The Resilient Recruiter

An ironic fact about the recruitment industry is that we have a very high attrition rate and so much churn, which can often translate into a massive drain on profit and can be an impediment to growth. My special guest, Mark Skinner, shares how they set up a work culture which has led to their recruitment team having an average tenure of more than eight years.    Mark is the Co-Founder & Managing Director of CSC Recruitment, a construction recruitment firm founded in 2005. CSC has 25 employees with 3 offices and specialist teams dealing with freelance, permanent, and executive search with a thriving international division. Mark began his recruiting career in 1998.  Episode Outline and Highlights [1:56] Why Mark started his own recruitment business. [5:52] With an average tenure of 8 years, Mark discussed how they take care of their people.  [15:29] How to set up an achievement culture for your recruitment team. [27:13] How to track and create an inventory of your team’s achievements. [32:18] Best practices for taking care of your team’s mental health -  how to make them feel okay to share if they are not okay. [42:05] Mark shares their greatest accomplishments [50:50] CSC Recruitment’s approach to partnering with clients. [55:29] Key factor in CSC’s success in winning businesses: consultative and solutions sales approach. The Key to Having An Average Tenure of Eight Years If there is a secret to having a sustainable and profitable business that grows over time, holding on to your team members - especially the ones performing well - is important. Mark and I discussed how they take care of their people leading to their average tenure of eight years. Some of the key highlights of our discussion on this topic are as follows: Having a management mindset where people come first Covering healthcare and prioritizing mental health Recognize your team’s efforts with celebration and praise even on small wins The last item is a very interesting topic we covered which is about building a culture of achievement.  Building a Culture of Achievement via Company Conferences On top of hosting sales meetings six times a year to recognize top billers, Mark’s company also do what they call ‘company conferences’. Over 17 years, they have done around 40 overseas trips where they take everyone. These conferences are a testament to how they value the contributions of their respective teams. The basis of where they are going or how expensive the trip is going to be will depend not only on individual achievements but also on overall group performance.   It Is Okay Not to Be Okay - Taking Care of Your Team’s Mental Health Another theme that stood out in our interview is how Mark is taking care of their team’s mental health. “Let’s face it millions of people said it before, the stigma is about it, a lot of people don’t understand it… when we found people that we think are happy go lucky… and you found out, hang on one second, they’re not and you try and help them. When the business was new, we didn’t have a lot of things in our toolbox,” is how Mark described how it was when they were just starting their business. Their commitment to their principle of “people come first” ensures that they have sufficient support from professionals. They made it possible for the people in their team to have someone to talk to 24/7 and if needed, therapists to give help.  What if people are not covered by their healthcare provider because of pre-existing conditions? Mark’s company pay a significant amount to help that person. Our Sponsors This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro and Recruitment Entrepreneur. i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Our technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees and increase their billings. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter for a 25% discount. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: www.recruitmentcoach.com/retained   We’re excited to announce that Recruitment Entrepreneur will be sponsoring the podcast! If you’ve dreamed of starting up or scaling up and exiting your recruitment business, this is your chance. James Caan and his team at Recruitment Entrepreneur are actively seeking ambitious recruiters who they can invest in. Start a conversation here: https://www.recruitmentcoach.com/vc   Mark Skinner Bio and Contact Info Mark is the Co-founder & Managing Director of CSC Recruitment. He spent four years with Hays and Hill McGlynn (now Randstad) before setting up a construction division for a boutique agency and then establishing CSC 2 years later.  A graduate in Economics and Politics from the University of Kent, Mark founded CSC Recruitment as a consultancy-led construction business to work with clients looking for a recruitment partner rather than a supplier. Mark on LinkedIn CSC Recruitment website link CSC Recruitment on Twitter CSC Recruitment on Facebook  CSC Recruitment on Instagram Brain Trust - a non-profit organisation that Mark fully supports: website link People and Resources Mentioned Leanne Sara Jones Hunt on LinkedIn Craig Paisley on LinkedIn Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR#31 Protecting Your Team’s Mental Health While Scaling Your Search Business, with Paul Hallam Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

Are you concerned about what is going to happen when the current growth in the recruitment industry starts to slow down? While the recruitment industry is still enjoying the momentum from 2021, propelling it forward through Q1 and most likely Q2 too, it remains a cyclical industry. Sooner or later, economic growth and hiring will decelerate. In this episode, Abid Hamid reveals the biggest concerns and hot topics on the minds of recruitment business founders and CEOs. The information that he shares in this interview can make a valuable contribution to any size recruitment business.  His advice is to prepare right now for when the next slow cycle comes around. This could be in 6 or 18 months from now and nobody can predict the exact date for the change in direction. The only certainty is that there will be one again and this should urge recruitment business owners to take the necessary steps to protect their businesses while still scaling and growing.  