People who deny LDL causality do is they look at that and say, well, you've got all this stuff going on, LDL can't be causal. No LDL remains causal, but that overall risk profile for this individual is higher. There's much more. It amplifies it. And so then we can have someone who's isolated high LDL and maybe they have high HDL and they have low triglycerides. But again, LDL is the causal pathway. HDL is not causal.

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