The Resilient Recruiter

A successful recruiter’s mindset is not focused on closing a deal but rather on opening relationships. Indeed, recruiting is a relationship business and that is why my special guest, Jodi Kulek Mayer believes that this is the number one key to her longevity in the business. In this episode, Jodi will share how she builds relationships and how it led to her growing her IT staffing desk to 80 consultants on billing and eventually starting her own staffing firm. Jodi is an IT staffing veteran and the founder of Clearmont Technologies, Inc. a WBENC-Certified Women's Business Enterprise. Starting in the recruitment industry in 1992, Jodi has placed hundreds of IT people both as employees and consultants at companies in the financial, consumer product, non-profit, and e-commerce industries. Many of Jodi’s clients have worked with her since the beginning of her career. In fact, many of the candidates she placed later became her clients. Jodi is also the host of Tech Talent Today, a podcast where IT professionals can get fresh ideas and inspiration on how to propel their tech career to the next level. Episode Outline and Highlights [1:30] Growing to 80 IT consultants on billing as an account manager - how did Jodi do it? [5:20] Two big reasons why Jodi prefers placing consultants rather than permanent employees. [10:05] Winning key accounts - Jodi tells a fun story of pitching for what eventually became the biggest account in her career. Best practices shared. [12:20] Moving in and becoming “part of the furniture” -- keys to building successful business relationships. [18:37] Breaking the “golden handcuffs” -  What made Jodi decide to build her own staffing firm?  [22:24] Jodi’s key advice for business longevity plus her story of how she started in 1992 and what the industry was like back then. [26:35] What made Jodi start her own podcast?  [30:30] What does the future hold for Clearmont Technologies? [31:40] Top tips to be successful in this business. [34:30] Jodi’s biggest roadblock in building her own firm and how she overcame it. Exploring the Option of Placing Consultants As a veteran recruiter, Jodi revealed her approach in terms of placing consultants on billing. I also asked why Jodi has a preference for placing consultants or contractors rather than permanent direct-hire employees. Are you also interested in exploring this market opportunity for your recruitment practice? Jodi shared two benefits in doing so: “It is like dating versus getting married” - as it is much easier to just say yes to a date than getting married. With this analogy, Jodi believes that the whole process can be very fast.  The biggest benefit is having a recurring revenue stream that sustains you even when times are tough. The reasons laid out by Jodi come with a tremendous advantage. Hear more of her story and how she builds relationships to win businesses. Breaking the Golden Handcuffs Jodi was doing really well with her previous firm - building an excellent team and generating very high revenues. But what made her decide to step out and create her own IT staffing firm? For Jodi, it was like “breaking the golden handcuffs.” She shared how work-related stress leading to hospitalization made her realize that she was unhappy which then eventually led to her starting her own firm with the support of her husband. Her business is now up and running for eight years as of today. As you listen to Jodi’s story, you will realize that this is a story of resilience and overcoming adversity. You may be able to relate in case you are planning to start your own business. Remember, there is never a right time or the best time to start.  Building Relationships is the Key Being a veteran since 1992, I asked Jodi for her top tips or keys to success in the recruitment business. For her, it was plain and simple. “For sure, number one is relationships” is how she described it. In our entire conversation, you will understand why she believes that this is important when it comes to building your business and resolving problems. Her longevity in the business can be attributed to her relationship building, and her stories of specific events prove just that. Jodi Kulek Mayer Bio and Contact Info    Jodi Kulek Mayer, an IT Staffing Veteran since 1992, is the founder and president of Clearmont Technologies, Inc. a WBENC-Certified Women's Business Enterprise. Her extensive career of working for staffing companies focused on corporate policies motivated her to start her own firm  with a focus on understanding client needs and a candidate’s professional and personal goals to establish right and long-term matches Jodi is the host of Tech Talent Today, a podcast where you can get fresh ideas and inspiration on how to propel your tech career to the next level.  She speaks with IT leaders about challenges they faced and how they overcame them. Outside of work, she enjoys skiing and scuba diving with her family. Jodi on LinkedIn TechTalentToday Podcast link Clearmont Technologies website link Clearmont on Facebook Clearmont on Twitter @ClearmontTech Clearmont on YouTube People and Resources Mentioned Juliette Samson on LinkedIn Dig Your Well Before You're Thirsty: The Only Networking Book You'll Ever Need by Harvey Mackay Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter    

I love hearing success stories, don’t you? I’m especially fascinated by fast-growing recruitment companies. Alex Zoboli and Matt Nichols have a track record of successfully building teams and creating rapid growth.  In our conversation, you will hear them share the success factors that enabled them to grow a recruitment business from 50 to 200 staff in just four years.   They also shared how they started their business during the pandemic and scaled up to 40 people in 18 months. We discussed a number of critical components in building your business for growth, such as goal setting, hiring, internal growth, and teaching moments from mistakes and failures. Alex and Matt are the founders of Cornerstone Recruitment Japan. Cornerstone is focused on placing bi-lingual professionals in a wide range of market-leading companies across all sectors. They are one of the fastest growing recruitment companies in Japan with a team of 40 and the only recruitment firm with backing from a major investment bank in Tokyo. Prior to founding Cornerstone Recruitment Japan, they were Directors with RGF Professional Recruitment Japan for four years. Episode Outline and Highlights [1:15] Alex & Matt shared how and why they launched their business in Japan. [5:22] The second biggest recruitment market in the world: what is recruiting like in Japan? [12:30] Scaling a business from 50 to 200 in 4 years - what are the three critical success factors?  [16:40] Hiring their first 50 - how Alex & Matt persuaded good talents to jump onboard. [21:27] Adding value to inexperienced and experienced recruiters and attracting great recruiters to your business. [32:18] How to know if a newly hired team member will be successful? Hear Alex & Matt’s viewpoints. [34:40] Why go for a team player instead of a ‘lone wolf’ achiever? [41:00] Laying out a career path for your team. [45:20] Teaching moments - sharing of mistakes and learnings when hiring people. Scaling From 50 to 200 in Four Years After sharing what motivated them to launch their business in Japan, I asked Alex and Matt on the critical success factors when scaling a business. They are pretty much specialists when growing a recruitment business - with a proven track record of having grown a previous business from 50 to 200 staff in four years!  