Property Management Growth with DoorGrow DGS 313: Profits Hidden in Plain Sight with Brian Seidensticker
As a property manager, how much do you know about tax liens and tax deeds? How much do your investors know?
In this episode of the #DoorGrowShow, property management growth expert Jason Hull sits down with Brian Seidensticker, Founder of Tax Sale Resources and Mountain North Capital, to discuss how property managers can help their investors buy more properties using tax lien strategies.
You'll Learn
[01:40] From Aerospace Engineering to Buying Tax Liens
[06:46] How Property Managers Can Benefit
[16:06] How to Learn The Ins and Outs of Tax Lien Investing
[23:29] The Biggest Questions and Pitfalls
Quotables"Property managers, the savviest ones, they're building up their own portfolios, not just helping everybody else."
"Property managers… what gets them access to more deals is just being connected to more investors."
"This might crack open a new idea for them, another growth channel that they could leverage as a resource for their investors."
Resources TranscriptJason Hull (00:00)
This might crack open a new idea for them, another growth channel that they could leverage as a resource for their investors.
All right, I'm Jason Hull, the CEO and founder of DoorGrow, the world's leading and most comprehensive coaching and consulting firm for long-term residential property management entrepreneurs. For over a decade and a half, we have brought innovative strategies and optimization to the property management industry. At DoorGrow, we have spoken to thousands of property management business owners, improving pricing, increasing profits, simplifying operations. We run the world's
leading property management mastermind to help them grow. DoorGrow, we believe good property managers can change the world and that property management is the ultimate high trust gateway to real estate deals, relationships, and residual income. We are on a mission to transform property management business owners and their businesses. We want to transform the industry, eliminate the BS, build awareness, change perception, expand the market.
and help the best property management entrepreneurs win. Now, let's get into the show.
So my guest today is Brian Seidensticker, founder of Mount North Capital and Tax Sale Resources, one of the nation's top platforms tracking over 8,000 tax sales and over 1.5 million distressed properties each year. Brian is a leading expert in tax lien and deed investing and shares how property managers can turn
overlooked tax delinquent properties into major portfolio growth opportunities. Brian, welcome to the show. Thanks Jason, thanks for having me. Excited to be here. Cool. So before we get into the topic at hand, let's rewind and tell everybody how did you get into entrepreneurism and how did you get into these businesses that you now have?
Brian Seidensticker (01:37)
Thanks Jason, thanks for having me. Excited to be here.
Yeah, well, I think it's an interesting story, although I'm slightly biased because I did not grow up with aspirations of being in this space or doing what I do today, although I love what I do now. I think the probably the first sign of, maybe the standard corporate.
Jason Hull (01:55)
I think it's an interesting story.
sign of hey maybe the standard corporate
Brian Seidensticker (02:14)
atmosphere isn't necessarily for me came when I was ⁓ still in school. Got my first internship in the aerospace industry, which is where I spent the first 10 years of my career ⁓ at Honeywell, of all places, in design engineering and ⁓ thought it was exactly what I wanted to do, but I didn't know much about, you know, engineering and what was actually involved. ⁓
Jason Hull (02:14)
atmosphere isn't necessary for me came when I was still in school got my first internship in the aerospace industry which is where I spent first 10 years of my career at Honeywell of all places and design engineering and thought it was exactly what I wanted to do but I didn't know much about you know engineering and what was actually all
Brian Seidensticker (02:40)
And that is the first time that I kind of realized, okay, maybe maybe this is not what I had in mind. was, you know, it's odd, you know, ironically enough, not a whole lot different than what I do today. I stared at a computer all day and that is not what I had envisioned for engineering. was assuming it was going to be much more hands on and touching things. And that was probably the first time where I called it my earliest twenties crisis, where I was like, Oh, you know, I'm three, four years into this. Is this what I want to do for the rest of my life?
Jason Hull (02:40)
And that is the first time that I kind of realized, okay, maybe this is not what I had in mind. was, ironically enough, not a whole lot different than what I do today. I stared at a computer all day and that is not what I had envisioned for engineering. was assuming to be much more hands-on and touching things. That was probably the first time where I call it my earliest 20s crisis, where I was like, whoa, I'm three, four years into this. Is this what I want to do for the rest of my life?
