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Lenny's Podcast: Product | Growth | Career
Making Meta | Andrew ‘Boz’ Bosworth (CTO)
Mar 3, 2024
01:42:21
The podcast delves into the early days of Facebook, Meta's culture shift, and lessons in leadership. Boz shares insights on career growth, the Apple Vision Pro, and finding strength in personal expertise. Stories of failures, seeking help, and setting incentives are also discussed, emphasizing the importance of communication and trust in decision-making.
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Quick takeaways
- Early Facebook challenges emphasized grit and sacrifice.
- Success of Facebook News Feed led to trillions in value.
- Passion drives productivity and career growth through diverse roles.
- Importance of diverse perspectives and adaptation in leadership.
- Communication, self-trust, and curiosity foster growth and resilience.
Deep dives
Early Days at Facebook: The Trial by Fire
Starting as one of the first engineers at Facebook, the guest recounts the intense early days where he worked long hours and faced constant challenges. He emphasizes the grit and sacrifice required, highlighting the lack of support and the all-consuming nature of the work that often goes unnoticed.
Creation of Facebook's News Feed: Controversy and Success
The discussion delves into the development of the Facebook News Feed, one of the earliest algorithmically ranked content feeds in social media. Despite facing initial resistance from users, the News Feed became a monumental success, doubling user engagement and creating economic value amounting to trillions of dollars through News Feed and ad integration.
Passion and Learning: A Career Lesson
The guest reflects on the importance of passion in driving better work and productivity. Through personal experiences of exploring diverse roles and projects, he highlights the value of being open to new opportunities and environments in optimizing career growth and learning.
Feedback Dynamics with Mark Zuckerberg: Lessons in Leadership
The guest shares insights into giving feedback to Mark Zuckerberg, emphasizing his receptiveness to varied viewpoints. Despite initial disagreements, Mark's willingness to listen and adapt demonstrates a strong leader who values diverse perspectives and continuously evolves.
Tattoos and Self-Expression: A Shift in Perspective
The conversation shifts to the significance of tattoos as a symbol of self-expression and personal growth. The guest discusses his own journey in embracing tattoos as a form of self-reflection and cultural shift, highlighting the evolution in societal views towards body art and individuality.
Embracing Honesty and Communication for Effective Leadership
Being honest and open in communication is essential for effective leadership and impact. Directly addressing concerns or issues with care and belief can lead to meaningful changes in various settings, from personal relationships to professional environments. Clear and effective communication, as highlighted in the concept that communication is the job, is crucial for creating lasting impacts and promoting positive change.
Navigating Challenges with Curiosity and Self-Trust
Encouraging self-trust and fostering curiosity can help navigate challenges and personal growth. Embracing self-trust allows individuals to take risks and handle outcomes confidently. By approaching disagreements or setbacks with genuine curiosity, like learning from others' perspectives or critiques, individuals can cultivate open-mindedness and resilience in facing life's obstacles.
The Power of Self-Reflection and Embracing Vulnerability
Engaging in introspection and self-reflection can lead to personal growth and emotional awareness. Recognizing personal failures and understanding their impact on others can facilitate growth and self-improvement. Embracing vulnerability by acknowledging past mistakes and learning from them can foster empathy and strengthen relationships with oneself and others.
Promoting Growth Mindset and Empathy Through Artistic Expression
Fostering a growth mindset and empathy through artistic expression can enhance personal development and self-awareness. Making art for personal fulfillment and self-expression encourages self-confidence and authenticity. Engaging in creative endeavors like photography can capture emotional moments and promote self-reflection, leading to a deeper understanding of oneself and others.
Andrew Bosworth—or Boz, as most people know him—is the chief technology officer at Meta and head of Reality Labs, the company’s augmented reality/virtual reality (AR/VR) organization, which he created in 2017. Boz joined Facebook in 2006 as their approximately 10th engineer, and in his 18-year tenure he built the original News Feed, Messenger, and Groups, as well as many early anti-abuse and infrastructure systems. At various times he has been the engineering director overseeing Events, Places, Photos, Videos, Timeline, Privacy, and more. Before Reality Labs, he ran the Ads and Business Platform product group, where he led engineering, product, research, analytics, and design, taking annual revenue from $4 billion to $40 billion in five years. Andrew currently leads Meta’s efforts in AR, VR, AI, and consumer hardware across Quest, Ray-Ban Meta glasses, and more. In our conversation, we discuss:
• Stories from the early days of Facebook
• Lessons from Meta’s downturn and recent turnaround
• Meta’s culture of transparency
• Boz’s thoughts on the Apple Vision Pro
• Why communication is the job
• Why you should regularly seek help from your manager
• Lessons in setting incentives and avoiding their misuse
• Why you should optimize for a variety in experience in your career
• The importance of trusting your own expertise and not being swayed by external opinions
• Stories of failures and personal growth
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Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/making-meta-andrew-boz-bosworth-cto
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Where to find Andrew Bosworth:
• Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/boz/
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/boztank/
• X: https://twitter.com/boztank
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/andrew-bosworth-8247a01/
• Website: https://boz.com/