Matt said, “For me the key is you gotta set the goal of what you want to achieve for the business really early, and you really got to commit to it. It’s got to stay part of the fabric of the business every single step of the way.” Matt added, “The other thing for me also is, your first 50 people are absolutely crucial if you’re gonna scale a big business. Your first 50 people should contain most of your future senior leadership team.”  Alex shared a third factor, “I think in general you have to have the ambition to do it. I think not everybody wants to have a big business. Having a big business and scaling in a short period of time is extremely stressful and a lot of hard work… You’re doing it really because you really want to do it. I think that is our success factor. The fact that we just really want to do it, that’s it.” My takeaway is that they went into scaling their business by having a very specific vision that they want to achieve from day one. Knowing that it is going to be challenging, stressful and difficult, for Alex and Matt it is entirely deciding that they want to make that commitment and make it happen.  Establishing the Dynamics and Finding the Team Player  When growing your business, it is important to establish the dynamics of your team. Part of choosing a talent is to not only consider their performance but rather how he or she can affect the entire dynamics with the tenured members. You would want people who are ambitious and want to achieve and those who want to be team players, but those two don’t always go hand in hand. So, I asked Matt and Alex on how they would usually deal with this element. Matt explained, “We would avoid the lone wolf type of person. They are pretty easy to spot… Some of the top billers from a competitor, they’re not a team player at all and those are lone wolves. We’re not interested, we can do without the billing basically.”  Matt and Alex mentioned some of the characteristics of who they would consider as team players: Those who are not afraid to share leads Those who are happy when their colleagues do well Those who realize that they increase their chances of individually succeeding by working as a team. In line with the above, Matt further elaborates on the characteristics of a smooth, functional and high-performing team.  Alex Zoboli & Matt Nicholls Bio and Contact Info  Alex and Matt are the founders of Cornerstone Recruitment Japan, the only recruitment firm with backing from a major investment bank in Tokyo and the fastest growing recruitment company in Japan. Matt has been in the recruitment industry for more than 15 years, starting as a Director with Nichole Lindsay in 2006. Alex started as a recruitment consultant with StaffBank recruitment in 2009. Both of them are now Managing Directors of Cornerstone Recruitment Japan and are aiming to be a major player in the Tokyo recruitment market and we are doing it by hiring the best recruiters in Japan and overseas. Matt on LinkedIn Alex on LinkedIn Cornerstone Search Japan website link Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter  

Recruitment is one of the most difficult sales jobs because we are placing human beings and not just products. Building a high-performing sales team is challenging, yet critical to growing a successful recruitment business. How do you hire recruiters who can sell - or at least who have the potential? How do you create a culture of high sales performance?  These questions will be answered by my special guest, Ian Moyse. Ian is an award-winning sales leader and the Chief Revenue Officer of OneUp Sales, a sales analytics and gamification platform for recruitment companies who want to optimize their team’s performance.  In this episode, he shares key insights on building candidate relationships, hiring for success, and creating a culture of high performance for your sales and recruitment team.  Episode Outline and Highlights Candidate relationships are key to your success. Hear Ian’s advice based on his experience of working with recruiters both as a candidate and a hiring manager. Hiring to build a high-performing sales team and why you should focus on behaviour. Six takeaways on what to look for when interviewing for own your team. What if the interview went well but the candidate did not do well on the job? Simple ways of assessing if someone is likely to deliver results. Other considerations we need to look at when assessing a candidate post covid. KPIs - how do you create a culture of high sales performance without micromanaging people? What are the right metrics to track in a recruitment business? Hear 3 takeaways.   The Good and Bad in Recruitment from a Candidate’s Perspective Ian and I started off our conversation with his perspective on the good and the bad in recruitment from his experience of being a candidate. He is also a hiring manager which gives him a fair and honest view of what he sees as the best and the worst in recruiting. His insights should be an eye-opener for us in the industry as he shared contrasts on his experience - how some treated him as an individual while others treated him as a product. He shared how some made him feel confident as a candidate while some made him feel that they were just after the commission. Indeed a good way to start off because this is related to the other topics that we talked about especially in hiring and building a high-selling team. Candidate Relationships is Your Key to Success You will hear Ian’s advice on how to establish good candidate relationships and why it is very important when forming a high-performing team. Here are my takeaways from our discussion: Remember that the candidate is a human being and not a product.  How they remember you has a knock on effect on your long-term success.  Give feedback and provide value - even to those you decide not to hire. What To Look for During an Interview There may be different criteria that you look for when assessing if someone is a fit for your organisation. Ian also shared what he looks for when interviewing and why he is really keen on looking at behaviour as a primary factor. Here is a list of what I heard: Did they get in touch prior to the interview? Were they prepared? Did they research the people they were meeting and the company itself? How well did they build rapport? Did they bring intelligent questions? Did they take notes during the interview? Did they treat it as a two-way conversation? We also discussed other considerations you may need to look at especially on mental health because of the pandemic. Also, how to avoid hiring candidates who perform well at interview but not on the job. Hear Ian’s practical way of assessing whether a candidate is likely to deliver. Ian Moyse Bio and Contact Info Ian Moyse, Chief Revenue Officer, OneUp Sales is a long time and award winning Sales Leader. He was Awarded the accolade of BESMA UK Sales Director of the year and in 2019 & 2020 and was also listed in the top 50 Sales Keynote speakers by Top Sales World. Ian is a judge on many sales awards and has grown four companies through to exit, advising many others as a non-exec along the way. Ian on LinkedIn Ian on Facebook Ian on YouTube Ian on Twitter @imoyse OneUp Sales website link Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR#73 Redesigning the Way Work Works Post-Covid, with Bruce Morton   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

