland and Chicago. They dissect the dynamics of the ongoing Letitia James indictment and its contextual relationship to the James Comey case. Expect insights into potential future indictments and the complexities of vindictive prosecution claims.

Justin Sherman, Founder and CEO of Global Cyber Strategies and expert in privacy and national security, delves into the FTC's landmark settlement with X-Mode. He explains how X-Mode gathers location data, raising privacy concerns from its apps. Sherman discusses the implications of the FTC's sensitive locations list and the need for comprehensive privacy legislation. He also addresses the challenges of enforcement and the likelihood of future FTC actions against data brokers, highlighting the crucial conversations around consumer privacy and legislative action.

Noah Efron, a professor at Bar-Ilan University and host of The Promised Podcast, shares insights on the aftermath of the October 7 attacks in Israel. He vividly recounts the eerie calm following the violence, highlighting a temporary unity among citizens despite deep political divisions. Efron discusses the complexities of the hostage situation, the anticipated military response, and growing public anger towards leadership. He wrestles with the moral implications of civilian casualties and the long-term trauma affecting future peace efforts.

David Sullivan, Founding Executive Director of the Digital Trust & Safety Partnership, and Ravi Iyer, Managing Director at USC’s Psychology of Technology Institute, delve into the evolving landscape of Trust and Safety in the digital realm. They discuss the need for user-centered regulations, the role of AI in moderation, and the importance of design over top-down policies. The duo explores how AI companions differ from social media in purpose and agency, and what best practices can be applied to ensure safer digital experiences, particularly for vulnerable users like teens.

Jen Roberts, Associate Director at the Atlantic Council’s Cyber Statecraft Initiative, and Sarah Graham, Research Consultant at the same organization, dive into the complex world of commercial spyware. They explore the evolution of the spyware industry, highlighting the surge in U.S. investment and the geographic centers of major players like Israel and Italy. The guests also discuss the implications of 'strategic jurisdiction hopping' and corporate rebranding, which complicate tracking. Their insights shed light on the need for robust policy approaches in addressing spyware's growing influence.