One of the ways to do this is by creating and sustaining sticky relationships with your clients. He explains all you need to know about how to do this in the next hour of conversation.  Episode Outline and Highlights [01:38] Abid explains the importance of sharing ideas with like-minded experts in your field [04:00] What are the hot topics in the minds of recruitment CEOs? [06:17] What’s the definition of a client? What does a sticky client relationship look like? [09:50] What is the cost of the business you have and is it something you want? [13:00] Abid expands on payment terms and how to collect your accounts receivables faster [17:45] Abid’s thoughts about the next 12 months in the recruitment industry [21:46] How to protect yourself while continuing to grow your business [24:00] These are the characteristics that Abid looks for when hiring recruiters? [27:00] What is a Risk Matrix and how does it come to play in your business? [31:50] Abid’s plans for the US recruitment market [33:15] Why are there so many small recruitment businesses that don’t scale? [38:50] Understanding the process of scaling-up with Abid’s help [43:20] Why your business isn’t attractive to buyers – even if your billings are good [47:07] Abid shares some of Recruitment Entrepreneur’s success stories [50:55] How to allocate time to work on your business to scale rather than working in your business to earn an income   What Are the Three Hot Topics on the Minds of CEOs Right Now? Abid states that currently, the thoughts of founders and CEOs centre around the current state of the market. He then breaks this down further, referring to what this entails. The first point to consider when you take a look at the entire market is how to build cultures in businesses where there is a flexible environment. Another point is how do you attract the right people in the market that is so heated when it comes to salaries. The third point of interest is, how do you create more sticky situations with your clients?   He says that in these cycles, it is evident that flexibility in the workplace is here to stay and what is becoming vital now is how you manage this flexibility. For example, if your teams work mostly remotely but do spend some time at the office, you get teams to come in at the same time. This still allows for some collaboration on the sales floor.    The Risk Matrix - What Is This and What Does It Mean To Your Recruitment Business?   What are the characteristics that Abid looks for in candidates when recruiting internally?    “For me, slightly out of the norm is good. Slightly unhinged is good…Slightly unhinged in the sense that you really, really know what you want because people who are passionate about something, they are slightly different,” Abid states before explaining what the Risk Matrix is that he is looking for in candidates.    The Risk Matrix is the built-in barrier that we all have that determines our decisions regardless of whether we purchase something or make a phone call. While he sees the perfect candidate to have a bit of an unusual side, the Risk Matrix must still be controlled, making them prepared to go to the edge of their experiences, constantly expanding on what they are capable of and getting comfortable with.    Why Are There So Many Small Recruitment Businesses That Don’t Scale?   The recruitment industry has an abundance of small recruitment businesses and there are many reasons why the majority of them don’t scale. According to Abid, creating a successful business and an exit-able business are two different things. You need to know how to exit and plan for that in advance. It is also important to understand that many of the solo recruiters or boutique firms don’t want to scale as they’re only interested in a lifestyle business.  That’s perfectly fine, so long as the business is providing what they want, and that they’re not letting fear hold them back from scaling.     Abid further emphasizes that it is important to distinguish between generating an income from recruitment and building a recruitment business that you can exit from at a later stage. The latter is what Recruitment Entrepreneur helps their clients to achieve.    Our Sponsors This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro®.  i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Our technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees and increase their billings. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter for a 25% discount. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: www.recruitmentcoach.com/retained    Abid Hamid Bio and Contact Info  Abid is trained as a lawyer, worked in corporate banking, and has been in the recruitment sector for the last 20 years mainly in management and leadership roles. He had worked globally within the recruitment sector and is a highly experienced business leader with a wealth of experience in various industry sectors and difficult geographies around the world. Abid had held various board positions from start-up to FTSE 250 Listed company and is currently Chairman and NED for 19 companies. Abid on LinkedIn Recruitment Entrepreneur website link Recruitment Entrepreneur on LinkedIn Recruitment Entrepreneur on Facebook Recruitment Entrepreneur on Instagram Recruitment Entrepreneur on Twitter @RecEntrepreneur People and Resources Mentioned Armed Forces Covenant website link Doug Bugie on LinkedIn James Caan on LinkedIn Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR #48 Recruitment Entrepreneur: How to Start-Up and Scale an Exitable Recruitment Business   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

