Ascend - The Great Books Podcast

Dr. Jeremy Holmes, an Associate Professor of Theology at Wyoming Catholic College, dives into Dante's Inferno, introducing listeners to its essential themes and remarkable literary structure. He shares personal anecdotes about family life that enrich the conversation, emphasizing love's vital role in the narrative. The discussion navigates Dante’s allegorical journey through sin and redemption, reflecting on the relevance of his work in today's context. Holmes also highlights insights on the symbolic beasts encountered in 'Inferno,' illustrating their connections to humanity's struggles.

Join Dr. Frank Grabowski, a Philosophy PhD professor and diaconate candidate, alongside Thomas Lackey, an independent scholar, as they delve into Aeschylus' Eumenides. They explore the evolution of justice from blood vengeance to a procedural approach, highlighting Athena's pivotal role in the transformation. Their fascinating dialogue covers the significance of the trial at the Areopagus, linking mythological themes to Athenian politics, and examines the cultural implications of storytelling in shaping justice over time.

Dcn. Harrison Garlick is joined by Dr. Frank Grabowski, a scholar of Aeschylus' works, and Mr. Thomas Lackey, an analyst of justice themes. They dive into the dynamics of 'The Eumenides,' focusing on the evolution of justice from vengeance to a more structured communal framework. Interesting discussions arise about the trial of Orestes, the contrasting ideologies of the Furies and Apollo, and how Athena introduces a new vision of justice. The hosts explore the socio-political implications of these themes, highlighting the transition from primitive to civilized concepts of justice.

Thomas Lackey, a guest expert on Aeschylus' works, provides insightful commentary on the complexities within the 'Libation Bearers.' The discussion delves into Orestes’ morally fraught path of vengeance and the fractured concepts of hospitality in his return home. With a focus on the intricate dynamics between Orestes and Clytemnestra, the episode highlights themes of familial loyalty, the tensions of justice, and the emotional complexities surrounding motherhood and revenge. Symbolism, particularly around weapons, is also explored, adding depth to the narrative.

This week Dcn. Garlick is joined by Mr. Thomas Lackey and the Adam Minihan to discuss part one of the Libation Bearers, the second play in Aeschylus' Oresteia. Check out thegreatbooksdpodcast.com for more resources.Check out our Patreon for a written GUIDE to the whole Oresteia.From our guide:The Libation Bearers presents Orestes as both the hero and the victim. The cycle of violence will both demand his action and condemn it. “The one who acts must suffer,” as Aeschylus observes. The play builds an incredible tension within the current mechanics of justice and primes the audience to desire some lasting resolution—a resolution that will only come in the Eumenides.Aeschylus’ Libation Bearers, the second play in the triad of the Oresteia, places Orestes within the moral tension of lex talionis and its cycle of violence. He is the son who, to avenge his father, must kill his mother, Clytemnestra. Aeschylus presents us with fundamental questions on justice—a primitive justice that demands blood for blood, an eye for an eye. The cycle of violence both demands action and condemns it.What makes the Libation Bearers such an essential and resonant part of the Oresteia is its relentless focus on the mechanics of justice and its interplay between violence and fate. Aeschylus "pushes us to think not only about the relationships in play but about larger moral questions.” Through Orestes’ struggle to fulfill his divine obligation as blood avenger, and through Electra’s own crisis of prayer, the play asks profound questions about the nature of justice. Aeschylus’ beautiful line, "The anvil of justice stands fast... fate beats out her sword" (628), is arguably the moral heart of the play. A tale of pain, justice, and fate. I.             Orestes Returns Home (1)The story begins several years after the murder of Agamemnon, when Orestes, now a young man of eighteen or so, secretly returns home from exile.[1] Much of the tragedy lies in understanding Orestes’ difficult situation: to be a blood avenger for his father, he must kill his own blood, his mother.Orestes’ opening monologue invokes Hermes—who fittingly serves as the bridge between the living and the dead (1). The opening invocation to the divine was seen in Agamemnon as well and will be seen again in the Eumenides. The relationship between the living and the dead is a key theme in this play and a perennial question that makes this a great book. It will contain both prayers on behalf of the dead and the intercession of the dead for the living.It is notable that in the absence of having a father, Orestes is presented as a confident, determined figure ready to do the unthinkable. In the Odyssey, he served as the role model for Telemachus, and here we see him lack the timidity and self-doubt that plagued the fatherless Telemachus. It raises the question, however, of who or what shaped Orestes into a character ready to face this grave moral burden? To use a phrase, who was his Mentor? As we will see in the text, as Telemachus had Athena, Orestes had Apollo....Keep up the good work![1] Fagles, 305.

