On today's episode of above board, I have got Rob Walling, entrepreneur, serial entrepreneur, author, and so many other things, and he's here to chat about his new book, the SaaS Playbook. And I read the book last night, it's absolutely incredible, I couldn't put it down in fact, and I stayed up quite late and took a ton of notes privately and for this interview as well, Rob. So

thank you for being here. Absolutely, it's my pleasure. So the way I want to do this is

I want to go over my notes and questions that I had from the book, because there's so much value here, and this is a new step though, this isn't just, I want to do a capital L lifestyle business and build it to $10,000, $20,000 a month. This is like how to get to the next level, and there's a lot of stuff in here that we resonate with, you know, we've done some of these things to get where we are, but there's also things in there that, you know, perhaps we haven't thought about, and so we'll get into that as we progress through this call. So I am stoked. The way you've set up the book is so well done, and the way you go to these incredible lengths to actually qualify the content that people should expect. You actually prepare them for certain things, and you explain why you've chosen to do things like focusing on SaaS, and it feels really authentic, and I just like that about it. So if you haven't got product market fit set up, they should probably go to start small, stay small, and then kind of gravitate towards this book as they start to grow. Is that a fair assessment?

Yeah, I think so. The book kind of assumes you have a product in the market, and it assumes a weak product market fit. You know, you product market fit is binary. It's like weak to strong, one to 100 or whatever. And I think once you're like maybe a 10 or a 20 out of 100, I think this will help you go further, but I honestly, I had another 200 pages written on all the idea validation trying to get. I have it in a Google Doc, and I'm going to do something with it. I don't know yet. I don't know if it'll be a book or any book or something, but that stuff though is so... You know how it is, man, it's a morpheus. It's like, it's almost inevitably hand-wavy. There's no like path to find product market fit. It's wandering versus like once you're starting to get there, it's like, okay, here's a path. It's like, you need to try some marketing, you need to build a team, blah, blah, blah. That's why I wanted to focus on stuff that was really, I could be really prescriptive about.