The Resilient Recruiter

“Everybody struggles. Building a business is really hard.” “But I’m going to keep listening to these podcasts and I’m going to keep pushing with my business… There’s no silver bullet, there’s no magic recipe, there’s no pill. You just need to keep going and going and going and eventually you get there.” These are the wise words of my next podcast guest, and valued client, Karen Lloyd. In October 2020, Karen set herself the goal of transforming her recruitment business and coming on The Resilient Recruiter podcast to tell her story.  Well, she has achieved her goal and more. In the last 12 months, she has increased her billings by 300% through her relentless commitment to making small improvements to every aspect of her business, making her systems and processes more efficient and most importantly by never giving up. In this episode, you will be inspired by Karen’s humility and resilience as she’s bounced back from multiple setbacks and regained her confidence.  Karen is the Managing Director of Armstrong Lloyd, a leading recruitment firm in the technology marketing space. Karen specializes in helping CMOs and marketing directors within technology companies to grow their teams and exceed their targets.  Episode Outline and Highlights [1:14] Karen’s story of resilience and how she was inspired by the Resilient Recruiter Podcast. [4:20] How Karen started her recruitment career at age 21 and initially felt like a failure. [10:54] The steps Karen took to triple her billings in 12 months, and doubled her best ever year from pre-covid times! [18:34] What Karen’s learned from co-founding her first recruitment business at the age of 24 and scaling to a team of 20 people.  [24:15] The huge setback that knocked Karen’s confidence, but ultimately led to Karen to launch her second recruitment business, Armstrong Lloyd, in 2014. [30:45] The turning point in her life and the parallels between running / personal fitness and running a recruitment business. [35:35] Karen reveals the biggest challenges she faced when growing her business. [35:20] Changes Karen made to her recruitment business to accelerate growth. [46:04] How Karen leverages content marketing and automated campaigns to get new clients. [50:55] Transitioning from contingency recruitment to a retained model. [54:55] Deciding whether to stay on your own or grow a firm. Starting a Recruitment Business at a Young Age and Growing to a Team of 20 “This is something I have learned for myself at a young age. Don’t doubt yourself. Just try it, just do it, and see what happens.” This mindset equipped Karen with the determination to start her business with another person at the young age of 24. It was a challenging feat on its own – given that a transition from being a full-time employee to a business owner can sometimes be daunting.  But they managed to grow their firm to a team of 20. “It was an incredible journey and I have learned absolutely so much,” says Karen. She was involved in the major decision-making, marketing, hiring and launching new divisions from scratch. In this interview, Karen shares her insights and main learnings from this transition. Bouncing Back from Setbacks Karen also shared a time in her career ten years ago when her confidence took a knock. This was when she left the company she co-founded and had spent 14 years of her life building. It was heart-wrenching for Karen to walk away, but looking back she now knows it was the right thing to do. What helped her overcome an experienced that was hard? For Karen, it is learning to ask for help. Karen started seeking support from a coach. This was an eye-opening experience and a game changer for her. Any roadblock she experiences, may it be related to her personal life, her personal fitness or her business, she finds getting help from a coach is one of the best courses of action.  “The coaching part has been a phenomenal change,” is how she puts it. How to Run Effective Virtual Team Meetings We also talked about the changes that Karen implemented in her team to further accelerate their growth. One of the things that were discussed is running powerful online meetings with her team. Here are the takeaways from what Karen shared: Stop being too task-focused. Include time for ‘chit-chat’. Get feedback from your team members via informal conversations. Setting a timeline with a clear agenda. Have every person speak (sharing something going on with wins, challenges and updates). Our Sponsors This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro and Recruitment Entrepreneur. i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Their technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees and increase their billings. Their software combined with world-class training enables you to transition from transactional, contingency recruiter to consultative, retained recruiter. Instead of being perceived as a “me too” vendor, you’ll be positioned as a “me only” solutions provider. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: www.recruitmentcoach.com/retained Recruitment Entrepreneur is the world’s leading Private Equity firm specializing in the international recruitment industry. If you’ve dreamed of starting, scaling and selling your recruitment business, this is your chance. James Caan and his team at Recruitment Entrepreneur are actively seeking ambitious recruiters who they can invest in. They provide everything you need to grow a successful recruitment business including: funding, financial expertise, coaching and mentoring, operational strategy, backoffice support, marketing and talent attraction solutions. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter. Start a conversation here: https://www.recruitmentcoach.com/vc Karen Lloyd Bio and Contact Info  Karen placed her first candidate in 1996 - someone who she’s still in touch today.  Karen has over 25 years experience in recruitment, with 20 years as a board director and business leader. She co-founded her first recruitment company at age of 24 and scaled it to 20 people. During that time, she started up a variety of new business divisions / brands from scratch. She’s now the founder and Managing Director of Armstrong Lloyd, a leading recruitment firm in the technology marketing space. She’s currently scaling the business and has increased her revenue by 300% in the last 12 months, doubling her previous best ever year.  Karen’s also a valued member of Recruitment Coach Inner Circle coaching program. Karen on LinkedIn Armstrong Lloyd Marketing Recruitment website link People and Resources Mentioned Abid Hamid on LinkedIn Leanne Sara Jones Hunt on LinkedIn Mindset: The New Psychology of Success, by Carol Dweck Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR#124 How to Recession-Proof Your Recruitment Business While Accelerating Growth, with Abid Hamid TRR#66 How to Grow Your Recruitment Business by Hiring Top Recruiters, with Leanne Sara Jones Hunt   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter  

