S2E16: Sexual Fluidity, and How Anger Helped Access My Sexuality, with Maddie Upson, part 2 of 2

Happy Pride Month from Sexvangelicals!

We kick off June by talking with our new Marketing and Communications Director, Maddie Upson, about her experiences navigating queerness inside and outside of religious contexts. This is one of the most riveting conversations we’ve had about queerness on our podcast. Check out our conversations about:

• Jenga Pieces (14:00): Julia uses the metaphor that deconstruction is like removing pieces of a Jenga Tower; eventually, it all comes crashing down. Maddie shares, “The first time I went to a party and someone offered me alcohol, I’ve been prepared my entire life for that. The Church said like, they're gonna try to get you to do drugs and you just gotta stand strong. And they [the partygoers] were like, okay. And they just bopped off. And I was like, well, this wasn't the spiritual haggling that I had expected as they led me to believe. And I started realizing these, like non-believers were way more respectful of my decisions than most of the Christians I grew up with.” When Maddie saw that people weren’t forcing drugs on her and her Christian values weren’t being attacked, a Jenga piece was pulled out. 

• Capacity during Deconstruction (20:00): Julia reflects on Maddie’s story and explains how during the deconstruction process it’s understandable and normal that she did not have the capacity to explore her sexuality. “So it is such a good point that you just didn't have the capacity to engage bisexuality or queerness and that wasn't a cop-out or, any other negative thing that was just where you were at the time and all your other capacities were utilized in other ways. You didn't have anything else left for that.” Deconstruction takes up a lot of our mind's energy and space, and there is no shame in making realizations about ourselves later in life, there is no such thing as “being late.” 

• Hair Cutting and Patriarchy (25:00): Maddie shares, “I buzzed my head and I was like, I'm not pretty anymore. But not in a sad way, right? Like I am still attractive, I can be so many other adjectives now. That person in the mirror belongs to me.” The Church and mainstream culture seem to agree on a few things: the idea that women need long pretty hair and make-up seems to be one of them. Of course, the amount of make-up and clothing varies, but the expectations set on women by the patriarchy are harmful and limiting to our self-expression. 

• Labels (39:50): Jeremiah summarizes, “Queer is all-encompassing. Whereas bisexual, like still in some ways is a word that centers around the gender binary. You're either attracted to men, you're either attracted to women. Oh, you could be attracted to both. Maddie, what you're talking about that given all these different types of attraction that happen is like my levels of attraction are situational, are circumstantial.” Labels can be constricting, and not that they are bad, they’re not, but a lot of people do not fall into the gay, straight, or bisexual labels, but find themselves identifying more with the term “queer” or just sexually fluid. It’s okay to not have a label. All that matters is practicing safe and consensual sex with whomever it may be. 

• Coming Out (45:00): Maddie shares, “Coming out can imply that this is something really important that you need to tell people and you're gonna have some questions and you're gonna have to be ready for them, instead of just being. It also implies that the default is heterosexuality.” Coming out shouldn’t be an expectation of queer people; nobody owes anyone an explanation for their sexuality. Coming out may be meaningful and important, however, it should not be the expectation of every queer person to inform everyone in their lives that they are queer. We do not need to divulge every piece of information about ourselves, especially with sexuality, because we may be sexually fluid, and there should not be the expectation that every time we date someone of a different gender an entire announcement has to be made. 

We hope you have a fantastic Pride Month, however you choose to celebrate. Let’s heal together!