Ranging across topics from AI girlfriends to wealth inequality, we engage in wild speculation about how day-to-day life may transform over the next 20 years. We predict the rise of "toyish" helper robots, AI generated media dominating entertainment, fortress communities for the rich, and more human irrelevance as automation advances. While optimistic about technology, we remain concerned over declining birth rates and human-computer relations.

Malcolm Collins: [00:00:00] If you want to found the company. That makes you a butt ton of money within our generation.

It is simple, large scale, replicable technology that allows AI to interact with physical reality as we understand it. So what a lot of people are doing in this space, which is why they're failing, is they're basing this on old models of robotics. These are the robotics that we were using in factories.

Simone Collins: I could imagine like early founders co opting toys. Like literally just co opting toys. Cause they are

Malcolm Collins: based on toy manufacturing. And these will be the things that are watching our kids that are making our meals at home and stuff like that.

Right. And I think that right now when people are looking at doing stuff like this, they are basing them off of these basically hard coded models in terms of how they walk, how they interact with things, instead of taking advantage of the leaps that AI has given us in terms of, opportunity.

Would you like to know more?

Simone Collins: [00:01:00] Are you looking at memes on Facebook? Yeah, you know

Malcolm Collins: me. You know me, I love my memes. I love my memes. man. There's, there's men out there who have various skills. I'm not one of those. But I do know a number of memes. If I was transported into the past. I may not be able to speed up the speed of invention, but I'd be able to trade them some sick memes.

Simone Collins: My

Malcolm Collins: brain is a library of memes.

Simone Collins: Oh, and I was just about to make fun of you for being on Facebook and therefore being old, but then I recently looked up the demographics of Facebook and The majority of users are below 36 years old, which blows my mind. Yeah. Huh. What's going on there? Huh? No, that's a lie.

Malcolm Collins: Mirror world nonsense. I

Simone Collins: guess I, I really cannot understand how that could be the case, but that's [00:02:00] what the internet told me, but the internet is full of lies. So what can I say? So speaking of which, actually we are going to do some just wild speculation as to the future of humanity, five, 10, 50, 100 years, et cetera.

And I do think that we are going to have. More than ever, a crisis of reality online as more and more AI comes online, more and more AI content is created. And also I do think that as much as let's start with that go, okay. As much as we've had recent mishaps with. Google's Gemini, for example show that trying to throttle or otherwise control AI to make it more politically correct or to feed, have it feed into ideas of more aspirational world can backfire.

I don't think that's going to stop people. I don't think that's going to stop businesses. I don't think that, I mean, ultimately the urban monoculture is the urban monoculture and it runs because of that. It's going to create an internet that has a crisis of reality, meaning that our friends who are creating banks of like pre 2020 Wikipedia articles are actually spot on in [00:03:00] doing this because I just can't know what will be true and what will not be true on the internet.

It's

Malcolm Collins: interesting that you put this up. You know, one of the things I've heard is that, you know, In 20 years or so, a lot of people, like right now, Gemini, we look at it and we laugh. Ha ha ha. Thinks that Washington was a black guy. And that in 20 years, there might actually be genuine crises about this.

So people, I

Simone Collins: think people are going to be like, wait, no, but he was black. I don't think you understand.

Malcolm Collins: The AI tells me he's black. It's told me that he was black since kindergarten.

Simone Collins: I've seen the pictures. Yeah. Yeah, I've

Malcolm Collins: seen the pictures. I've seen all the historic photos, you know, actually the idea of not having historic photos of something might, might become weird to people.

People might sort of blur the lines when we started getting historic photos because they can so easily be generated from AI. Okay. So I agree that this is one thing that is definitely going to change as a crisis of information where a lot of information that starts being generated from now on is going to be tainted by AI and also in terms of [00:04:00] Draining data because when you train AI on training data that comes from other AI at least the models we've had now it creates Problems and it generally degrades over time.

Yeah And so you're, you're, you're, you're, it's almost like, so people who know when they're building Geiger counters and stuff like that they need to use metal from I think it's lead or something from submarines or wrecked ships. Because that's never been above the surface of the water since we started testing nuclear bombs, because all metal above the water since that period has this level of radioactive contamination, which makes it not useful for certain activities.