What are the benefits of producing a podcast, a video series and an annual salary survey? To many recruiters that sounds like a lot of work. Is it really worth all the effort? My special guest, Sean Rigsby, believes that the combination of inbound marketing strategies position you as the ‘go to’ recruiter in your space. The salary survey, for example, provides valuable market data for your clients and candidates. It also helps to build your brand and generate inbound leads. In this interview, Sean revealed his process for researching, publishing and promoting his firm’s salary survey as well as other brand-building strategies. He also shared practical and golden approaches to making your life easier by working smarter. You will also hear the challenges he had when he shifted to an engaged model and the payoff he is getting now. Sean is the Managing Partner of Rigsby Search Group (RSG) founded in 2012 and recognized by Forbes as one of America’s best-recruiting firms. RSG specializes in the environmental industry and has made over 1200 placements nationwide. Episode Outline and Highlights [1:15] What motivated Sean to start a podcast? [6:44] Ways to broaden your brand - doing a salary survey and getting good data. [20:18] Sean’s “interview tip of the day” videos and how this approach can help your brand. [28:51] Are you treating your time like the money it is worth? [42:30] Shifting from contingency to an engaged model after 23 years - the risks and rewards [57:30] How the Pinnacle Society helped Sean when he started his own firm. [58:33] Mistakes and learnings when starting your own recruitment business. Building Your Brand People are more likely to do business with you if they know you. That is why marketing and building your brand are important aspects of running your business. Sean shared the specifics of how they do it at Rigsby Search Group. For them, it is not just spreading awareness but also becoming thought leaders and adding value to the industry. Here are the takeaways Podcast - Sean revealed what motivated him to start a podcast and the benefits they are getting from it. Salary Survey - Definitely value-adding to your community, hear how to capture the data and get higher engagement. Interview Tip of the Day - this video making process not only helps your candidates but spreads brand awareness as well. Sean shared their best practices. Working Hard and Working Smart One of the key topics that Sean shared with me is how he makes his life easier by delegating tasks that he hates, allowing him to focus more on more complex tasks in his business. His guiding principle is based on the question of “Are you treating your time like the money it is worth?”  Sean admitted, “I wasn’t very good at delegating...I would try to do everything.” He then shared how and when you can hand off some tasks to someone else. He shared his thought process on which tasks to delegate. As he summarized, “Which ones I hate and what is the quickest turnaround.” Here are some examples of the time-consuming tasks he is now effectively delegating: Research - hear how he trained his admin to handle candidate sourcing. Taking references and making follow-ups - this one is brilliant, I’ve never come across anyone else who delegates this task effectively. Shifting From Contingency to an Engaged Model After roughly 23 years in his recruitment career, Sean decided to shift to an engaged or retained search model. He was skeptical at first as he initially felt that it is not fit for his specific industry niche. He shared that he even lost a number of clients when he started asking for part of the fee up front. But what made him decide? And what are the key benefits he is getting now? Sean shared valuable insights from his own experience transitioning to retained/engaged search. Sean Rigsby Bio and Contact Info Sean P. Rigsby, CPC, is the Managing Partner of Rigsby Search Group, LLC. He formed the company in 2012 to meet the marketplace’s need for a more consultative approach to helping both clients and candidates. He has developed many long-term relationships with both clients and candidates that extend nationwide and include all U.S. markets, for a mix of clients from the ENR Top 100 to smaller boutique type firms. Sean is a Member of The Pinnacle Society, an organization of 80 of the highest volume recruiters in North America.  Sean is also an active member and has assumed leadership roles within a number of organizations, namely: Environmental Professionals Organization of Connecticut and the Environmental Business Council of New England – Connecticut Chapter. He’s also been a speaker at various conferences for organizations such as: American Institute of Professional Geologists, Association of Environmental and Engineering Geologists, Society for Women Environmental Professionals – Massachusetts Chapter, EnviroExpo of Boston and the University of Connecticut. Sean finds a strong calling to give back. Recently he became a Member of the Patient and Family Advisory Council for Bristol Hospital. He has Co-Chaired and led the Recruitment and Retention section for the Saint Paul School Board in Kensington, CT. In 2010, Sean was honoured when he received the “HOPES Volunteer of the Year Award” by the Archdiocese of Hartford. Prior to founding Rigsby Search Group in 2012, Sean spent 19 years at RJS Associates, one of the top search firms on the East Coast headquartered in Hartford, CT. While working at RJS, Sean received numerous awards including: “Consultant of the Year” – 3 times, “Environmental Recruiter of the Year” – 17 times and “Rookie of the Year” – 1993. When he finished his career at RJS Associates, he was a Partner and was ranked as one of the top three highest producing recruiters within the history of the company. Sean on LinkedIn Rigsby Search Group website link Rigsby Search Group’s podcast link Rigsby Search Group’s Salary Survey Rigsby Search Group’s Referral Program Rigsby Search Group on Facebook Rigsby Search Group on YouTube People and Resources Mentioned Joe Rice on LinkedIn  Cameron Boyd  on LinkedIn  Rich Rosen on LinkedIn James Caan on LinkedIn  Danny Cahill on LinkedIn The Entrepreneur Roller Coaster by Darren Hardy Pinnacle Society website link Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR #81 James Caan on the 10 Characteristics of Highly Successful Recruitment Entrepreneurs TRR #67 Think Like a Big Biller: How to Get Repeat Business and Referrals, with Rich Rosen TRR #55 How to Build (or Rebuild) Your Recruitment Firm to 7-Figures From Scratch, with Joe Rice TRR #45 Doing Things Differently – Objectivity, Flat Fees and Getting Rid of Commission Schemes, with Cameron Boyd   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter  

