You Can’t Figma Your Way out of Complexity With Jen Briselli

Sep 11, 2025

Jen Briselli, a strategist and educator, dives into the complexities of design, illuminating why conventional best practices often fall short. She explains that navigating chaotic organizations requires focusing on relationships and informal networks rather than rigid structures. Briselli contrasts complicated design challenges with truly complex ones, advocating for adaptability and learning. She emphasizes how fostering growth conditions within teams unlocks potential and encourages experimentation, offering a fresh perspective for designers feeling lost in complexity.

Ask episode

AI Snips

Chapters

Books

Transcript

Episode notes

ANECDOTE

From Physics To Complexity In Design

Jen moved from physics to teaching and then to UX after craving interdisciplinary work.
Chaos theory and systems thinking from physics seeded her interest in complexity science.

ADVICE

Shorten The Sense–Respond Loop

Shorten your sense–response loop: probe small, observe quickly, then adapt.
Use fast experiments and monitoring instead of relying on static best practices.

INSIGHT

Relationships Unlock Influence

Career progress requires facing organizational complexity, not hiding in craft alone.
Influence grows from relationships and learning capacity, not just superior craft skills.

Get the Snipd Podcast app to discover more snips from this episode

Get the app

Design isn’t a straight road. It’s more like a maze with moving walls. In this episode, strategist Jen Briselli shows us why learning, relationships, and hidden networks matter more than best practices when navigating complex organizations.

How do you thrive as a designer when the org around you is unpredictable, political, and constantly changing?

Most designers hit a wall at some point in their career: their skills are strong, but the system they’re working in feels impossible to navigate. Best practices don’t seem to work, processes break down, and “design maturity” feels like a buzzword no one can actually define.

That’s where Jen Briselli comes in. With a background in physics, teaching, and design strategy, Jen helps teams understand what complexity really means and why learning is the only way through it. In our conversation, she explains how complicated and complex are not the same thing, how informal networks drive influence more than org charts, and why the real work of design is creating the conditions for growth rather than forcing outcomes.

If you’ve ever felt stuck in a low-maturity team, frustrated by org politics, or burned out by chasing “best practices,” this episode will reframe how you see your role. Thriving in complexity and ambiguity is not about having all the answers. Instead, it’s about learning how to sense, adapt, and build the great relationships that make great software possible.

Take a listen to learn how to stop fighting complexity and start working with it.

Topics:• 02:41 – Understanding Complexity in Product Design• 04:06 – Jen Belli’s Journey into Complexity Science• 04:41 – Exploring Complexity Science in Design• 11:55 – The Difference Between Complex and Complicated Systems• 16:56 – Navigating Complex Systems in UX Design• 30:56 – The Role of Learning in Complex Systems• 34:58 – Formal and Informal Networks in Organizations• 40:57 – Understanding the Metaphor of Soil, Seeds, and Sunlight• 41:54 – Exploring Design Maturity and Emergent Properties• 43:33 – Creating Conditions for Psychological Safety and Design Maturity• 44:46 – The Role of Affordances in Design Maturity• 45:06 – Nurturing Growth in Unpredictable Environments• 50:00 – Balancing Work and Mental Health• 54:18 – The Importance of Identity and Letting Go• 57:33 – Final Thoughts on Complexity and Learning

Helpful Links:
• Connect with Jen on LinkedIn
• Learning is the Engine // Jen’s Rosenfeld Talk
• Jen’s YouTube channel

—

Thanks for listening! We hope you dug today’s episode. If you liked what you heard, be sure to like and subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts! And if you really enjoyed today’s episode, why don’t you leave a five-star review? Or tell some friends! It will help us out a ton.

If you haven’t already, sign up for our email list. We won’t spam you. Pinky swear.

• ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Get a FREE audiobook AND support the show⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

• ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Support the show on Patreon⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

• ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Check out show transcripts⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

• ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Check out our website⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

• ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Subscribe on Apple Podcasts⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

• ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Subscribe on Spotify⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠• ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Subscribe on YouTube⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠• ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Subscribe on Stitcher⁠