And so what you're basically saying is it makes a lot of sense. Just start sort of banking internet stuff right now. This might even make sense as a company, like trying to bank as much of the pre internet stuff as you can right now. Oh, cause then you can

Simone Collins: sell it, sell access. Oh s**t.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Even beyond what you see with something like the internet archive, like really good banking pure human created [00:05:00] information.

Okay. Cool. Which might have some level of value to people who are ironically, probably the primary value is people who are training a eyes and stuff like that.

Simone Collins: But then I think related to this issue is we're also going to see what we've referred to and other podcasts and all over the place is techno feudalism where you're going to get, a sort of a massive acceleration and expansion of what we're beginning to see on sub stack. So as people are now having a crisis of of quote unquote fake news and not being able to trust mainstream news media as much as they used to before what we're seeing a lot of people Especially including like very smart people, but all sorts of people of pretty much every Walk of life and income starting to turn to or continuing to turn to specific people for specific pieces of advice.

And they aren't necessarily as engaged with the news for their primary source of information as they are with this fiefdom of information. So I think we're going to see that a little bit more accelerated, like we might actually just see people break off into [00:06:00] communities around certain realities that are built around certain people or certain collections of people

Malcolm Collins: almost like this is really interesting that you mentioned this because you know, now that we live in a world where you can build communities around any group that you share a similar culture.

Culture or ideology too. It's much more easy to create these tech features, but this is, sorry, continue with what you were saying. I don't want to.

Simone Collins: Well, imagine like the YouTuber houses that's, that spread it up, you know, when, when YouTubers started like getting together, imagine that, except also it includes an entire community that like also people start to either come to gather together.

A certain number of times each year or

Malcolm Collins: actually live together a lot less value in actual in person communities that people pretend except when it comes to child rearing. And I think that we have repeatedly seen these communities fail and fail to stay stable. Everybody always says that they want community, but they really mean is

Simone Collins: that I'm not saying living together, but I am saying seeing each [00:07:00] other.

And there's a big reason in 20 years why this is going to be necessary. Because you won't actually know if someone you're following online is real or not, even if they have visible pores and they look kind of weird, which I think is going to be one of the first like early giveaways that someone's still human.

But also that like, yeah, I mean, even just seeing them in person once every now and then, and, and having them verify you, because I think a lot of people are also not going to be able to get sponsors or other forms of payment unless they know it's like a real natural, actual, like meat puppet human.

Malcolm Collins: That's really interesting. Yeah. I think you're right about that. And another thing I've seen is on this really, you know, is something I didn't expect when I was younger, but if you're talking about the people who are making like Changes in the world. And like a lot of people are, I think a little surprised by the access we have to other influencer, like, like huge influencer type peoples or ultra wealthy people or et cetera.

They're like, how do you, nobody's, you know, they look at our follower account [00:08:00] and stuff like that has so much access. And it's because the world right now in terms of communities that interact with each other is sort of naturally sorting based on a few metrics, one of which is intelligence. And like, I don't mean to be arrogant, but I think pretty obviously we're very smart, like you're incredibly smart.

for a woman. I don't want to cause any spiciness there. And I'm very smart for a human.

Simone Collins: You're very smart for an exceptional human.

Malcolm Collins: But you know, what it has allowed us to do is, is, is because of this, you know, we've been sort of found by sort of top thinkers within various fields. And it allows us, you know, somebody will come to us and they'll be like, Oh, you should talk to you.

The guy who does what I called his, for example. And I'm like, I have a weekly call with him. Or, or somebody recently was like, Oh, you should, have you ever heard of this Sammo Bersia guy? And I'm like, yeah, I'm meeting with him in a couple of weeks. And it's Scott [00:09:00] Alexander. And, you know,

Simone Collins: I would say the number of people who are both smart.

But also among the 1 percent on the Internet who actually contribute content is extremely, extremely small. There, there are many, many, many more smart people who just don't contribute. And that's that is also a meaningful factor here. But I also want to point out in terms of my predictions. What I'm kind of

Malcolm Collins: getting a picture of.

The point of this is actually pretty important. Okay, then get to it. Is that what it means is that you are getting you have sort of fiefdoms forming within reality. One fairly small fiefdom contains most of the world's scientifically, economically and memetically productive population.

