The Foreign Affairs Interview

Searching for an Endgame With China

Jul 11, 2024

Former top policymaker on Asia and deputy national security adviser in the Trump administration, Matt Pottinger, discusses the evolving US-China policy, advocating for a tougher approach and setting clear goals. Topics include strategies for managing competition, engaging with allies, China's role in the illicit fentanyl supply chain, influencing China's future, analyzing China's rise to power, and navigating challenges under Xi Jinping's regime.

42:41

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Episode guests

Matt Pottinger

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Episode notes

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Quick takeaways

Pottinger advocates for a radical goal in U.S. China strategy for desired outcomes.

Strategic alliances are crucial to counter China's influence and promote U.S. leadership.

Deep dives

The Shift in America's China Policy

America's China policy has transformed significantly in recent years under the influence of Matt Pottinger, a key figure in the shift towards a tougher stance on China. The consensus now acknowledges Beijing as a significant threat to national security and prosperity, marked by Secretary of State Blinken's assertion of Beijing's interference in U.S. democracy.

Intro

4min

Strategies in Managing Competition with China

6min

U.S. Engagement with Global South and Allies in the Face of Chinese Competition

10min

Understanding China's Role in the Illicit Fentanyl Supply Chain

2min

Influencing China's Future: Communist Party's Pursuit of Power and Dominance

5min

Analyzing China's Rise to Power

2min

Navigating Challenges with China Under Xi Jinping's Regime

15min

In just a few short years, the United States’ China policy has undergone nothing short of a revolution. Few people have been more central to that shift than Matt Pottinger. He was a reporter in China for Reuters and The Wall Street Journal, then a U.S. Marine, deploying to Iraq and Afghanistan. He went on to become the top policymaker on Asia and the deputy national security adviser in the Trump administration.

Pottinger argues in a new essay for Foreign Affairs that even though Washington’s China strategy has already gotten much tougher, it still has a ways to go—to take on more risk and lay out a clear, if radical, goal for the kind of China the United States wants to see. His views are a window into what China policy might look like if Donald Trump returns to the White House.

You can find transcripts and more episodes of The Foreign Affairs Interview at https://www.foreignaffairs.com/podcasts/foreign-affairs-interview.

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The Foreign Affairs Interview

Searching for an Endgame With China

Episode guests

Podcast summary created with Snipd AI

Quick takeaways

Deep dives

The Shift in America's China Policy

Aim for Victory, not Stalemate

Reframing the U.S. Approach to Allies and Partnerships

Managing Gray Zone Tactics and Containing China's Influence

Remember Everything You Learn from Podcasts