Have you ever dreamed of starting and scaling up a recruitment business to the point that you could achieve a successful exit? If so, you’re going to love my interview with James Caan, who joins us for his second time on the show.  In this episode, James walks us through how to successfully launch, scale, and exit your business.  His insights are backed up by his track record as the founder of Recruitment Entrepreneur, the world’s leading private equity firm specializing in recruitment start-ups and scale-ups. RE has been successfully operating in 60+ countries and has currently invested in 45 recruitment businesses.  You will hear a case study of how one of Recruitment Entrepreneur’s partners was able to launched, scale, and sell their business for $12m in just five years! James is an investor, a serial entrepreneur, and a former panellist on the hit TV series Dragon’s Den. He founded two recruitment companies with combined revenue of £1B. Episode Outline and Highlights [1:41] James shares his perspective on the recruitment market of 2022 compared to 2021. [5:08] How Recruitment Entrepreneur helps recruiters build scalable businesses. [10:05] From $220k to $2M USD in billings in five years - James shared a Recruitment Entrepreneur case study. [22:08] Why is James now expanding Recruitment Entrepreneur to the US? [27:36] What is meant by smart capital and how it impacts the recruitment industry. [29:16] Expanding beyond the US - why Recruitment Entrepreneur is going global and why it makes sense. [35:35] James’ mindset on creating value for their clients. Also, hear James reveal their ‘secret sauce’ for their success.  [40:55] How James’ team consistently helps enhance the value of businesses prior to exit events.  [42:46] What buyers are looking for in a recruitment business that they may want to acquire. [47:45] How Recruitment Entrepreneur supports businesses in their portfolio to attract good talent. [54:44] How training and development can easily assimilate new joiners to your business’ work culture. Launching, Scaling and Selling a Recruitment Business for $12M in Only Five Years Since its founding in 2014, Recruitment Entrepreneur’s goal is to help founders and owners of recruitment businesses to globally, launch, scale, and exit their recruitment businesses. James shared a superb case study on how they worked side by side with James Absalom, CEO of Walter James recruitment. Below is the chronology of his success: James launched his business with Recruitment Entrepreneur In year one, he earned $350k compared to previous years of earning around $220k in average. By year five, he had 15 consultants with annual revenue of $5m and $2m in profit. Recently acquired by ZRG Partners for $12m   You will hear James walk you through the process - what do you need to start? What is the thought process in deciding when to scale? How do you grow the billing? How do you attract talent? These are a few of the golden nuggets that you will hear in this episode. If you are strategizing on launching, scaling and exiting your recruitment business, you will enjoy our interview. How to Create and Enhance Your Recruitment Business’ Value James’ recruitment and entrepreneurial experience bring invaluable insights when it comes to enhancing businesses under their portfolio. You will hear James reveal specific key pointers for success. How do they create value and further enhance recruitment businesses to set it up in a profitable exit? “The single factor to success and scale is having the ability to attract and keep people,” James stated. He further elaborates on specific focus areas that founders would need to work on to make their business scalable and successful. James added, “First thing is, we don’t back markets, we don’t back sectors, we don’t back products. We back people, and that has been the mantra of my entire working life and it has never failed me yet.” Must Haves to Make Your Business Scalable and Exit-Able If you plan to scale and exit your recruitment business, you will hear the following key takeaways from our discussion: The importance of having a stable workforce by attracting and retaining the right people. Establishing a culture of coaching, learning, and development. Having a clear strategy for developing your brand. Having an international mindset. You will find James’ take on the above elements definitely insightful.   Our Sponsors   This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro®.    i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Our technology and methodology allows recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees and increase their billings. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter for a 25% discount. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: www.recruitmentcoach.com/retained  James Caan Bio and Contact Info James founded private equity firm Hamilton Bradshaw in 2004 and joined the panel of heavyweight investors for BBC’s Dragons' Den in 2007. His main focus is on charity work, current investments, growing Hamilton Bradshaw and mentoring entrepreneurs to help ensure their success. With a passion for building businesses and backing talented people, he has been building and selling businesses since 1985 and thinks it is important to invest in people rather than products or businesses. James is a great believer that it is people who create a successful business through their passion and conviction, with a firm belief that “It’s your attitude, not your aptitude that determines your altitude”. James’ website link (You may find and download his audiobook via this link) James on LinkedIn James on Twitter @jamescaan James on Facebook James on Instagram Hamilton Bradshaw Group website link Recruitment Entrepreneur website link People and Resources Mentioned Abid Hamid on LinkedIn Doug Bugie on LinkedIn Walter James website link ZRG Partners website link Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR#81 James Caan on the 10 Characteristics of Highly Successful Recruitment Entrepreneurs TRR#69 Recruitment Legends: Leadership and Life Lessons From 40 Years in the Global Recruiting Industry, with Doug Bugie TRR#48 Recruitment Entrepreneur: How to Start-Up and Scale an “Exit-able” Recruitment Business, with Abid Hamid Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