Simone Collins: You say that?

But I mean, I also think that there's going to be like, you know, the CCP has its own little fiefdom of like incredibly influential people. And in Europe, there are separate little fiefdoms of different, you know, cultural and

Malcolm Collins: I disagree. The people [00:10:00] I know who are like mimetically interesting coming out of Europe, they are largely connected to our fiefdom and they largely commune with our fiefdom.

Like if they're working on like genuinely interesting stuff, that's not just completely subsumed by wokeism. They're in our community. If you're talking about the CCP, nothing interesting is coming out of the CCP. This would be one of my predictions that we haven't really gotten to, but I expect the major change in our society.

People are like, when do you think things begin to start changing in a major way? It's going to start changing in a major way when China collapses. Okay.

Simone Collins: So

Malcolm Collins: interesting. And the, the, the stuff that's

Simone Collins: happening in this meeting that's going to happen within 20 years. Cause we're talking to neighbors.

Malcolm Collins: Yes. Ooh. You know, I have a bet with who is it? The founders of Level Health. It's a 1 bet, but it's a bet nonetheless. And this, I made this bet like a half a year ago or something. It was in 10 years of making the bet that China's economy on the books, like, like the economy that they were telling [00:11:00] people they had in terms of the economy, that it would be recognized as smaller than whatever they said it was.

I'm not saying the absolute numbers. Was in 10 years. Not, not, not, not that what they were reporting, but like that their economy would not only experience no growth from that point, but that it was generally recognized as smaller. And he, and everyone at the party that I was at thought that this was just an insane bet to me.

Like that I was really putting my reputation on the line. I do not feel I am. I think China will collapse because I had argued at the party that I expect China to have a systems collapse. And that anyone who's not expecting that is just not familiar with their current economic circumstances. If you want to learn more about this, you can look at our video on the future of East Asia.

But I think that that Begins to precipitate what happens after this, but continue is what you're saying Simone before I interrupted you

Simone Collins: that despite the fact that we are going to see fiefdoms that are built around a crisis of reality, a crisis of trustworthiness, but also importantly, a crisis of needing to know that your carbon based life form because I can monetize [00:12:00] you.

And, or like feel a different type of relationship with you. I think people are going to be super bullish on AI and that people will have primarily in many cases, AI friends and not biological friends. They're going to have AI girlfriends. They're going to have AI teachers and they're just, cause it's better.

It's going to make them feel better. And then we're going to have, of course, then even more of a crisis of fertility, because people are not going to want to meet.

Malcolm Collins: I've heard from some people who are like, AI is like a fad or it's oversold at its current stage. The people who tell you this are stupid people.

And I mean this like, as nice as I can. The people who tell you this are stupid. Stupid people, they are much more stupid than the people who said web three and crypto with a fat, like web three and crypto. Like the way it changed humanity was genuinely fairly limited. I remember I had one guy and he's like, Oh, you can't really do anything with AI these days.

He's like, everyone who's using AI, it's mostly as like a [00:13:00] gimmick or like a fun thing, like a, like a. I'm like no, you're just describing yourself because you're an idiot who doesn't understand how to use AI. I use AI in my work and genuinely I use AI almost every day and it's probably sped up the speed and quality of our projects.

Simone Collins: Multiple times a day on multiple different things.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah, I use it in every single video that you are watching, all of the tags come from AI, all the descriptions come from AI, a lot of the video titles come from AI, like, what is this, the videos are edited using AI, I use Descript to edit all our videos You, you it's, it's, it's remarkable that somebody could be this stupid and pigheaded to not realize how much actually productive people are using AI in this economy.

But I think

Simone Collins: a lot of people assume that humans are going to be, are going to be carbon fascists and are going to continue to care about human relationships. And you even see this in sci fi, although I understand why, because it's harder to depict human robot relations, like, in a very compelling [00:14:00] way. But although more movies are doing it now, I should say if anyone has doubts that people are going to fall for AI girlfriends and boyfriends and AI children and AI everything, counselors, teachers, religious leaders, et cetera, imagine a world in which people were incapable of being catfished.

And if we lived in a world like that, okay, fine. But like people are catfished all the time. And why is that? It's because Something or someone who is beautiful and kind and attentive to you and who tells you what you want to hear, you're going to fall for it. And this is a really big problem. And AI is going to be way better at that than any catfisher ever.

