Anne Ganguzza and Tom Dheere share decades of combined experience in this insightful episode, dedicated to the long view of a voice acting career. Having been in the industry since the cassette and CD demo era, the hosts emphasize that longevity is achieved not through linear steps, but through resilience, strategic adaptation, and continuous self-improvement. The discussion provides a candid look at why the work never stops, the necessity of community, and the critical importance of mastering the mental game.
00:00 - Anne (Host) Hey bosses, Anne Ganguzza here. Are you ready to take the next step in your voiceover career? At Anne Ganguzza Productions, I specialize in target marketed coaching and demo production that gets you booked. If you're thinking about elevating your performance or creating an awesome demo, check me out at anneganguzza.com.
00:22 - Speaker 2 (Announcement) It's time to take your business to the next level, the boss level. These are the premier business owner strategies and successes being utilized by the industry's top talent today. Rock your business like a boss a VO boss. Now let's welcome your host, Anne Ganguzza.
00:41 - Anne (Host) Hey, hey everyone. Welcome to the VO Boss podcast and the Real Bosses series. I'm your host, Anne Ganguzza, and I'm here with the one and only illustrious Mr Tom Dheere, real Boss.
00:54 - Tom (Host) Hi everybody, hi Anne hey.
00:56 - Anne (Host) Tom, how are?
00:57 - Tom (Host) you. I'm doing pretty good, if I'm not mistaken, haven't you, didn't you just have an anniversary?
01:03 - Anne (Host) I did Just celebrated 25 years with my hubby whoa. It seems like yesterday. I swear to god, 25 years just went so fast that's amazing and uh, and you, just, you just were telling me about your blogiversary how long have you been blogging? 17 years oh my god, tom that blogging, I mean I've been blogging for a you been blogging 17 years. Oh my God, tom, blogging, I mean I've been blogging for a while, but blogging for 17 years is insane.
01:31 - Tom (Host) Thank you.
01:31 - Anne (Host) Wow, you must have really good SEO. That's all I got to say.
01:35 - Tom (Host) I would like to yeah. Yeah, my SEO is pretty good.
01:37 - Anne (Host) Yeah, we would like to think that you have good SEO, but, wow, so long term relationships. You know it makes me think about voiceover, because I have been in voiceover just about as long Not quite as long as I've been married to my husband, but you know, 21 years, and it's. It's incredible. I feel like I just started, but yet I don't, because it is and we always talk about it being a marathon, not a sprint and I think you've been in voiceover longer than me.
02:03 - Tom (Host) Yes, I decided I wanted to be a voice actor in 1994.
02:09 - Anne (Host) Wow yeah. And then I got my commercial demo. Some people were born in 1994.
02:14 - Tom (Host) Not me, I know.
02:17 - Anne (Host) Yeah, some of my students haven't been born.
02:19 - Tom (Host) Some bosses listening to this are going to be like, I was born in 1994. I know, or 2004. And then I got my commercial demo in 1995 and I booked my first voiceover in 1996. And I went full time as a voice actor in 2005 and started coaching in 2011. So I've been-.
02:39 - Anne (Host) Oh, I started coaching just shortly before you. Yeah, yeah, just a little bit longer, because then we started coaching just shortly before you. Yeah, yeah, just a little bit longer, because then because we met shortly thereafter at Voice 2012.
02:49 - Tom (Host) Oh my goodness, we already knew each other, but I don't think we met.
02:52 - Anne (Host) Yeah, but I remember we.
02:54 - Tom (Host) I definitely remember we hung out at Voice 2012, which was 13 years ago. Oh my gosh.
02:59 - Anne (Host) Woo At Disneyland. You know so and it's funny because we talk about you know how long have you been in voiceover and how long did it take you to become successful in voiceover? Well, I always say you know, my overnight success took many, many years. So I think and I think it's something that a lot of people don't understand, especially those that are intrigued by this industry you know thinking that, oh yeah, it's, I can stay at home, I can do this. You know thinking that, oh yeah, it's, I can stay at home, I can do this. You know, I can buy the mic. It'll cost me a few hundred dollars and then I can just start booking jobs and making money.
03:32 And I think really for I know we talk about all the time, but I think I want to have a whole episode dedicated to the realities of having a long view career and the fact that it is something that you have to be in for the long run if you truly want to be successful at it. I mean, of course, you could be in it for a couple of years and then, if you don't like it, you get out. But most people I know want to make a good, they want to be successful at it, they want to make a good living. So let's talk about what it's like to be in voiceover for a long time and what it looks like, because it's certainly not like a corporate job. I am a corporate girl and came from corporate and then education, and I certainly was not handed a paycheck every other week in this full-time voiceover job. That's for sure, because it's a much different, much different industry. It's our own businesses.
04:22 - Tom (Host) I have the luxury of being able to zoom out and look at 30 years of being in the voiceover business, where when I started, you know, they just segued out of reel to reels and started using plastic cassette tapes. So I'm of the cassette tape generation of voice actors that started in the mid 90s and now we are. I was CDs, you were CDs, so you were, just I was CDs.
04:51 - Anne (Host) Yeah, shortly after the cassettes came the CDs.
04:53 - Tom (Host) Just as CDs came out and then, a few years after the CDs, came the MP3.
04:57 - Anne (Host) Yeah, and it was a thing, because I remember the burning of the CDs was like, oh God, who do I get to do that for me?
05:03 - Tom (Host) I did it myself.
05:04 - Anne (Host) Yeah, well, that was before. Right CD burners came out and now you know you can have a CD. I had a duplication company that I did all my cassettes through and then started doing the CDs.
05:14 - Tom (Host) There, you go and then I was like wait a minute.
05:20 - Anne (Host) I can print my own labels.
05:21 - Tom (Host) using Avery, I can burn my own CDs, stick it in the tray and my desktop.
05:25 - Anne (Host) I was one of those people. I got that. The stamp thing where you push it down, you stamp your label on the CD and that was like, oh my gosh.
05:33 - Tom (Host) Oh, now I feel old. Now we're getting really anachronistic and alienating ourselves.
05:37 - Anne (Host) That was like. That was like that. That was the coolest. That was the peas knees.
05:40 - Tom (Host) That was kind of fun.
05:42 - Anne (Host) I love that little stamper. That was awesome, it was.
05:46 - Tom (Host) But anyway, so, yeah, so looking back and zooming out and looking at what are the realities of what you need to have a long VO career, I mean it starts with training. It absolutely starts with training. I'm a theater-trained actor. I went to college and then I did a little graduate work at a place called the National Shakespeare Conservatory that used to be here in New York City. So I got like hardcore theater training about body and mind and spirit and voice and engaging. I had great voice coaches, I had ballet coach, chekhov coach, like all this stuff. That really gave me a very, very, very solid, solid foundation. Gave me a very, very, very solid, solid foundation. So if you want so the so step one. If you want longevity in the voiceover industry, if you want a long career, you got to start with very solid training performance training, voiceover training, genre training, so you can be demo ready.
06:38 - Anne (Host) I didn't realize you you had been a theater trained. Yes, I did. How did I not know that about you, Tom? And I know I've known you for a long time it doesn't come.
06:45 - Tom (Host) I mean, it was so long ago, Wow.
06:47 - Anne (Host) Do you miss it? Do you still do it or do you miss it?
06:50 - Tom (Host) No, I haven't been on a stage in almost 25 years. When I discovered voiceover after I dropped out of the conservatory for reasons we will not get into as soon as I discovered voiceover I was like, oh, that's where I need to be and that's where, also, I can take all of that training that I did on stage and I had a little bit of on camera. I had a little bit of TV and a little bit of film experience very, very little bit like extra work on 30 Rock and things like that.
07:25 You know that's that sort of that. You know if you blink you'll miss me, that sort of thing. But that turned into that inhabited me. As I'll put it to you this way, that sort of training, theater training, it's like pro wrestling, like it's large gestures, projecting, you know, into an audience and then voiceovers is is boxing. It's very, it's very intimate and it's very, it's very, very close.
07:51 Um, so that all that great theater training, I had to obviously learn to make adjustments and turn from this very open, broad presentation, presentational type of acting to this very intimate, one-on-one, you know, doing this, this kind of acting. And I use that training, consciously or unconsciously, every every day, 30 years later, but, like I, I definitely attribute a big, I credit a large part of my longevity as a voice actor to the performance training that I got and I had a great voiceover coach uh, who's no longer, who's with us Um, she really set me on the path to understanding the difference between theater acting and film acting and voice, voice acting, and you know it gave me all kinds of exercises and stuff and you know I recorded. I still have the cassette demo to this day. Um, but that training I still have it. Uh, I whip it out once in a while on a, on a, on a at a conference or something.
08:48 I'll be like check it out once in a while at a conference or something. I'll be like check it out and people are like, oh my god, is that a what's? And then the Gen Z's are like what's a J card? What look?
08:55 - Anne (Host) it up if you don't know what it is in those 30 years, though, would you say that there's been like, okay, so I do this, and then I get to this level, and then this is what I do. Next, is it like a to this level, and then this is what I do next?
09:07 - Speaker 2 (Announcement) Is it like a? You know, one of the?
09:08 - Anne (Host) steps to attaining and achieving that voiceover career.
09:14 - Tom (Host) That's a great question. First off, there are no levels, there are no steps. It never gets any easier, it just turns into different types of hard.
09:22 - Anne (Host) Ah, that we can just go home now, because that I think that sums it up in a nutshell, because it is so not a linear climb. It is not, but it's something that I think that you know over time. That's why I think you have to be in it for a long time, right, so you can adjust, you can evolve, you can work with it and understand it and somewhat predict it. I don't know.
09:45 - Tom (Host) Not predictable. Oh, I wish I could predict it.
09:48 - Anne (Host) But maybe a little bit. You can make it more predictable in certain ways, right? Yes, you can. Yeah.
09:53 - Tom (Host) Yeah, Absolutely Understanding how the industry ebbs and flows understanding trends, keeping up with performance trends, keeping up with technology trends. That's a big part of the realities of a long VO career, but but yeah, let yeah. I definitely want to drive home the point that there is no linear like do this, do this, do this successful? That's not. That's not how it works. You got to get your training, you got to get a website, you got to get demos produced, you got to set up a home recording studio. Those are your pillars.
10:35 - Anne (Host) And even the intricacies of that. Changes. I think you have to have, I think what's pillars, and even the intricacies of that. Changes have a down or a lull in your business and you question everything you've ever like. You know what got you into it in the first place. You're like, oh my gosh, I don't belong here, should I? I mean, there's so many things that happen during a lull in your business because it makes you question am I good enough? Am I valid, am I to be a success in this industry? Should I just quit? Should I give it up? Should I not have quit my job? And so there's so many things that get in the way of evolving and growing in your career.
11:17 And again, this is not a linear growth. It's ups, it's downs, and sometimes you can be like, oh, I just booked that gig, and then things are amazing for a while. But then you're like, okay. Sometimes you can be like, oh, I just booked that gig, and then things are amazing for a while, but then you're like, ok, so I should be able to book the other gig, I should be able to book a gig a week now. And then you say, ok, my goal is to book 10 jobs every week. Did you ever try that? Because I tried that a long time ago. Oh, I'm going to book.
11:44 - Tom (Host) My goal is to book 10 jobs a week. I had a very specific thing to that end, which is, I thought for a very long time I needed three very specific sources of voiceover income to be successful and consistent and sustainable on an income level. One was with a regular client that I was making well over $10,000 a year with for a number of years. One was Voice123 as a source of online casting, a source of auditions and bookings, and then I was just that elusive third source and I was saying that for years and years and years and my career has evolved and gone up and down and all around that I don't think that way anymore, because what's interesting is that client that was paying me well over $10,000 for many, many years, who I still work with to this day. I've worked with them since 1997. I now book one or two clients, one or two gigs a year with them, because their business model changed and the industry of their genre changed, so therefore my relationship with them changed.
12:51 I'm still on Voice123 making great money, and there's so many factors too.
12:57 - Anne (Host) So many factors to that and I love that because it's not just about you and your skill set and your skill level. The industry changes because our clients change. Their industries change right, their jobs change. Our relationships change with the people that some people come and go from jobs, and especially when you're talking about the repeat client or clients that you've had for years, which are great, they're wonderful, they're one of the more predictable things in this industry that you can count on, but then again, you know, don't count on them all together because tomorrow they could be gone.
13:33 - Tom (Host) Right, and as you were talking, I just had a revelation.
13:37 - Anne (Host) Ah Okay. Will you disclose the revelation, Tom? Oh, no, I'm going to share.