What do the most successful recruitment business owners have in common? I can’t think of anyone better qualified to answer that question than James Caan.  In this interview, James and I discussed the challenges and opportunities for recruiters in a post-pandemic environment, and what it takes to achieve extraordinary success in our industry. James delivered massive value for aspiring entrepreneurs, including advice based on his own experience, plus insights from his unique perspective as an investor in the recruitment sector. James is a serial entrepreneur, investor, philanthropist, and a former panelist on the hit TV series Dragon’s Den. James founded two recruitment companies with combined revenues of over a billion pounds, Alexander Mann Solutions and Humana International. In 2004, he set up his own private equity firm Hamilton Bradshaw, and in 2014 he launched Recruitment Entrepreneur. To date, Recruitment Entrepreneur has enabled 32 founders to launch and scale 22 recruitment businesses.  Episode Outline and Highlights [2:08] Key challenges and opportunities for recruiters in the current market and post-pandemic environment. [12:11] Why recruiters should broaden their horizons and consider international markets. [14:28] Preventing counter-offers - James’ advice on candidate qualification. [21:30] Starting a successful recruitment firm in the current market [23:08] The 10 characteristics that are critical to your success when starting or scaling your recruitment company.  [33:20] Attracting & retaining great talent - how to persuade the best people to join your recruitment firm.  [43:40] James’ thought process on how to assess someone’s drive / self-motivation [48:36] The single best piece of advice James has ever received.  Post-Covid Environment Challenges and Opportunities Considering where we are and what we’ve been through the past 12 months, I asked James for his observations on the key challenges and opportunities for recruiters in the current market. James shared live experiences of the challenges the recruiters in his portfolio companies have  faced for the past year.  James’ advice for recruiters included four very specific suggestions: The impact of internal recruitment and the need to move up the value chain. Internal recruitment is growing rapidly and typically most positions below £50k salaries are the ones being easily filled with internal recruitment. What does this mean for your recruitment business? You need to elevate yourself above the 50k-salary and start working on more senior positions. Specialization and focusing on a niche market is important, but in order to grow, you should start thinking laterally by expanding horizontally across your client base. Instead of being super-specialised within a particular function, e.g. Tax, focus on maximizing the value of each client relationship. The market has quickly become highly candidate driven. This creates tremendous opportunities for recruiters but also certain challenges. The epidemic of counter-offers points to the need for recruiters to re-learn the craft of candidate qualification and improve their skills at managing the placement process. Out of necessity, recruiters were very creative last year in terms of uncovering new opportunities - e.g. expanding into new geographic territories.  Let us not lose the element of strength that we created due to the pandemic.   Is Now the Best Time to Start Your Recruitment Business? Are you hesitating to start or scale your recruitment business because of the uncertainty created by the pandemic and volatility as the market recovers? I was curious to know whether James thought it was harder or easier to start or scale a recruitment business nowadays.  His reply was, “I think starting a recruitment business is not about the market timing. I think it’s about you. Success in our industry is about your passion, your drive, your conviction, your belief, your expertise.” He added, “When I see somebody succeeding, it’s rarely because of the market, it’s rarely because of the sector, it’s generally because of them.” How to Start and Scale a Successful Recruitment Company What is your definition of success?  As James pointed out in our conversation, success means something different to everybody.   Not everyone wants to grow a large recruitment company.  Many owners would be perfectly content running a lifestyle business with a small team of 3-4 people that generates a million pounds per year, for example. James highlighted the fact that very few recruitment companies grow beyond 10 people.  That’s absolutely fine provided you understand that type of business has no exit value because it requires the owner’s personal involvement to sustain it.   On the other hand, if your goal is to scale your recruitment business, that requires a different set of skills and qualities. According to James, there are at least 10 different characteristics you must possess (or be willing to develop) in order to achieve extraordinary growth. Toward the top of James’ list was the ability to attract great talent and persuade them to join your team. Unless you can bring the right people on board, you’ll never be able to scale a recruitment firm.   To hear James’ advice on how to attract and hire great recruiters, and discover the other 9 characteristics of highly successful recruitment entrepreneurs, click the “play” button and listen to the podcast. James Caan Bio and Contact Info James founded private equity firm Hamilton Bradshaw in 2004 and joined the panel of heavyweight investors for BBC’s Dragons' Den in 2007. His main focus is on charity work, current investments, growing Hamilton Bradshaw and mentoring entrepreneurs to help ensure their success. With a passion for building businesses and backing talented people, he has been building and selling businesses since 1985 and thinks it is important to invest in people rather than just products or businesses. James is a great believer that it is people who create a successful business through their passion and conviction, with a firm belief that “It’s your attitude, not your aptitude that determines your altitude”. James’ website link (You may find and download his audiobook via this link) James on LinkedIn James on Twitter @jamescaan James on Facebook James on Instagram Hamilton Bradshaw Group website link People and Resources Mentioned Abid Hamid on LinkedIn Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR # 69 Recruitment Legends: Leadership and Life Lessons From 40 Years in the Global Recruiting Industry, with Doug Bugie TRR # 48 Recruitment Entrepreneur: How to Start-Up and Scale an “Exit-able” Recruitment Business, with Abid Hamid Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter    

How do you position yourself as the recruiter of choice in your chosen sector? What’s your strategy for building your brand reputation and that of your client to attract talent in a skills short marketplace?     By leveraging digital media and the power of storytelling, you can dominate your market and create a competitive advantage for your clients and your own firm simultaneously.  In this interview, my special guest Joe Mullings explains how recruiters can use video marketing and digital branding strategies to fill jobs faster, and multiply their success.   Joe is the founder and CEO of The Mullings Group - the world’s leading search firm in the medical device industry. The Mullings Group has completed more than 7000 successful searches with more than 600 companies in the medical device industry. Their clients include multi-billion dollar companies like Johnson & Johnson, Google, and Siemens. Recently, Joe was appointed Chief Visionary Officer in the MRI Networks.  How do you position yourself as the recruiter of choice in your chosen sector? What’s your strategy for building your brand reputation and that of your client to attract talent in a skills short marketplace?     