John McMahon is one of the more intimidating people you meet in your entire life, but he's got a heart of gold underneath that. I learned about how do you run a very disciplined organization? How do you build a high-performed sales organization? They were very, very good at that and it grew a group. And so, and so, and the facts in my bedroom like all night. That's so funny. So, so McMahon for people I don't know. John was after PTC went to Blade Logic with David Cherrya was the CEO of Blade Logic. Dave is now the CEO of Mongo and John has he's sort of the father of all these PTC mafia

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