Is Putin Willing to Take a Huge Risk?

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I feel like they kept surprising many observers, because putin kept doing things that were more immoral and more violating of the basic rules of the international political settlement. But none of them actually involved a huge amount risk for him or for russia. And i guess one question about the war eucrane is the teaces miscalculate. He fhought that eon crane wouldn't be a huge risk either, because within three days he would be in ke when all european countries kept making excuses for everything else he had done across the world. No, it's not that he was willing to take a much bigger risk. He just didn't think that the risk was that

Anne Applebaum is a staff writer for The Atlantic and a Senior Fellow of the Agora Institute at Johns Hopkins University. In her books - most notably Red Famine: Stalin’s War on Ukraine and Iron Curtain: The Crushing of Eastern Europe she has chronicled the terrible human costs of past attempts by Russia to dominate countries in Central and Eastern Europe.

In this week’s conversation, Anne Applebaum and Yascha Mounk discuss the developing ideology of "Putinism," what it would look like for Ukraine to win the war, and how democracies can defend their values in a world of resurgent authoritarianism.

This transcript has been condensed and lightly edited for clarity.

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