By leveraging digital media and the power of storytelling, you can dominate your market and create a competitive advantage for your clients and your own firm simultaneously.  In this interview, my special guest Joe Mullings explains how recruiters can use video marketing and digital branding strategies to fill jobs faster, and multiply their success.     Joe is the founder and CEO of The Mullings Group - the world’s leading search firm in the medical device industry. The Mullings Group has completed more than 7000 successful searches with more than 600 companies in the medical device industry. Their clients include multi-billion dollar companies like Johnson & Johnson, Google, and Siemens. Recently, Joe was appointed Chief Visionary Officer in the MRI Networks.  Episode Outline and Highlights [2:33] Digital branding strategies and why recruiters and recruiting firms should utilize digital platforms. [10:00] What is Price’s Law and why it is important for your recruitment organization. [11:16] Using digital storytelling that led to developing a unique process for Mullings Group. [15:30] Different mindsets of users on each social platform (LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, Twitter) and how you can use it to your advantage [21:10] How to have a “construct” when creating content on LinkedIn. [27:40] Joe shares his motivations behind creating a docu-series. [34:39] The 4 key factors to digital media success as explained by Joe. [38:57] Joe shares the challenges he faced on his journey and the ultimate payoff [47:08] Great advice on content marketing and improving your practice and serve your customer on a higher level. [56:33] When is the best time to leverage your video and digital marketing strategies? [1:02:06] Will digital marketing replace the traditional telephone? Leveraging Digital Storytelling for Clients The Mullings Group takes employer branding to new levels. In order to attract talents, their marketing team would create digital publications that are media-rich and descriptive in content. Another way they do customer branding is through video storytelling. These videos are professionally produced for branding, messaging, and storytelling of their clients’ technology and history for market awareness. How did it start? The concept was first introduced in a very large multi-million dollar project they headed for Google and Johnson & Johnson when building out a surgical robotic system. Since they were unable to show the robot or even the inside of the Google / Verily facility, they had to create a digital storytelling strategy on “who you would become” when you went to work there. And the rest is history.  Learn the process and how it actually evolved from long-form videos to short clips, how organic growth was driven, and how the traction they got impacted their business. Joe shared how he believes this is important for headhunters. One example is how Inbound traffic on these videos will shorten the timescales to complete searches. Joe explained “Even when we had to make outbound calls, when we made the outbound calls, we didn’t have to spend the first 30 to 45 seconds of that phone call on who [the client] was, who we were, and why that sort of career part will be a good one for you to consider.” This actually led to them developing a process called Demand Gen they were able to generate fees in 8 figures exclusively on their search business.  The 4 Keys to Success with Digital Media Another phenomenal feat that was shared in our conversation is when Joe and his team travelled across the globe and created an Anthony Bourdain style documentary. Joe revealed that this is out of selflessness with the intention of propping up the health tech industry. The exposure it got was phenomenal. Selflessness is one what Joe considers as ‘keys’ to success, which are: Discipline Strategy Thought Selflessness Hear it from Joe as he gives context to these key factors. He also told me about what drives him, the challenges he encountered and why it was all worth it. He also reveals the ROI from digital media. Joe said, “I have never balanced a chequebook in my life. And what that means is money is never a driver. It is what game are we gonna play and on what field.” Joe Mullings Bio and Contact Info  Career expert Joe Mullings has been building companies and careers since 1989. He founded and is Chairman & CEO of The Mullings Group, the world’s leading search firm in the medical device industry. The Mullings Group is responsible for more than 7000 successful searches with more than 600 companies in the medical device industry. His clients are multi-billion-dollar companies like Johnson & Johnson, Google, Medtronic, Abbott, and Siemens, as well as the emerging startup companies that are bringing futuristic technologies like surgical robotics, telerobotics, artificial intelligence and Deep Learning to the market.  Joe is also the Chief Visionary Officer of MRI Networks, the 3rd largest executive recruitment firm with 300 offices worldwide. He is President & CEO of Dragonfly Stories, which is the production company behind the docu-series, “TrueFuture” of which he is the host and producer. Joe is also the founder of the media platform TMG360, a Medtech news and opinion website. Joe has an engineering degree from The University of Dayton Ohio. Joe’s web page link Joe on LinkedIn Joe on Instagram Joe on YouTube Joe on Twitter @joemullings Joe on Facebook The Mullings Group website link The Mullings Group on Facebook The Mullings Group on YouTube Dragonfly Stories website link TrueFuture docu-series website link Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter  

To be the best recruiter in your chosen sector, you must commit to continuous improvement. That means making learning and development a priority when allocating budgets for your business. My special guest, James Fernandes, believes that every pound invested in L&D will return five-fold.  James is Managing Director and Co-Founder of Carrington West, a recruitment company with over 60 team members specializing in placing technical talents within industries such as in highways, traffic & transportation, town planning, rail, buildings, utilities & water.  In 2020, they won the 'Best Learning and Development' award at the Investors in People Awards. Episode Outline and Highlights [1:34] Growing from a start-up to a team of 60 people in 10 years. [8:08] Setting up a system for scaling - James shared how they prepared for growth in terms of technology, structure, values, and culture. [17:18] Money as a motivator? Digging deeper into the true motivations of your team members. [19:25] What is Work-Life Blend?  [22:06] James shared the key phases of Carrington West’s growth. [32:39] Shifting to a Managing Director role - James shared his learnings. [34:40] Focus on Learning and Development - creating a culture of continuous improvement.  [41:12] Why invest in L&D? Hear why James believes every pound you invest in learning and development will come back five-fold. [45:55] Carrington West’s future vision. [50:29] Practical approach to your team’s well-being. Humble Beginnings in a Garage Carrington West is an award-winning recruitment company that was founded in 2011. James shared their humble beginnings when they started in a converted garage with a makeshift desk and two laptops. Their inspiring story is full of learnings for anyone who wants to start or scale a recruitment business.  James revealed the phases of their growth as well as how they set up their technology, structure, values and culture in preparation for growth.  My takeaway in that part of our interview is James and his co-founder’s clear vision of their WHY. This is how he put it: “You come to understand that you don’t know what you don’t know… We had a very strong why when we started… Really trying to be the best that we could be. That’s continued throughout the business. That is what got us out of bed in the morning. That demanded even harder work from us, we were never stopping… Because we have this fundamental why - we believe we can be better… That was our driving force in the beginning.” The vision statement reflects the founder’s original purpose: “Our Vision is to be the best possible employer and the best possible recruitment partner for all stakeholders within our chosen sectors.” Work-Life Blend  Carrington West’s focus on their people’s development and well-being created a culture with an emphasis on the work-life blend. Why not call it work-life balance? James said, “A lot of people would describe it as work-life balance, to me that seems that would be more like 50-50. You can spend more time at work than at home, so the balance is the wrong term. Blend to me is looking at people’s well-being. I’ve heard an interesting [saying], ‘If you don’t look after your well-being, you’re gonna end up looking after your illness.’ We don’t need people here ‘til 7 o’clock every night burning themselves out. Actually, we’ll get a lot more from them if their well-beings are high, and they’re very healthy and they’re enjoying themselves at work.”  James explained Carrington West’s practical approach to taking care of their team’s well being, such as managing on trust (not micro-managing), offering flexi-time and work from home arrangements. Creating a Culture of Continuous Development When Carrington West started, they had a strong sense of WHY which is focused on trying to be the best they could be. This eventually translated to a culture of continuous improvement and development. In 2020, they won the 'Best Learning and Development' award at the Investors in People Awards. Training isn’t just for new recruiters, it’s ongoing and continuous. Everyone can benefit from coaching to improve their performance, including the directors who really buy into the value of L&D and receive coaching themselves.   James explained, “We are so passionate about continuous improvement. When the leadership team behaves in a certain way, everybody else really follows suit.”  Their comprehensive approach to Learning & Development includes: Leadership development program Internal coaching program Online learning hub which is a rich resource of training videos and materials Regular training sessions Bringing in world-class speakers Giving audio books to their staff Company library of business books What is the ROI of investing so much in the team’s learning and development? James believes that every pound you invest in L&D will come back five times. This investment in people’s development paid off last year during the pandemic when Carrington West not only achieved their targets, they exceeded them. James Fernandes Bio and Contact Info James is Managing Director and co-founder of Carrington West where he is responsible for implementing the vision for the business, the development of the management team and driving growth. He is a passionate recruitment leader whose driving force is to create an outstanding working environment where all employees are able to progress in their careers, be healthy and happy at work and deliver best in class recruitment services to clients and candidates. Since their inception, Carrington West and many of their consultants have won numerous recruitment industry and business excellence awards. Their focus on creating a culture of learning and development extends beyond individual’s careers to include the continual evolution and improvement of company and industry best practices. James has worked in Recruitment for 17 years since graduating from university where he studied Engineering with Business Management. James on LinkedIn Carrington West website link Carrington West on Twitter @CarringtonWest People and Resources Mentioned Find Your Why by Simon Sinek Speed of Trust by Stephen Covey The Five Dysfunctions of a Team by Patrick Lencioni Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

Do you have the ambition to achieve extraordinary success in recruitment? Whether you’re a recruiter building a desk, a manager building a team, or a director building a company, you’ll get tremendous value from my interview with Jonathan Field. Jonathan is the Joint Group CEO of Shilton Sharpe Quarry (SSQ), a leading international legal recruitment business headquartered in London. SSQ has 100 employees and was recently ranked the UK's #1 Professional Services Recruiter by the Recruiter Magazine. With humility and candour, Jonathan shared his own journey from lawyer to recruiter and ultimately to the C-suite. We also discussed hiring, managing and retaining top performers, and what distinguishes a really good recruiter from an exceptional one.  Plus Jonathan revealed how to “step up your game” and become a trusted advisor to your clients. Episode Outline and Highlights [1:41] Jonathan’s story: transition from being a lawyer to falling in love with recruitment and becoming a successful recruiter. [13:24] Key factors to Jonathan’s quick progression in the recruitment industry. [18:30] Transitioning from 100% fee earner to Joint Group CEO. [27:31] Learnings and takeaways from ‘thousands’ of mistakes as CEO. [34:36] When hiring internal talent, what should you look for in a good recruiter? [48:55] Engaging your team and bringing out the best in them.  Rapid Career Progression  Jonathan’s career has involved some key transitions.  Having been a qualified lawyer at a prestigious firm, he fell in love with recruitment and joined SSQ in 2007.  Later he transitioned from being a 100% fee earner to Joint CEO in 2019. He describes how a combination of factors enabled him to progress quickly, including hard work, timing and an element of luck.  Jonathan admitted that transitioning to the Joint CEO role was especially challenging. He shared some of the mistakes he made when he stepped up to the C-suite, and what he learned from them.  For example, at first he tried to do everything himself instead of leveraging his very capable management team. Once he learned to let go, he got better results with less stress. Hiring Recruiters - What Should You Look For? With a team of excellent recruiters, SSQ recently ranked as the UK’s no.1 Professional Services Recruiter by the Recruiter Magazine. So I asked Jonathan what we should be looking for when hiring internally? He stated a number of mandatory criteria, such as: Given that recruitment is a sales job, you should look for hunger, ambition, and drive. Good foundations such as work ethic and sales ability. Test for cultural fit. Building a High Performing Team with Multiple 7-Figure Billers Jonathan shared that SSQ has multiple consultants billing seven figures. So what distinguishes a really good recruiter from an exceptional one? For Jonathan, there is a thin line between a really good recruiter and an excellent, brilliant recruiter. He said, “The bit that will then separate good recruiters from brilliant recruiters is their ability to be more than just recruiters.”  