13:42 - Tom (Host) No, I'm going to leave and run away and write a book.
13:44 - Anne (Host) No, let's go. I must go now. No revolution share.
13:47 - Tom (Host) No, I'm going to leave and run away and write a book. No, let's go, I must go now. No revolution, no, no, no, no, no. So this is one thing I've realized In the past 25 years or so of me being a voice actor roughly 50% of my voiceover income has come through e-learning, explainer, corporate, industrial, medical. That's been roughly 50% of my income this whole time, almost since the beginning.
14:10 - Anne (Host) So that's been stable.
14:11 - Tom (Host) Yes, but what hasn't been stable is the other 50%. We're talking purely on a genre level. On a genre basis On a genre level, well yay corporate explainer e-learning. Right.
14:26 - Anne (Host) All my stuff too, no-transcript.
14:50 - Tom (Host) Yeah, it's interesting because now that I'm kind of thinking through the evolution of what the other 50% has been and the other 50% hasn't been all one other genre but it's been a combination of other genres but I would say, for the first third of that years, a big part of that years, that other third was that part a big part of that other 50 was commercial. But then around from 2011, basically for like roughly 2011, and for another 10 years it turned into audiobooks, that which a big, the lion's share of that other 50 was audiobook narration, and now what a big chunk of it is is political. Yeah, yeah, yeah, so things change.
15:31 - Anne (Host) Mine is more. Yeah, I'm going to say mine is more heavier on the e-learning, just because it's what I enjoy doing E-learning, corporate explainer, all of that side. 30% commercial, but again that's the one that is super volatile, the commercial genre aspect of it. And audiobooks. I did one and I said uh-uh and I was no longer going to pursue that, and then I had other areas of my business that I found to be interesting, which obviously VO Boss was one of those. Vo Peeps was another thing and those were alternate sources of income.
16:03 But when you talk about just voiceover, the real steady part has been the size of the market in the non-broadcast long format narration genres, and I always tell people like it's just a huge market that is always needing voiceover.
16:21 And for me that's just kind of where I live, because I love it number one and I find it to be challenging intellectually and also creatively, and so that's where I choose to spend my time, pursuing income and pursuing jobs in those genres. In terms of ups and downs, yes, but there's ups and downs in those genres as well because, again, you're still trying to find the client, you're trying to, you're trying to be able to, to get the client's attention. Yes, right, I mean there's, there's. It can be a huge market, but if they don't know, you're out there, right. And then part of that is the let's try to get their attention to say, hey, I'm out here, you can hire me for that voiceover, let me audition for you, I'm available, you know I'm reliable and that sort of thing. So that's, that's got to be like a big portion of the consistency, like resilient. Being resilient and consistent I think is so important in having a long term career in this industry, resiliency and consistency.
17:26 So at the beginning- Resilient, resilient, resilient, right here on my arm.
17:29 - Tom (Host) Oh, look at that.
17:29 - Anne (Host) Resilience. Yes, resilience is on my arm, so-.
17:32 - Tom (Host) Oh, that's, I didn't know. I never noticed that.
17:34 - Anne (Host) That's crazy yeah it is definitely a plus.
17:38 - Tom (Host) So as a just a very brief recap, and then keep going, the realities of long VO career. We said training at the beginning and then I talked about genre stability working in stable genres, and then when you're talking about consistency and resilience. But you touched upon something which is also the next part of it is adapting to the realities of marketing strategies, because marketing strategies, the realities of marketing strategies.
18:06 Yeah, oh my gosh. Yes, Because marketing strategies, the effectiveness of marketing strategies, changes through the years. What worked five years ago doesn't necessarily work anymore, and what didn't work or didn't exist five years ago as a marketing strategy may be a critical part of your marketing strategies and tactics.
18:24 - Anne (Host) And see well, performance too has evolved over the years, Not quite as drastic as marketing strategies and tactics. And see well, performance too has evolved over the years, Not quite as drastic as marketing.
18:31 - Tom (Host) Performance demands evolve, Genres rise and fall and grow and ebb and flow and marketing strategies. All of this stuff evolves and changes and some stuff becomes obsolete and some stuff becomes like if you're not doing it now, you may not have a career, and then five years from now, it's going to, it's going to change on you.
18:50 - Anne (Host) And when I think about like longevity right, I think about a lot of people will be like burnout, you know, is there burnout or is there just, you know, fatigue in the actual work that's involved in running a business? I think there's think there's two different things, right. I personally feel I mean, unless you've been in it for a while and you're really like I'm gonna give this a go, right, and I'm gonna audition a hundred times a day, then you experience fatigue or burnout. I can see that for sure, because I think there's more ways to really move forward than just the auditioning on a daily basis. There's so many other things you can do in terms of marketing and business, right.
19:28 But I feel like just being consistent and being out there, because a lot of times I talk about when do clients buy? We are at the mercy of the clients needing our services. Really, we are at the mercy of the clients buying or needing our services number one, and then purchasing our services, and so, unless that need exists, right, it's hard. It's like we have to just be patient and we have to be resilient and we have to be consistent in our marketing and we also have to make sure that we're consistent in our skill set right and that we are not falling into something that we're educating ourselves along skill set right and that we are not falling into something that we're educating ourselves along the way, so that if somebody is asking for a conversational read, when the script is not written conversationally but yet we're still reading it, you know, in a way that sounds like this is what they want to hear, versus you acting, you know, and that's easy to fall into.
20:22 It's very easy to fall into that. I deal with that all the time because I teach long format narration, because you can keep somebody's attention for a sentence. But talk about keeping somebody's attention for, you know, five minutes or 10 minutes or an hour right, how are you doing that effectively, especially in today's world where you know I can barely like, I can't sit through a sitcom without scroll. You know, scrolling on barely like.
20:43 - Tom (Host) I can't sit through a sitcom without scrolling on my phone. Yeah Right, no, it's definitely a challenge and that's why continuing education with great coaches like Anne not to blatantly plug too much, Because Anne who is also a narrator, who is booking work regularly, who is reading casting notices and auditioning for stuff regularly work regularly? Who is reading casting notices and auditioning for stuff regularly? Who's?
21:05 I'm assuming you're having conversations in some capacity with your representation, you know and making cold calls and emails, and doing blog posts and social media and shooting videos. Yeah, there's so much to it, right?
21:15 - Anne (Host) There's so much more than just the audition and and I did want to just want to finish my thought on like I was talking about like, is it fatigue because you're doing 100 auditions a day, or is it burnout?
21:26 I'll be quite honest with you, I don't think the majority of people that get into this industry know how much work it takes To be quite honest, know how much work it takes to actually be successful and to do this for long term. And the people that have stuck it out, they get it, I mean, and that just becomes part of their part of their strategy, part of their resilience. And, honestly, I think a lot of people they don't give it enough of a chance and they quit before they've put in the actual work. So I don't think there's burnout, to be honest, unless you're talking about people who've been at it for 20 years, right, and they're just burnt out. But in the beginning I don't think you find people with burnout because I don't think they realize just how much work it takes and I say that one more time, tom they do not realize how much work it takes and even today for me, right, and you, it takes a lot of work.
22:17 - Tom (Host) Yeah, I mean I'm not gonna sugarcoat it. A couple years ago someone booked a free 15 minute consult with me and I'm like sure what's going on. They're like I've booked, I've done all these auditions and I just can't seem to book anything. And I'm like well, how many have you done? 40?
22:33 - Anne (Host) Yes, exactly.
22:37 - Tom (Host) And I'm such a jerk I went oh, I'm so sorry, just like I did and I apologize profusely. I'm like, I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. I really don't mean to laugh, but you need to put two zeros on the end of that before you can really. Exactly, he was very he's like okay, thanks for your time, and he pretty much hung up on me. He was very upset and I feel bad to this day. I hope he's a successful voice actor right now. I felt really bad about that.
23:06 - Anne (Host) It's funny because people, yeah, I will say that it's kind of like the old thing, like when you invite 100 people to a party, how many people show up? Right, there's a small small percentage. Right? If you do auditions, how many? If you book how many percent of those auditions? Right, and Tom, that's something you can go back to your spreadsheet. I don't have a spreadsheet.
23:25 - Tom (Host) I did have a spreadsheet before.
23:26 - Anne (Host) I know you've got the numbers and so you could say it's a lower percentage than people think they think oh, I auditioned for 100. I should be able to book 50.