I am always fascinated by hearing how recruitment business owners navigate their journeys through difficulties to grow their practices. That’s why I am very much delighted to share this episode with you on how my special guest, Doug Baird focused on four strategic pillars to successfully grow his small contract recruitment firm into a leading consultancy group today. Doug is the CEO at New Street Consulting Group (NSCG), a people advisory firm that helps their clients find, assess, build and accelerate teams and leaders who are as good in practice as they are on paper. NSC has been ranked as one of the best small companies in the UK, previously ranked in the Sunday Times’ Fast Track 100, and Doug himself has been a finalist in the Ernst & Young Entrepreneur Award. Episode Outline and Highlights [2:40] How Doug started his recruitment firm leading up to the foundation of New Street Consultancy Group. [9:30]  NSC’s approach to offering client solutions via meaningful strategic conversations. [13:50] Growing through acquisitions - Doug shares his thoughts. [18:54] Doug’s Four Strategic Pillars for growing his recruitment business. [24:10] How to use the sense of dissatisfaction to achieve more in your career. [29:54] Discussion on some of the biggest challenges that Doug had to navigate through. [32:26] Sharing best practices to find the right people for your recruitment business. [34:35] What is governance and what does it mean for your organization? [37:11] How to balance your team’s structure when bringing in talent. [44:12] Utilizing technology as you scale your business. [49:43] Looking back at his journey, what are the things that Doug would have done differently? The Four Pillars of Success in Growing Your Recruitment Business Doug shared his story beginning in 2003 when he started Interim Partners. They started off as an interim management provider and contracting recruitment business. In this interview, you will hear how he was able to lead his company to growth which ultimately led him to establish a professional services consulting firm, the NSC Group. I asked for his critical success factors and you will certainly enjoy how he laid the foundation of his business growth on four pillars: talent, structure, governance, and technology. You will also hear us discuss each of these and I am confident that you will be able to pick up several golden nuggets of wisdom to use in your own journey of scaling your business. Using the Sense of Dissatisfaction to Your Advantage Tony Robbins once said that being dissatisfied is one of the best ways to achieve more and stay motivated. This is definitely the same with Doug. He believes that having a sense of dissatisfaction and having the courage to walk away from what you are famous for can work to your advantage. He revealed how this mindset gave him a clear vision of his end goal. Related to this idea, you will hear from this interview why growing your business via acquisition makes sense in certain situations.  Strengthening the Pillar of Technology to Scale Your Business We also covered utilizing technology to effectively manage your recruitment business. Doug shared how they had to let go of some legacy systems they were using and how they adapted by using contemporary technology. We were very specific with some tools such as SalesForce, Bullhorn, Marketo, Cascade for HR, and others. An interesting thing that Doug shared is how they are using Salesforce and Bullhorn at the same time despite the potential overlap. You may be able to relate with some of the technologies mentioned. What Would Have Doug Done Differently? What I consider to be the best part of my conversation with Doug in this episode is when he responded to the question of what he would have done differently. “I would probably have tried to have held onto people, some of them that I’ve had at the very beginning,” is how Doug puts it. When you listen to this part, you will hear Doug’s sincerity as he further elaborates on what he meant.  Our Sponsors This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro®.  i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Our technology and methodology allows recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees and increase their billings. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter for a 25% discount. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: www.recruitmentcoach.com/retained  Doug Baird Bio and Contact Info Doug has 25 plus years in recruitment and professional services where he created and managed companies operating within Interim Management, Executive Search and Leadership Consulting. Outside of work, his four children keep him busy. With his family, Doug loves traveling, skiing and cinema. He enjoys rugby, plays golf badly and loves learning new things - fortunate to be heading to Harvard in May. Doug on LinkedIn Doug on Twitter @Doug_NSCG New Street Consulting (NSC) Group website link People and Resources Mentioned Katie Howard on LinkedIn James Caan on LinkedIn Greg Savage on LinkedIn Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR#15 How Katie Howard Cross Empowers Women in Recruitment to Excel TRR#81 James Caan on the 10 Characteristics of Highly Successful Recruitment Entrepreneurs TRR#64 The Recruiter Roadmap to Recovery: How to Thrive in a Post-Pandemic World, with Greg Savage   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

“Leaving people in the situation where all their major needs are met. For us, that is what a truly employee-centric model is. It is putting our people’s needs first so that they are at their best, and in turn they will make sure that the service they are providing to our clients and candidates is also at its best.” This is how my special guest, Saira Demmer, explains their approach to creating a culture of high performance. If you are looking for strategies to increase your employee engagement and individual performance, I am sure you will enjoy this episode! Saira is the CEO of SF Recruitment Group, a specialist recruitment firm located in the Midlands. Since 1998, SF Group has placed over 40,000 people and they’ve been recognized as one of the Top 20 companies to work for in the UK. Saira is passionate about employee engagement and since joining SF has introduced a new people-centric business model which has delivered an increase of over 60% in individual employee performance and reward.  