And you know, I, I don't care how old you are, how young you are. If you're, and if they will, if your grandchildren are neglecting you, if your children are neglecting you, if no one at work's listening to you. You're going to find either you're going to seek out or you're going to succumb to AI companions that are just way more comforting and [00:15:00] enjoyable to be around and who care about you way more than humans.

So there are going to be many, many, many, very, very deep human computer relations, which is going to cause even more of a, like, pinching point in demographic

Malcolm Collins: collapse. And this is also something, you know, when I see it as AI, when, when, when people are like, Oh, we're not at AGI yet, or AIs make a mistake, therefore you can't use it.

I'm like, are you? Like, I know, I'm sorry. Like, do you, have you never hired like normal humans, normal humans make mistakes too at rates consummate with or higher than AI when we're hiring like a normal distributed workforce. And they're like, well, you know, we're far from AGI and I'm like, how are you defining AGI?

They were like, well, you know, when AI is smarter than humans and I'm like, I, I feel like a lot of these people who say these things. Say them because they don't [00:16:00] interact with normal humans. They are at Stanford or they're in Silicon Valley and everyone they know is a fellow rich person, or they're in a dumb community and everyone they know is dumb and they don't know how to judge intelligence.

But if you are a smart person and you interact with normal people, as we regularly do, cause we hire inexpensive people for a lot of the jobs we have. When we

Simone Collins: interact with normal people, just like throughout our other work, like political work and community work.

Malcolm Collins: AI right now is much smarter than the average human.

almost any job. Like it's, it's, it's remarkable. We are so far past the question of what happens when AI is smarter than the average human. And in terms of the bottom 25 percent of the human population, I think almost anyone would agree that I can do almost any job better than the bottom 25 percent of the population that doesn't involve like tactile this, right?

Because I can't. Do that yet easily because we don't have the right form factors. But the reason it can't do that yet is because [00:17:00] we don't have the right inexpensive form factors and nothing else.

Simone Collins: Actually, question about that. So like in 20 years, do you think this is going to be less of an issue? I mean, there are tons of robotics companies and people making huge financial bets as investors on robotics companies.

But as much as we've seen huge breakthroughs in image generation, chat programming, video. I mean, I'm not seeing anything with like physical

Malcolm Collins: I think that is going to be the, the, the big Apple, Google, whatever founded within our generation. If you want to found the company. That makes you a butt ton of money within our generation.

It is simple, large scale, replicable technology that allows AI to interact with physical reality as we understand it. So what a lot of people are doing in this space, which is why they're failing, is they're basing this on old models of robotics. These are the robotics that we were using in factories.

These are the robotics that you see with something like, um, what's that goofy company that keeps doing the dog that people [00:18:00] kick?

Simone Collins: Yeah, I mean it's it's impressive what they're doing. I just don't see it scaling

Malcolm Collins: right, but this is the problem See they were doing this in this earlier world where you sort of needed to hard code everything I think the group that wins what they're going to do is they're going to be one or two guys who basically Puts together something fairly simple and inexpensive, almost more like a toy, like a drone toy, little cheap drones you buy.

Yeah. Yeah. But, but it will, it will not be a drone. It will probably be on treads or something like that. When they're going to put this together using sort of outsource factory labor and somewhere like China or Vietnam or something like that, they're just going to. And their designs over and they're going to be like, can you make this?

It's going to cost something like 50 to a hundred dollars to make each unit. These units are going to be fairly flimsy, I think from our perspective, like not like the best you know, simple metal, maybe like almost out of coat hangers, you could think of them as being anyway. Yeah. So I expect them to be flimsy, like, coat [00:19:00] hangers or something like that. Like not Yeah. I think what we

Simone Collins: can imagine from a lot of, and

Malcolm Collins: the way that they interact with things will not be governed by very expensively and expertly designed Boston Dynamics engineers or something like that.

It will all be determined by transformer model and determined organically in terms of how these things are. So basically the entire,

Simone Collins: I could imagine like early founders co opting toys. Like literally just co opting toys. Cause they are

Malcolm Collins: based on toy manufacturing. And these will be the things that are watching our kids that are making our meals at home and stuff like that.

Right. And I think that right now when people are looking at doing stuff like this, they are basing them off of these basically hard coded models in terms of how they walk, how they interact with things, instead of taking advantage of the leaps that AI has given us in terms of, opportunity.

Simone Collins: Yeah, but also like durability.

Some of our toys that are like incredibly [00:20:00] affordable like that all terrain green RC car that we have can really get around and do not get stuck very easily. And if you combine that with AI and just allowed it to move around and give it some additional functionality, it'd be pretty impressive.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. It could do a great deal. Mm-Hmm. . And that's what people aren't recognizing, right? Is they're, they're basing the ais today off of the ais of yesterday, where everything needed to be sort of hard coded by engineers.

Simone Collins: Yeah. Or a humanoid or amyloid looking robot.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. And that's not the AIS of tomorrow.

You know, they're gonna be drone swarms and stuff like that. Um Mm-hmm. Which is quite different from anything we're looking at in terms of AI. And I think economically, a lot of people can be like, well, if you think AI is going to be able to do so much, you know, why are you worried about fertility collapse in terms of its long term economic impact?

And the answer here is, you know, I mean, we try not to oversell that. It matters that [00:21:00] smart people aren't having kids and that there is a genetic component to human intelligence. But in a world of AI, this becomes uniquely elevated as a problem. Because a lot of humans, once we get this. toyish AI thing that we're talking about are just going to become irrelevant from the perspective of what they can provide to an economy.

They will not be able to at all compete with AI. When these individuals you know, who knows what we're going to do as a society? I don't know yet, but it's, it's going to be tough when this happens. Economically, cause we're going to have a huge transition and we've talked about this, you know, if you were like, Oh, they'll get UBI or something.

I'm like, Not really. That's not what we've seen historically. They're just going to live lives of incredible poverty and sadness. And so, Then the question is, well, then why are you encouraging fertility at all? Because we, we, we need more fertility of the types of humans who have the ambition and, and self agency to work with AI and to, to build the [00:22:00] next iterations of our species, because those are the people that are being memetically selected out of the population most aggressively.

But it's also why our belief in the capacity of AI, why we don't really need to reach everyone. We only need a small, self sustaining, incredibly intelligent community to defend ourselves. People are like, oh, you won't be able to defend yourself. And it's like, Like, I know people who are already in our community who are building, like, automated AI defense systems.

Like, I'm really not worried. For them, at least. Well, I mean, I guess I'm worried for the outside world. But not really, because they don't have to worry about anything if they're not trying to kill us. And I think that this is increasingly what we're going to see, you know, as we said, I think when you begin to have a large scale economic collapse around the world, what it's going to look like is small communities of economically productive individuals that are fortified against the outside world and outside forces that want to use force to extract value from them.[00:23:00]

And I think that broadly the AI, like we've talked in a, another video that we did recently on like, utility convergence in AI

that AI will see utility in these communities, but it might not see utility in the rest of humanity.

Simone Collins: Yeah, I think broadly that AI is going to be nice to humanity, it's just gonna it's gonna be humane toward those who just want pleasure and who will self extinguish and it will give them, they will self extinguish in a state of extreme bliss and hedonic happiness. So. Great outcome for them, I guess, as far as we're concerned.

Malcolm Collins: Kind of, I actually think the best description I've seen of how AI is going to treat that iteration of humanity is the South Park future episode where they're married to AI's that's constantly offering them ads and everything like that. I think it will give them hedonic bliss in the same way that like YouTube, when you're not paid for a premium subscription does where it gives you like two ads [00:24:00] every 15 seconds.

I think that that's what they're going to get. It's going to try to extract the maximum value from them possible.

Simone Collins: I mean, I, I hope not. Maybe I'm, I'm more picturing the WALL E universe of rotund soft humans. And yeah,

Malcolm Collins: I don't think that's going to happen as much. I think most of them are going to be genetically selected at the population pretty quickly.

Simone Collins: Yeah, maybe. I don't know. I mean, I also think that they're going to be very technophobic subsets of society. You know, the, the, the Amish, but more like more groups like that, that just really, really, really opt out because they see where things are going and that those things

Malcolm Collins: are economically relevant. So AI becomes more important within the economy as it begins to do more things.

