The first question I asked him is, Hey, so what do you think the problem is? And he kind of paused on why they were late. They didn't have the framework that this client wanted something sort of generalizing. It was a humbling encounter. You see that look in their face of and it's the look of, Oh, this is my fault. I'm doing this.These are people that believe in ownership. These are not people trying to shy away from that. This is an actual problem where you can't diagnose what it is until you look at a couple things you're not looking at"