Controllers Classified

Host Erik Zhou sits down with Amber Papp, VP of Finance at Scentbird, to explore the unique challenges of accounting in the e-commerce space. From managing a massive inventory of over 700 fragrances to navigating rapid growth and making smart automation decisions, Amber shares firsthand insights on what it takes to keep financial operations running smoothly at a high-growth, subscription-based company.Amber and Erik also dig into relevant themes like the role of AI in accounting, balancing efficiency with cost when evaluating new financial tools and systems, and the never-ending pursuit of data integrity.And as the episode closes, Amber shares a truly unexpected budget request—one that involved a Cybertruck, a demolition derby, and a marketing team with big dreams.Key quote“Having over 700 fragrances, it does present certain challenges. We want to make sure as an ecom business that we're giving our customers the best offering. You want to have as much variety as possible, obviously, but at the same time, you have to be able to manage the different fragrances.”Time Stamps(02:20) Career path and transition to Scentbird(06:20) Challenges with inventory management(16:31) Data integrity and AI in accounting(21:25) Homegrown systems vs. off-the-shelf solutions(30:07) Maintaining company culture remotely(41:09) Finance leaders are fun tooLinksConnect with AmberVisit ScentbirdConnect with ErikVisit Brex

On this episode of Controllers Classified, host Erik Zhou sits down with Brad Silicani, COO of Anrok, to talk about his journey from Big Four accounting to leading operations at a fast-growing tech company. The discussion begins by covering Brad’s transition from audit to client side, and highlights the myriad of roles he held at Dropbox. In his time there he was Controller, tasked with landing a sound revenue recognition method, Head of Tax, focused on developing the right international tax structure prior to IPO, and Treasurer, responsible for managing $2B in cash in a changing interest rate environment. In covering all this, Brad shares how these experiences set him up for success in his current role as COO at Anrok, highlighting why a background in accounting and finance makes him the operations leader he is today. And of course, no modern finance conversation would be complete without tackling the AI revolution. Erik and Brad dig into how automation and AI are reshaping accounting, tax, and treasury functions—not just making processes smoother but fundamentally redefining the role of finance leaders. Whether you're a CFO- OR COO-in-the-making, or just someone who loves hearing behind-the-scenes war stories from hyper-growth companies, this episode delivers sharp insights and great conversation. Key Quotes“It was a big transition, being in an environment where I was around a bunch of accountants who knew the acronyms to being in a world where you had to communicate with people who had no experience or background in accounting.” “Accounting in a startup - you have to work with what you have.” “I genuinely think that tax drives a lot of how the world works. Getting exposed to tax strategy was like a light bulb moment for me. I understood why a business would make a decision about where to play their people, produce their products, why they would acquire a company and do it in a certain way.”“My career goals changed from CFO to COO because I loved getting exposed to all of the different parts of a business.” Time Stamps(00:50) The journey into accounting(02:04) Early career and experience at E&Y(05:03) Joining Dropbox: revenue recognition methods(06:54) Scaling Dropbox: tax challenges(20:12) Transition to Treasurer and preparing for IPO at Dropbox(21:49) Becoming COO at Anrock(25:55) The evolution of financial software(36:14) Finance leaders are are fun tooLinksConnect with BradVisit AnrokConnect with ErikVisit Brex

In this episode of Controllers Classified, Erik Zhou sits down with Michael Williams, a Tax Partner at PwC, to unpack both his career path to Partnership and his firm’s POV on corporate tax strategies in 2025 and beyond. Michael begins by sharing key milestones in his time at PWC, noting how his perspective, role, and scope shifted as he worked towards becoming a Partner at the firm. He underscores the importance of real value creation for clients and notes that if you’re in the business of service and advice, it has to be quality and actionable. He then pivots to sharing why companies need to embed a tax perspective into their strategic planning. Erik and Michael cover upcoming changes in the tax landscape and what companies should be prepare for, underscoring that thinking about tax proactively instead of reactively isn’t just smart—it’s essential. Michael closes with his funniest business travel story. It may involve a cat on the loose. Tune in to get all the details! Key Quotes“As I’ve grown my career, I continue to think about where and how can I create value?” “It’s almost as if you are pulling a little piece of clay from each person that you work with, and ultimately you come out as a person molded by those relationships, leadership, mentors, etc.” “There are two aspects that we’re focused on right now.. One is about the operating model and how companies handle their tax department. The second is looking at the timing of tax adjustments.” “The word tax means so many different things to a person that works in tax. Cash tax, effective tax rate, statutory tax rate, marginal tax rate - when thinking about these different tax rates, they have different implications when looking at your financial statements.” “You have to be within the tax code. But I think a lot of times opportunities are missed because of the fact that when you’re in an accounting mindset, everything is recognized when it's accrued and that can be different from a tax perspective.”Time Stamps(01:13) Overview of Michael’s career (05:11) Journey to becoming a partner at PWC(28:26) Tax considerations for the upcoming year(45:30) Michael’s funniest business travel experienceLinksConnect with MichaelVisit PwCConnect with ErikVisit Brex