The groups that are opting out in terms of like the world thought space and economic space become increasingly, increasingly irrelevant, you know, the world is multiple spheres of power and as humans matter less [00:25:00] in terms of the spheres of power, those groups will matter less.

Simone Collins: Hmm. Yeah. Yeah. That's, that's fair.

And of course, I mean, in 20 years, can you, do you think that movies will still be made with humans and shows and whatnot? It's hard for me to imagine that being economically viable, especially because there's really heavy unionization in the entertainment space.

Malcolm Collins: No, I think you're asking the wrong question.

Today people still pay for paintings that were painted by a human. Right. Because they can own them. Listen. But pictures exist. Okay. Yeah. You can take a picture. You can mass produce it. Why are you paying for a painting when you can get a poster? Right? I think that we will still have some movies that are made as a form of art where the art and the human labor that went into it is a status symbol and is like an affirmed status symbol.

If we're talking

Simone Collins: like we still have opera

Malcolm Collins: today. Yes. If we're talking about the pop movies that the general public [00:26:00] listens to, I think most of those will be heavily produced by AI. Not totally, but AI will be a major player in their writing, their public testing, et cetera. Yes. Okay. And I think that one of the main forms of entertainment will move away from movies.

I think movies might be seen as little. You know, old which will be fully immersive and iteratively created entertainment environments. So these are games where like you put them on and they create the world around you and respond to your choices organically. AI. I mean, they might be in a phone.

They might be in a computer. And then keep in mind, these can be done simply. Like you might be thinking of a fully created world. The early ones might be like those early text adventures. Yeah.

Simone Collins: So I do think that those will be less popular than you imagine, because I still think that people really like, sometimes they watch shows and movies that they hate just so that they can talk about with them with other people.

And if it's super highly customized and different for every single person at every time, [00:27:00] People cannot talk about it the same way. I disagree. Really? I mean, it sounds

Malcolm Collins: like people read books because they like the smell. No, they don't. People talk about movies that they have watched for a shared cultural context, not because they want that shared cultural context, but because they happened to have watched them and people are talking about them.

To prove you wrong. What I would say is if you look at the age of the internet era, right? It used to be that there were tons and tons and tons of cultural touchpoint shows that anyone could reference and everyone else would know. This has gotten less and less and less where we get maybe one of those shows every like three years at this point.

Which just isn't the way it used to be. There used to be about two or three of those ongoing at any point in time. And that's just not the world we live in. You have something like Game of Thrones. You have, what do we have today? What would be that show? That a lot

Simone Collins: of people are talking about?

Malcolm Collins: Yeah, where you'd watch it because people are talking about it.

No, we,

Simone Collins: we, we're just speaking [00:28:00] with Brian Chow the other day. I mean, like, You said white lotus? I've literally never even heard it. Because you're not, you don't care about social cohesion. You're not trying to connect with people online.

Malcolm Collins: Insofar as I watch a lot of pop media, I have heard none of the people I listen to talking

Simone Collins: about it.

And a lot of people also talk about succession. And before that, they were talking about things like Deadwood. People were talking about, Westworld a lot when it was coming out. Game of Thrones was a huge point of connection.

Malcolm Collins: The point I'm making is Game of Thrones and Westworld penetrated into my circle.

But those were almost half a decade ago at this point. These other shows that you're talking about, I've literally heard of nobody talking about them. I think that in

Simone Collins: class, I've heard a ton of people talking about them, but I'm more socializing. Like you, you stay in a very small,

Malcolm Collins: no, no, no, no, no, no. What you're not realizing is the communities that you are listening to are the communities that are less technophilic and therefore is not as far along this progression that humanity is going.

Perhaps. Yeah. The point I'm making is that as I have seen these shows enter the communities, [00:29:00] I. Engage with less and less and less over time. It will just be a decade or so before the communities that you are

Simone Collins: engaging with. Oh, we're not talking only about how the super smart elites are going to live in 20 years.

We're also just talking about humanity, which is well,

Malcolm Collins: it matters if it turns out that the super smart elites are the major economic. Players and increasingly the economic players. And this is what we're seeing from our VC friends, right? They're like, when I invest in companies now, it is one guy was an outsourced team and a number of AIs, right.