23:34 - Tom (Host) No, take a zero off of that.
23:35 - Anne (Host) Yeah, exactly Exactly, it is in the 1% to 2% to 3%.
23:40 - Tom (Host) If you're booking 5% of your auditions, you're doing amazing.
23:43 - Anne (Host) Oh, that's amazing. And that's even if you've been in the industry for 20 years. Yeah, exactly.
23:48 - Tom (Host) And also that percentage will go up and down based on whether the auditions are coming through your representation, which there may be a lot less people auditioning for it, or if it's coming through an online casting site, especially if it's like a free online casting site, like if you're on Casting Call Club or something where literally thousands of people are auditioning, you know or if it's through your self-marketing strategies, where you're one of a handful of people with of your demographic on some production company's roster and you're one of three or four people that are auditioning. So the percentages will go up and down. But if you average the whole thing out, yeah, if you're doing 5%, you're doing really, really well.
24:23 - Anne (Host) Yeah, and I'm going to say, I'm going to say a big part of that again, it runs into this whole mindset. That I think is a huge part of success in long-term success is mindset Because, again in the beginning, when you're like, oh my gosh, i've've auditioned 40 times and I didn't get anything, or I auditioned 100 times, you know what I mean? I got a short list and so that whole thing in the very beginning of my career myself, right was hard. I had to fight through it. I had to fight, I had to make sure that I was like no, no, no, no. I am confident in my skills, I'm confident that I can do this, and I think that your mental mindset has a lot to do with your success and in sticking it out right Again and pushing through the lean times, pushing through the times where even you know I did a great audition, I could have been the perfect voice, yet I still did not get the job, understanding that people cast for many different reasons. It's not all to do with your skill or performance.
25:28 - Tom (Host) I agree. I need to make one more very important point, which is the reason why I'm able to still be in the voiceover industry, because there was a time when my income was fluctuating wildly and then kind of downshifted. This is one thing. That this is, bosses. If there's one thing I want you to take away from this conversation, it's this. It's that decision makers they make decisions in certain ways over who they're going to cast, why they're going to cast them and how they're going to cast them. That changes over time. So in the 90s there were no online casting sites. It was agents. So either you had an agent or you didn't. And self-marketing I was making in the 90s I was making 50 cold calls a day. A lot of people didn't really even have email.
26:22 Nobody knew what that was, so the decision makers in the 90s right were agents and managers which I didn't get representation for a very long time.
26:30 - Anne (Host) I didn't get my first quality, consistent rep until 2005. Yep, yep. I think it was 2006. Before that, it was 2006.
26:37 - Tom (Host) Okay, and then you know, and then it evolved into email, so I'll put it. So it's like this You're a voice seeker, you're a decision maker and you're looking in this direction and saying this is how I decide, this is how I cast voice actors. They've got these horse blinders on. This is the point where they're facing. You need to be right there in their view, being like how you doing With your demos in their hand, with the marketing and whatever, but there's going to come a point and this happens for almost all of them that at some point they're going to be like nope, this is how I make voiceover decisions now.
27:10 This is how I cast Often, and in the early 2000s to this day it's shifted where now they're looking at online casting sites. So if the view of the decision makers goes from here and it moves in the spot, let's say it's a spotlight. If that spotlight goes over here and you're not in that spotlight, they're not booking you. You need to go from there to there to be like how you doing? Because now the spotlight's shining on you, because this is where they're making decisions on how to cast, and then it'll shift again. And it'll shift again. Agents, managers, casting directors, free casting sites, pay-to-play casting sites, self-marketing strategies indirect and indirect and AI.
27:53 - Anne (Host) And I always think, like we are so isolated in our booths, right, and we're auditioning, we're like, but I've got the skillset, but I'm not getting the work right, or whatever mindset tricks you're playing on yourself. You still cannot forget that our profession is guided by the clients who hire us. Right, they're decision makers, Like, what is like, where are they hiring? How are they hiring, is it? You know? They're busy people, we're busy people.
