

The Counter Narrative: Changing the Way We Talk (and think) About Education
Charles Williams
A podcast dedicated to changing the way we talk and think about education. We all know that the field isn't perfect but there is plenty of awesome work happening everyday. Listen in as I profile educators who are positively impacting their staff, students, and communities.
Episodes
Mentioned books

Mar 31, 2023 • 46min
Episode 149: Interview with Sarah Said
In this episode, I chat with Sarah Said, an educator who has served in various roles including Teacher, Assistant Principal, Dean, Curriculum Coordinator, and Multilingual Coordinator. Sarah is an advocate for the students she serves and is a strong voice in education. She has been published in various publications such as Learning for Justice, EdWeek Teacher, The Teaching Channel and Edutopia
During our conversation, we talk about how Sarah got her groove back by examining her journey from classroom to administration and then back again. We focused on mental health and questioned how much we are truly doing despite talking a lot about the need for shifts in this area. We reflected on the often unnecessary burdens we carry with us and the impact that has not only on ourselves but those around us. Sarah also pointed out that we could benefit from shifting from our standardized approaches to Norway’s more fluid practices.
Ready to hear more? Let’s go!
Facebook - Sarah Dollah-Said
Twitter - @MrsSaid17
Instagram - @dollahsaid
Linked In - Sarah Dollah-Said

Mar 24, 2023 • 13min
Episode 148: Pause to Ponder - All Brown All Around
In Sandra Cisneros' book, "House on Mango Street," there exists a passage that seemingly sticks out to most people who have read the text.
"Those who don’t know any better come into our neighborhood scared. They think we’re dangerous….All brown all around, we are safe. But watch us drive into a neighborhood of another color and our knees go shakity-shake and our car windows get rolled up tight and our eyes look straight. Yeah. That is how it goes and goes."

Mar 17, 2023 • 54min
Episode 147 - Interview With Barbara Bray
In this episode, I chat with Barabara Bray, a coach, teacher, writer, disruptor, risk-taker, learning designer, connector, and visionary. She calls herself a creative learning strategist where others call her a “change-maker.” Her dream long ago was to create an online place for educators that was safe and secure with all the tools and resources in one place. She did it with My eCoach in 1999 — way before there was Twitter, Instagram, TikTok, or Pinterest. Barbara is what some call a “Digital Pioneer.” With her coaching background and an amazing team, they created coaching and mentoring strategies and processes that have been adopted in schools and districts in the U.S. and other countries. Barbara coined the phrase “Making Learning Personal” in 2000 and trademarked it in 2002. In 2004, she started her Rethinking Learning blog in My eCoach and in 2010, she moved her blog to barbarabray.net. In 2017 she launched the Rethinking Learning Podcast and published Define Your Why in 2020.
During our conversation, we explored the treatment of teachers and how it has impacted the field of education. From teacher recruitment to teacher retention, we discussed common practices and their effectiveness in improving our schools. Barbara talked about the often distanced school board members and recommended that they spend time in the schools for which they are making decisions. She shared how passion projects not only improved teacher and student investment but also provided a window into what is happening within our schools.
Ready to hear more from this educational guru? Let’s go!
Connect with Barbara
Host, Rethinking Learning Podcast
Author, Define Your Why: Own your story so you can live and learn on purpose
President/Owner, My eCoach
Facebook (barbara.bray)
Twitter (bbray27)
Linked In (barbarabray)

Mar 10, 2023 • 15min
Episode 146: Pause to Ponder - What is Equitable Grading
Equitable grading has come to mean plenty of things but the problem with most of the approaches is that they have become excuses used to enable our most at-risk students. Join me as I reflect on a disagreement that I continue to have with a colleague and request your input on this challenging conversation.

Mar 3, 2023 • 38min
Episode 145: Interview with Rosalba Rodriguez
In this episode, I chat with Rosalba Rodriguez, an educator of 20 years as an instructional assistant, a substitute teacher, a teacher. She has served as an administrator for the past four years and is currently a Principal in southern California. Rosalba is a mother of two and an advocate for her daughters to be leaders and empathetic to others. As a leader, she believes all students can learn and belong to their school. Rosalba loves her role as a principal and is excited to continue her journey in leadership.
During our conversation, Rosalba presents a question that serves to define our leadership - what battles are you willing to fight and are you brave enough to stand firm? She explains how, in her new role, those who rode the bus were not only often from vastly different neighborhoods than the affluent community in which the school exists but also dropped off in the back of the school and required to traverse less than ideal terrain in order to enter the school. Why was this okay? She also stresses the need to hold all students accountable to the same level and differentiates between pity and promise.
Ready to hear more from this phenomenal leader? Let’s go!

Feb 24, 2023 • 13min
Episode 144: Pause to Ponder - Should African-Americans (and others) be Offered ELL Programming?
We know that African-Americans have struggled historically when in our academic spaces and there is a maintained gap between them and all other racial groups. When discussing these disparities, we often talk about access and opportunity but what if there is something that we are missing in that conversation? This episode explores the possibility that this gap persists because many of our students, and not just African-Americans, exist within households and communities where the language needed to navigate academia is not commonly used and is, in many ways, foreign to them. What do you think?

Feb 17, 2023 • 37min
Episode 143: Interview with Marcus Belin
In this episode, I chat with Marcus Belin, the Principal of Huntley High School, President of Illinois Principals Association, 2021 National Association of Secondary School Principals Digital Principal of the Year, and 2020 Illinois Principals Association Kishwaukee Region Principal of the Year. Marcus received his Bachelor’s and Masters from Bradley University and his Education Specialist (Ed.S.) and Doctor of Education (Ed.D.) in Educational Leadership from National Louis University. He is also the creator and host of the podcast Unapologetic Leadership which can be found across most platforms and on his website drmarcusbelin.com.
During our conversation, we discussed time. Yes, that’s right time. The fleeting resource that most of us wish we had more of so that we could accomplish all that we have to do. And yet this valuable resource is finite and thus we are forced to consider how we make the most of it. Marcus points out that our constant desire to “catch up” is a fallacy considering that we exist within an ever changing environment. Instead, he suggests that we examine our mission and vision to ensure that they are aligned with our actions so that we are moving in the right direction. Marcus also assures us that it is okay to set boundaries and give ourselves grace.
Ready to hear more? Let’s go.

Feb 10, 2023 • 14min
Episode 142: Pause to Ponder - Black Mental Health
What happens when trauma goes unaddressed? What happens when a community is denied the opportunity to access adequate health care? What happens when individuals are convinced that engaging in discussions around mental health is a sign of weakness? Join me as I reflect on how these issues perpetuate ongoing trauma within our communities and will continue to do so until they are truly addressed and resolved.

Feb 3, 2023 • 49min
Episode 141: Interview w/ Black, Brown, & Bilingue Podcast
In this episode, I chat with Lissette Jacobson and Maurice McDavid, the co-hosts of the Black, Brown, and Bilingue podcast, a show designed to unite the Black and Brown communities through education, storytelling, and community engagement. Both Lissette and Maurcie have over a decade of experience serving in education and both are currently principals in the suburbs of Chicago.
During our conversation, we focus on the intersectionality of language and identity. When was the last time you considered the relationship between the two and what did your assumptions or reactions say about your perceptions? For example, Lissette and Maurice talk about the “improper language” that is used in academia and yet is commonplace with those who use this same language to convey love, affection, and support. They point out that language which is acceptable in our educational system is often elitist and serves to create barriers among many of our marginalized populations despite great skillsets.
Ready to hear more from this dynamic duo? Let’s go … or should I say vamos.

Jan 27, 2023 • 12min
Episode 140: Pause to Ponder - Love + Work
Inspired by Episode 405 from the SuperCreativity Podcast hosted by James Taylor, this episode briefly shares some insights into Marcus Buckingham's newest book "Love + Work" and presents a challenge to all listeners for the month of February (and hopefully beyond). Jump into this episode and be sure to check out Taylor's podcast and Buckingham's book.
SuperCreativity Podcast
Love + Work