Joining the discussion are Zrinka Bralo, a journalist from Sarajevo and executive director advocating for migrants, Lindsay Stonebridge, an academic focused on Hannah Arendt's work, Oliver Scott Curry, an anthropologist from Oxford, and philosopher Jack Symes. They dive deep into timeless questions of evil, contrasting personal experiences from the Bosnian War with philosophical reflections on morality. Fascinating insights emerge on the 'banality of evil,' the complexities within legal definitions of evil, and how societal structures can mask malevolence in everyday life.
Evil is a complex concept that has been interpreted through various lenses, such as philosophical, psychological, and systemic frameworks over centuries.
Conversations around evil highlight the existence of flawed systems, suggesting that individuals often observe harm perpetuated by structural conditions rather than encountering raw evil themselves.
Hannah Arendt's 'banality of evil' emphasizes that ordinary individuals can commit heinous acts within bureaucratic structures, raising critical questions about moral responsibility and societal influences.
Deep dives
Conceptualizing Evil
Evil is difficult to define and has been conceptualized in various ways over the past 2,500 years. Philosophers and psychologists have described it as a cosmic principle, a form of ignorance, a mental state, or even a recognizable identity. In particular, forensic psychiatrist Gwen Adshead characterizes evil as an event in the mind, suggesting that it may not be a fixed trait of individuals. This complex understanding emphasizes that discussions surrounding evil often reflect our broader assumptions about human nature and morality.
Personal Encounters with Evil
Many individuals express that they have not directly encountered evil in their lives but have observed systems that perpetuate harm. For instance, author Ruth Ware reflected on how she has met flawed and complicated people rather than truly evil ones, pointing to the existence of 'evil systems' that operate without regard for individual suffering. Philosopher Jack Symes observed that although he has witnessed malicious acts, he has not been caught in prolonged exposure to evil. This suggests that direct encounters with evil may be less common than the structural and systemic conditions that enable it.
Terror and Trauma in Violent Contexts
Certain guests described chilling experiences that revealed the presence of evil through acts of violence and terror. Shrinka Brallo shared a haunting memory from the siege of Sarajevo, highlighting the impact of a war criminal's orders to his soldiers. Such experiences illustrate how evil can manifest in organized societal violence, creating an atmosphere of terror for those affected. Brallo’s insights shed light on the psychological trauma experienced by individuals living under such brutal conditions, emphasizing that evil is often systemic rather than perpetrated by isolated actors.
Hannah Arendt's Perspective on Evil
Philosopher Hannah Arendt introduced the notion of the 'banality of evil,' suggesting that evil often exists within mundane bureaucratic systems rather than as an expression of monstrous individuals. Arendt's analysis of Adolf Eichmann's trial revealed that he represented a kind of thoughtlessness, suggesting individuals could participate in evil without a deep moral reflection. This perspective has led to discussions about the potential for ordinary individuals to commit acts of evil in structured environments. It raises essential questions about moral responsibility and how societies can enable or constrain such behavior.
Philosophical and Psychological Approaches
The podcast explores various philosophical and psychological perspectives on the nature of evil and its implications for human behavior. Oliver Scott Curry notes that evil acts often result from a combination of individual disposition and situational context. The dialogue moves toward the question of responsibility, particularly how the environments people inhabit can either elicit or suppress their moral actions. This discourse prompts critical engagement with how societies can foster ethical behavior and prevent the normalization of evil acts among individuals.
Matthew Sweet is joined by guests including Dr Jack Symes, philosopher at Durham University; Professor Lyndsey Stonebridge, Interdisciplinary Chair of Humanities & Human Rights at the University of Birmingham; novelist Ruth Ware; Dr Oliver Scott Curry, Chief Science Officer at Kindness.org and Research Affiliate in the Anthropology Department at the University of Oxford; and campaigner Zrinka Bralo, Director of Migrants Organize.
Topics include the classical philosophical problem of evil, the psychology of evil, Hannah Arendt's concept of the banality of evil, and the question of why the Devil gets the best lines in literature.
Plus, we look at t6he work and legacy of social psychologist Philip Zimbardo, who devised the controversial Stanford Prison Experiment in 1971, and who died in October 2024.
Producer: Luke Mulhall
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