John Vervaeke, a cognitive scientist known for his insights on sensemaking and rituals, is joined by Jordan Hall, who shares his transformative journey of conversion to Christianity. They explore the intricate relationship between faith and cognition, questioning the nature of belief systems. The duo discusses grief, love, and their roles in shaping human experience, while drawing fascinating parallels between Christianity and Buddhism. Their heartfelt dialogue emphasizes authenticity in faith and the necessity of genuine connection in understanding spirituality.
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The Need for a Specific Christian Argument
John Vervaeke suggests the need for an argument supporting Christian faith beyond general faith in primordial presuppositions.
He points out that the argument for faith, as presented, applies equally to other religions like Buddhism, creating a pluralistic scenario.
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The Proto-Map
Jordan Hall posits a "proto-map," more fundamental than any specific map, as the foundation of Christianity.
This proto-map is the process by which maps are formed and defines all possible maps.
insights INSIGHT
Universality of Proto-Map Concept
John Vervaeke challenges the uniqueness of the Christian proto-map concept.
He suggests that other traditions like Buddhism, Taoism, and Neoplatonism also offer similar concepts of ultimate relationality.
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This conversation is in part John Vervaeke's response to my previous video with Jordan Hall (The End of Strategy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnR2PYtLLnI) where we discussed Jordan's recent conversion to Christianity. John fires up some questions, and we discuss different aspects of sensemaking and religious structures to answer the question: Why Christianity?
Original YouTube version: https://youtu.be/Vp_08T0Ucik
REGISTER TODAY FOR OUR NEW SYMBOLIC WORLD COURSE WITH JOHN VERVAEKE: The Cognitive Science of Ritual. Live classes start on October 7th, 2024, 2-4 pm EST on the Symbolic World Circle community. This is a 6-week, 12-hour online course. All lesson recordings will be made available afterward and all materials will be provided. The final lesson will be co-hosted by Jonathan Pageau in a Q&A format. All patrons at the Involved tier or higher get a 10% discount; see your unique code at the top of the course page and apply at checkout: https://www.thesymbolicworld.com/courses/the-cognitive-science-of-ritual Join Jonathan Pageau, Jordan Hall, John Heers, and others in Florida for an exclusive, intimate weekend filled with leisure and hospitality. This November event is a fundraiser for First Things Foundation. Learn more: https://first-things.org/aot
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Timestamps: 00:00 - Coming up 01:42 - Intro music 02:07 - Introduction 05:07 - John's pov on Jonathan and Jordan's conversation 08:49 - Why Christian faith? 15:38 - Jordan's answer: the Ultimate Map 18:27 - The current dialogos 21:10 - Jonathan: The Christian Escatological map 25:52 - Jordan: Relationship to Jesus 32:20 - Grief and the qualities of love 37:40 - Jonathan: Particularity beyond duality 41:43 - Jordan: A deeper capacity to suffer 44:49 - John: Being is good / Not escape 46:54 - Jonathan: Theosis 49:25 - What if this is a crypto-egoism? 55:26 - Is this the grounding of your Christian faith? 01:01:29 - Zen: Does the infinite love you? 01:11:39 - Intimacy 01:22:18 - We can't be meta 01:27:47 - Universalism 01:29:01 - We each have our callings 01:30:21 - John and Christianity
Our website designers: https://www.resonancehq.io/ My intro was arranged and recorded by Matthew Wilkinson.
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