Jordan Rayboy is famous within the recruitment industry for billing millions of dollars from his RV. In this interview he reveals that now at age 43 with 3 young kids, he’s no longer interested in accumulation, significance, ego, keeping score or trying to impress people.  Jordan says he’s rebalanced his life to prioritize health, fitness and family. He told me “I try to be the best husband and father I can be, try to be healthy and my work supports the rest of my life, rather than living to work… I’m in a much happier, positive mental place since the last time we talked.” In this episode, Jordan gives his inspiring take on prioritizing what matters. He reveals how he is able to balance his priorities while being laser-focused on managing his recruitment business. We also talked about the importance of having a peer group, and he shared his thoughts on valuing mental health as well as practical tips on planning and productivity. Episode Outline and Highlights [2:52] Jordan describes his daily routine while running a recruiting business from his RV. [13:20] How being intentional enables Jordan to balance his priorities while running a profitable recruitment business. [17:50] Jordan’s “Power Planning” process, how to eliminate distractions and execute your plans.  [25:43] Being laser-focused and why you need to have a scheduled planning time. [30:33] Jordan reveals what he is prioritizing at the moment and why he quit marijuana. [42:25] Insights on current events and his mindset towards recessions. [49:30] Why now is the time to keep learning and growing in your respective niche. The Importance of Being Intentional It has been around 15 months since we’ve heard Jordan in this podcast. He now shares his latest endeavours: having a new baby, focusing on his health, and prioritizing his family. “Being on the road and living the dream with three little kids and two dogs, still doing it 16 years into the adventure,” is how he describes it.  He detailed what his daily routine looks like, and it was interesting to hear how busy yet balanced it is in terms of quality of life. Jordan is able to rank a lot of things to improve personal well-being and family life while doing well in his recruitment business. What is the key to his success? For Jordan, it is all about being intentional.  He schedules his and his family’s health before scheduling phone calls. He knows his sleep is an important component of his health. He puts his sleep in his schedule. He schedules his time with his family first. Doing so, Jordan is in his best shape when it comes to “ground and pound” and is able to manage his business effectively. How to Avoid Distractions and the Myth of Multitasking Jordan is well-versed when it comes to power-planning. But for many of us, having a plan is not enough – the challenge is staying focused and executing our plan. How does Jordan stay on track? Jordan shared two tips: Having Open and Closed hours for both business or personal time.  When somebody calls or texts him while biking, he doesn’t answer. Likewise, when he’s working, no one can disturb him in his air-conditioned trailer/office.    Having a good plan allows you to be the author of your own story. It is about being proactive versus being reactive. Planning ahead and focusing on executing your plan can help out in eliminating time-wasters.   Having a scheduled planning time. Jordan shares that this is the money-maker in the recruitment industry. You will hear him discuss this and why it makes sense.   Focus on the Right Priorities With Jordan’s success in both business and personal life, what are his current priorities? He believes that he is past the accumulation stage. He has changed his priorities and is now more focused on things that allow him to find balance and happiness. Jordan's top priorities these days are more on his health and energy - both physically and mentally.  He has shifted his mindset to focusing on positive things. I asked Jordan about his feelings on a possible recession and he was able to share very practical tips on how to prepare based on having already experienced multiple recessions. Our Sponsors This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro and Recruitment Entrepreneur.   i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Our technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees and increase their billings. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter for a 25% discount. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: www.recruitmentcoach.com/retained Recruitment Entrepreneur is the world’s leading Private Equity firm specializing in the international recruitment industry. If you’ve dreamed of starting up or scaling up and exiting your recruitment business, this is your chance. James Caan and his team at Recruitment Entrepreneur are actively seeking ambitious recruiters who they can invest in. Start a conversation here: https://www.recruitmentcoach.com/vc Jordan Rayboy Bio and Contact Info  Jordan Rayboy has always taken the road less traveled. He began his recruiting career with MRI in 2000, and by 2005 was ranked Top Ten globally out of 5,000 recruiters. The following year, Jordan struck out on his own, forming Rayboy Insider Search – the nation’s leading executive search firm in the cybersecurity, data storage, and data center infrastructure marketplace. He joined the Pinnacle Society in 2009, and has served on their Board of Directors and as Member Education Chair. Being an impatient type-A recruiter, Jordan long ago abandoned the deferred life plan (slave, save, retire). By building an effective virtual team and leveraging technology, Jordan has run his firm for over a decade while traveling full-time in a tour-bus RV with his wife Jeska, their three dogs, and their daughter Ryder. They’ve covered the majority of the U.S. and Canada during their adventure while living their dream every day. Jordan on LinkedIn Jordan on Twitter @jordanrayboy Rayboy Insider Search  website link Rayboy IS on Facebook Rayboy IS on Instagram Rayboy IS on YouTube People and Resources Mentioned Joel Slenning on LinkedIn Mark Phillips on LinkedIn Cathy Stewart on LinkedIn Rich Roll podcast link Atomic Habits by James Clear Indistractible by Nir Eyal The Myth of Multitasking by Dave Crenshaw Rich Dad Poor Dad Robert Kiyosaki Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR#46 How to Run a Million Dollar Recruiting Firm From Your RV TRR#53 How to Scale Your Staffing & Recruiting Firm to $16,000,000, With Joel Slenning Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

“Turning around worst ever billing through the pandemic, to record-setting results currently.” In this episode, my special guest Wes Ashworth shares his story of the proactive steps he took to overcome a perfect storm of business during the height of the pandemic.  He also explains how he went from 100% contingency to 100% retained! Wes is the Vice President of Executive Search at Lee Group Search, and specializes in partnering with packaging companies nationwide to find the talent they need to grow and scale their business operations. He joined the company in 2014 as an Executive Search Consultant and was promoted to his current position in April 2020. I’m especially proud of this episode because Wes credits The Resilient Recruiter as being a “lifeline” during the toughest period of his career, and helping him access the motivation, strategies, role models and resources he needed to turn things around. Episode Outline and Highlights [2:27] How Wes finds the Resilient Recruiter podcast value-adding. [4:30] Wes shares his story on how he came into recruiting. [6:45] Why 2020-21 were the worst years for Wes and how he turned it around. [19:02] Key changes implemented to shift from the worst times to the best. [25:18]  “The world belongs to askers,” - how moving to the engaged model drastically changed Wes’ recruitment results.  [33:15] Great ways to pitch the engaged model to your existing contingent clients. [39:30] Turning around the worst ever billing through the pandemic, to currently record-setting results. [42:05] How having a peer group to pace yourself against can give better results. [46:00] How to develop your messaging approach to stand out in a world of noise. From Worst to Best Times - Key Success Factors Wes’ recruitment journey is indeed colourful in terms of successes and learnings. He joined the industry around 2014, and three years later he was stable and was billing $550k with his own book of clients. He had high hopes for 2020 and he even got promoted to VP.  Then suddenly in March 2020, Wes’ high hopes came crashing down. Due to the pandemic,  businesses and clients started to go away. His personal production plummeted and he was feeling the pressure. Being newly promoted, he had to carry his team’s performance which added more stress. Like with many others, the negativity brought about by the pandemic placed a great toll on Wes both personally and professionally.  Wes was never a quitter. With the support of his wife and the proactive actions that he took, he was actually able to turn from the worst times to the best times of his career. This is a story I am sure you will want to hear. What are the key factors that enabled him to overcome this colossal challenge? Here are some takeaways from our conversation: Revisiting his business development and quantifying his efforts. Wes discussed how doing so made him realize that he lost around $600k+ in billings.   Transitioning from 100% contingent, to 100% engaged/retained. This was not easy, but as Wes discussed it, he had to “put his stake in the ground and don’t look back”.   Listening to the Resilient Recruiter podcast and reaching out to those whose stories resonated with him.   Having a peer group - applying for and getting accepted to the Pinnacle Society. Wes discussed each of the above in this episode and even shared other best practices. The World Belongs to Askers One game-changer that contributed to Wes’ success is how he transitioned from 100% contingent to 100% retained. This was not easy at the onset as he had to be willing to walk away from businesses. Initially, Wes focused on implementing this approach to his new clients. How did Wes transition from pure contingent to engaged? He is a firm believer in the advice that “the world belongs to askers.” Asking the right questions enabled him to apply the retained approach to new clients and to some legacy clients as well. Wes is confident that he made the right decision, saying “honestly there is nothing in my mind that can convince me otherwise to do anything different.”  Aside from the outstanding results profit-wise, he found that it makes more sense for him and his clients. With this approach, he is able to foster a working relationship based on trust. To Wes’ realization, if a client would not want to pay an engagement fee, it could be that they don’t trust you. He believes that if a client does not trust you, it will not be a good working relationship and best to move forward. How to Stand Out in A World of Noise Wes also shared his best approach to improving his messaging. There is a lot of noise out there at the moment, so how did Wes change his business development strategy? His approach is more niche specific. He also utilizes LinkedIn automation. He explained that it is not overbearing, it’s important to come across as a normal person. His messaging leans more on being raw, real and relevant. You will hear how he turned his messaging upside down and generated better results. Our Sponsors This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro and Recruitment Entrepreneur. i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Our technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees and increase their billings. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter for a 25% discount. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: www.recruitmentcoach.com/retained   We’re excited to announce that Recruitment Entrepreneur will be sponsoring the podcast! If you’ve dreamed of starting up or scaling up and exiting your recruitment business, this is your chance. James Caan and his team at Recruitment Entrepreneur are actively seeking ambitious recruiters who they can invest in. Start a conversation here: https://www.recruitmentcoach.com/vc Wes Ashworth Bio and Contact Info A member of The Pinnacle Society, Wes continues to find success through his strong belief in doing the right thing, caring about people and fostering close relationships with both the company and the candidate. His proven process to align talent to grow businesses starts with taking the time to deeply understand what a business needs, the culture they’ve created for their team members and what type of candidate will help them grow. It stretches into getting that same level of understanding from the candidate. This work goes beyond a traditional meet and greet or interview. It’s more than a job description and more than a resume. For Wes, getting the perfect fit is the name of the game. Finding the candidate that fits the company and the company that fits the candidate are both critical. Only with a carefully evaluated fit will a candidate be positioned for success and find fulfillment in their job. In turn, companies benefit from an engaged employee who is a top performer over the long term. Wes’ laser focus on fit and long-term success has served him well. Recalling a client who turned to Lee Group Search with a job opening that several other agencies could not fill after more than six months of searching for candidates, Wes took the time to learn about the company and get up to speed on the nuances of the specific job requirements and culture of the organization. Within a few weeks, he was able to fill the position with the right candidate who went on to be successful with the company. Today, Wes counts the company as one of his most loyal clients. When he’s not matching candidates with positions, Wes enjoys spending quality time with his family and being around the water – piloting his kayak, catching a fish, or simply relaxing at the beach. Wes on LinkedIn Lee Group Search website link Lee Group Search on Facebook Lee Group Search on YouTube The Pinnacle Society website link Danny Parch’s PMC (Cause Wes wishes to support) website link Experience Camps website link People and Resources Mentioned Joe Rice on LinkedIn Rich Rosen on LinkedIn Josh Braun  on LinkedIn Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR#67Think Like a Big Biller: How to Get Repeat Business and Referrals, with Rich Rosen  TRR#55 How to Build (or Rebuild) Your Recruitment Firm to 7-Figures From Scratch, with Joe Rice   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

If you want to make more (and better) placements, you owe it to yourself to study “Performance-based Hiring.” The creator of Performance-based Hiring is Lou Adler, and I’m excited to have him on the podcast to learn from his four decades of recruitment experience. In our interview, you will hear Lou’s philosophy on figuring out the “performance objectives” for each role, instead of simply focusing on the skills that are needed. Lou’s models, examples and anecdotes are rich with insights for agency recruiters who want to gain the respect of hiring managers and get better results for their clients.  With over 40 years in the recruiting industry, Lou's company ‘The Adler Group’ has trained over 40,000 hiring managers and placed over 1500 executives for many of the fastest-growing companies with clients including Disney, General Dynamics and Paycom. Lou has over 1.4 Million followers on Linkedin and is one of the top bloggers on LinkedIn’s Influencer program writing about the latest trends in hiring, employment, and recruiting. His articles and research have also been featured in Inc. Magazine, Business Insider, Bloomberg, SHRM, and The Wall Street Journal. Lou is the author of ‘The Essential Guide for Hiring & Getting Hired’ and the Amazon top-10 best-seller, ‘Hire With Your Head - Performance-Based Hiring to Build Outstanding Diverse Teams.’  Episode Outline and Highlights [1:24] Lou’s fascinating story of how he became an executive recruiter. [6:46] The concept of “applicant control.” [9:30] How to become a thought leader in your recruitment niche. [12:46] What is the “One Question Interview?” [22:30] Get the respect and co-operation of hiring managers and other stakeholders with the Challenger Sales Model. [33:45] Lou shares his insights on Performance-Based and Evidence-Based Hiring. [37:00] Lou discusses the one-question interview with the analogy of peeling an onion. [43:01] How the performance-based approach can increase candidate engagement. [48:40] What is the most important piece of technology in recruitment? The Sherlock Holmes of Recruitment Lou has had a diverse experience in his career, from becoming a nuclear missiles engineer to running manufacturing companies as a financial analyst. It is in recruitment that he found his calling. Lou’s background gave him a unique perspective when he joined the industry. This led him to invent what’s now known as the ‘Performance-based Hiring' model. In this interview, you will hear out-of-the-box ideas that you may find useful in your own recruiting practice. Some of these are: Performance-based Hiring Evidenced-based Hiring The One-Question Interview Challenger Sales Model His insights are invaluable and I am sure you will find them beneficial. Ask the Right Questions Lou is famous for the concept of the “One Question Interview.”   You will hear the interesting story of how Lou came up with this idea. The logic behind it is very straightforward - how would a candidate identify broken processes? How would the candidate solve it? What has the candidate accomplished comparable to how he responded to the two previous questions? Lou used the analogy of peeling an onion when describing this approach which is the basis of the evidenced-based and performance-based hiring. In fact, the process can be outlined as follows: Figuring out the performance objectives Having the candidate present what they accomplished Having the candidate present evidence of what they have accomplished It does make sense that this pragmatic approach can increase the probability of hiring the right candidate by focusing on accomplishments without emotional bias. The Most Important Piece of Technology in Recruitment You may also be intrigued with Lou’s perspective on the most critical piece of technology in recruitment. With Lou having around 1.4m followers on the platform, is it LinkedIn? Is it high-end CRM platforms? Here is what Lou said: “I did my last LinkedIn Talent Connect where I have thousands of people there. They talked all about this great technology. So I spoke in the afternoon to a sub-group… and I said ‘you know there is one piece of technology that nobody talked about. As far as I am concerned it is the most important and nobody… it is right here. It is the phone. You got to talk to people. To me, high-tech is not going to cut it. You got to combine the best of high-tech with high-touch.” Our Sponsors This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro and Recruitment Entrepreneur. i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Our technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees and increase their billings. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter for a 25% discount. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: www.recruitmentcoach.com/retained   Recruitment Entrepreneur is the world’s leading Private Equity firm specializing in the international recruitment industry. If you’ve dreamed of starting up or scaling up and exiting your recruitment business, this is your chance. James Caan and his team at Recruitment Entrepreneur are actively seeking ambitious recruiters who they can invest in. Start a conversation here: https://www.recruitmentcoach.com/vc Lou Adler Bio and Contact Info  Lou Adler is the CEO and founder of Performance-based Hiring Learning Systems – a consulting and training firm helping recruiters and hiring managers around the world source, interview and hire the strongest and most diverse talent. Lou is the author of the Amazon top-10 best-seller, Hire With Your Head (John Wiley & Sons, 3rd Edition, 2007), The Essential Guide for Hiring & Getting Hired (Workbench Media, 2013) and the Lynda.com Performance-based Hiring video training program (2016). His current “Diversity Hiring without Compromise” initiative is focused on developing a colourblind hiring process that ensures the best people get hired regardless of race, religion, age, sexual preference and physical challenges. Lou is one of the top bloggers on LinkedIn’s Influencer program writing about the latest trends in hiring, employment, and recruiting. His articles, quotes and research can now be found in Inc. Magazine, Business Insider, Bloomberg, SHRM and The Wall Street Journal. The company’s new mobile-ready learning platform – Win-Win Hiring Learning Systems – provides instant access to all of the tools needed to find and hire outstanding talent. Lou on LinkedIn Performance-Based Hiring website link "Almost Daily Recruiting Show" podcast link The Essential Guide for Hiring and Getting Hired Hiring with Your Head - Performance-Based Hiring Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter  

There are significant advantages to being known as the premium brand in your market. For one, you can charge higher fees than your competitors.  Secondly, your job as a recruiter is more fulfilling because you’re focused on delivering exceptional client and candidate experiences.  Rob Bowerman is President and Executive Recruiter at The Bowerman Group, focused on recruiting for specialty and luxe brands. As you’ll hear from Rob, earning a reputation as the premium recruitment firm in their market has been a critical factor in their long-term success. Rob’s background in the retail sector gives him credible insights and perspectives on the topic of delivering outstanding customer service in the recruitment field.  Episode Outline and Highlights [2:21] How The Bowerman Group are winning more retained searches and increasing their average fee. [9:33] Customer experience - lessons from premium retail brands that Rob has applied to recruiting. [14:54] Powerful questions you can ask your clients to assess their specific needs. [16:26] How to partner with HR while having access to the hiring manager. [21:13] Rob reveals their processes for ensuring a positive customer experience for both the candidates and clients. [27:48] What defines a positive client experience? [39:11] What could stop a recruitment firm from delivering a positive client experience? [43:49] How to consistently deliver a great experience to candidates even if they are not moving forward in the hiring process. [47:00] Rob reveals the burning issues discussed at a recent Pinnacle Society meeting, including preventing and handling counteroffers. [56:20] Why it is a great time to be in our industry. How The Bowerman Group Increased their Average Fee by $6,200 The last time I collaborated with Rob in this show was two years ago. It was indeed an amazing conversation (link of the episode below) and as the head of the Pinnacle Society, Rob also introduced me to other members who became guests of this show. This kind of support brought tremendous value to our audience and I am truly grateful. What has happened in the last two years? As with all businesses, the last couple of years were truly unprecedented. Rob shared a lot of learnings and strategies.  You will hear how they intensionally focused on higher-level roles. The benefit of this has been twofold - winning more retained searches while also increasing their average fee from $21,800 to $28,000. The success of the Bowerman Group can be attributed to how they value client and candidate experience, which became a core topic in this episode. Becoming a Premium Brand in Recruiting Through Client and Candidate Engagement Coming from the Retail and Merchandising industry, Rob learned a great deal when it comes to customer experience. From his standpoint, a customer is not only your client but your candidate as well.  He recently did a LinkedIn post (link below) about notifying a candidate that will not be moving forward with the recruitment process. The main theme is, “How can you not approach recruitment - either as an internal recruiter or external recruitment partner - without empathy and appreciation for the candidate's work in the process?” This post got hundreds of reactions and responses. It amazes Rob that since we are in the people business, the reactions and number of reactions were indicative that it is a massive issue within our industry. In this episode, Rob gave a great analogy on what defines a great customer experience. He then shared their process of engaging with clients and candidates consistently. He also gave insights on what could be preventing a recruitment firm from providing the same positive customer experience to its clients and candidates. The Bowerman Group Difference So what makes the Bowerman Group different from other recruitment brands? How do they consistently ensure positive customer engagement from both clients and candidates? Rob elaborated on the following pointers that I am sure you will find valuable: How to ensure that you’re giving candidates feedback within 48 hours Doing the Job Intake Call effectively Asking the right questions to assess the client’s culture Partnering with HR and Hiring Managers Process for preparing both candidates and clients for interview Our Sponsors   This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro and Recruitment Entrepreneur. i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Our technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees and increase their billings. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter for a 25% discount. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: www.recruitmentcoach.com/retained   We’re excited to announce that Recruitment Entrepreneur will be sponsoring the podcast! If you’ve dreamed of starting up or scaling up and exiting your recruitment business, this is your chance. James Caan and his team at Recruitment Entrepreneur are actively seeking ambitious recruiters who they can invest in. Start a conversation here: https://www.recruitmentcoach.com/vc   Rob Bowerman Bio and Contact Info Rob started The Bowerman Group in 2009 after having been a successful Executive Recruiter since 1994.  He discovered his passion for Search following a career in merchandising and shares his love for the industry with his team, clients, and candidates every day. Carving out a unique niche that focused on speciality and luxe brands, he has developed long-standing relationships with many respected American and European designer apparel, accessory, jewellery, and home furnishing companies.  Rob had a vision of creating a boutique firm that matched the unique profile of this niche—excellence, brand heritage, and an unwavering dedication to quality.   This vision has manifested itself into a dynamic group that is experiencing consistent year-over-year increases in successfully completed searches within TBG’s unique niche. Rob currently serves as the President of The Pinnacle Society, the premier consortium of industry-leading recruiters in North America.  He is proud of his association with this group of the “best and brightest” within the search profession as well as honoured to be the only “retail guy” in the organization. Rob Bowerman on LinkedIn The Bowerman Group website link The Bowerman Group on Facebook The Bowerman Group on Instagram The Bowerman Group on YouTube People and Resources Mentioned Rob’s LinkedIn post on following through with candidates How to Gain Access to Hiring Managers Without Alienating HR Michael Pietrack on LinkedIn Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR#32 How to Build a 7-Figure Search Firm with a Small Virtual Team, with Rob Bowerman TRR#106 How to Bill £12,800,000 in 14 Years, with Michael Pietrack Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

Last time Paul Taaffe came on the podcast, we heard how this former CFO has enjoyed extraordinary success running a boutique search firm. He revealed how he managed to bill €4,000,000 in revenue with a small team.  Nearly two years later, Paul is back for his second appearance on the show. You’ll hear fascinating insights on how to gain an advantage over the competition and outperform even the biggest search firms in the world.   Paul’s philosophy is about providing “return on energy invested.” He and his team provide an efficient service without compromising quality by leveraging their relationships and market knowledge. You’ll learn how he achieves market mastery by carefully cultivating his network so he can deliver a shortlist in 30 days or less.  On multiple occassions, Paul has made a €100,000 placement fee in 7 days! Paul is the founder and CEO of FINANCE People Solutions (FPS) based in Frankfurt, Germany.  Prior to starting his business in 2014, he was either a CFO or CRO for US global corporations as well as high profile private equity funds and their portfolios where he mastered various change management challenges, from turnaround and restructuring to the implementation of new growth strategies. Episode Outline and Highlights [1:43] Paul shares the latest developments at his firm, Finance People Solutions. [6:15] FPS’ focus market, revenue stream, and marketing strategy. [10:35] How to choose the right client to work with - and when to walk away. [15:30] Coaching your clients on their recruitment process [16:53] Paul’s top tips on how to market a candidate. [20:36] FPS’ new Benchmarking Products as a differentiator [23:30] Why Paul launched his own podcast. [27:26] Why ‘head-hunting’ is an outdated term and Paul prefers ‘resource matching.’ [33:58] How to build your brand on LinkedIn. [43:01] Paul reveals what he learned from working for Phil Knight, Nike’s co-founder. [51:00] Why Paul likes to hire students when building his team Choosing the Right Clients Paul is a fan of positive energy which means he is selective of the clients he works with. He only works with committed clients, no contingency, only retained or exclusive. In our interview, Paul shared his criteria in client selection and when to ‘fire’ or let go of a client. “If we do not enjoy working together, if the process is not good, in this day and age if you get your hands on top three candidates or two or even one for this matter, we never say we are going to produce a shortlist, we will produce at least one … and the customer is not coming back, not setting up appointments, not picking it up, that is no good we are wasting people’s time,” is how Paul described it. He shared concrete examples based on experience how in some cases it did not work with some clients. Also, given the current situation in the market where recruitment needs to adapt, how do you coach your compatible clients on improving their recruitment process? Paul shares his best practices. Marketing and Brand Building Best Practices Although Paul’s background is in finance, he is actually excellent at marketing. In this interview, you will hear some of his marketing strategies including: FPS Benchmarking Product Podcast Partnership with FINANCE Magazin LinkedIn content Paul believes US companies are the best at marketing and says his experience at Nike helped him to become a great marketer.  Why Head-Hunting is a Term of the Past Another interesting topic we talked about is the term “headhunting” which Paul believes is outdated.  As Paul said, “The difference for us is we have relationships with these people… That is why I don’t like this term head-hunting… I call it resource matching. We match resources. We don’t headhunt people, we have them already in our network. So it is about what is the best position for these people. So it is an evolution from the old headhunting.” Paul doesn’t need to “hunt” because he’s already mapped his market and curated a strong network. Since he already knows and has relationships with the vast majority of the candidates in his space, he is able to move fast without compromising quality. Our Sponsors This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro and Recruitment Entrepreneur. i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Our technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees and increase their billings. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter for a 25% discount. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: www.recruitmentcoach.com/retained We’re excited to announce that Recruitment Entrepreneur will be sponsoring the podcast! If you’ve dreamed of starting up or scaling up and exiting your recruitment business, this is your chance. James Caan and his team at Recruitment Entrepreneur are actively seeking ambitious recruiters who they can invest in. Start a conversation here: https://www.recruitmentcoach.com/vc Paul Taaffe Bio and Contact Info Paul is the founder and CEO of FINANCE People Solutions (PFS) in 2014. He has been in the recruitment business since 2014, and prior to that, he was either a CFO or CRO for US global blue-chip companies such as Pepsi Cola, Nike, Lear Corporation, and Dell as well as having worked in Private Equity. He founded the PE Finance Organisation Benchmarking company, Taaffe and Partners in 2011. Paul on LinkedIn FINANCE People Solutions website link People and Resources Mentioned Joel Slenning on LinkedIn Shoe Dog, by Phil Knight Finance Magazin website link Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR#21 The Former CFO Turned Finance Recruiter Who Billed €4M Last Year, with Paul Taaffe TRR#53 How to Scale Your Staffing & Recruiting Firm to $16,000,000, With Joel Slenning   Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

Want to attract inbound client leads and convert them into engaged search assignments, where the client pays part of the fee up front? Then you’ll love my interview with Skip Freeman, founder of Smart Buildings Talent. Skip shared that he’s currently working on 13 engaged searches simultaneously at 25% fees. Of those 13 searches, 12 of them were inbound leads meaning the client approached Skip instead of the other way around.   Skip reveals some of his most effective tactics and strategies, including a detailed masterclass on how to be “prominent and visible” in your chosen niche. You’ll also hear his fascinating story of resilience - from building a business, overcoming prostate cancer, and restarting from the ground up.   Skip is the Founder and President of Smart Buildings Talent, specializing in Buildings Automation and Smart Industry. Skip graduated from the United States Military Academy, West Point, in 1976, with a bachelor's degree in Mechanical Engineering and has almost 20 years of experience as a recruitment business owner.   Episode Outline and Highlights [2:22] Skip shares how he became a recruiter and the latest accomplishments of Smart Buildings Talent [9:24] How to become a specialist and find a super-focused niche. [15:06] Global Acquisition: Key factors that made Skip’s firm attractive to a global brand.  [22:09] Steps to becoming prominent and visible in your chosen niche.  [36:38] Skip’s tips for consistently creating and posting content on LinkedIn. [44:49] The importance of systems - Skip reveals his “sequence of recruitment operations.” [55:00] Skip’s process for closing engaged searches including the ingredients of a winning proposal.   Finding a Super-Focused Niche A recent achievement that Skip shared is when a global IT consulting and contract staffing firm, Emerge360, reached out to acquire his brand, Smart Building Talent. This is an outstanding accomplishment for a business of its size - and what made it possible are three things:    Finding a critical niche Having a systematic approach  Building a brand   On the topic of finding a critical niche, Skip’s background in mechanical engineering served as a foundation to look at focusing on automation and discovering the talent behind this industry. He then focused on his mastery in this specialty which was a critical game-changer in his business. Skip also revealed what made him prominent and visible in his chosen niche.   Your Recruitment "Sequence of Operations" Another topic that Skip shared is the system he discovered, which he refers to as his sequence of recruitment operations. “A system is going to be a consistent process that everybody understands, and you have the tools as well as needed. Every time you get a job order, it enters into the system,” is how he describes it.    Inspired by Mike Pietrack and Scott Adams, you will hear his four major steps to the job order fulfilment process:   Find  Attract Qualify Land   How to Be Prominent and Visible in Your Chosen Niche Choosing the niche and area of specialisation is the first step, but how do you become prominent and visible in your chosen niche? How do you generate inbound leads? Skip shared how he does it. From his experience, he explained how he attends trade shows, creates articles and content specifically for his industry, and how he has become a “community leader” on LinkedIn. You will hear how to use polls to your advantage and how to generate inbound leads from LinkedIn.   Our Sponsors This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro and Recruitment Entrepreneur.   i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Our technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees and increase their billings. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter for a 25% discount. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: www.recruitmentcoach.com/retained We’re excited to announce that Recruitment Entrepreneur will be sponsoring the podcast! If you’ve dreamed of starting up or scaling up and exiting your recruitment business, this is your chance. James Caan and his team at Recruitment Entrepreneur are actively seeking ambitious recruiters who they can invest in. Start a conversation here: https://www.recruitmentcoach.com/vc   Skip Freeman Bio and Contact Info   Skip Freeman graduated from the United States Military Academy, West Point, in 1976, with a bachelor's degree in Mechanical Engineering. He served in the US Army Corps of Engineers, more specifically the Combat Engineers, after which he moved into industry as a chemical sales rep for a major speciality chemical company.     He progressed from field sales into sales management. As a Sales Manager, Skip had started using one particular recruiter for all of his hiring needs. That relationship began with none other than an MPC marketing call. And while that candidate wasn't hired, many were over the next several years.   Then Skip's firm was purchased. To stay with the company, he was going to have to relocate. That not being an option due to family reasons, he called his recruiter this time saying, "I don't need a candidate, I'm going to need a job." After some contemplation, his recruiter said, "Have you ever thought about running your own business? Skip said, "Tell me more..." and that's how Skip's recruiting career began.   With some of Skip's recruitment work helping to hire chemists and chemical engineers, he was contacted by an agency in Washington, DC, which led to an interesting parallel journey. in which Skip recruited for the CIA for 4-years.   In 2013, he started building a recruiting firm and his wife joined him in the business. His firm reached a size of 8 people when he suffered a personal setback, prostate cancer, which, more or less, took him out of the game for 3-years. One by one everyone in the firm dwindled away or needed to be fired until it was just Skip again along with his wife. Since then he’s completely rebuilt his business as the founder and president of Smart Buildings Talent, focused on buildings automation and smart industry. Today he is back with an exciting story that illustrates perseverance, discipline, and a will to win.   Skip on LinkedIn Skip on Twitter @SBTrecruiter Skip on YouTube Smart Buildings Talent website link Smart Buildings Talent on Facebook   People and Resources Mentioned Michael Pietrack on LinkedIn David Perry on LinkedIn Shield Analytics website link Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR#106 How to Bill £12,800,000 in 14 Years, with Michael Pietrack TRR#26 Canada Day Special: How the Rogue Recruiter Closed 1100 Searches, with David Perry Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

“For those out there that are starting a firm or for those recruiters out there thinking about starting a firm… when people really will look at the mirror and understand what their capabilities are, and where there are gaps and they work on that, they will then become a better leader.”  I am very much looking forward to sharing this episode with you. My very special guest, Bert Miller, with more than 25 years of leadership experience in the world of work, has been very generous in sharing golden nuggets of wisdom. Hear his fascinating insights on the “Great Realignment” and how it impacts our recruitment business today. You will also hear major trends in the recruitment industry as well as effective techniques you can use to warm up your leads. Bert currently serves as President of Protis Global, plus President and CEO of MRINetwork, a network-centric recruitment organization that offers consulting, training, contract staffing, and community building to over 325 search firms worldwide Episode Outline and Highlights [2:05] How Bert started as a recruiter leading up to him becoming President and CEO of MRI. [8:06] How recruitment firm owners can future-proof their business. [10:30] The 10-4-2 strategy to engage people on LinkedIn. [16:32] How to effectively use LinkedIn to warm up your leads using the headline approach. [26:25] What is the “Great Realignment?”  [31:50] Bert’s principle on ‘storytelling your North Star.” [37:35] The importance of empowering your recruiters to have their own personal brand. [42:29] Circling back to the Great Realignment, how do recruitment business owners ensure that they are in the forefront? [45:13] Bert shares the biggest mistakes he sees recruiters making: from rookies to long-term veterans. [48:39] Success factors for owning and growing a recruitment firm. LinkedIn Strategies to Warm Up Your Leads How are you using LinkedIn as a tool to find potential candidates or clients? You will be delighted to hear strategies shared by Bert on how to warm up your leads using this platform. How do you connect with an executive? How do you make your presence felt with insightful engagement? Bert shared two techniques: The 10-4-2 Strategy and  The Headline Approach The Great Realignment A fascinating insight shared by Bert is about the “Great Realignment”. In his words, “What happened in the last two and a half years only accelerated something that is already underway… The power of individuals coming in to play… The dynamics coming into play about the hybrid model, working flexible… I think companies that do not react or respond enough on the last several years to the individual… those organizations are now stepping back.”  With this transition, how do recruitment businesses remain in the forefront instead of being left behind? Bert placed an emphasis on rehiring your people all the time - keeping the ones you have and storytelling your North Star. You will hear a more elaborated explanation about it in this episode. Also, key areas that would need to be addressed are: Proper planning Learning what is going on in your sector Going deeper in your ‘dig’ Bert’s Success Factors in Owning and Scaling Your Recruitment Business With over 25 years of leadership experience in the world of work running Protis Global and becoming President of the MRI Network, what are the success factors that Bert can share to all our listeners?  “I find myself at 60-years-old continuing to learn every day. I know that I am not there. My team does that too. So having that humility and vulnerability does not make you weaker as an organization, it actually makes you stronger.” Our Sponsors This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro and Recruitment Entrepreneur. i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Our technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees and increase their billings. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter for a 25% discount. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: www.recruitmentcoach.com/retained   We’re excited to announce that Recruitment Entrepreneur will be sponsoring the podcast! If you’ve dreamed of starting up or scaling up and exiting your recruitment business, this is your chance. James Caan and his team at Recruitment Entrepreneur are actively seeking ambitious recruiters who they can invest in. Start a conversation here: https://www.recruitmentcoach.com/vc   Bert Miller Bio and Contact Info With over 25 years of leadership experience in the world of work, Bert E. Miller currently serves as CEO of Protis Global,  Ace Talent Curators, and President and CEO of MRI Network. MRI is a network-centric recruitment organization that offers consulting, training, contract staffing, and community building to over 325 search firms worldwide. Bert also co-founded Protis Global, an award-winning search and recruitment firm specializing in the F&B, CPG, cannabis, and hospitality industries. Bert is an active speaker, mentor, advisor, and investor. He hosts the MRINetwork Podcast and his new video podcast series, "Beyond the Bottom Line," features interviews with CEOs and leaders from across categories on issues impacting the world of work. Bert on LinkedIn MRI Network website link Protis Global website link BCC Media website link MRI Network on Facebook Bert on Twitter Bert on Instagram Bert on YouTube People and Resources Mentioned Joe Mullings on LinkedIn Building a StoryBrand, by Donald Miller Chris Voss on LinkedIn Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR #80 How to Use Video to Attract Candidates and Grow Your Recruitment Business, with Joe Mullings Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

Are you putting up with companies who aren’t your ideal clients? Does the thought of asking for a retainer or increasing your rates scare the hell out of you? Do you have a mind block to being more specialized or refocusing on a niche that’s truly aligned with the direction you want to take your recruitment business? In this interview, my special guest Jackie Rothschild shares how after years of struggle, a change in approach and mindset enabled her to attract the right clients – clients who were willing to work with her as a true partner. You’ll also hear Jackie’s inspiring story of resilience, and how a health crisis was the catalyst for renewed determination to succeed and no longer being willing to settle. Jackie is a Human capital advisor and retained search executive for PBMs (pharmacy benefit managers) and Physician practice owners who want to grow their business and hire the most qualified PBM, healthcare executives and clinicians. Episode Outline and Highlights [1:46] Jackie’s journey from being a licensed pharmacist to becoming a recruiter. [10:09] Jackie reveals her struggles and lessons when starting her recruitment firm from the ground up. [16:26] How you should define your niche if working in a broad industry. [21:30] How to identify the best client you should be working with. [26:23] Training a Virtual Assistant from administrative tasks to making placement - how Jackie developed her VA [32:46] Jackie’s recent biggest challenge and how it defines resilience. [49:58] Getting off the hamster wheel through retained business.   From a Successful Pharmaceutical Career to a Starting a Recruitment Business Jackie shared her successful career as a licensed pharmacist when she worked in the Pharmacy Benefit Industry (PBM) for 15 years. Being a friendly person, she built an extensive network of connections. Her friends made her a point of contact if ever they needed to hire a specialist in the industry. This made Jackie realise that recruitment is something she should try. Even with no prior background, she took a massive salary cut, took a risk,  and started her recruitment career.  She was then assigned to build a branch for her staffing firm which became a huge success. This is when her husband encouraged her to start her recruitment firm. It was a strange idea in the beginning since she had no business background. She took a risk and started Acclaimed Staffing. At the onset, things were okay but were not clicking.  This is where her story becomes interesting. She shared her struggles and learnings. You will hear instances of failures and adversities, but what will resonate is her journey of resilience.    COVID Setbacks and Surviving Cancer An astonishing revelation that Jackie shared in our interview is how she was able to overcome a series of devastating events. In 2020, Jackie’s business was affected by the pandemic. At that time, she was also diagnosed with a very rare type of cancer with which very few medical professionals in the country can deal with it. As she was recovering from surgery, her husband had a heart attack.  Those were trying times for Jackie and her husband. What type of treatment did Jackie have to endure? How was she able to manage her business? How is Jackie doing now? I am confident that you will be inspired by her story of grit, resilience, and courage.  Her husband calls Jackie a badass, and once you hear her story I think you’ll agree! Getting off the Hamster Wheel Through Retained Business Jackie shared how she learned to filter the best client when she shifted to the retained business model. For her, it was a change in mindset. This enabled her to walk away from new clients that are not really a good fit and made her focus on her partners or clients that stood by her. If you are contemplating whether you should consider shifting from a contingent to a retained search model, I highly recommend hearing out how it became a game-changer for Jackie.   Our Sponsors This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro and Recruitment Entrepreneur.   i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Our technology and methodology allow recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees and increase their billings. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter for a 25% discount. Book your free, no-obligation consultation here: www.recruitmentcoach.com/retained We’re excited to announce that Recruitment Entrepreneur will be sponsoring the podcast! If you’ve dreamed of starting up or scaling up and exiting your recruitment business, this is your chance. James Caan and his team at Recruitment Entrepreneur are actively seeking ambitious recruiters who they can invest in. Start a conversation here: https://www.recruitmentcoach.com/vc Jackie Rothschild Bio and Contact Info Jackie is the owner of Acclaimed Staffing and CEO of Rothschild RX. Acclaimed Staffing is an Arizona staffing agency that specializes in the healthcare career placement of all aspects for ambulatory surgical centres, clinics, medical offices, hospitals, imaging and radiology centres, nursing homes, home care, hospice, and other healthcare facilities. Jackie and her team have been trusted business partners for over 7 years servicing many medical offices, health plans, home health and assisted living facilities in finding mid-level and executive clinicians and ancillary staff.  Jackie is a licensed pharmacist since 1995 and worked in the PBM (pharmacy benefit management) industry for over 15 years.   Based on her deep PBM roots, RothschildRx was formed in 2021 to specifically service the PBM (pharmacy benefit management) industry.  Recently due to their successful track record, the RothschildRx team is being awarded an exclusive talent sourcing agreement with a leading mid-market PBM.   Originally from Brooklyn, NY, Jackie is living in Arizona where she lives with her husband, 2 children, and 4 “furry children”. Jackie on LinkedIn Acclaimed Staffing website link Acclaimed Staffing on Facebook People and Resources Mentioned Joel Slenning on LinkedIn Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Related Podcast You Might Enjoy TRR#53 How to Scale Your Staffing & Recruiting Firm to $16,000,000, With Joel Slenning Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter