Is the U.S. Experiencing a Narrative Shift on China?

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Feb 3, 2025

In a thought-provoking discussion, Jeremy Goldkorn, co-founder of the Sinica Podcast and editor at Chinafile, shares his insights on the shifting narrative regarding China in the U.S. He explores the role of social media in changing perceptions, specifically among younger generations, and the decline of human rights rhetoric. Jeremy predicts a cautious yet hopeful future for U.S.-China relations, considering how recent developments might influence American attitudes. The conversation delves into the implications of these changes and the complex dynamics at play.

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INSIGHT

Narrative Shift Drivers

Several factors drive the vibe shift in US-China discourse.
These include the TikTok ban and refugees, DeepSeek, Trump, and China's tech advancements.

INSIGHT

Youth and the Shift

Young people like TikTok and resent government censorship of it.
This, coupled with China's competence and fewer new human rights abuses, contributes to the shift.

INSIGHT

Trump's Influence

Trump's actions and rhetoric make the CCP look benign in comparison.
His disinterest in bashing China, corruption, and focus on other issues further contribute to the shift.

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This week as we enter the Year of the Snake, Sinica co-founder Jeremy Goldkorn makes a re-appearance on the show. It's been a year since his last, and much has changed — and indeed, if Jeremy is right, we may be at an inflection point in American attitudes toward China. With the "TikTok Refugees" on Xiaohongshu or "RedNote" taking in a view of China that contrasts starkly with the image presented by the U.S. Government and by many American media outlets, and with DeepSeek now having upended some ideas about American tech primacy, the "vibes" on China among young people seem to have changed for the better. Will it endure? Jeremy and I plunge into that question on this week's episode of the Sinica Podcast.

2:55 – What Jeremy has been up to lately

4:19 – What has been driving the recent narrative/vibe shift in China discourse in the U.S., and why human rights rhetoric around Xinjiang has died down

14:11 – Whether the narrative/vibe shift will be long-lasting and the role of young people in driving it

23:06 – Predictions for future changes within China

29:40 – The concern that the narrative/vibe shift could go too far, or that the copium will overwhelm the positive of the shift

33:24 – Previous narrative shifts around freedom of speech, the internet, and China, and technological innovation

43:57 – What recent developments reveal about Chinese soft power, and Jeremy’s predictions for how everything will play out

49:34 – Whether the narrative/vibe shift will change how American politicians talk about China, and the Chinese government has reacted to the shift so far

Paying It Forward: Savannah Billman’s Career China email newsletter

Recommendations:

Jeremy: Paul Cooper’s Fall of Civilizations podcast series; David Kidd’s Peking Story: The Last Days of Old China; and The 404’s podcast interview with a PornHub exec (which includes discussion of real-name registration requirements)

Kaiser: The TV miniseries American Primeval (2025) on Netflix; and Paul Triolo’s Substack

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