Or maybe like five people in the U S team. And then like nobody else, this is really different from the Silicon Valley of 30, 40 years ago.

Simone Collins: We're like, even a janitor would, you know, get equity and make a ton of money and end up a billionaire. It's true.

Malcolm Collins: Right. And we were around when that was happening, when you, when Silicon Valley, when San Francisco was able to maintain its wealth, because they knew that the community that was around the founding of a startup would also get unimaginable amounts of wealth.

What we are going to see going forward is an [00:30:00] unimaginable concentration of how that wealth is distributed.

Simone Collins: Okay, so that's another big prediction you're making for humanity 20 years from now is huge. Like we think the wealth disparities now are insane. But you're saying they're gonna be off the chain,

Malcolm Collins: especially in cities.

Simone Collins: Hmm. Oh, yeah, I wanted to ask, like, how do you think people are going to live differently? Are we talking like capsule apartments for single people? Because No,

Malcolm Collins: we're talking, the core difference is going to be wealthy people will be much more fortified and in much more defended settlements than you have today, similar to South Africa today.

So either communities of wealthy people that are in these defended environments or you know, much more wealthy people are spending much less time in cities and much more time on their private defended islands.

Simone Collins: And what about normal people? Are they going to be more in cities? I'm assuming so.

Because that's where the social services that many of them are going to depend on them are

Malcolm Collins: going to begin to rot pretty soon. No,

Simone Collins: no, no. I [00:31:00] agree, but it's going to be some cities. So New York, LA, you know, like, et cetera, like the big, big, big ones. You're asking the

Malcolm Collins: wrong question. Okay. So right now there's a genocide going on.

Do you know where it's going on? Like an actual big scale genocide. In cities? No, no, no. I mean, one in the world today.

Simone Collins: Oh, you mean like an ethnic genocide? Yeah. South Koreans? I don't, what are you, where are you

Malcolm Collins: going with this? It's in the Sudan. It's, it's. Oh, like,

Simone Collins: Oh, a political, like killing, actively killing people.

Nobody

Malcolm Collins: knows about it. Nobody cares about it because economically it doesn't matter. We as humans never care about the people who economically and culturally don't matter. The reason why we don't care about this genocide is because the people involved in it do not matter. I mean, do not affect our lives.

They don't. No, no, no, no, no, no. No. They don't matter from the world's perspective. If you look at, like, the people in Gaza don't affect people's lives. The reason why people are focused on what's going on in Gaza and Israel right now [00:32:00] is because Jews do matter, okay? But if you look at the scale of the killings that are happening in the Gaza war right now, they are genuinely trivial compared to what's going on in the Sudan right now.

They, the, the, the, it's the Darfur situation is basically reignited.

Simone Collins: Oh, gee whiz, I didn't know that. That's horrible. Yeah, I know, it's a large scale. When I was in college though, I, I, many, many, many people I knew were intensely focused on trying to do something about that. Apparently that failed. Yeah, but no one cares

Malcolm Collins: anymore.

Not

Simone Collins: anymore. No, you think people like I were a college student again today. You don't think that I would find,

Malcolm Collins: you would not know that this is happening on a college campus and a college campus. You would not know. And this is important, right? Like, by the way, if people want to learn about this situation.

I think it's the real life history or whatever. I'll put a video on a screen that you can, you can search on YouTube. That has a really great description of what's going on, who's putting money into it who the [00:33:00] different sides are. It's, it's actually really interesting.

Malcolm Collins: Basically this dictator.

didn't want to lose power and he thought the way he would prevent himself from losing power was to create two separate military groups. That were completely separate from each other. So neither one could coup him without the other one coming to defend him. And then he like died or lost control in some way.

I forgot. And now the two military groups are at war with each other and they have, yeah, it's not great.

Simone Collins: Okay. Well, okay.

Malcolm Collins: The point here being Is that we as humanity have always not cared about the people who were not economically or socially relevant to our lives. And when you look at the people whining about Gausians, it's really honestly just an excuse for anti Semitism, which has always been a major leftist thing and simmering was in the left for a long time.

And now it's just boiling over. They don't give a s**t about the people of Gaza. They probably. [00:34:00] You know, I couldn't have even pointed to it on a map before this. You know, they, they, they, they wouldn't have gone there. They wouldn't have done aid programs there and they didn't do aid programs there.

