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The Tradeoff Between Lift and Shift and Cloud Native Migration
Kio: Etsy was very generous and they published a lot of how they were calculating the carbon footprint. And then essentially we have a sustainability program at ThoughtWorks and we were wanting to do the similar things. So we collaborated and essentially used those algorithms and put that into kind of a node library for creating a carbon, recalculating a carbon footprint and it integrates with the cloud. Kio: It's interesting to see that that kind of stuff is now becoming a first class part of most of the cloud vendors dashboards as well. Like so to me there's a direct line from that story to kind of having an industry influence, you know, so that everybody's getting that.