We are reading Aeschylus' Oresteia. This week Dcn. Garlick, Adam Minihan, Thomas Lackey, and Dr. Frank Grabowski discuss part two of Aeschylus' Agamemnon, the second part of the first play of the Oresteia. Check out thegreatbookspodcast.com for more sources.Check out our written guide to the Oresteia.I.             Clytemnestra and Agamemnon: Murder, Manipulation & Denial (795)Clytemnestra dominates Agamemnon as a complex figure of cleverness, rage, and manipulation. Upon Agamemnon’s return, she denies him a true homecoming by rolling out the red tapestries and inviting him to walk on them (901). Two main observations on the red tapestries. First, Clytemnestra is literally denying Agamemnon the satisfaction of setting his foot on Argos’s soil. It is a denial of him truly coming home. Compare this denial to the herald who praises the soil of Argos upon his return (493).Second, walking on the tapestries is an act of hubris and impiety. Even Agamemnon states it is an act reserved for the gods (915). It said that the dye needed to make these tapestries would have been incredibly laborious and expensive—and upon walking upon them, they would be ruined. Note also their comparison to streams of blood (903). Clytemnestra is inviting Agamemnon to a prideful, impious, and prodigal act. The invitation should be compared to Agamemnon’s opening lines that praise and give gratitude to the gods (795).Clytemnestra hatred is profound. Her actions reflect years of planning, deep-seated hatred, and extraordinary control over the narrative surrounding the king’s return. She is leading Agamemnon into impiety so that he will die at odds with the divine. It is akin, in Catholic parlance, to leading someone into mortal sin prior to murdering them. It is a supernatural cruelty similar to Achilles intentionally throwing bodies in the river to deny them their burial rites in the Iliad.Agamemnon's behavior in this moment reflects his characteristic weakness. He is effeminate, weak-willed, and impressionable. Clytemnestra is clever and dominative (935). He even states that Clytemnestra is treating him “like a woman” (912). His inability to assert himself as either husband or king leaves him vulnerable to Clytemnestra's intellectual superiority. She remarks: “The power is yours, if you surrender your free will to me,” underscoring how she undermines his authority on every level (939). One should recall the wife of Odysseus, Penelope, the “matchless queen of cunning,” who through her wit and fidelity preserved King Odysseus’ kingdom and herself until his return. One may see Clytemnestra as an evil Penelope—a queen whose wit is turned against her king to his destruction. II.           The Chorus and the Tragedy of Cassandra (977) The old men of Argos, the chorus, “huddle in terror” as Agamemnon and Clytemnestra enter the palace. They are afraid and inept. Notice the imagery of a man’s blood wetting the earth and whether it can then sing (1017). It is difficult not to think of the story of Cain and Abel, and how Abel’s blood cried out to God (Genesis 4:10). Clytemnestra reemerges from the palace and attempts to coax Cassandra, the Trojan princess, into the palace. Cassandra is silent, which is expected, as it was tradition only two persons would speak on the stage at a time—and here Clytemnestra and the leader of the chorus are both speaking. As an aside, one of the most comical moments of the entire Oresteia was when Cassandra was revealed (947). Agamemnon steps down from his chariot in front of a wife who hates him only to reveal the young, beautiful Trojan princess. It is a darkly comedic moment in which one imagines the internal hatred churning in Clytemnestra at the sight of Cassandra.Aeschylus plays with his audience’s assumption that Cassandra is not a speaking character. When Clytemnestra goes into the palace, it would have been a surprise enough to have Cassandra speak—but Aeschylus has her scream (1072). As Lackey describes, Cassandra’s scream would have shocked the audience and created a sense of foreboding. Lackey compares the moment to a “jump scare in a horror movie,” emphasizing how unexpected and unsettling it would feel to a Greek audience accustomed to the constraints of the dramatic tradition.Aeschylus draws heavily from the myth of Cassandra. To wit, Apollo, the god of prophecy, desired Cassandra, but in the act of coupling with her, she drew away from him (1213). It is a rare occurrence of the divine act lacking fecundity. As such, Apollo cursed Cassandra with the gift of prophecy, but no one will believe her (1218). The one caveat is that when someone does finally believe her, it will be a sign of her death is imminent (1219).[1]Her prophetic warnings go unheeded, as per her curse, but her vivid descriptions of the family’s blood-soaked history and impending doom deepen the play’s tension. “The house that hates god, an echoing womb of guilt… soil streaming blood,” Cassandra cries, invoking the horrors of Tantalus and Atreus (1088). Aeschylus uses Cassandra to explain the action that will occur offstage, as she describes Agamemnon’s death (1126). Justice in Agamemnon is reduced to cycles of revenge, a primitive form of blood vengeance that sustains violence rather than resolving it. Cassandra herself is tangled in this cycle, a figure of tragic innocence like Iphigenia before her. As Lackey notes, “Cassandra is innocent in so many ways… the most innocent of victims,” and yet she is offered no way out of her fated demise. She is the “last ember” of Troy (1173). One should recall too that in addition to suffering the fall of Troy and the death of her family, Cassandra was raped by little Ajax in the temple of Athena in Troy. It was this evil she suffered that caused Athena to curse the Achaeans with Poseidon’s help during their journey home...Check out our guide, linked above, for more![1] Fagles, 302.