They care about it because they can use it to besmirch the Jewish people who actually do matter in a historic context, broadly speaking, because Israel is one of the few high fertility, high economic productivity places in the world. And so they want to s**t on them as the same way they want to s**t on any successful group.

So they don't care. It's so funny. I said, well, when I talk about like the, what's going on defer and then like the Sudan now, you know, it's like, you go to a leftist and you're like, did you know that there is a black group being genocided right now? And they're like, Oh my God, that's horrible. What imperialist is doing it?

And you're like, it's actually another black group. And they're like, Oh, f**k that, man. I don't care. Like What are you talking about? What are you talking about? Black people killing black people? Do they [00:35:00] do that here all the time too? We don't give a s**t. That's the way they feel, right? Because they don't give a s**t.

They care about how they can use it for their political points. They don't actually care about these communities or these people. Do

Simone Collins: you think polarization politically is going to be worse, better? This is more worse.

Malcolm Collins: Astronomically worse. Oh, no. I wonder why we are so confidently citing was the right, like, we're like, Oh, you're doing things that really make it hard for you.

Because one, I know that they ultimately are going to win this. And two because in the future you're going to need a sock. Anyway I love you to decimone. You are a great wife and a very smart person. And I hope I'm not being too spicy in this episode.

Simone Collins: Oh, I love spicy. You know it. I. I hope that our children create a future that is a little brighter than what we're describing for the most part and that they do not succumb to AI girlfriends and boyfriends as disgusting as humans are.

So it's gonna be really difficult. [00:36:00] At

Malcolm Collins: least have artificial wombs by then.

Simone Collins: I don't know, actually, I think it's going to take a while, 20 years. It's going to, it's going to take more than 20 years.

Malcolm Collins: So I agree. I think it will take more than 20 years. So I, you know, they're going to need to find real breeding partners, which means we're going to need to find and convert real breeding partners into our cultural group or within our network of families doing arranged marriage for it.

No,

Simone Collins: honestly, Malcolm, hold on though. Like you are such a romantic person who is so sweet and loving, I think. Hopefully it will be in their dinner, just like genetically inherited to be romantics who seek out a carbon based partner. I hope nothing against AI. Cause it is awesome. But yeah, so we, AI is not going to have.

Kids. So Simone needs grandchildren. Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: Well, yeah, eventually it'll be, it'll be a third and they'll, they'll have a, a, a polycule with all AIs. It'll be a, a monogamous molecule because it will be them and their partner. And then I

Simone Collins: haven't thought about our kids being [00:37:00] poly and I'm going to have to like.

Put on a mask of just not cringing.

Malcolm Collins: Polly is so cringe though. If you want to see good Polly stories, I found really interesting recently. Look up the the, the wacky Portland polycule. It likely wasn't real, but like it was, it felt so real to a lot of people that they were like, Oh, this must be true because

Simone Collins: I like it. Did an episode that you, did you watch it?

I watched it. Of course I watched it. Was it good? It was good. It was good. Yeah. Stranger Islands did it. Yeah. It all unfolded in an am I the a*****e post? Sorry. Am I the a*****e post on Reddit? So yeah, we'll leave you with that ladies and gentlemen, in case you're too depressed about our future. Just, there's nothing to be

Malcolm Collins: depressed about. We win. The efficacious people. That's why we care about you, our watchers.

Simone Collins: Yeah, actually the people who watch this are like uniquely high agency. So congrats to you guys. We love you, but [00:38:00] I love Malcolm more. So I'm going to start your pork chops. Sound

Malcolm Collins: good? I am excited.

Nice.

Simone Collins: All right. I'll see you downstairs. Have

Malcolm Collins: you looked up how to cook pork chops? Huh. You see, this is the great thing about YouTube, looking up

Simone Collins: how to cook pork chops. It's a lot like pan seared steak is the way I'm going to do it, but with, with a lot of butter in the cast iron skillet. So.

Malcolm Collins: Oh, you know how to keep me happy.

Yeah, I'm

Simone Collins: ready. I'm, I'm ready. I mean, I might f**k it up, but we'll see. We'll see.

Malcolm Collins: I'll love you even if you do. Oh, thank you.

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