THE TRUST CRISIS #1 w/ Alan Watkins & Durwin Foster
Aug 27, 2023
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Join leadership guru Alan Watkins, a physician and neuroscientist known for his work on human performance, alongside psychotherapist Durwin Foster, a student of Ken Wilber and mindfulness expert. They tackle the crisis of trust in today’s leadership, debunk the seven dark arts of deception, and discuss how to spot dark triad personalities in various spheres of life. The conversation dives into the ethics surrounding truth, the impact of misinformation, and the importance of integrating diverse perspectives to foster genuine understanding and healing in a complex world.
The podcast discusses the alarming rise of deceitful leaders, emphasizing that their disregard for truth erodes societal trust and coherence.
A nuanced understanding of truth, encompassing subjective, shared, and objective realities, is essential for effectively navigating today's complex information landscape.
The seven dark arts of deception provide a framework for recognizing manipulation, highlighting the need for truth activism to combat harmful deceit in communities.
Deep dives
The Nature of Deception
Deception is a complex phenomenon that operates at both individual and collective levels, heavily influenced by bad incentives and moral failings. The discussion highlights the alarming rise of leaders who can lie without remorse, showcasing a disregard for truth that undermines societal trust. Examples from various political figures illustrate how the ability to deceive can become a liability, leading to societal decay as shared truths erode. Recognizing and addressing this trust crisis is essential for individuals and leaders alike to restore integrity in communication and interactions.
Understanding Different Truths
Truth is multifaceted, consisting of subjective, shared, and objective realities, each with significant implications for understanding and communication. The conversation discusses the difficulties in categorizing observable facts versus shared perceptions, citing humorous examples that demonstrate how commonly accepted 'facts' can be contested. This distinction is critical, as confusion between subjective truths and objective realities can lead to further deception and miscommunication. Cultivating awareness of these various truth types can help individuals navigate the landscape of information more effectively.
Dark Triad and Ordinary Lying
The podcast delves into the spectrum of lying, from ordinary dishonesty to pathological deception associated with dark triad personalities—psychopathy, narcissism, and Machiavellianism. Ethical boundaries are blurred as societal norms often shift with cultural expectations, complicating the distinction between manipulation and honest communication. Individuals frequently grapple with the ethical implications of their actions, particularly when incentivized to deceive under specific conditions. Thus, recognizing where ordinary lies transform into harmful deceit is crucial for fostering a more authentic and responsible dialogue.
The Influence of Distrust in Leadership
Leaders often struggle with the balance of confidence and doubt, as effective leadership demands certainty while growth requires questioning and vulnerability. The tension between wanting to maintain authority and the necessity of admitting fault or uncertainty can create a toxic environment where deception thrives. Furthermore, the conversation touches on the detrimental impact of political climates that discourage open dialogue, particularly when leaders are incentivized to avoid accountability. Developing organizational cultures that prioritize trust and transparency is essential for leaders aiming to promote ethical standards.
Navigating the Seven Dark Arts
The seven dark arts of deception—discarding, discrediting, displacement, distortion, disruption, doubt, and distraction—serves as a framework to understand various manipulative tactics. Each art presents unique challenges and requires distinct antidotes, such as prioritizing active listening and cultivating self-awareness of biases. The podcast brings forward the idea of truth activism as a proactive response to these dark arts, emphasizing the importance of individuals engaging in fostering honesty and compassion within their communities. Building awareness and developing skills to combat these dark arts are imperative for safeguarding against manipulation.
Hope Amidst Deception
Amidst the challenges of deception and mistrust, various signs of hope indicate a shift towards truth activism and societal change. The rapid pace of innovation, particularly in AI, presents both challenges and the potential to foster new conversations about truth and dishonesty in the digital age. Initiatives that promote critical thinking and discerning truth from falsehood are essential, as is the role of popular culture in addressing these issues. Engaging with these evolving dynamics can empower individuals to strive for a more transparent and honest society.
In this special episode, Layman is joined by leadership expert, Alan Watkins, and psychotherapist, Durwin Foster, to explore themes from Alan's new book, Lie-Ability: How Leaders Build and Break Trust. What are the seven dark arts of deception? From integral leadership and psychotherapeutic perspectives, how are we to address breakdowns in sensemaking and coherence in a culture where deceit has become common, and will soon be even more powerfully amplified by AI and other emerging technologies? How can we better recognize, and respond to, the tactics of dark triad personalities in our political cultures, workplaces, and spiritual communities?
A physician and neuroscientist, and the CEO of Complete, Dr. Alan Watkins is recognised as an international expert on leadership and human performance. Over the years he has coached thousands of individuals to greater levels of performance, transformed organisational cultures and helped leaders discover new ways to succeed. Alan has become a confidant to many of the world’s top leaders over the past 22 years. Alan believes we can create a world with enlightened leaders in all walks of life, but this requires leaders to ‘wake up’, ‘grow up’ and make better decisions. His optimism for the potential of human beings never wavers. He is also the author of many books, including Crowdocracy: The End of Politics and Wicked and Wise: How to Solve the World’s Toughest Problems.
Durwin Foster, MA, CCC, has learned the science of effective therapy through rigorous academic training. Completing a Master of Arts in Counselling Psychology at the University of British Columbia, Durwin is certified at the national level through the Canadian Counselling and Psychotherapy Association (CCPA). Durwin completed all required doctoral level coursework and trained in supervision, while performing research on the benefits of mindfulness training. A close student of Ken Wilber, Durwin has recently trained in Full-Spectrum Mindfulness, an approach that combines mindfulness with developmental psychology to help us wake up from our dreams of separation, while also growing into our greatest potentials.
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