Brian Seidensticker (03:10)
and ultimately decided, well, I'm this far along. Starting over was more terrifying. so, you know, go ahead and finish it out. I was I was lucky in the fact that ⁓ within a year out of school, I did land what I consider a dream job and did love what I did for for quite a while. ⁓ I was basically what they call systems engineer for missile defense programs, working on
Jason Hull (03:10)
And ultimately decided, well, I'm this far along. Starting over was more terrifying. And so, you know, go ahead and finish it out. I was, I was lucky in the fact that within a year out of school, I did land what I consider a dream job and did love what I did for quite a while. I was basically what we call systems engineer for Missed Defense Programs, working on,
you
Brian Seidensticker (03:39)
you know,
programs that essentially mimic ⁓ weapons of other countries. And then our systems would also practice shooting them down, which all sounds really, really cool. Right. And it was cool. ⁓ But my my second realization came later when I kind of well, I went on vacation for six weeks and I had a lot of anxiety about being gone that long of how much I would be behind. And when I got back, I realized, you know, how
Jason Hull (03:40)
programs that essentially mimic weapons of other countries and then our systems would also practice shooting them down, which all sounds really, cool. Right. was cool. But my second realization came later when I kind of, well, I went on vacation for six weeks and I had a lot of anxiety about being gone that long and how much I would be behind and when I got back I realized how
Brian Seidensticker (04:08)
little I was behind.
Jason Hull (04:08)
little I was behind.
Brian Seidensticker (04:10)
was basically stepped right back into it like I'd never been gone. And that was a realization for me that, you know, I'm spending a lot of my time on a hamster wheel unknowingly. And then eventually came to the conclusion that I've got two years of banging my head against the wall with government contracts, right? Anybody has dealt with that red tape associated with that for what equated to about two minutes of really cool. that those those just didn't equate for me as being worth it.
Jason Hull (04:10)
and Yeah. ⁓
Brian Seidensticker (04:37)
Right. And that's not to say, you know, I
loved what I did at certain cases that company I worked for was fantastic. It just wasn't necessarily for me. And that was where I kind of realized, OK, I got to find something else. Now, I wish I could say the next day I gave my notice, dropped the mic and left. That's certainly not how real life works. ⁓ But I did start getting into, well, originally fix and flip houses.
Jason Hull (04:49)
and and
Brian Seidensticker (05:01)
And this is in 06, 07 timeframe and ended up upside down in one of those. were flipping properties in Montana. And I guess most people know what happened in 07, 08. Luckily, it wasn't a detrimental thing and I didn't have too many houses, but was upside down. And so I've got a notice of a potential taxing on that property. Now, the odd thing is that
Jason Hull (05:06)
and ended up upside down in one of those. were flipping properties in Montana and I guess most people know what happened in 07, 08. Luckily it wasn't a detrimental thing and I didn't have too many houses but it was upside down and so I got a notice of a potential taxing on that property. Now the odd thing is
that because the way that Montana statutes are at the time,
Brian Seidensticker (05:30)
because the way that Montana statutes are at the time where
every potential investor had to send you a certified letter, I didn't just get one notice from the county. Probably would have never thought twice about it, but I got 20, 30, 40 of these certified letters all saying roughly the same thing. And that's really what triggered me to go, what is this all about? guess I'm a curious person by nature and started researching this whole tax lien certificate.
Jason Hull (05:34)
where every potential investor had to send you a certified letter. I didn't just get one notice from the county. I would have never thought twice about it. But I got 20, 30, 40 of these certified letters all saying roughly the same thing. And that's really what triggered me to go, what is this all about? Because I'm a curious person by nature. I started researching this whole tax lien certificate
enigma at the time. And lo and behold, was a whole industry.
Brian Seidensticker (05:59)
enigma at the time. And lo and behold, it was it was a whole industry. There's
legitimate large businesses and banks that are are doing this. And that's what really steered me in the direction of shifting from a fixed flip to buying tax liens. And that was really the introduction to the space that we do a lot in today. So I guess a little bit on the journey of how I eventually became an entrepreneur ⁓ and how I was introduced to this space. ⁓
Jason Hull (06:04)
legitimate large businesses and banks that are doing this. And that's what really steered me in the direction of shifting from a pay-per-fit to buying tax leaps. And that was really the introduction to this space that we do a lot in today. So was, I guess, a little bit on the journey of how I eventually became an entrepreneur and how I was introduced to this space.
Brian Seidensticker (06:28)
I guess there's a whole line between today and then, but that's kind of the origin story anyway, Jason.
Jason Hull (06:28)
I guess there's a whole lot in between today and then, but that's kind of the origin story.
Got it, yeah, interesting background. So from aerospace, doing engineering, to real estate fix and flips, and now you're in software and technology and doing some other cool stuff. So tell us a little bit about how can this benefit property managers? Let's get into this idea. Yeah, so.
Brian Seidensticker (06:57)
Yeah. So
I think when it comes to property managers specifically, whether they're working with investors, to acquire on behalf of the investor and then they're operating that property or they're maybe managing that portfolio themselves. I really what tax sales have two different avenues, there's tax liens and then there's tax deeds. The tax deeds are what are sold at the end of a ⁓ foreclosure process for the
Jason Hull (07:16)
Deeds are what are sold at the end of a proposal process for
the liens that never end up getting repaid. They go through a proposal process very similar to the mortgage proposal closure, although a lot longer timeline. And most of those are in areas where property managers or let's say a segment of property managers, you can get great. ⁓
Brian Seidensticker (07:23)
liens that never end up getting repaid. go through a foreclosure process very similar to a mortgage foreclosure, although a lot longer timeline. ⁓ And most of those are in areas where property managers or I'd say a segment of property managers, ⁓ you can get great, ⁓ the great
Jason Hull (07:43)
great rental options, especially if you're in the avenue of fixing rent. We work with several folks that buy properties, fix them up
Brian Seidensticker (07:43)
rental options, especially if you're in the avenue of fixing rent. We work with several folks that buy properties, ⁓ fix them up and
with intent to rent them. And so if you're looking for an avenue of acquiring properties, right, and it may shift here in the next couple of years, we'll see what comes to reality. ⁓ But it's been an avenue of acquiring properties for the past 10 years where I think most people found it to be
Jason Hull (07:53)
with intent to rent them. And so if you're looking for an avenue of acquiring properties, it may shift here in the next couple of years, and we'll see what comes to reality. But it's been an avenue of acquiring properties for the past 10 years where I think most people found it to be pretty...
Brian Seidensticker (08:12)
pretty hard to find any sort of consistent ⁓ deals at a smaller scale of acquiring to build that portfolio over time. That's really probably the biggest impact too.
Jason Hull (08:12)
pretty hard to find any sort of deals at a smaller scale requiring to build that footloid over time. That's really probably the biggest impact
to those folks. Now on the flip side, as a data point, one of the quickest ways of getting in trouble, right, is if properties that are owned outright, and we see this all the time, that are owned outright, you don't have that, you know, tacking of...
Brian Seidensticker (08:23)
to those folks. Now, on the flip side, as a data point, I think one of the quickest ways of getting ⁓ in trouble, is if properties that are owned outright, and we see this all the time, that are owned outright, you don't have that ⁓ escrow
Jason Hull (08:41)
best grow account that's making sure those taxes get paid and that people aren't paying those on their own behalf and they can end up in a tax outproposure unknowingly. Now, most people catch on, but we have
Brian Seidensticker (08:41)
account that's making sure those taxes get paid. And if people aren't paying those on their own behalf, then they can end up in a tax out foreclosure unknowingly. Now, most people catch them, but we have seen
Jason Hull (08:51)
seen properties that make it all the way through and at the end of the day, end up essentially losing a property due to these unpaid taxes and ignoring notices over a couple years. It seems like impossible, but it happens, right? And so it's making sure that property managers and just investors in general understand.
Brian Seidensticker (08:51)
properties that make it all the way through. at the end of the day, end up essentially losing a property due to these unpaid taxes and ignoring notices over a couple of years, which seems like impossible, but it happens. And so it's making sure that property managers and just investors in general understand, hey,
Jason Hull (09:09)
Hey, gotta keep monitoring, keep paying those property taxes even after the escrow is done and you have the property paid
Brian Seidensticker (09:09)
you got to keep monitoring and keep paying those property taxes even after the escrow is done and you have the property paid off.
Jason Hull (09:15)
off. Yeah, a lot of people get confused during the sale process and think, oh, it's all taken care of. Yeah, well for so many of us it is, right? If you have a mortgage on your house, it's all taken care of, right? It's when that mortgage is paid off, it's a happy day, but now you've got a few more things you've got to monitor you've never had to worry before. Yeah, got it. So,
Brian Seidensticker (09:22)
Yeah, well for so many of us it is, right? If you have a mortgage on your house, it's all taken care of, right? It's when that mortgage gets paid off, it's a happy day, but now you've got a few more things you've got to monitor you've never had to worry before.
Jason Hull (09:37)
Yeah, property managers, the savviest ones, they're building up their own portfolios, not just helping everybody else. And so they're investors too. And so this could be a nice channel or avenue for them to find some additional deals or properties. So what do they need to know in order to get started with working with tax liens or tax deeds and finding property? Well, I think the biggest thing to understand is really how the sales are.
Brian Seidensticker (10:02)
Well, I think the biggest thing to understand is really how the sales occur
in your area. Every state has a slightly different process, slightly different statutes, ⁓ and even within that state, counties can interpret those statutes slightly differently. And so the number one thing that I always recommend is be smart and as in talk to an attorney that is familiar with the sale process in your specific area. ⁓ It's an
Jason Hull (10:08)
state has a slightly different process, slightly different statutes, ⁓ and even within that state counties can interpret those statutes slightly differently. And so the number one thing that I always recommend is be smart and as in talk to an attorney that is familiar with the sale process in your specific area. ⁓
It's an unregulated space, meaning you don't have to have a license. There's nothing you have to do to participate.
Brian Seidensticker (10:30)
unregulated space, meaning you don't have to have a license. There's nothing you have to do to participate. If you have got
Jason Hull (10:37)
you've got capital, can go jump on one of the auction platforms and start buying. But that's also a quick way of maybe getting into a property you shouldn't have. you had spoken to an attorney that knows what they're doing, they might have advised you on submitting those pit holes to a lawyer. So that would be mine and one recommendation is start there. Now, if you're not quite ready,
Brian Seidensticker (10:37)
capital, you can go jump on one of the auction platforms and start buying. But that's also a quick way of maybe getting into a property you shouldn't have. And if you had spoken to an attorney that knows what they're doing, they might have advised you on many of those pit holes to avoid. And so that would be my number one recommendation ⁓ is start there. Now, if you're not quite ready,
I think the next best thing, in my opinion, is we do, I do interview ⁓
Jason Hull (11:00)
think the next best thing in my opinion is we do, I do interview.
Brian Seidensticker (11:03)
attorneys in different states. And so if you don't want to pay the attorney fees to figure some of that out, ⁓ it's free on our site. You don't have to pay anything. Just go to our website and there's a resources section you can filter down by the state that you're interested in. And if I've interviewed an attorney and asked a lot of those questions, it can be a free hour or two of that attorney's time ⁓ answering those basic questions for anybody that wants to start there.
Jason Hull (11:04)
attorneys in different states and so if you don't want to pay the attorney fees to figure some of that out it's free on our site you don't have to pay anything just go to our website resources section you can filter down by the state that you're interested in and if I've interviewed an attorney and asked a lot of those questions it can be a free hour or two of that attorney's time answering those basic questions for anybody that wants to start there
Brian Seidensticker (11:28)
It's a less expensive starting point.
Jason Hull (11:29)
it's a less expensive starting point
Okay great, what's the website address? We'll plug it right now. taxsaleresources.com awesome. Let me do a quick word from our sponsor and then we'll get back into this. So many of you tell me that maintenance is
Brian Seidensticker (11:34)
This is taxsaleresources.com
Jason Hull (11:51)
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step up your property management game with Vendoroo. Visit vendoroo.ai slash DoorGrow today and make this your last maintenance hire you'll ever need. Okay, so let's get back into tax liens and tax deeds. Now, how could property managers start to educate their clients on this so that they can get more properties in their portfolio?
Brian Seidensticker (13:10)
So, one, I guess a quick note, just listening to that note from Vendoroo. ⁓ This is the first I've heard of it and it sounds fantastic. So it's definitely one I'm gonna check out after this. That's cool. So, sorry, I was thinking about that. How does Tax Sale Resources help these folks?
Jason Hull (13:10)
So, well, I'm gonna use a quick note just listening to that note from Ben-Dur-Roo.
Hahaha
So, sorry, I was thinking about.
Yeah, property managers, they're one of their primary goals. What gets them access to more deals is just being connected to more investors. They want to get more clients and they want their existing clients that they love that want to get into more property, help them find more property more quickly. So how can property managers start to educate their clients, these investors on
tax liens and tax deeds, what would be a good way for them to start being self-educated enough that they could go and educate them about this so they can create more business?
Brian Seidensticker (14:02)
Yeah,
I mentioned our website with resources section, but there's I host a podcast as well called Tax Sale Insiders where I'm interviewing industry professionals, interviewing attorneys, interviewing folks that are real and legitimate in the space. And I started that podcast because there wasn't a whole lot of real and legitimate information out there. ⁓ Now, truth be told, it's it's
Jason Hull (14:07)
to the podcast.
folks that are real, legitimate space. And I started that podcast because there wasn't a whole lot of ⁓ real and legitimate information out there. ⁓ Now, truth be told, it's it
Brian Seidensticker (14:29)
can be pretty, ⁓ what does my wife say? ⁓ If you want any assistance in going to bed at night, it's probably a good podcast to listen right before bed because I'm interviewing attorneys, right? it's,
Jason Hull (14:29)
can be pretty. What does my wife say? If you want any assistance in going to bed at night is probably a good podcast to listen right before bed because I'm interviewing attorneys, right? They're not super thrilling.
Brian Seidensticker (14:45)
are not, you know, small episodes of very high level of information. gets pretty deep, right? But for anyone that is legitimately wanting to get in the space, it is outstanding. ⁓
Jason Hull (14:45)
These are not small episodes of very high level information. gets pretty deep, right? Yeah. But it's legitimately wanting to get in space is outstanding. Got it. It sounds
like a good step maybe to check out the podcast, if there are, you know, check out your website, see if there's any attorneys that maybe you've connected with in a particular market. But regardless, they need to find a local attorney and maybe a good
strategy for some of my clients listening and others would be to go find that local attorney and maybe do a little event with them. Bring your investors to the table. It could be a Zoom event, a virtual event, but bring this attorney. Be the interviewer. Make it a little bit more interesting. You'll have to be the interesting one, it sounds like. And interview them and ask the attorney to help you put together something that would be mutually beneficial for you, the attorney.
and for the potential mutual client that you could share. sounds like a good strategy to start getting into some of these deals.
Brian Seidensticker (15:48)
Absolutely, there's, you know, while tech sales occur nationwide, right, and they there might be slightly different processes, but it's something that I'd say everybody could look into. It's not isolated to one market or another. can be a tool utilized, right, for anybody in the space.
Jason Hull (16:06)
So explain your services, your sites, how can, besides just doing research, how else can these facilitate what they're trying to accomplish here? So really what Tax Sale Resources is today is it answers all the basic questions that there weren't any answers to when we first got into space, right? was over a decade and a half ago. But at the time, and I say simple answers, things like...
Brian Seidensticker (16:19)
So really what Tax Sale Resources is today is it answers all the basic questions that there weren't any answers to when we first got in this space, right? This is over a decade and a half ago. But at the time, and I say simple answers, things like when
are these auctions taking place? Where are they taking place? What are the properties associated with these auctions, right? And what are the information associated with those properties? Because typically, definitely at the time and still today, what's
Jason Hull (16:34)
When are these auctions taking place? Where are they taking place? What are the properties associated with these auctions? And what are the information associated with those properties? typically, definitely at the time and still today,
Brian Seidensticker (16:46)
but published as a list of partial numbers. So that doesn't tell you a whole lot. Partial numbers and tax amounts do. And so what we've done is compiled that all into, I haven't gotten trouble for this yet, it's a Zillow style platform where it's all loaded with all of that information. And so
Jason Hull (16:46)
what's published is a list of parcel numbers. that doesn't tell you a whole lot. Parcel numbers and tax amounts do. And so what we've done is compiled that all into, I haven't got trouble for this yet, it's a Zillow-style platform where it's all loaded with all of that information.
Brian Seidensticker (17:01)
if you're after a specific asset type, which I think property managers could certainly in their area say, hey, I want to target these parts of town. I want to target these types of properties with
Jason Hull (17:02)
If you're after a specific asset type, which I property managers could certainly in their area say, hey, I want to target these parts of town. I want to target these types of properties
with certain square footage and number of beds and baths. You can settle that criteria up and the system will tell you here's what's going up for sale in given moment in time. And those types, it seems simple, That's a massive task coming from somebody that it all together and have a great team.
Brian Seidensticker (17:11)
you know, certain square footage and number of beds and baths, right? You can set all that criteria up and the system will tell you here's what's going up for sale, right? At any given moment in time. ⁓ and those types, it seems simple, right? And that, that's a massive task, right? Coming from somebody that put, well, ⁓ put it all together, right? And have a great team monitoring
Jason Hull (17:31)
monitoring that, but it's 8,000 plus auction a year, know, are millions of properties. And so it's a massive task.
Brian Seidensticker (17:31)
that. ⁓ but it's 8,000 plus auctions a year. It's, know, millions of properties. And so it's a massive task. So
Jason Hull (17:39)
So we simplify that, right? And that's essentially think of tax and resources as once you kind of know what you're doing in this space, right? So go do your research, to attorney, right? You've got your model, right? What you're looking for, you're looking to target. Then the platform can be all of the information for you to be successful from there. We like to call it all of the tools for knowing
Brian Seidensticker (17:39)
We simplify that, right? And that's essentially think of tax resources as once you kind of know what you're doing in the space, right? So go do your research, talk to attorney, right? And you've got your model, right? What you're looking for, what you're looking to target. Then the platform can be all of the information for you to be successful from there. We like to call it all of the tools for knowing not
your knowledgeable space or knowledgeable investors in the space to actually be successful. And that's really what tax resources, the platform is now.
Jason Hull (18:01)
not in nodule space, not investors in the space to actually be successful. And that's really what tax resources the platform is.
Now, that kind of dovetails into typically, right, this is one of the issues that some investors may come and get up against is a very cash intensive acquisition strategy because you have to typically have cashier checks, right, capital on hand, they have the auction, you don't have...
Brian Seidensticker (18:09)
that kind of dovetails into typically, right, this is one of the issues that ⁓ some investors may come up against is a very cash intensive acquisition strategy because you have to typically have ⁓ cashier's checks, right, capital on hand, day of the auction. You don't have 30
days to go close. Now there's some states where you can put a deposit down, but in general, most of the country works under a
Jason Hull (18:29)
⁓
Brian Seidensticker (18:36)
as is sale right then and there. I've actually even participated in auctions where they pause the auction and they won't continue until the person that won it comes down and provides their cash to purchase that asset. ⁓ Most folks, right, you don't have millions of dollars laying around. And that's really where Mountain Earth Capital, which is the other side of the house, came
Jason Hull (18:47)
Wow.
Brian Seidensticker (18:57)
about, which is working with local investors in helping provide the capital and
Jason Hull (18:58)
came about, which is working with local investors and helping provide the capital
Brian Seidensticker (19:03)
in acquiring those properties. ⁓ Now, I'll stop short in saying that we're all lender. We're not a lender. This is not a lending scenario, but we can be a capital partner for folks that want to use this as an acquisition strategy and have a model that is already successful or have a great ⁓ model in mind and want to pursue it because we can be the capital that
Jason Hull (19:03)
and acquiring those properties. Now, I'll stop short and say we're lender. We're not a lender. This is not a lending scenario, but we can be a capital partner for folks that want to use this as an acquisition strategy and have a model that are either A, already successful, or have a great ⁓ model in mind and want to pursue it. Because we can be the capital that
Brian Seidensticker (19:26)
on the day of action and buying those assets.
Jason Hull (19:27)
on the day of action and buying those assets
Brian Seidensticker (19:30)
in kind of a bridge type scenario where you have an end goal in mind. And so that's what Mountain North Capital is, is the access to the other major problem, right? The harder problem. We solved the easy questions and problems back in 2010 and then in 2020 we solved the second half, which is the capital aspect for folks that want to participate in this acquisition strategy.
Jason Hull (19:30)
in kind of a bridge type scenario where you have an end goal in mind. And so that's what Bound Worth Capital is, is the access to the other major problem, right? The harder problem. We solved the easy questions and problems back in 2010 and then in 2020 we solved the second half, which is the capital aspect for folks that want to participate in this acquisition strategy.
Got it. Do some get involved with lenders trying to do these deals or hard money lenders or? Yeah, I think there's probably three avenues of, let's say four.
Brian Seidensticker (19:57)
I think there's probably three avenues of, I'd say four avenues
of capital, And if I were to rank them in the least cost, if you have cash on hand, great, right? That doesn't cost anything. If you can get a line of credit out on some other asset or assets, right? Then that's a least cost effective or cost.
Jason Hull (20:07)
Right, cash is king.
Brian Seidensticker (20:21)
least costly ⁓ avenue, hard money lenders are another one, right? Where, if you've got credit available and have those hard money lenders that you can utilize, that might be one that is available. ⁓ I would caution though that not caution, but not all hard money lenders are aware and comfortable with tax sales. So that's something you got to work through with them. And then most folks don't have access to those or you have access to those until you kind of max all those out, right? And then
Jason Hull (20:22)
least costly avenue.
one that is available.
Okay interesting so
Brian Seidensticker (20:47)
You know, our, our source of capital is a very different source of capital allows folks to continue buying when typically folks have to stop buying and run out of other sources.
Jason Hull (21:01)
Yeah, so they've got to find the cash, they've got to find the funds to be able to do these deals and they move quick, like real time sometimes at these auctions. How do these auctions differ from the foreclosure auctions and some of these sort of deals?
Brian Seidensticker (21:10)
Yes.
I'd say they're similar for, so for most folks or folks that are familiar with mortgage foreclosures, a lot of time, this procedures are very similar. ⁓ now the biggest difference is the type of title that you get at these auctions. And this is why banks don't typically touch these types of assets. Cause you're essentially buying a quick claim deed. Now that quick claim deed comes with headaches, right? You have to potentially do some quiet title, which is probably the most common thing that you got to deal with. ⁓ and you.
Jason Hull (21:17)
I'd say they're similar. So for most folks, there are folks that are familiar with mortgage foreclosures, a lot of times, these procedures are very similar. Now the biggest difference is the type of title that you get at these auctions. And this is why banks don't typically touch these types of assets, because you're essentially buying a quick claim deed. Now like quick claim deed comes with headaches, right? You have to potentially do some quiet title, which is probably the most common thing that you got to deal with. And
you...
Brian Seidensticker (21:45)
may
or may not most of the time you don't have to deal with any other liens on the property. Right. And so those are things that most people don't understand. That's also a reason why a lot of hard money lenders don't really like the space and also a reason why banks won't touch it. Right. They don't want to go through the effort of learning all of those things at the scale that we're talking. Right. Because there, you know, there's probably four to five billion dollars of real estate sold like this annually, which
Jason Hull (21:46)
may or may not most of the time we don't have to deal with any of the liens on the property. Right. And so those are things that most people don't understand. That's also a reason why lot of hard money lenders don't really like this space. also a reason why banks won't touch it. They don't want to go through the effort of learning all of those things at the scale that we're talking. Right. There's probably four or five billion dollars of real estate sold like this annually.
Yeah. There's plenty for most of the folks listening but for banks that's small drop.
Brian Seidensticker (22:10)
is plenty, right? For most of the folks listening, but for banks, that's a small drop in the bucket compared
Jason Hull (22:15)
budget compared to traditional real estate. And so that's one thing to keep in mind is the the actual ad there, the logistics of ⁓ registering for the sale, participating in the auction, right? That's all very similar, right? Underwrite properties, that's no different. The biggest difference is when it comes to underwriting the title, right? You have to keep that in mind. That's also one of the things that Mountain Rock Capital
Brian Seidensticker (22:15)
to traditional real estate. And so that's one thing to keep in mind is the logistics of ⁓ registering for the sale, participating in the auction, right? That's all very similar, right? You underwrite properties, that's no different. The biggest difference is when it comes to underwriting the title, right? You have to keep that in mind. And that's also one of the things at Mountain Earth Capital.
provides is we understand that it can kind of people
Jason Hull (22:39)
provides is we understand that it can kind of help.
Brian Seidensticker (22:42)
avoid pitfalls because we're interested in making sure that they're successful also. ⁓ That's the biggest difference is just the additional underwriting involved on that.
Jason Hull (22:42)
people avoid pitfalls because we're interested in making sure that they're successful also. That's the biggest difference is just the additional underwriting involved
on that one. Got it. So maybe it would be a good first place to start would be to leverage the expertise of Mount North Capitol, go through one of these processes before you start trying to wing it on your own, perhaps. Yes, mean, I guess without completely tuning our own horn.
Brian Seidensticker (23:06)
Yes, I I guess without completely tooting our own horn,
I would recommend that obviously I'm biased, but for folks that are somewhat new to the space, but at least understand real estate, understand how to manage that real estate, which ⁓ majority of listeners fall into that bucket and just want to utilize this, then Mountain Health Capital can be the perfect partner to work with in that regard.
Jason Hull (23:14)
that are somewhat new to this space, but at least understand real estate, understand how to manage that real estate, which majority of listeners fall into that bucket and just want to utilize this, then Mount of Capital can be the perfect partner to work with
in that regard. Got it. What are some of the big questions that people have when they start getting involved in this that they should be aware of?
Brian Seidensticker (23:36)
well, we've, we've covered some of them already, but it's like, what are, what are the other, I'll say unknown unknowns, right? Of like, what, what should I be aware of that I haven't asked about, right? And we've touched, you know, the hate, you know, making sure that you speak with attorney, right? Making sure that you're actually underwriting every property. And I don't worry about this as much for, for tax deed buyers because they're used to underwriting properties. There's a, on the taxing side, there's, there's kind of a
Jason Hull (23:37)
Well, we've covered some of them already, but it's like...
say unknown unknowns, right? Like what should I be aware
Brian Seidensticker (24:05)
a myth out there that there's value in every tax lien sold. And that's not the case because there's tax lien sold on worthless pieces of property. So underwrite your property just like you would normally, ⁓ make sure that you understand the title aspect, ⁓ you know, of, of the property that you're acquiring and what other I would call garbage are you going to have to deal with? ⁓ and then, you know, just making sure that you have a valid and good exit ramp.
Jason Hull (24:06)
myth out there that there's value in every tax lien sold and that's not the case because there's tax liens sold on worthless pieces of property. So underwrite your property just like you would normally. Make sure that you understand the title aspect of the property that you're acquiring and what other item called garbage you're going to have to deal with. And then just making sure that you have a valid and good exit
Brian Seidensticker (24:31)
Right. Especially if we're going to partner with folks, want, we're not
Jason Hull (24:31)
ramp. Especially if we're going to partner with folks, we want...
Brian Seidensticker (24:34)
interested in the long-term hold strategy. We want to be that, Hey, let's buy the property. Let's get it stabilized. Let's make sure the title issues are squared away. Then go get normal financing, right. At a lot better rate, get us out of the way. And then you can hold it, you know, for the term of however long you want to own that rental property. Right. And we've worked with several folks that are using that strategy of working with us in that, in that short period of time. And that's like.
Jason Hull (24:34)
We're not interested in long-term hold strategy. We want to be that, hey, let's buy the property. Let's get it stabilized. Let's make sure the pilot issues are squared away. Then go get normal financing at a lot better rate. Get us out of the way. And then you can hold it for the term of however long you want to own that rental property. We work with several folks that are using that strategy of working with us in that short period of time.
Brian Seidensticker (25:00)
If you execute that playbook, you can be very successful.
Jason Hull (25:01)
If you execute that playbook, you can be very successful.
Does that cover then most of the major potential pitfalls that people fall into when you see them getting started with this? Yes, I think if you do it the right way, you do your research, right, and you don't just blindly go start buying items, then you'll be successful. Where people typically get burned is they look at Zillow for pictures. Well, these properties are distressed, right? These are more distressed than mortgage proposals. You definitely need to grab a private.
Brian Seidensticker (25:10)
Yes, I think if you do it the right way, you do your research, right? And you don't just blindly go start buying items, then you'll be successful. Where people typically get burned is they look at Zillow for pictures. Well, these properties are distressed, right? These are more distressed than mortgage foreclosures. You definitely need to try to the property because
Zillow might be 10 years old and shows a nice property there. Well, in the last three years, you know, when it
Jason Hull (25:32)
because they might be 10 years old and shows a nice property there. Well, in the last three years, know,
Brian Seidensticker (25:37)
first went delinquent through the foreclosure process, they could have had a fire in the back and it's a tear down. These are all things that maybe normal real estate investors don't think about, but that is the type of assets that you might encounter in this space. So it's just doing your research like you should, or any real estate investor should.
Jason Hull (25:37)
it first went delinquent, right, through the portfolio process, they could have had a fire in the back and it's a tear down. These are all things that maybe normal real estate investors don't think about, right? That is the type of assets that you might encounter in this space. So it's just doing your research like you should, right? Or any real estate investor should. Do these always have to be done in person? Is there a way to do this?
any of these remotely or is that just dependent on some markets?
Brian Seidensticker (26:03)
So the auction platforms in attendance typically can be done remotely. that's
part of working with Mountain Earth Capital is some of the many of the auctions we still get great deals are live. But that's part of the services we provide is actually having bidders that attend the auctions. And so if you're in California, for example, and you want to participate in auctions in Texas, typically you wouldn't be able to do that. But through our program, you would. ⁓
Jason Hull (26:13)
Many of the oxygen-re-stemming great deals are...
So if you're in California, for example, and you want to participate in auctions in Texas, typically you wouldn't be able to do that, but through our program you would. Interesting.
Brian Seidensticker (26:30)
On other hand, are almost every tax deduction in Florida is online these days. And so if you wanted to go it alone and participate in these auctions remotely, about 70 % of the country is online ⁓ post COVID.
Jason Hull (26:31)
And there are almost every tax deduction in Florida is online these days. And so if you wanted to go it alone and participate in these auctions remotely, about 70 % of the country is online ⁓ post-COVID.
Got it. Yeah. They just doing this on zoom or Google meter.
Brian Seidensticker (26:51)
Yeah, well, they know they, you they have platforms,
auction platforms that the counties have contracted with and utilized for the sale of property. So instead of raising your paddle, you're clicking a button. mean, the auction is executed the same, but allows it, you will anybody to participate in them at this point?
Jason Hull (26:55)
that the counties have contracted with. Interesting. Lies to the sale of property. So instead of raising your paddle, you're clicking a button. Yeah. But a lot of that really needs to be put in.
Yeah, got it. Okay, well that's really cool. So, well let's get your info. How can people reach you and reach both of these entities that you've got and.
And then any parting words that you have for those that are wanting to get involved in this?
Brian Seidensticker (27:28)
Yes, I think the easiest well as far as the two websites for folks that
want to check it out, right? Taxsaleresources.com mentioned that earlier on the Mountain North Capital side is mountainnorthcapital.com You can check that out. If you want to get in touch with me, go to TaxsaleResources.com and there's a
There's a phone number on there, call the phone number. There's actually a real person on the other end answering it. It's not an AI agent. We haven't made that leap. I still believe that having real people on the other end is important and just tell them, yeah, I heard Brian's caught me a podcast on Jason's or took me and Brian on Jason's podcast. I'd like to talk to more about, you know, XYZ and they'll get you in touch with.
Jason Hull (27:55)
I still believe that having real people on the other end is important. Just tell them, I heard Brian's podcast on Jason's, or take me and Brian on Jason's podcast. I'd like to...
Perfect, awesome. Cool. Well, Brian, appreciate you coming on the show. This is very interesting. think a lot of my clients, This might crack open a new idea for them, another growth channel that they could leverage as a resource for their investors. And so I appreciate it. Thanks so much. All right. So those of you listening, if you've ever felt stuck or stagnant and you want to take your property management business to the next level, reach out to us at doorgrow.com also.
Brian Seidensticker (28:25)
Thanks for having me, Jason.
Jason Hull (28:36)
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