In this episode of Controllers Classified, Erik Zhou sits down with Karen Wu, the Chief Accounting Officer at Clari, to discuss the role of accounting in a company’s exit strategy. The conversation starts with an overview of Karen’s time in Transaction Services at PWC, where she helped a myriad of companies prepare for IPO - including Alibaba, the largest IPO in US history. Drawing on those experiences, Karen covers the reasons why a company may look for an exit, the types of exit strategies, and the role of the accounting team in those strategies. Specifically, Karen speaks to some ‘musts’ that accounting teams have to get right no matter the exit strategy - things like closing the books on time, ensuring precision and reliability in financial statements, and being able to comply with public company requirements. She speaks to the IPO readiness timeline, and how companies should approach it not just through the lens of accounting and finance, but across all functions. The conversation then pivots to Karen’s time at Clari. She shares her priorities as well as her POV on global accounting processes given the company’s international operations. Her number one piece of advice? Don’t be hesitant to outsource pieces of work to consultants who may have a better handle on local tax policies. The episode closes with a funny story from Karen’s PWC days involving an inventory count of Hairy Crabs. Have you ever wondered how baby crabs should be classified on a balance sheet? Then you must tune in! Key Quotes“When you think about an exit, from an accounting team perspective, you got to have precision in your financial statements. You have to be able to close your books in a timely manner. You have to have established company policies - and the ability to follow those policies consistently.” “If you can do 1-2 years of IPO readiness, that’s the best. You can of course do it in four months but companies who shortcut often struggle once public.” “You should always do a close process review. You need a process that is repeatable and scalable and can become a muscle memory for the team to perform every single month.”“Diligence requests during an acquisition are consistent with that of an IPO. You should still expect to have to show your top 20 customers with contracts; your top 20 vendors and purchase commitments; org charts; accounting policies; etc. “Partner with your people team and law firms to understand the local employment regulations when operating globally,  because those things are highly difficult to change once you put a process in place, and once you’ve exposed your current practice to employees”Time Stamps(00:33) Karen’s professional journey(01:35) Understanding transaction services(11:46) IPO readiness(23:41) Acquisition readiness(28:00) Accounting considerations for international operations (39:00) Controllers are fun too: the accounting classifications of hairy crabs LinksConnect with KarenVisit ClariConnect with ErikVisit Brex

In this episode of Controllers Classified, host Erik Zhou sits down with Jeff Arensman, Controller at Bloomerang, to cover two important topics: building a finance function from scratch and the role of finance in acquisitions. For Jeff, the two are inextricably linked at Bloomerang. As the first finance hire at the company, his first task was supporting an acquisition that needed to close in just three weeks. He then quickly turned to building a strong foundation for the accounting and finance practice at the company through new processes, tools, and technology. Jeff covers how he spent his time in the first few years at Bloomerang, including how he approached team building, and then turns to his current priorities now four years in at the company (a big NetSuite implementation!). After sharing how he approached building a function, Jeff does a deep dive into considerations during acquisitions both on the buy and sell side. He details his extensive experience in acquisitions and highlights some of his best practices and learnings - including how important it is to add nuance and context to the models that bankers develop during the due diligence process. The episode closes with Jeff sharing the deep detective work he had to do to get to the bottom of one of his weirdest company expense moments early in his career. Key Quotes:“As I grew in my career and focused not just on debits and credits but on how everything affects the business as a whole, that really set me up”“I am the first finance hire here. I started and then they told me ‘we’re going to get this deal done and it's closing in 3 weeks’. So challenging to say the least” “It took quite a long time to get things to a point where we could then say ‘ok now we can start doing the things that we need to do in order to scale this thing up’”“What worked and what we did when we started isn’t going to work now to take our company to $100M and beyond” “Bankers may put a model together for you - but I found it to not be ideal. Because how the bankers look at it is not how we’re actually running the business” “It’s amazing once you’re able to join two companies that really fit together, it’s crazy how fast things can go” Time Stamps(00:28) Jeff's journey into accounting(03:46) Learning through acquisition experience(06:12) Building the finance function at Bloomerang(16:59) How to implement processes that scale(28:39) Financial modeling approach for acquisitions(36:46) Post-acquisition integration considerationsLinksConnect with Jeff ArensmanVisit BloomerangConnect with ErikVisit Brex

When you think about accounting at growth stage companies, the word "artistry" might not immediately come to mind, but Desene Sterling makes a compelling case for it in this episode of Controllers Classified. As the Controller at Sourcegraph, Desene describes how crafting processes, like implementing procurement workflows or streamlining month-end close, feels like painting a masterpiece—except her medium is reconciliations and financial statements.This episode takes a deep dive into what it takes to build an accounting function from scratch in a growth stage startup. Desene recounts the feeling of being the first in-house accounting hire, navigating "free-for-all" credit card policies and training teams to embrace structure in a way that doesn’t stifle innovation. Her philosophy? Build processes that flex and grow alongside the company, even if that means starting with something imperfect.But it’s not all about debits and credits—relationships take center stage too. Desene explains how building credibility with colleagues and positioning finance as a partner (and not just an enforcer) are critical steps in successful change management. She also spends time on what she looks for in talent when building out her team, noting that nothing is more important than hiring people who can manage the details while keeping sight of the big picture. From detailing the nuances of SaaS and on-prem revenue recognition to recounting an unforgettable typo on a 10-Q filing, this episode showcases how accountants at growth-stage companies tackle big challenges with grit, ingenuity, and the occasional dose of humor.Key Quotes“What keeps me coming back in accounting specifically at growth stage companies is that I get so much satisfaction out of building.”“I assume this is how artists feel after they paint a painting. When I see a bunch of reconciliations and really nice financials, I am like ‘ah yes!’”“We try to get people to feel more responsible for their spend at the company” “I want finance to be seen as a group that has authority, but at the same time, I don’t want to just say no. I want to be a partner”“To create value for themselves, finance needs to tie back what they are doing to how they are making the company more valuable” “By nature, I want tons of structure whereas the rest of the company just wants to move fast. So, I need to think about a process or control that can flex.”Time Stamps(00:54) Operational vs. public accounting(02:03) Building processes in growth stage companies(06:43) Change management with new processes(14:31) The importance of relationship building(20:06) Preparing for audits(25:48) Balancing controls and speed(34:01) Advice for aspiring startup accountants LinksConnect with Desene SterlingVisit SourcegraphConnect with ErikVisit Brex

In this episode of Controllers Classified, host Erik Zhou, CAO at Brex, dives into the world of accounting and automation with Jake Jones, Controller at FinQuery. Jake shares his journey from a decade at Cherry Bekaert to his current role, detailing the transition from audit to client side and his 30, 60, 90 day ramp up plan at FinQuery. He also shares some background on his company, including their approach to their recent fundraising efforts and the accounting team’s role in that. The discussion then turns to achieving efficiencies in the accounting process. Jake shares how he got their accounting close down to 5 days from 10 days, and reflects on the productivity benefits of automation. He underscores the need for ongoing collaboration with cross-functional partners like rev ops, sales, and engineering teams to ensure seamless tool and system integration, and shares how he thinks about evaluating new accounting tools and technology. The episode wraps up with an insightful discussion on the importance of taking the accounting function from proactive to reactive through continuous process improvement. And at the conclusion, Jake closes out with some funny anecdotes from his early days in audit, including the time he had to audit medical socks as a part of inventory count. Key Quotes“It’s very easy to get your CPA and forget about it. But there are so many things that are changing, it’s important to stay up to speed.”“Going through the fundraising process, it was important that we had a good bridge between accounting and the FP&A team.”“We’ve had to work a lot with our Rev Ops team to make sure we know about changes in Salesforce.”“We’ve had a lot of support from our CFO around relying on automation tools. We were closing in ten days when I first started and we’ve gotten down to five.”“I always look at: are the dollars you’re going to spend worth the time you’re going to save?” “For us, we want continued process improvements. We want to be a proactive instead of reactive organization.” Time Stamps(00:38) Jake’s career journey(04:09) The importance of community building(11:31) The role of Jake’s accounting team in fundraising(19:03) Transition from Auditor to Controller (27:32) Implementing new tools and systems(30:00) Evaluating ROI on various vendors(32:02) Challenges and successes of automationLinksConnect with JakeVisit FinQueryConnect with ErikVisit Brex

In this episode of Controllers Classified, host Erik Zhou welcomes Jessica Peng, Controller at Invoca, to delve into mastering change management. Jessica got her start in a Big 4 helping companies build the right controls as a part of SOX readiness. This experience being audit side shaped her approach to controllership in many ways, including her willingness to push back on her auditor partners now when they have asks that place undue burden on her team and her desire to always balance efficiency and effectiveness in her controls. Jessica briefly touches on her team structure and priorities, and then dives deep into a discussion on change management, using a two-year journey to implement a new revenue recognition process and system as her example throughout. In this example she highlights: Why a discovery process is important prior to implementing new tools or systemsHow to adjust on the fly when you identify new dependencies after the discovery processThe best way to engage cross functional partners and executives in change managementConsiderations for managing a high-performing team through changeUltimately Jessica’s reflections offer a practical roadmap for organizations undergoing major system changes - you won’t want to miss it.Key Quotes“Having been on the audit side, you end up having a different level of interaction with your own auditors [once you’re client side]. For example, if you haven’t been on the audit side, if you’re asked for something, you will boil the ocean to provide it. But I generally question it - how important is it really? What are you trying to achieve” “Our finance team needed to be kept in the loop on any revenue recognition changes. But we really need to also work closely with the business systems team - we have daily stand ups with them to get on the same page” “You need executive sponsorship when you’re taking on change management in addition to having people work their day-to-day jobs. For example, executive team needs to understand that month end close may be a date late as the team works on something else” “I had an auditor partner say ‘bad news doesn’t get better with age’ - it is important to keep that in mind. You want to encourage executives to keep an open mind so people are more willing to come to them when things go wrong” “You should never automate in a way that doesn’t allow exceptions” “I have team members who want to get to the next step. And I have team members who are happy doing what they are doing. It comes down to what they want” Time Stamps(02:08) Audit side experience(5:00) Transitioning companies to SOX compliance(11:26) How audit side experience shapes approach to controllership(19:19) Jessica’s team structure & priorities(23:15) Change management with new revenue recognition process(31:35) Engaging cross functional partners(35:30) Executive sponsorship during change management(41:30) Managing and growing a team through change(45:11) Controllers are fun too!LinksConnect with JessicaLearn more about InvocaConnect with ErikVisit Brex

In this special bonus episode of Controllers Classified, host Eric Zhou, Chief Accounting Officer at Brex, is joined by Kevin Moore, Brex's Controller, to discuss the recent resignation of Ernst & Young as the auditor for Super Micro Computer. The conversation delves into the nuances surrounding auditor transitions and explores potential reasons behind such decisions, touching on factors like corporate governance, risk management, and regulatory scrutiny. The episode also highlights the challenges that will be faced by both the internal accounting team at Super Micro and the audit team at EY as a result of the shift. LinksConnect with KevinConnect with ErikVisit Brex

In this episode of Controllers Classified, we explore the role of accounting in scaling businesses as well as public company accounting processes with Eric Van Cleve, Controller at 8x8. The episode begins with a recap of Eric’s career in accounting, detailing his discovery of accounting in college and how he worked his way up the ladder once he landed client side out of college. He notes that he found the most success when he focused on being interested, proactive, curious and capable. The episode then turns to a discussion on how to think about directing accounting operations at scaling companies. Eric shares how he thinks about team structure to ensure efficiency in the close process as well as his decision making framework for where to automate and where to offshore.  In every decision, he tries to factor in not just current but also future business needs. From there, the discussion deep dives into private vs. public company accounting, with Eric providing advice to finance and accounting leaders at pre-IPO companies regarding what to prioritize as they think about SOX readiness. He notes that these companies must be able to confirm that the answers they get to in their data are in fact the right answers. In other words, teams have to be able to prove out their control processes and ensure that reporting obligations can be met. And of course, teams should familiarize themselves with 10Ks and 10Qs. The episode closes with Eric’s favorite accounting joke. Why did the accountant break up with the calculator? Tune in now to find out! Key Quotes“I found myself being very proactive in going after the areas I wanted to be a part of. Leaders are looking for who is interested and who is capable” “If you want to get to a one day close, you need to structure your team in such a way that you are closing your sub-ledgers first in APAC, then analyzing the data in EMEA, and doing a check/consolidate view of the information in the US.” “We look at industry benchmarks to assess what makes sense for every control in our process”“You need your team to know what the right answer is so that way when you’re delivering it to the auditors, they can do their basic checks”“I would first look at what your reporting obligations are going to be - get yourself familiar with what 10Ks and 10Qs look like” Time Stamps(07:19) Streamlining accounting processes for a faster close(10:09) Automating and accelerating accounting processes(27:51) Accounting processes at public companies(33:48) Preparing accounting teams for auditsLinksConnect with EricLearn more about 8x8Connect with ErikVisit Brex