Going Steady with Herman Daly: ‘¡No pasarán’/ É Proibido Proibir’

Sep 9, 2025

Guest

David Batker

Guest

Karen Daly Junker

Guest

Herman Daly

Herman Daly, an influential ecological economist and former World Bank employee, reflects on his revolutionary career critiquing mainstream economics. He shares fascinating insights on sustainability, influenced by his family and activism in Brazil. Karen Daly Junker offers personal anecdotes about her father's passion, while David Batker discusses Daly's impact on ecological economics and the push for policy changes. Together, they explore the fight against neoliberalism at the World Bank, advocating for a shift toward sustainability and social justice in development.

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ANECDOTE

From Shorts To Suits

Herman Daly swapped LSU casuals for World Bank suits and found the transition uncomfortable.
His family remember his discomfort with formal life in Washington but admiration for the opportunity he saw there.

INSIGHT

Power Follows Money

The World Bank's voting power links directly to financial contribution, privileging wealthy nations.
This institutional setup shapes global development decisions and preserves the influence of rich shareholders.

ANECDOTE

Empates and Martyrdom

Chico Mendes and Marina Silva led nonviolent empates to defend the Amazon and rubber tappers' land.
Mendes won international awards but was later assassinated, shocking and destabilizing the movement.

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We follow Herman Daly into one of the last places you’d expect to find a rebel economist: the World Bank. We will hear how the academic work of Herman’s sister, Denis Daly Heyck, impacted on his worldview. We’ll also see how this fused with Herman’s own experiences teaching in Brazil, and the building of pan-American ecological and human rights movements to fuel him to advocate for policy and philosophical changes at the Bank - culminating in his famous farewell speech.

Featured in this episode:

Karen Daly Junker & Terri Daly Stewart, Herman and Marcia’s daughters

Jon Sward, Environment Project Manager at the Bretton Woods Project

Denis Daly Heyck (Deni), Professor Emeritus of Spanish language & literature

David Batker, Ecological economist

John Redwood, Former World Bank employee

Robert Costanza, Ecological economist

Clóvis Cavalcanti, Ecological economist

Peter May, Ecological economist

Kate Raworth, DEAL co-founder

Joshua Farley, Ecological economist

Xiye Bastida, Climate justice activist

Thank you to the Daly family for their generous support in sharing Herman’s story.

Thanks also to: C40's Barbara Barros for voicing Marcia Daly’s email in this episode; Denis Daly Heyck for providing the images for our episode art; and to Nate Hagens and the team behind The Great Simplification podcast for granting us permission to use a clip from their show.

Thank you also to our series consultants and fact checkers, Peter Harnik, Rob Dietz, and Peter Victor, who also graciously supplied the interview tape with Herman Daly, recorded in 2022.

Media citations by order of appearance:

(That'll Work) (Live), Chuck Brown

The Heritage Foundation - “Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!”

The Great Simplification: “Toward an Ecological Economics”

If you want to learn more about the Journal of City Climate Policy and Economy, please visit our website: https://jccpe.utpjournals.press/

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Edited by Morgane Chambrin: https://www.morganechambrin.com/

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