TCC Podcast #131: What Copywriters Need to Know About Design with Lori Haller

Direct response designer, Lori Haller, talks all about design and how copywriters can work more effectively with designers in the 131st episode of The Copywriter Club Podcast. Lori was also one of the speakers at our recent copywriting event in Brooklyn, TCCIRL (videos available soon). Kira and Rob asked Lori about her processes, how she built her design agency, and all of the following: •  how she got started as a designer •  where her first jobs came from—and how she chose direct response as her niche •  how branding design differs from direct response •  her 3-step read-through process before she designs anything •  how copywriters can improve their working relationships with designers •  what separates the best copywriters from the rest •  how she landed the big name clients she works with •  how copywriters can learn basic design principles •  how she makes sure she has the ideas an attitude she needs to do her best work •  her advice to anyone growing a team •  where she sees copywriting going in the future •  what she does to keep learning and growing If you’ve ever wanted to get more out of your relationship with your designer, this is a good one to add to your podcast play list. To hear it, click the play button below. Or if you like reading more than listening, scroll down for a full transcript.   Most of the people and stuff we mentioned on the show: Jim Rutz Gary Bencivenga Doug D’anna David Deutsch Clayton Makepeace Carline Cole Envisioning Information by Edward Tufte Latrice Eiseman Bonus link to an interview of Lori by John Carlton Lori’s list of design references 3 Step Copy Review and Checklist Lori's website Kira’s website Rob’s website The Copywriter Club Facebook Group The Copywriter Underground Intro: Content (for now) Outro: Gravity   Full Transcript: Rob:   What if you could hang out with seriously talented copywriters and other experts, ask them about their successes and failures, their work processes, and their habits, then steal an idea or two to inspire your own work? That's what Kira and I do every week at The Copywriter Club Podcast. Kira:   You're invited to join the club for Episode 131 as we chat with direct response Art Director Lori Haller about working with copywriters, the relationship that design and copy share and why they need each other, why she chose direct response as her niche, and how knowing design basics will make you a better copywriter. Welcome, Lori. Rob:   Hey Lori. Lori:   Hey guys. How's it going? Kira:   It's great. Rob:   So good. Kira:   Yeah. Great to have you here, especially to have a designer in the house. Let's kick this off with your story. How did you end up as a designer? Lori:   I knew at an early age that I was in love with visualness, design, fonts. And so I went to training program for a couple years in high school where you had to be picked, it was like some type of tie in with the community college. Then I went to many years of a variety of trainings and college, at different colleges and sites in order to gain access to typography, communications, marketing, design, all that jazz. Then I went right from there into top agencies in Washington, DC. I tried to follow some of the lead art directors of that time and train under their wings for several years. The whole time I wanted my own agency at some point. And finally, about 20, 21 years ago, I decided to leave being a full-time employee and jumping in and starting my own agency. I had already ... I don't know, we might have talked about this Kira, but I'd already done nighttime work and weekend work on the side, all the whole while that I was employed, ramping up for hopefully one day building my client list and being able to go full-time just having my own agency. So luckily, it worked out. Rob:   Yeah, and it has worked out. When you were just starting to do the side projects, where did those projects come from?