28:21 I mean I would say that life, the pacing of this life, just gets quicker and quicker and quicker, and so some of them still rely on talent agents or their agents or casting directors to help them make decisions. Some of them are like I just need to Google at the prompt and find someone. And it really depends on who is hiring us, really depends on who is hiring us. And don't forget to educate yourself and practice resilience and strategies to get to those people and understand why they hire us, why they may not hire us and how you can get in front of them. And I love that example of the spotlight, tom, because that just makes a whole lot of sense. You've got to be in their field of vision in order for that to happen, and there can be many reasons as to why you're not, but understanding and educating yourself and evolving along with the industry and being knowledgeable in more ways than just performance. There's a lot to be said for that.
29:13 Yeah, because you know what Cold calls worked, and then they don't work, and then emails work, and then they don't work, and then newsletters work, and then they don't work. And then emails come back a little bit, and then they work again. And then postcards work, and then newsletters work, and then they don't work back a little bit, and then they work again, and then postcards work, and then they don't work.
29:24 - Tom (Host) Yeah, exactly texting works, and then social media works, and then it doesn't work and then they go to a different social media platform that you were on exactly now.
29:31 - Anne (Host) They're tired of you know, like ai, they try ai and then they.
29:35 - Tom (Host) Then they get off of ai and you know it's, it never stops, which is why you make sure that and this is a big word and make sure that legacy thinking does not stagnate your voiceover career. Legacy thinking destroys careers.
29:50 - Anne (Host) Absolutely, absolutely. You have to have a broader and you have to have a broader sense of the business of voiceover to really understand and have longevity. Now there's very few people who maybe started off in the beginning. They're super talented, they're in a big market, they've got a manager right or an agent that is going to bat for them, and so you know that's a different story, but I would say that's maybe less than 1% of the total voiceover population where that's happening.
30:20 Other than that, you have to be, have your eye on the ball, you have to have your eye, you have to be in that spotlight, as Tom says, that moving, rotating spotlight. You have to be educated about that spotlight and I'm going to say that good, I'm going to say trusted people in the industry that you are have a relationship with good coaches, good agents, good managers, and your community is so important to help you to be successful. It is an isolating job, right, this is such an isolated. We're in our booths, we're by ourselves, and I know that it was a big adjustment for me when I went full time into voiceover versus, you know, having my corporate job where I went to the office every day. I had kind of a social interaction with my colleagues and my you know my teammates. And now, all of a sudden, I'm by myself and I have myself and my thoughts Scary. And my thoughts can be scary sometimes, especially when I'm doubting right, why am I not booking Right? Why?
31:18 And those thoughts can be destructive in a successful voiceover career. So the mental part of it, the resilience, the strategizing, is, I think, almost well. You can't really have a career without having good performance skills and good business skills. But also, if your mental health is not there and your community is not there to support you, your loved ones aren't there to support you, your loved ones aren't there to support you and encourage you, it's going to be really hard because it's an isolating industry and you know, thank goodness for the conferences, right, and the little get-togethers that we can have. I mean, we're just, we're like hungry people when we go to conferences. We're all like you know, we can't get enough of each other right. Seeing each other after all this time and really that community is, I think, a big part of what can help you to be successful in a long-term voiceover career.
32:11 - Tom (Host) I think you're right, anne. I think that's one of the most important ingredients to a successful long-term career is to be a part of the community for education, for inspiration, for commiseration and for renewal of purpose.
32:23 - Anne (Host) Exactly, yeah. So, bosses, we are part of a community, so I encourage you to be a part of a community. Be a part of Tom's community and really we will get through this and 20 years from now, we will still be God willing, if the technology doesn't, God willing if the creek don't rise, as the old people say.
32:44 God willing, we will still be here. We'll still be here doing voiceover and the stuff that we love, or, even if it's not voiceover, it's something that we love and that we still have our community. And so, what a great conversation, guys. Keep going. A marathon, not a sprint. Keep going. We've got faith in you and we've got a community here that can support you. Tom and I are here, so, bosses, reach out if you need, and we've got you All right. Big shout out to our sponsor, ipdtl. You, too, can connect and network like bosses real bosses. Find out more at IPDTLcom. Have an amazing week, bosses, and we'll see you next week.
33:21 - Speaker 2 (Announcement) Bye. Join us next week for another edition of VO Boss with your host, Anne Ganguzza, and take your business to the next level. Sign up for our mailing list at vobosscom and receive exclusive content, industry-revolutionizing tips and strategies and new ways to rock your business like a boss. Redistribution with permission. Coast-to-coast connectivity via IPDTL.