Jock Steen was the manager of Celtic at that time. I'm a major supporter, so there was no reason at all for me to be expected to surprise from call out of nowhere. So it said, hello, is that Frank D? Yep, this is Jock Steen. I wonder if you'll have some lunch with me tomorrow. Which I didn't take as much as an invitation as kind of an order. It's the people who are in the arena, and who work in the arena - they're accountable for everything. Not the people who stand on the outside and have observations. And that was a big lesson to me, and it made me want to study a

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