Episode Outline and Highlights [1:45] From corporate to a big investment firm to recruiting - Saira shared how she fell in love with the recruitment industry. [10:54] How employee engagement is promoted at SF Group. [19:02] “Work where and when you want” - learn what this means in SF’s way of working. [26:10] Is it possible to enable people to measure and track performance without imposing KPIs? [30:23] The SF Experience and how it creates an environment where people can be successful. [34:08] Promoting intellectual freedom with a culture of coaching and guidance. [37:37] SF’s efforts in developing seniority and compensation to enhance performance. [40:42] How SF celebrates and shares success stories within the business. [46:53] Saira shares their plans for SF's expansion. How to Create an Environment of High Performance Recruiters SF Recruitment was listed 18th in the UK's 'Top 100 Small Companies to Work For', securing a place in the Top 20 for the second year. Their commitment to employee engagement has not only garnered them local and national recognition, but it is reflected in their performance as well. After joining SF, Saira introduced a people-centric business model that doubled productivity. Saira’s insightful take on KPIs may nudge you to re-think your strategy in terms of performance management and employee engagement. Here are some key pointers that Saira shared which I encourage you to focus on in this episode: The work “where and when you want to” approach. Promoting intellectual freedom among recruiters in a coaching environment. Backing up performance with an Employee Ownership Scheme The SF Recruitment Experience To show the level of commitment they have for their employee experience, Saira came up with a business model called the SF Experience. This is an approach wherein they are able to build a high-performing culture through autonomy and flexibility. Benchmarking of packages and earnings is regularly done. In fact, one notable achievement by Saira is achieving a 0% gender pay gap at SF three years after reporting a 23% gap in 2018! This combination of benefits indeed results in better profitability and employee retention. Listen to this episode to hear the specifics directly from Saira. An Insightful Take on KPIs  I am a firm believer in knowing your numbers. Metrics and key performance indicators (KPIs) are incredibly valuable in order to manage and optimize your performance. Interestingly, Saira mentioned that in SF, they do not impose KPIs. I asked Saira to what extent they enable people to measure their milestones resulting in placements and billings? Be sure to listen to this interview to discover her answer. Our Sponsors This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro®.  i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Our technology and methodology allows recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees and increase their billings. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter for a 25% discount. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: www.recruitmentcoach.com/retained  Saira Demmer Bio and Contact Info Saira is CEO at SF Group, a specialist recruitment firm headquartered in the Midlands. Saira joined in 2018 having previously been UK CEO and CFO at Ignata where she played a key role in building the group to over £40m of turnover today. Her knowledge of recruitment and talent solutions was honed during six years spent in Deloitte’s M&A strategy team, where she was involved in a number of high-profile deals in the recruitment sector. Outside of the boardroom, Saira is also a dedicated adventurer, she previously climbed half of Mount Everest and loves to travel the world to pursue her love of open-water diving. Saira on LinkedIn SF Recruitment website link SF Recruitment on Facebook SF Recruitment on Twitter @sfrecruiters SF Recruitment on YouTube People and Resources Mentioned James Caan on LinkedIn Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR#81 James Caan on the 10 Characteristics of Highly Successful Recruitment Entrepreneurs   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter  

Best results come from the best talents, and the best talents can be found in the best places to work. How do you make your recruitment company a top place to work? My guest, David Cathey, reveals their standards and practices that made his firm, Unity Search Group, amongst the Dallas Business Journal’s Best Places to Work for three years running. David is a Partner at Unity Search. He oversees Unity's finance, accounting and tax consulting/contract, Unity's IT division and Unity's practice development, including training and development of our core team members, along with client development, relationship management and candidate recruiting. Episode Outline and Highlights [01:24] How David and I got acquainted via podcast. [03:45] Discussion on training and why it is important to approach different learning modalities. [08:50] David reveals Unity Search’s ‘train-the-trainer’ approach and how it builds a supportive environment for newly hired recruiters. [14:30] The advantages of growing your own talent versus hiring someone with years of experience. [19:30] Hear best practices when hiring rookie recruiters. [24:22] Know more about Unity KPIs, standards, and how they build a culture of accountability. [29:33] Great ideas on gamifying your KPIs to drive a self-managing culture. [35:06] Distinction between micromanagement and helping your team to be successful. [41:30] Are client visits still ‘fashionable’ for recruiters? [50:05] The problem with Vendor Management Systems (VMS) - and how to avoid them. [53:55] David shares his battle with the ‘impostor syndrome.’ [1:02:00] What is next with Unity Search? Continuous Learning and Establishing a Culture of Accountability In our conversation, you will hear David shared Unity Search’s approach on team development focusing in the following areas: The importance of continuous learning and approaching different learning modalities Best practices in hiring inexperienced recruiters  Train-the-trainer approach  How to get consistent results by establishing a self-managing culture and accountability Why It’s Time to Start Doing Client Visits Again Because of the pandemic, most recruiters stopped or drastically reduced the number of in-person client meetings. The advent of technology also made it possible for recruiters to engage via Zoom or MS Teams which brings us to the question: “Are client visits still relevant when it comes to recruitment?” Dave shared how client visits are one of his team’s KPIs and how meeting clients face-to-face is more relevant than ever, now that pandemic related restrictions are getting more lenient. He shared his philosophy behind it, “You are not going to date someone long term and develop a long-term relationship if you haven’t seen them face-to-face.” David explained that the pandemic really took that in-person element away because everybody was working remotely.  