Procedural memory and trapped survival

What if the very practices you’re using to “heal your nervous system” are actually keeping you stuck in freeze?

In this episode I sit down with Irene Lyon, one of the most nuanced voices in the trauma healing and nervous system regulation space. Irene has spent decades studying somatic education, somatic experiencing, and early developmental trauma, and what she brings to this conversation is discernment… something sorely missing in today’s wellness culture.

We explore the shadow side of popular practices like cold plunging, meditation, and cathartic trauma release, and why more sensation doesn’t always mean more safety. We talk about freeze response, pre-verbal and developmental trauma, and how well-meaning “trauma hacks” shared online can actually destabilize sensitive nervous systems.

This is a conversation for those who feel they’ve “done all the right things” but still don’t feel settled inside themselves. It’s also for clinicians, parents, and seekers who want to understand what true embodiment looks like—beyond trends, performative regulation, and spiritual bypassing.

My hope is that this episode offers a long exhale, and a return to what is simple, humane, and honest about healing.

You’ll Learn:

[00:00] Introduction

[16:12] Why many chronic symptoms are nervous system survival patterns, not separate diseases

[25:18] How trauma-release methods fail when a person can’t feel interoception

[36:41] Why early and pre-verbal trauma requires a different path to safety and regulation

[44:07] What goes wrong when meditation, catharsis, or pelvic work are done too soon

[46:52] How meditation can reinforce shutdown instead of presence

[53:24] Why cold plunging and breathwork can trigger freeze or collapse

[1:10:36] How incomplete survival responses turn into freeze, collapse, and chronic illness

[1:24:11] What must be in place before emotional or sensation-based healing

👉🏻 Want to start a podcast like this one? Book your free podcast planning call here.

Resources Mentioned:

Andrew Huberman | Website

Andrew Huberman Control Your Vagus Nerve to Improve Mood, Alertness & Neuroplasticity | YouTube

Stephen W. Porges Vagus Theory | Website

Waking the Tiger by Peter Levine | Book

Somatic Experiencing | Website

David Berceli Trauma Release Exercises | Website

Molecules of Emotion by Candace Pert | Book or Audiobook

Feldenkrais Method | Website

EMDR Therapy | Website

Vipassana Meditation | Website

Spontaneous Healing by Andrew Weil | Book or Audiobook

Progressive Muscle Relaxation | Website

Learn more about Irene's 21-Day Nervous System Tune Up here.

Connect with Irene:

Irene Lyon | Website

Irene Lyon | YouTube

Irene Lyon | Facebook

Irene Lyon | Instagram

Find more from Kelly:

Instagram: @kellybroganmd

Website: kellybroganmd.com

Join Kelly's monthly membership, Vital Life Project here.

Get Kelly’s new book The Reclaimed Woman here.

Go to the Juvent Store and use code KELLY300 at checkout to get $300 off your purchase.

You can head to lotuswei.com and use the code Kelly15 for 15% off.