Dcn. Garlick, Dr. Frank Grabowski, and Thomas Lackey are reunited to discuss the first part of Agamemnon, the first play in Aeschylus' Oresteia. Check out thegreatbookspodcast.com for more information.From our written guide available to our supporters:The first play of the Oresteia tells of the homecoming of Agamemnon and is predominately animated by revenge. Aeschylus presents us with questions concerning the legitimacy of the Trojan war, how Argos has suffered without its king, and why Clytemnestra has plotted to murder her husband. Though chronologically Odysseus has not return home yet, one should compare this text to the Odyssey and Odysseus’ own homecoming – written almost three hundred years prior by Homer. Aeschylus draws heavily from Homer but changes small but significant details, which creates a narrative that presents a profound lesson on the weaknesses of lex talionis as enacted by the blood avenger model. Throughout Agamemnon and into Libation Bearers, we are invited to consider whether a new model of justice is needed.I.             The Opening: Unease and Gender Inversions (1)The play begins with an invocation to the gods, as will the following two plays. Through the watchman, Aeschylus communicates the time and setting to his audience in a manner typical of Greek drama. The watchman’s opening monologue conveys a disquieting mood of fear and quiet dread. As observed, Lackey describes the opening as “a little eerie and a little bit off.” Notably, the watchman yearns for the return of Agamemnon, his king, and we note the king’s absence has left the kingdom, Argos, in suffering (24, 37). One thinks here of the suffering of Ithaca without Odysseus in the Odyssey. The opening passages invites us to ask: “What has life been like in Argos over the past decade during the king’s absence?” and “What is the effect of the empty throne of Argos upon its people?” From the outset, Aeschylus will play with gender roles and descriptions. Notice Clytemnestra, Agamemnon’s wife, “maneuvers like a man” (13), while Agamemnon himself will be presented as effeminate. This thematic inversion invites readers to examine Aeschylus’ pedagogical purpose for such language. As Dr. Grabowski observes, the toying with gender traits parallels Shakespeare’s Macbeth, wherein Lady Macbeth similarly exhibits masculine qualities of ambition and dominance. As the play progresses, readers gain insight into life in Argos during Agamemnon’s ten-year absence. The people long for an end to their suffering, for “an end to their pain” (23). Notably, Aeschylus allows us to see how Argos viewed the Trojan war (44), which is largely presented, at first, as a just war in which Agamemnon was the “great avenger” of Zeus punishing Troy for its violation of guest-friendship (45), i.e., Prince Paris absconding with Menelaus’ wife, Helen. The reader should note whether Agamemnon’s return starts to adjust this narrative....Check out our whole guide on the Oresteia.

Dcn. Harrison Garlick and Adam Minihan are reunited to intro Aeschylus, the Father of Greek Tragedy.Aeschylus (b. 525 BC) was a warrior, statesman, and the father of Greek tragedy. Born into nobility, he grew up in Athens during its pivotal transition from tyranny to democracy. Furthermore, he famously fought in the Battle of Marathon (490 BC), defending a nascent Western civilization against Persian invasion. Aeschylus died in 456 BC, leaving behind a legacy that shaped the foundation of Greek drama.Check out thegreatbookspodcast.com for more information.From our guide on the Oresteia:1.        What is the Ionian Revolt?To understand Aeschylus, we must first understand the Greco-Persian War (c. 499 BC to 429). In sum, what is called the “First Persian Empire,” founded by Cyrus the Great around 550 BC, stretched from modern-day Iran, Asia Minor, modern day Israel, and Egypt. In Asia Minor, this Persian empire ruled over Hellenistic city-states. One may recall that Troy, a polis with both Hellenistic and eastern traits, was also located in Asia Minor. In 499 BC, the city-states rebelled against their Persian overlords with the support of Athens in what is known as the “Ionian Revolt.” The revolt failed and the Persians retained control of Asia Minor; however, King Darius of the Persian Empire believed Athens should be punished and elected to invade Greece. 2.        What was the first invasion in the Greco-Persian Wars?The Ionian Revolt sparked the larger Greco-Persian Wars and led to King Darius’ invasion of ancient Greece in 492 BC. Athens led the federation of city-states against the Persians, and Aeschylus fought for the Athenian army. Notably, Aeschylus and his brother both fought at the famous Battle of Marathon in 490 BC at which the first Persian invasion was defeated.[1] Aeschylus’ brother, however, died in the conflict.[2] The Battle of Marathon is often held as a watershed moment in the birth of Western culture. The battle is also the namesake of running a marathon, as the legend has it that an Athenian runner ran the twenty-six miles from Marathon to Athens to tell them of the Athenian victory. 3.        What was the second Persian invasion in the Greco-Persian Wars?Ten years later, a second Persian invasion was headed by King Darius’ son, King Xerxes. This is the setting for the famous Battle of Thermopylae (480 BC), in which the smaller Spartan force of approximately 7000 men under King Leonidas held off 120,000-300,000 Persian invaders. The word Thermopylae means “hot gates” and takes its name from the hot springs in that area—it is also fittingly one of the mythological entrances to Hades. After Thermopylae, the Athenians won a great naval battle against the Persians at Salamis in 480 BC. Notably, Aeschylus is said to have fought in this battle as well and wrote his play The Persians about the conflict. The Greeks, led by the Athenians and Spartans, would eventually expel the Persians and bring peace in 449 BC. 4.        What do we know about Aeschylus’ writings?Aeschylus is the “earliest Greek tragic poet whose work survives,” and “he wrote some seventy to ninety plays.”[3] Aeschylus is considered the “real founder of Greek tragedy.”[4] He won his first victory as a tragic poet in 484 BC. It should be noted that the competitions for best tragic play were religious and civil festivals; thus, the plays have deep ramifications for the spiritual and political realities of the Athenians.[5] Only seven of his plays still exist: the Persians (472), the Seven Against Thebes (476), the Oresteia triad (458), the Supplicants (463), and Prometheus Bound—the last of which has disputed authorship and was produced after Aeschylus’ death.[6] 5.        Why do we read the Oresteia?Aeschylus is a teacher. He is a teacher of justice, suffering, and order. The Oresteia is a triad or three plays telling the story of the death of Agamemnon, the death of Clytemnestra, and the trial of Orestes. Aeschylus takes a story well known in Homer and masterfully moves it into a story revealing how Athens matured in its understanding of justice. The execution of justice moves from a familial blood avenger model to a more procedural model of the polis. It represents a considerable step forward in the Greek understanding of justice. In many ways, Aeschylus’ Oresteia gives us a more robust ending that what we received in the Odyssey. Looking forward, it brings us one step closer to considerations of justice in Plato’s Republic. The Oresteia, like all great books, comments on the human condition, and offers perennial truths for those with the patience to listen.Coming up! Join us in reading the Oresteia:Agamemnon Part IAgamemnon Part IILibation Bearers Part ILibation Bearers Part IIEumenides Part IEumenides Part IIFootnotes:[1] Companion, 15.[2] Companion, 15.[3] Companion, 15.[4] Companion, 15.[5] Companion, 16.[6] Companion, 15.

Dr. Frank Grabowski, a philosophy professor, and Thomas Lackey, an independent scholar, discuss Hesiod's Theogony, delving into themes like the primordial chaos, the role of Eros as a binding force, and Zeus's emergence as a symbol of civilization. They explore the contrasting depictions of women and the philosophical implications of suffering in learning. Additionally, they examine power dynamics between the Titans and Olympian gods, emphasizing the intertwining of divine relationships and human morality, inviting listeners to reflect on the complexities of creation and existence.

Dive into the world of Greek plays and discover their relevance in exploring human experiences and philosophical themes. Unravel key concepts like justice, love, fate, and divinity while learning about iconic works such as 'The Bacchae' and 'Prometheus Bound.' Explore the tragic journeys of characters like Antigone and how they reflect timeless dilemmas. Transition to the lighter side with a glimpse into the comedic genius of Aristophanes, making ancient wisdom feel strikingly modern.