He then elaborated, “What ended up happening at least for our business … is your client visits turned to just phone call check-ins.” Now that restrictions have been lifted, David is making sure his team is taking the opportunity to get back out there and get in front of them. If you are running a local desk, this is something that you may want to look at to further engage with your clients and establish more connections. As Dave shared, “Sometimes meeting them for a cup of coffee, they love that because they are going out of their house.” Are You Struggling with Impostor Syndrome? If you are experiencing persistent self-doubt on your skills, talents and accomplishments, you may be suffering from impostor syndrome. This is like an elephant in the room that talented recruiters and recruitment business owners may be hesitant to discuss but it is something that everybody feels every once in a while. David courageously shared his battle with the impostor syndrome and how he overcame it.  “I’ve really worked on changing my attitude towards impostor syndrome” David stated. You may be able to relate on how it can hold you back in your career or how it can make it difficult to engage with a client. David realized that it is actually rooted in fear and not getting out of his comfort zone. He then shared how he turned it into a benefit for him and the steps he took to get out of that comfort zone. I hope that you too can appreciate the nuggets of wisdom in this part of the interview. Our Sponsors This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro®.  i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Our technology and methodology allows recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees and increase their billings. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter for a 25% discount. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: www.recruitmentcoach.com/retained  David Cathey Bio and Contact Info David’s experience includes over 15 years of executive recruiting on both a direct hire basis and consulting/contract recruiting basis. Throughout his recruiting career, his primary focus has been in accounting, finance, tax and information technology. After spending time as a Financial Analyst and Senior Pricing Manager for a large multinational organization, David began his recruiting career with one of the largest, US domestic recruiting firms, working in the Dallas/Fort Worth market for over 7 years. He established himself as a top performer in the organization, earning multiple incentive trips throughout his time as a producer.  At Unity Search, David’s focus remains in development of core information technology, accounting, finance, and tax recruitment and consulting for (and with) our clients. David’s focus on being relationship driven and process oriented allows Unity Search to service our clients at our best. David on LinkedIn Unity Search website link Unity Search on YouTube People and Resources Mentioned Bob Marshall on LinkedIn Joe Slenning on LinkedIn Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter  

Many recruiters claim to provide excellent customer service. Certainly, nobody sets out with the goal of delivering bad service. But is customer satisfaction built into your recruitment process, and most importantly do you actually measure it?  My podcast guest, Nick Eaves, is the Chief Customer Officer of Stanton House.  As his job title suggests, customer experience is something they take very seriously indeed. They’ve made customer satisfaction central to the way they engage with clients and candidates.   Nick believes it’s a key differentiator and one of the secrets to their success. The results speak for themselves - Stanton House is one of the UK’s fastest-growing recruitment companies. Since launching in 2010, they have scaled to £35m and a team of 80 people with offices in the UK, Singapore, Hong Kong and the US. Episode Outline and Highlights: [06:48] Candidates and clients are both customers  [09:47] Nick explains their systems and processes to enhance customer experience [12:30] Being a hero at Stanton House requires more than being a great biller [15:34] Nick shares examples of how they differentiate their brand [18:20] What does their customer experience look like? [21:20] How to create a narrative with your customers in a customer-centric environment [26:50] What training do they provide to ensure that their team delivers excellent value [31:50] What motivated Nick to co-found Stanton House in 2010? [36:00] The switch from recruiting to starting a recruitment business [38:50] What are the success factors driving Stanton House forward? [41:40] How and why Stanton House has evolved away from the 360 model [46:50] Employing experienced recruiters vs developing professionals with no recruitment experience, which is best? [52:10] What characteristics do they seek in their team members? [53:50] The Pathway Program - how it promotes diversity internally and for their customers [57:55] Stanton House’s international expansion Candidates and Clients Both Deserve Outstanding Customer Service “When we started the company, right from the start, the one thing that we were adamant was going to be different about Stanton House was that we are passionate about the customer experience and that was going to be the heart of everything we did. It is part of the DNA and it remained true until today,” Nick expands on how much value their brand attaches to ensuring that both clients and candidates enjoy the level of service they deserve.  He states that the recruitment industry often treats clients very well but not candidates so much. Yet, both are just people and the investment that a candidate has with a recruitment company has a far greater impact on the candidate than on the client.  Therefore, Stanton House has a comprehensive system in place to ensure that they always deliver on customer satisfaction and this is the foundation of their success. Exploring the Factors that Contributed to Their Success When Nick and co-founder Neil Wilson founded Stanton House, they didn’t have any clients and could only rely on their networks. They were determined to make their venture a success and create a brand that values customer service.   