Supported by Our Partners

• WorkOS — The modern identity platform for B2B SaaS.

• The Software Engineer’s Guidebook: Written by me (Gergely) – now out in audio form as well

• Augment Code — AI coding assistant that pro engineering teams love

—

Not many people know that I have a brother: Balint Orosz. Balint is also in tech, but in many ways, is the opposite of me. While I prefer working on backend and business logic, he always thrived in designing and building UIs. While I opted to work at more established companies, he struck out on his own and started his startup, Distinction. And yet, our professional paths have crossed several times: at one point in time I accepted an offer to join Skyscanner as a Principal iOS Engineer – and as part of the negotiation, I added a clause to my contrac that I will not report directly or indirectly to the Head of Mobile: who happened to be my brother, thanks to Skyscanner acquiring his startup the same month that Skyscanner made an offer to hire me.

Today, Balint is the founder and CEO of Craft, a beloved text editor known for its user-friendly interface and sleek design – an app that Apple awarded the prestigious Mac App of the Year in 2021.

In our conversation, we explore how Balint approaches building opinionated software with an intense focus on user experience. We discuss the lessons he learned from his time building Distinction and working at Skyscanner that have shaped his approach to Craft and its development.

In this episode, we discuss:

• Balint’s first startup, Distinction, and his time working for Skyscanner after they acquired it

• A case for a balanced engineering culture with both backend and frontend priorities

• Why Balint doesn’t use iOS Auto Layout

• The impact of Craft being personal software on front-end and back-end development

• The balance between customization and engineering fear in frontend work

• The resurgence of local-first software and its role in modern computing

• The value of building a physical prototype

• How Balint uses GenAI to assist with complicated coding projects

• And much more!

—

Timestamps

(00:00) Intro

(02:13) What it’s like being a UX-focused founder

(09:00) Why it was hard to gain recognition at Skyscanner

(13:12) Takeaways from Skyscanner that Balint brought to Craft

(16:50) How frameworks work and why they aren’t always a good fit

(20:35) An explanation of iOS Auto Layout and its pros and cons

(23:13) Why Balint doesn’t use Auto Layout

(24:23) Why Craft has one code base

(27:46) Craft’s unique toolbar features and a behind the scenes peek at the code

(33:15) Why frontend engineers have fear around customization

(37:11) How Craft’s design system differs from most companies

(42:33) Behaviors and elements Craft uses rather than having a system for everything

(44:12) The back and frontend architecture in building personal software

(48:11) Shifting beliefs in personal computing

(50:15) The challenges faced with operating system updates

(50:48) The resurgence of local-first software

(52:31) The value of opinionated software for consumers

(55:30) Why Craft’s focus is on the user’s emotional experience

(56:50) The size of Craft’s engineering department and platform teams

(59:20) Why Craft moves faster with smaller teams

(1:01:26) Balint’s advice for frontend engineers looking to demonstrate value

(1:04:35) Balint’s breakthroughs using GenAI

(1:07:50) Why Balint still writes code

(1:09:44) Rapid fire round

—

The Pragmatic Engineer deepdives relevant for this episode:

• The AI hackathon at Craft Docs

• Engineering career paths at Big Tech and scaleups

• Thriving as a Founding Engineer: lessons from the trenches

• The past and future of modern backend practices

—

See the transcript and other references from the episode at ⁠⁠https://newsletter.pragmaticengineer.com/podcast⁠⁠

—

Production and marketing by ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://penname.co/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@pragmaticengineer.com.

Get full access to The Pragmatic Engineer at newsletter.pragmaticengineer.com/subscribe

The myth of the ethical consumer

Mentioned by

Mentioned in 1 episodes

The AI-powered Podcast Player