He then further elaborated, “They have the ability to digest, organize and synthesize information that allows them to be more than just transactional recruiters for their clients. And the way for you to get the best client relationships and get the highest value of work, and really become advisors to your clients is to make sure that you’re doing more than just bringing them good people. You’re offering them analysis on the market and you’re a reservoir of information on your particular market and that you can talk coherently and credibly and with insight into what’s going on.”  To simplify the secret to their firm’s success, the advice he would give is to “just become the expert in what you do.” How to Retain Top Talent Having brilliant recruiters can be challenging, but engaging and retaining these top talents can also present some difficulties especially in a competitive market. So, how does SSQ do it? As Joint CEO, Jonathan found that what works best for them are the following: Offering a variety of tasks and providing opportunities to develop and take on more responsibilities, such as running a team.  Incentives such as having equity within the local business and bonuses tied into the performance of the group. Hear from Jonathan how this works for them and see how it can also be applied in your current set-up. Jonathan Field Bio and Contact Info Jonathan is the Joint Group CEO of SSQ - a leading international legal recruitment business headquartered in London with offices in Paris, Munich, Frankfurt, Madrid, Dubai, Hong Kong, Beijing and Shanghai. Launched in 2003, SSQ has c.100 employees and was recently ranked the UK#'s #1 Professional Services Recruiter by the Recruiter Magazine. Born and raised in London, Jonathan trained and qualified as a lawyer in 2006 before leaving the law firm Allen & Overy to join SSQ in 2007. For several years, he was responsible for running part of the London business. He was later appointed Joint Group CEO in 2019 following a management buyout/group re-organisation.  Jonathan still splits his time between running the business and advising the world's top law firms on their most senior and strategic lateral hiring Jonathan on LinkedIn SSQ website link SSQ on Twitter @SSQlegal  SSQ on Youtube  SSQ on Instagram  People and Resources Mentioned Greg Savage on LinkedIn Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR#64  The Recruiter Roadmap to Recovery: How to Thrive in a Post-Pandemic World, with Greg Savage TRR#1 The Future of Recruitment: Strategies To Stay Relevant and Effective, with Greg Savage  Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter  

How do you build a £20m recruitment business? It starts by hiring, retaining and developing good people, of course. But the glue that holds everything together, and lifts the business from good to great, is company culture. In this interview, Jonathan Keen shared how he creates a high-performance culture while promoting a healthy home-work balance. Jon revealed so many fantastic insights for recruitment leaders, from providing extra holidays, fostering a safe space for people to share their true thoughts and feelings, to adopting a qualitative approach to management. Jon is the CEO of Cognitive Group, a company he founded in 2007 at the age of just 25. Since then, he built Cognitive into a £20m business with a team of 21 and offices in the UK and Germany. Cognitive is a Microsoft talent expert and has placed over 2000 professionals into Microsoft projects on both a permanent and interim basis, building leadership teams and supporting digital transformations.  Episode Outline and Highlights [1:15] Moving from South Africa to the UK with £1,200 in savings, aged 20 with no degree or experience. Hear Jon’s astonishing story. [6:30] On handling objections - how training at a young age impacted Jon’s career. [8:54] Challenges when starting - Jon shared key learnings on nearly losing the business in the early years because of cash flow.  [14:00] Mental health awareness: Jon shared his valuable takeaways from depression and what we can learn from his journey.  [28:00] Massive jump in productivity - Jon revealed the positive effects of providing extra-long weekends to their employees. [34:49] How to uncover your team’s motivations and bring the best out of them.  [47:58] Optimistically looking forward to the succeeding years after the pandemic - what is next for Cognitive Group. Starting Was Not Easy - Jon’s Journey Jon moved from South Africa to the UK at age 20 - with £1,200 in savings, no degree, or experience. A friend referred him to join the recruitment industry and the rest was history. After five years, at age of 25, he launched Cognitive and eventually built the company to around £20m.  It was easier said than done though, and like all successful business owners, he also had to go through some difficulties and challenges which can be a foundation for valuable learnings. Jon shared how he almost lost his business in the early years because of cash flow. He offered an honest and realistic perspective on the stress of running a successful business and how it can affect our physical and mental well-being. Jon also did not hesitate to share his key learnings: never risk everything and beware of being complacent in client relationships. Mental Health Awareness, Work-Life Balance, and Building a High Performance Culture As we went along in our conversation, one of the main topics we discussed is being aware of your mental health - why it is important to both personal and professional aspects of your life. I really admired Jon’s transparency and courage when he shared how he dealt with depression. For sure, we can learn a lot from his journey.  I had to ask Jon, how is he able to build a high-performance culture while protecting his team from burnout? He shared very insightful approaches on how he handles work-life balance for his employees. The gist of it, in Jon’s words, is “bringing your physical and mental health to the top of your priority list.” He shared two practices that you may want to consider if you have a recruitment business: Providing extra holidays: Every 2nd Friday in Cognitive is a free holiday which translates to 25 extra long weekends on top of the usual holiday entitlement. Being a qualitative rather than a quantitative leader. Hear how these approaches actually resulted in a massive increase in their productivity. Bringing the Best Out of Your Team Another interesting thought that Jon mentioned is uncovering your team’s motivation and bringing the best out of them. It is no question that if we know our team’s motivations, we can help them to achieve their goals. So what is Jon’s approach to knowing his team’s motivation? Jon said leaders must “show that your intention is to genuinely help them. When someone can feel that they're in a safe environment to speak openly, that the answer that they might utter isn’t quite the answer between a sales leader and salesperson. It can be “Actually I’m not sure whether this is right for me,” and you can genuinely say ‘let’s talk about it’.” Very well said indeed. Jon further elaborated by sharing two takeaways: Celebrating successes via personalized praise Fostering an environment where people share things  Jonathan Keen Bio and Contact Info Jon is the Founder and CEO of Cognitive Group - a team of experts in Microsoft talent and staffing specialists across Azure, D365, Power Platform, Data, Analytics and AI. Jon is an experienced recruiting leader, 18 years in the Microsoft tech space helping customers build their teams and building a super productive, driven and balanced team at Cognitive. Jon is dedicated to building and inspiring a leadership team that is committed to delivering the best candidate and client hiring experience by nurturing a progressive company culture that not only supports, but actively encourages all forms of diversity and inclusion internally, and in the way they engage with candidates and clients. Jon on LinkedIn Cognitive Group website link Cognitive Group on LinkedIn Cognitive Group on Youtube Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