One challenge was that neither had actively run a recruitment desk for a while. Their solution was to get funding from investors so they could hire excellent people from the beginning. Nick highlights the following factors as the keys to the success they enjoy: The vision and the ambition to scale The desire to make a statement to the industry that if you operate with integrity, you can still win commercially. The culture, vision and values are the backbone of the business. Therefore, they hire people who share the same values as they do.  Why Experience Isn’t the Most Important Criteria When Recruiting Recruiters When hiring internally, values fit is essential. It is why Stanton House often employs people without recruitment experience and then provides excellent training to give them the skills to be successful in the industry.  Nick states that one of the most important things they are looking for in candidates for internal employment is the ability to overcome adversity. They prefer candidates who had to face severe challenges in their past and managed to overcome these challenges.  They’re looking for individuals who will care about the customer experience and are not only concerned with making money. Work ethic and shared values are what bind their team and not age, gender, background or experience. This is how they manage to remain a team that achieves greatness.  Our Sponsors This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro®.  i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Our technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees and increase their billings. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter for a 25% discount. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: www.recruitmentcoach.com/retained  Nick Eaves Bio and Contact Info  Nick Co-Founded Stanton House back in 2010 and has played his part in building the Business to the 80+ people it is today.  Stanton House operates in the UK, Asia and the US in a range of professional service verticals and the vision for the Business is to Achieve Outstanding Performance through exceptional customer experiences.   This balance of ambitious business success, a focus on the Customer and a true commitment to strong values go to the heart of Stanton House. As Chief Customer Officer, Nick is the custodian of measuring and enhancing that customer offering.   Nick on LinkedIn Stanton House website link Acuity Partners website link Just Giving website link Stanton House on Instagram Stanton House on Twitter  People and Resources Mentioned Mark Farris on  LinkedIn Katrina Collier on LinkedIn Robot-Proof Recruiter: A survival guide for recruitment and sourcing professionals by Katrina Collier Steve Beckitt on LinkedIn Sourcebreaker website link Romney Rawes Recruitment Growth Accelerator Course  SenseHQ Neil Wilson on LinkedIn Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR #98 How to Partner Successfully with Human Resources, Talent Acquisition and Hiring Managers, with Katrina Collier   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter  

If you’re tired of being treated as a “vendor” and want to forge true partnerships with your clients, this is an episode you won’t want to miss. Many recruiters would like to shift from a transactional business model to a more consultative, value added one. The challenge is that both the recruiter and the client are constrained by old patterns — outdated ways of thinking and doing things. They recognize their recruitment process is incredibly inefficient but they don’t know how else to do it. Listen in to my fascinating interview with Steven Street about how he’s disrupting the ways recruitment services are traditionally sold and delivered and creating joint-ventures with client companies to solve their talent acquisition challenges. Since 2015, Steven has been the CEO of Cubed Talent Management – incorporating Cubed Recruitment, Indigo Healthcare Recruitment, and Cubed Academy. Cubed Talent Management brings a new approach to strategic talent management for the engineering, FMCG, electronics, manufacturing and supply chain sectors. Steven started his recruiting career over 25 years ago. Episode Outline and Highlights [3:00] Steven shared his humble beginnings [10:18] What is Steven’s “person-to-person” principle? [20:30] How to establish a true partnership with your clients [29:05] An interesting discussion about repositioning in the recruitment sector [32:10] How to make ‘in-house’ an opportunity instead of a threat [42:30] Learn more about the joint-venture and gain-share business models [55:21] “Be an individual” - how this advice relevant to help your recruitment business

Why should clients do business with you instead of your competition? What do you offer that is genuinely unique? Couldn’t your competitors make exactly the same claim? Are your prospects able to discern the difference between what you offer vs your closest competitors? It’s not easy to explain how your service is better in a way that is tangible and believable. Yet it’s critical that you create a “unique value proposition” if you’re going to thrive in a saturated recruitment market – especially during tough times. In this episode of the Resilient Recruiter, my special guests, Kevin Redman and Matt Halfpenny share their journey – the highs and lows – and discuss how they have differentiated their service from their competitors. Kevin and Matt are owners of the Property Recruitment Company, founded in 2012 with offices in London and Manchester. Episode Outline and Highlights [1:34] The how and why - Kevin tells the story of how he started the business in 2012. [6:57] Matt and Kevin unveil their “highs and lows” that they had to navigate through as leaders and entrepreneurs. [12:52] A vision of trying to be different and having a unique value proposition. [16:10] Kevin and Matt talk about differentiating themselves from the competition and what you can learn as a recruiter. [29:46] What it means to lead the change in recruitment instead of just catching up. [33:05] How the retained model can provide more options, flexibility, and a better sense of protection to your clients. [41:10] “The CV is dying” - this is a bold statement you should hear more about! [50:00] What the future holds for the property recruitment company

