Rutger Bregman, a Dutch historian and author of bestsellers like Utopia for Realists, dives into pressing global issues. He critiques wealth inequality and emphasizes the need for moral ambition to drive societal change. Bregman discusses the role of altruism in philanthropy, arguing that empathy often falls short. He explores universal basic income and its potential to reshape work in an age of automation. Additionally, he champions innovative charity models that empower individuals to tackle humanitarian challenges, advocating for a more aspirational approach to giving.
Rutger Bregman advocates for moral ambition, urging individuals to redirect their talents towards pressing societal challenges instead of pursuing conventional high-paying careers.
Bregman highlights historical precedents of moral movements as inspiration for contemporary efforts to combat societal inequalities and injustices.
He champions universal basic income as a transformative policy that could redefine work culture and promote moral engagement in an era of increasing automation.
Deep dives
The Importance of Moral Ambition
Moral ambition serves as a call to action, encouraging individuals to address pressing societal issues rather than adhering to conventional career paths. Rutger Bregman discusses his transition from academia to journalism, emphasizing the need for a focus on structural forces that govern society. He expresses a desire for the brightest minds to tackle significant challenges, rather than pursuing high-paying, low-impact jobs. This notion forms the backbone of his book, where he encourages a cultural shift towards making altruism and doing good more aspirational.
Understanding Historical Progress
Bregman highlights a nuanced perspective on global progress, noting that while there are significant societal challenges, historical data shows an overall decline in extreme poverty and child mortality. He references Max Roser's work from Our World in Data to illustrate that while these positive trends exist, there are still alarming situations, particularly in American politics. He suggests that understanding history can yield important lessons about the possibility of both decline and progress, thus underscoring the urgency for moral ambition now. This framing encourages an acknowledgment of advancements while advocating for continued efforts to improve the human condition.
Countercultural Revolt Against Immorality
Bregman draws parallels between historical movements for moral change and present-day challenges, suggesting a need for a similar countercultural revolt against disregard for societal well-being. He discusses examples from history, such as the British abolitionists, who fought against the prevailing moral failures of their time, and the progressive movements that arose in response to extreme inequality. He emphasizes that there are opportunities for contemporary movements to rally against moral immorality in politics, particularly as values shift in today's society. This historical context serves as inspiration for the current generation to take action against injustices.
The Role of Wealth in Initiating Change
Bregman discusses the mixed views on billionaire philanthropy, highlighting that while some billionaires, like Bill Gates, contribute significantly to addressing societal issues, much of their wealth often remains underutilized. He argues that a more balanced system of taxation and a cultural reevaluation of how we view business success could foster greater social responsibility among wealthy individuals. He advocates for a shift where moral and financial success are celebrated together, encouraging socially beneficial behavior among those in power. This view promotes the idea that philanthropy can be effective, especially when aimed at supporting neglected causes like malaria prevention or improving health care.
Universal Basic Income as a Solution
Bregman champions universal basic income (UBI) as a transformative policy, particularly in the face of increasing automation and potential job loss due to AI advancements. He notes that while evidence for UBI's effectiveness is still mixed, particularly in wealthier nations, the idea has gained traction across different political spectrums. Incorporating cash transfers has shown promise in developing countries, suggesting that UBI could address welfare inadequacies and redefine work culture for future generations. By framing UBI as a means to liberate people from traditional notions of work, he emphasizes its potential to reshape societal values towards personal fulfillment and moral engagement.
Sam Harris speaks with Rutger Bregman about Rutger’s new book, Moral Ambition: Stop Wasting Your Talent and Start Making a Difference. They discuss why it seems like we are at the hinge of human history, wealth inequality, how altruism should be rewarded, how we should think about philanthropic billionaires, effective altruism, why empathy is overrated, moral entrepreneurship, universal basic income, work and meaning, existential risk, and other topics.
Rutger Bregman is a Dutch historian and author. His books Utopia for Realists (2017) and Humankind (2020) have sold over 2 million copies and have been translated into 46 languages. In 2024, he co-founded The School for Moral Ambition, a non-profit inspired by his book Moral Ambition: Stop Wasting Your Talent and Start Making a Difference (Dutch edition 2024), which helps ambitious people tackle the world’s most pressing problems. The English edition of Moral Ambition will be released on May 6, 2025.
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