"Ethical Consumption" & the History of "Selling Out"

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Nov 2, 2025

Dive into the complexities of ethical consumption versus selling out in a capitalist world. The hosts discuss the origins of the phrase 'no ethical consumption under capitalism' and explore critiques of consumerism. They examine the impact of anti-litter campaigns that shifted blame to individuals and question if boycotts can truly affect corporations. Cultural shifts in the music industry are highlighted, alongside debates on artists performing for questionable regimes. The conversation wraps up with reflections on the enduring entanglement of commerce and culture.

02:05:25

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INSIGHT

Amazon's Profit Engine Is Not Retail

Amazon's public face as a retailer obscures that AWS supplies most of its profits.
Targeting consumer purchases alone won't easily harm Amazon without coordinated structural or labor pressure.

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ADVICE

Make Boycotts Strategic

Use consumer boycotts that support concrete levers like unions or targeted pressure campaigns.
Passive abstention from a brand rarely changes corporate behavior without organized demands.

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ADVICE

Reduce Consumption First

Consume less as the most effective personal environmental action you can take.
Reducing purchases matters more than choosing different retailers alone.

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Why discuss ethical consumption and selling out now

02:34 • 8min

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Origins and meaning of 'No ethical consumption under capitalism'

10:29 • 8min

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Limits of ethical shopping and the neoliberal emphasis on consumption

18:31 • 5min

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How anti-litter campaigns shifted blame to individuals

23:09 • 14min

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Can boycotts and consumer choices meaningfully hurt corporations?

36:50 • 10min

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Personal consumption: practical steps versus systemic change

46:39 • 12min

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History of 'selling out' and its cultural rise and decline

58:56 • 10min

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How MTV, Napster, and streaming normalized commercial tie‑ins

01:09:03 • 7min

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Single sellout vs double sellout and cultural expectations

01:16:17 • 10min

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Is performing for autocratic regimes acceptable for artists?

01:26:11 • 9min

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Should journalists do sponsored partnerships with criticized companies?

01:34:59 • 13min

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Does awareness excuse participation in harmful systems?

01:48:22 • 10min

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Are cultural apex predators immune to consequences?

01:58:12 • 3min

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Zooming out: historical continuity of commerce and culture

02:01:37 • 1min

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Hosts' personal stances and hypocrisies about sponsorships

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A “point, counterpoint”-style deep dive into the double-sided coin of “ethical consumption” and “ethical salesmanship” (or its alternative, “selling out”) under that little thing we call “capitalism,” sponsored by our treasured economic partners in the Saudi Royal Family.

“Is There REALLY No Ethical Consumption Under Capitalism?” from Clotheshorse with Amanda Lee McCarty (2024)

“This feminist t-shirt isn’t actually made in a sweatshop” by Zing Tsjeng from Dazed (2014)

Karl Marx in America by Andrew Hartman (2025)

“Marxism Unmasked: From Delusion to Destruction,” a lecture series from 1952 by all-time neoliberal juggernaut Ludwig von Mises

“The Litter Myth” from “Throughline” by NPR (2019)

“A Beautiful If Evil Strategy” by Chris Rose from Plastic Pollution Coalition (2017)

“Leaked Audio Reveals How Coca-Cola Undermines Plastic Recycling Efforts” by Sharon Lerner from The Intercept (2019)

“What is Amazon Web Services?” by Melissa Eddy from The New York Times (2025)

“People Think Amazon Is an E-Commerce Company, but 74% of Its Profit Comes from This Instead” by Anthony Di Pizio for The Motley Fool (2024)

This video from Grace Blakeley, author of Vulture Capitalism, about whether one’s identity as a consumer can ever be weaponized as an anti-capitalist tool

“Ethical Consumerism Isn’t Dead, It Just Needs Better Marketing” by Julie Irwin for Harvard Business Review (2015)

“The Case Against Corporate Social Responsibility” by Aneel Karmani for Wall Street Journal (2010)

“Nirvana: Inside the Heart and Mind of Kurt Cobain” by Michael Azerrad for Rolling Stone (1992)

“Lived Through This,” an interview with Chuck Klosterman, by David Wallace-Wells for Vulture

“The Rise and Decline of the ‘Sellout’” by Franz Nicolay for Slate (2017)

Shakespeare’s Sonnet 110, in which he bemoans the need to do spon con so he can make a living as a writer

“In the 90s, We Worried About Nirvana ‘Selling Out.’ I Wish That Concept Still Made Sense,” by Dan Brooks for The Guardian (2023)

“How We Stopped Caring About Selling Out” and “Comedy’s Favorite Truth-Tellers are Playing Jester for the Saudi Prince” by Emily Topping for Current Affairs (2025)

“The Age of the Double Sell-Out” by W. David Marx (2025)

“I didn’t listen to a single Taylor Swift song on Spotify last year. She still made money off me.” by Chris A. Williams for The Philadelphia Inquirer (2024)

“It’s Not the Crime, It’s the Coverup” by Freddie deBoer (2025)

“Ha ha! Ha ha!” an infamous review of Trick Mirror by Lauren Oyler for London Review of Books (2020)

“The Journalist as Influencer: How We Sell Ourselves on Social Media” by Allegra Hobbs for The Guardian (2019)

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