How resilient is your recruitment business? What will you do the next time there’s a financial crisis, like we experienced in 2020? In this interview, my guest Lauren Stiebing describes the experience of her pipeline evaporating in March 2020. She goes on to reveal how she used that setback as an opportunity to create new service offerings that complimented her core business. Best of all, the new Mentoring program she developed aligned with her passion for and commitment to championing gender diversity. Could you recession-proof your recruitment business by creating multiple revenue streams? Listen-in to Lauren describing her process for researching the market, creating a “minimum viable product” and sales strategy leading to a very successful launch.  She also shares how she uses “video sales letters” as part of her fresh and innovative approach towards marketing. Episode Outline and Highlights [02:50] Behind the scenes of a podcast and overcoming nerves. [03:50] What happened at LS International in the last two years? [06:45] Don’t panic! Lauren’s key lessons learned during this period. [11:03] Had no searches to work on, so she used the downtime to develop a new service offering [12:22] How the need for female talent in leadership roles led to a new venture [16:04] Find out how creating an MVP (Minimum Viable Product) can prevent paralysis by analysis to stop you from proceeding on a new venture [20:03] Lauren shares why they are not planning to grow the mentoring business too quickly [22:50] There is value in taking a step back from your network and seeing with whom you can partner for future ventures [24:30] What did the marketing process look like and how did Lauren include selling through teaching? [25:57] What is a “video sales letter” and why should you create one?  [31:33] What is the value of a landing page? [36:50] Change required that Lauren steps out of her comfort zone, what did she learn from this? [40:00] How to use podcasts to your advantage to build trust with your audience [42:45] Can you hire less experienced recruiters and develop them successfully? Female Mentorship - Answering a Need In the Market When the pandemic hit in March 2020, Lauren suddenly had no searches to work on. She was coming off a record year and had money in the bank, so at first she didn’t panic. But as the months went by without any signs of improvement, she realized she had to try something new. “Always analyzing the market, analyzing what is happening and when you see a gap or a need, to really create a minimal viable product and see how the client reacts,” is how Lauren describes her process for developing a new service offering. What Lauren realized is that there was a need for mentorships for female executives.  Her clients often struggled to recruit female talent into leadership roles.  So rather than recruiting outside talent, companies should invest to develop and advance their own female employees so they could promote them internally.  This is how LS Elevate, Lauren’s mentorship program came into existence. Her initial goal was to sell 10 mentorship programs in the first year.  However, the sales and marketing campaign exceeded her expectations and she ended up selling 27 - more than double her original target. Now, in the second year of the program, she is ready to expand but is cautious about growing too quickly.  She would rather enjoy sustainable, long-term growth instead of over-extend herself. Especially since her search business has picked up again.  Podcasts Are The Perfect Way to Present Yourself As An Authority Lauren has published roughly 60 podcasts and states that these podcasts play a vital role to earn the trust of potential clients and candidates. When she already has a rapport with these people when they meet for the first time, it makes discussions and negotiations so much easier.  Lauren is also committed to constantly trying out new and different marketing ideas to see what delivers the best results. One of her most effective marketing strategies are “video sales letters.” In this interview, she shares all you need to know to create your first video sales letter.  Plans for Growth and Hiring for Attitude Over Experience Lauren is growing her team once again and I asked what she looks for in a potential hire.  She believes that “learning, agility, and curiosity are what is going to make someone successful.”  comes Lauren’s words infused by her own experiences and the many mistakes she made as a young recruiter. Lauren is highly committed to the learning and development of her team and wishes for them to step outside of their comfort zones and to explore wider horizons on the constant journey of self-improvement.  Our Sponsors This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro®.  i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Our technology and methodology allows recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees and increase their billings. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter for a 25% discount. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: www.recruitmentcoach.com/retained  Lauren Stiebing Bio and Contact Info  Lauren is a small-town girl with big dreams. She has a degree in International Studies from Louisiana State University and Vrije Universiteit Amsterdam. Her passion for head-hunting, top-notch networking abilities and being a skilled judge of people made her an experienced head-hunter. She is the founder of LS International, persevering, hard-working, resilient and has high personal standards.  She is dedicated to the success of every client and candidate with a burning ambition to transform executive search. Lauren specializes in finding the best people for Sales, Marketing, and General Management positions in the consumer goods industry across the USA, Europe, Middle East and Asia. Her relationships with candidates and clients give her a broad and deep knowledge of markets and people. Both clients and candidates acknowledge that they love working with her because of her unique ability to craft solutions that balance client needs with candidate interests. Extensive international travel allows Lauren to pursue her hobbies of collecting currency and attending electronic music events.  Lauren on LinkedIn LS International on Twitter LS International website link LS International Podcast People and Resources Mentioned Larry Weinberg LS International Blog Article  - How to Increase Female Promotability by 66% LS International Careers Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR 10 How to Build Your Personal Brand As A Recruiter   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter