Did you know there are piles of guidebooks meant to help women excel at being the church's first lady? From how to step out of a car when pulling up to church on Sunday, to preparing the perfect casserole, to keeping the kids smiling and still in the front pew. And those dirty dishes in the sink? They could be the talk of the lady's luncheon if you're not careful. On this episode, Katelyn and Roxy dig into the pile of expectations put on pastor's wives — and the idea that his ministry must be her ministry.

As a woman newly wed to a priest, Roxy wonders what those expectations mean for her — and which parts of this role to lean into and which to resist. And Katelyn ... well, Katelyn has some new reasons to care too (listen to find out!). We talk with historian Beth Allison Barr about why the role of pastor's wife has evolved in many denominations to be the primary path of ministry for some women.

Plus: The Millennial Girl Boss's Guide to Being the Pastor's Wife (as cringe as you'd expect!)

GUEST:

• Beth Allison Barr is the James Vardaman Professor of History at Baylor University. She is the author of the New York Times bestselling book, "Becoming the Pastor’s Wife: How Marriage Replaced Ordination as a Woman’s Path to Ministry," as well as, "The Making of Biblical Womanhood: How the Subjugation of Women Became Gospel Truth." She is a pastor’s wife and mom.