When I had issues with executives, you know, or with management, for example, like my nature is to like run to the fire and fix things. Like it's a problem. I'm actually very reactive and it shows up in all areas of my life can work in business. It can also be really bad in relationships. And so he helped me clarify that I wanted to do things that felt more like projects and less like an undertow business. He taught me this is one of the most interesting things he ever taught me: there's a really healthy amount of avoidance that a leader needs to have to redirect people to solve their own problems.

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