Are you allocating enough time and money to marketing?  Recruitment is traditionally a sales-led business.  However, the companies who recognize the power of recruitment marketing to amplify their sales enjoy a massive advantage in the marketplace. In this interview, Matt Walsh reveals why some of the early hires he made in his recruiting business were marketing people. He also shares the specific marketing strategies they implement to attract placeable candidates as well as great clients.  Matt is the CEO, and Founder of Blue Signal, a multi-million dollar, award-winning, Phoenix-based recruitment agency specializing in IT. Some of his agency’s accolades include: Forbes 5-star staffing firm #2 Best places to work in Phoenix (Phoenix Business Journal) Ranked #2 Executive Search Firm 3 years in a row (Ranking AZ) Ranked #4 Technical Placement (Ranking AZ) In this fun and fascinating conversation, Matt also delivers tons of insight on how he scaled his recruitment business to 45 people, including best practices for hiring and retaining great people. Episode Outline and Highlights [2:05] Scaling from a one-man band to a team of 45 staff - Matt reveals his story. [7:51] Hear a game-changing concept that Matt learned from Monte Merz and how it scaled his business drastically. [11:25] Matt shares the hiring decisions that helped him scale the business. [12:48] Brilliant marketing strategy: how Blue Signal uses targeted ads for candidates. [25:33] How Matt’s marketing team supports new client acquisition. [28:33] Retention strategy: Blue Signal’s strategy for retaining awesome recruiters. [30:40] Blue Signal’s internal hiring process - from onboarding, behavioural assessments, to career progression. [45:01] Resilience when scaling - hear Matt’s extraordinary challenge and how it led to trusting and empowering his team. [49:52] Learning from mistakes: Matt shares his key learnings. Using Marketing to Find the Best Candidates and Fill More Jobs While talking about how Matt scaled his business, he mentioned that he invested in hiring two marketing people. You will hear in our conversation why this proved to be really valuable to successfully scale his business. He then shared his strategy on how he uses SEO and targeted marketing to get placeable candidates and great clients. This is how Matt described the impact, “I’m this tiny company that nobody ever heard of. Nobody’s gonna go ‘Oh Blue Signal this, Blue Signal that’, but if I go to CareerBuilder, or Monster, or LinkedIn and some of the others, boom! I’m at the top now. If I post it there everybody sees me. That’s not only candidates but also hiring managers.” Matt also gave details on how they would target candidates for very specific roles using technology. Whenever a new search comes in, the marketing team works hand in hand with the recruiters to fill the job.  Listen as Matt describes the whole process and consider how these strategies can be applied to your recruitment business. Motivation to Becoming a Recruiter and Eventually Scaling His Business Back in 2016, Matt had a successful lifestyle business which meant he did not work too hard to make a living. So I had to ask, why complicate his life by taking on the massive challenge of hiring, managing, leading and training people? Matt shared motivations that really resonated with me.  He believes that there is a big void in recruitment and he is passionate about changing the reputation of recruiting. He also shared an analogy about planting a tree - when is the right time to start hiring and scaling his business? The best time to plant a tree is 20 years ago, the second-best time is now. Matt also imparted a game-changing lesson that he learned from another guest we interviewed, Monte Merz. Hear this lesson that actually led to Matt successfully scaling his business and making his business life less stressful. Creating Awareness About Smith-Kingsmore Syndrome Right after Matt started hiring and growing, his youngest son was diagnosed with the Smith-Kingsmore Syndrome (SKS). This was an extremely difficult and challenging time for Matt but also led him to empower and trust his team more than ever, so he could focus on his family.  This leadership philosophy turned out to be one of the success factors that’s had a positive impact on the growth of Blue Signal. If you wish to learn more about SKS and would like to help, visit the Smith-Kingsmore Syndrome Foundation website link below. Matt Walsh Bio and Contact Info Matt Walsh is the CEO, and Founder of Blue Signal, a multimillion-dollar, award-winning, Phoenix-based Recruitment Agency specializing in IT, IoT, Telecom, Wireless, Supply Chain, Food Production, Manufacturing, Healthcare, Accounting & Finance, HR, and Emerging Tech. Matt has over 15 years of experience in recruitment. Matt was born and raised in a small farm community in Illinois. He received his bachelor’s degree from Illinois State University and landed a job at Management Recruiters International in Chicago. At MRI, he won several awards. Matt left MRI in 2010 to consult and started Blue Signal in 2012. Matt relocated to Phoenix and started Blue Signal. Early on as an entrepreneur, he was a one-man shop. Since 2016, he has taken the company from one person to over 40 and the company has made almost 1300 placements with over 100,000 LinkedIn followers. Matt still runs a full desk continuing to be a top biller while also being the CEO.  He thrives on working in the trenches, closing deals, and leading by example. Matt on LinkedIn SKS Foundation website link Blue Signal website link Blue Signal on LinkedIn Blue Signal on Twitter @BlueSignal_ Blue Signal on Facebook Blue Signal on Instagram Blue Signal on YouTube People and Resources mentioned Joe Rice on LinkedIn Jordan Rayboy on LinkedIn Jeremy Sisemore on LinkedIn Monte Merz on LinkedIn John Schlegel on LinkedIn Predictive Index website link The Bomber Mafia by Malcolm Gladwell Clockwork: Design Your Business to Run Itself by Mike Michalowicz The E-Myth Revisited by Michael Gerber Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR #65 Recruiting Success: How to Bill $700k+ While Achieving Work-Life Balance, With John Schlegel TRR #59 How to Build a Multi-Million Dollar Team of Recruitment Rockstars, with Monte Merz TRR#55 How to Build (or Rebuild) Your Recruitment Firm to 7-Figures From Scratch, with Joe Rice TRR#46 How to Run a Million Dollar Recruiting Firm From Your RV, with Jordan Rayboy TRR#35 Inner Grit: The Traits of a Big Biller, with Jeremy Sisemore  Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter