The Zen Kwan is sort of like a mantra that you meditate on or? Yeah. In my 50s, like early 50s, I wandered into the Unitarian church near my house, five minute walk. My son was having a coming of age ceremony. And the mom knew that I was interested in meditation. She pointed to the minister and said, that guy is a Zen master. So I googled him, went to see him in his office at the church,. talked to him and thought, I could learn from this guy. And so I started studying with him.