American Divorce: How the States Can Quit Each Other (Featuring Dr. Jason Sorens)

What if the United States could peacefully resolve its deep political rifts through secession? Dr. Jason Sorens, a leading expert on secessionism and author of the book Secessionism, joins the pod to discuss the legal, historical, and cultural dimensions of secession in America. The contentious idea has gained renewed interest following Donald Trump's re-election in 2024, and we examine the complexity of secessionist movements from California to Texas to Cascadia and more. Recognizing the confines of the Supreme Court's defining 1869 Texas v. White ruling about the legality of secession, we question whether a breakup might actually bridge the political chasm dividing progressives and conservatives across the nation.

We also discuss the dynamics shaping current secession discourse, from the redrawing of state boundaries to the culture clashes within states that complicate these efforts. Drawing comparisons with international movements, such as Greenland's path to greater independence and the peaceful dissolution of Czechoslovakia, Dr. Sorens provides a nuanced perspective on the potential paths states might consider. We examine the challenges of forming new nations and the delicate balance between self-determination and the cohesion required to sustain a united country.

Finally, we dig into the relationship between partisanship and polarization in America, contemplating whether secessionist rhetoric is merely a symptom of deeper societal divides. With examples like Vermont's quest for greater policy autonomy, we consider innovative solutions that focus on self-governance as an alternative to outright separation. Ultimately, our conversation seeks to answer this question: can unity be achieved through separation?

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