• Photography website: https://wardenshortbow.com/
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Where to find Lenny:
• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com
• X: https://twitter.com/lennysan
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/
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In this episode, we cover:
(00:00) Boz’s background
(04:48) Fun facts about him
(07:20) Early days at Facebook
(11:11) Advice for founders
(13:22) Leveraging leaders
(19:27) Tips for communicating with managers
(22:10) Transparency at Meta
(27:01) The importance of clear guidelines
(29:11) Involvement in the details
(33:15) Building the News Feed
(37:28) Passion and career growth
(40:25) Exploring new opportunities
(42:02) The value of variety in experience
(45:01) Giving and receiving feedback
(47:38) Boz’s tattoos
(51:30) Communication is the job
(01:00:47) Comparing VR headsets: Meta Quest 3 and Apple Vision Pro
(01:10:41) Meta’s downturn and turnaround
(01:16:10) Navigating org changes
(01:20:43) Lessons from failure
(01:26:33) Closing thoughts
(01:29:57) Lightning round
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Referenced:
• Reality Labs: https://about.meta.com/realitylabs/
• Quest: https://www.meta.com/quest/
• Ray-Ban Meta smart glasses: https://www.ray-ban.com/usa/ray-ban-meta-smart-glasses
• Taekwondo: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taekwondo
• 4-H: https://4-h.org/
• David Copperfield’s website: https://www.davidcopperfield.com/html/
• MC Hammer on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/mchammer/
• George W. Bush: https://www.whitehouse.gov/about-the-white-house/presidents/george-w-bush/
• Fry’s Electronics: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fry%27s_Electronics
• Association for Computing Machinery: https://www.acm.org
• Get It Done: https://boz.com/articles/get-it-done
• Patrick Stewart on X: https://twitter.com/sirpatstew
• The FB Exec Practice That Changed the Way I Lead (about HPMs): https://livingos.substack.com/p/fb-exec-hpm
• Mark Zuckerberg on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/zuck
• Chris Cox on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-cox-2896b841/
• Javier Olivan on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/javierolivan/
• Brian Chesky’s new playbook: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/brian-cheskys-new-playbook/
• Eye of Sauron: https://lotr.fandom.com/wiki/Eye_of_Sauron
• Ruchi Sanghvi on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/rsanghvi/
• Eric Schmidt on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/eric-e-schmidt/
• Sheryl Sandberg on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sheryl-sandberg-5126652/
• Best Advice Sheryl Sandberg Received: If Offered a Seat on Rocket Ship, Get On: https://news.yahoo.com/blogs/newsmakers/best-advice-sheryl-sandberg-received-don-t-idiot-161459450.html
• Veritas: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veritas
• Communication is The Job: https://boz.com/articles/communication-is-the-job
• Repetition does not spoil the prayer: https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/repetition-does-spoil-prayer-constantine-constantinides-m-d-ph-d--1f/
• Janet Lansbury’s website: https://www.janetlansbury.com/
• Dr. Becky on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/drbeckyatgoodinside
• Boz to the Future Episode 18: The Future According to Matthew Ball: https://www.meta.com/blog/quest/boz-to-the-future-episode-18-matthew-ball-metaverse-epyllion/
• Apple Vision Pro: https://www.apple.com/apple-vision-pro
• Quest 3 headset: https://www.meta.com/quest/quest-3/
• Virtual desktop: https://www.meta.com/experiences/2017050365004772/
• Meta Horizon Workrooms: https://www.meta.com/experiences/2514011888645651/
• After trying the Vision Pro, Mark Zuckerberg says Quest 3 ‘is the better product, period’: https://www.theverge.com/2024/2/13/24072413/mark-zuckerberg-apple-vision-pro-review-quest-3
• Lou Holtz on X: https://twitter.com/CoachLouHoltz88
• Gell-Mann amnesia effect: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Gell-Mann_Amnesia_effect
• “Wet streets cause rain”: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19026568
• Michael Crichton on X: https://twitter.com/CrichtonBooks
• AI research at Meta: https://ai.meta.com/research/
• Llama 2: https://llama.meta.com/
• Warren Buffett quote: https://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/warren_buffett_383933
• Mark Slee on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mcslee/
• Dave Fetterman on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davefetterman/
• Emacs and Vim: https://dev.to/george_udonte/emacs-and-vim-an-overview-for-beginners-2e65
• Ami Vora on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/amvora/
• The Dream Machine: https://www.amazon.com/Dream-Machine-M-Mitchell-Waldrop/dp/1732265119
• Alan Turing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Turing
• Good Inside: A Guide to Becoming the Parent You Want to Be: https://www.amazon.com/Good-Inside-Guide-Becoming-Parent/dp/B09Y4WG7RJ
• Dr. Becky’s website: https://www.goodinside.com/
• The Mandalorian on Disney+: https://www.disneyplus.com/series/the-mandalorian/3jLIGMDYINqD
• Scott Trowbridge on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/scott-trowbridge-b70866/
• Dave Filoni on X: https://twitter.com/dave_filoni
• Jon Favreau on X: https://twitter.com/jon_favreau
• Mercedes-Benz AMG EQS Sedan: https://www.mbusa.com/en/vehicles/model/eqs/sedan/amgeqsv4
• Tracey Emin “Trust Yourself”: https://www.artsy.net/artwork/tracey-emin-trust-yourself
• Tracey Emin on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/traceyeminstudio
• Rick Rubin: Protocols to Access Creative Energy and Process | Huberman Lab Podcast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpgqXCkRO-w
• Ansel Adams: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ansel_Adams
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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.
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Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.
Get full access to Lenny's Newsletter at www.lennysnewsletter.com/subscribe
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Discover
highlights
Listen to the best highlights from the podcasts you love and dive into the full episode