The Zack Arnold Podcast How ‘The Great Resignation’ Caused Us to Question Everything About the Way We Work (and How to Quit if It’s Time to Move On) | with Anthony Klotz
“Sometimes the only way you’re going to cure your burnout is to get away from what is burning you out.”
- Anthony Klotz
Anthony Klotz is an Associate Professor of Organizational Behavior at UCL School of Management in London who has made a career of studying resignations. Anthony’s research has been published on a multitude of high-profile platforms such as The Harvard Business Review, MIT Sloan Management Review and The Wall Street Journal (just to name a few). He instantly rose to stardom early in the pandemic for having coined the now ubiquitous term “The Great Resignation” to describe the mass exodus of workers across industries from jobs & careers that no longer suit them.
When it all comes down to it, the pandemic has given all of us a giant dose of perspective, and in my conversation with Anthony we dig much deeper into how this perspective shift has caused so many to reevaluate the work they do and how they spend the majority of their waking hours. If your work no longer fulfills you - or even worse if your workplace is toxic - it often feels like quitting is the only way out. But quitting is not always necessarily the best option. As Anthony states, “There’s more to quitting than just the decision to leave.”
If we decide to stay despite our shift in perspective, what changes can we make to improve our current job situation? If we decide to leave, how can we do so without burning bridges along the way? Especially in the freelance “gig economy” relationships are everything. In this candid and deep conversation, Anthony provides not only answers but also specific action steps you can take to help you decide if a job is worth sticking with or not, and if it is genuinely time to move on how you can do so without destroying valuable relationships along the way.
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Here's What You'll Learn:
- What the term “The Great Resignation” really means as defined Anthony, the expert that coined it
- How both employees and management can embrace post pandemic changes in the workforce and move forward differently, rather than go back to what wasn’t working
- What specific steps Entertainment Industry leaders can take to create a work environment that balances the previous ‘normal’ with the changes required by employees today
- KEY TAKEAWAY: Organizations aren’t going to offer you exactly what you need. It’s up to you to first identify how you work best, and then be upfront with the organization about the changes you require to get there
- How to know when it’s time to leave your job and you’re not just having ‘a problem’ you need to get over
- The first step to take if you think it’s time to leave your job (it’s not what you think)
- How you can make the job you have the job you want if you suffer from ‘the grass is greener’ syndrome
- How to determine if a job opportunity is right for you by doing a ‘Cost/Benefit Analysis’
- KEY TAKEAWAY: If you want to avoid burnout, step one is setting proper expectations for yourself and your company during the interview
- The definition of ‘Quiet Quitting’ and when that is okay to do so...from an expert
- KEY TAKEAWAY: Quiet Quitting is a symptom of a much larger problem that an immense amount of people are unhappy with the levels to which they are working
- How to find a healthy balance between meeting your standard job requirements and going above and beyond
- KEY TAKEAWAY: Certain individuals want to go above and beyond in their careers, while others simply want a ‘transactional relationship.’ There needs to be an understanding that both are ok, but they should not be compensated equally
- The specific steps to take (and not take) in order to quit your job without burning a bridge
- How much notice you should actually be giving when you resign (you might need to forget the 2 week standard)
Useful Resources Mentioned:
The Original Quiet Quitting Post
Dear Hollywood: We Don’t Want to “Go Back to Normal." Normal Wasn’t Working.
Continue to Listen & Learn
Dear Hollywood...We Create Entertainment For a Living. We’re Not Curing Cancer.
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Guest Bio:
Anthony Klotz
Dr. Anthony C. Klotz is an organizational psychologist who, stemming from his research on resignations, predicted a major pandemic-related labor shift and coined it the "Great Resignation" in an interview with Bloomberg Businessweek in May of 2021. He explained the reasons behind his prediction in an op-ed for NBC News later that month. Since then, his theory has been supported by months of record numbers of resignations in the United States and evidence that this shift is happening globally as well. Anthony has discussed The Great Resignation with multiple media outlets including CNN, CNBC, The New York Times, The Wall Street Journal, BBC, The Today Show, and NPR. In addition, Anthony has discussed his insights about navigating The Great Resignation and what it means for the future of work with executive teams at numerous Fortune 100 organizations.
Anthony’s primary research involves investigating the different ways that employees resign and the causes and effects of different resignation styles, studying how and why employees balance their good deeds and bad deeds at work, and exploring how contact with the natural world affects employees. Anthony’s research has been published in Academy of Management Review, Academy of Management Journal, Journal of Applied Psychology, Journal of Management, and Personnel Psychology. His has also written for the Harvard Business Review, MIT Sloan Management Review and The Wall Street Journal.
Show Credits:
This episode was edited by Curtis Fritsch, and the show notes were prepared by Debby Germino and published by Glen McNiel.
The original music in the opening and closing of the show is courtesy of Joe Trapanese (who is quite possibly one of the most talented composers on the face of the planet).
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